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Thread: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

  1. #26
    Featured Member Miss_Luscious's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    In all seriousness, please explain to me why we should be so incredibly concerned with what other countries think of us? That's not a rhetorical question either, please answer it.

    We are the greatest country on Earth. Who saved Europe from Hitler in WWII? Who defeated Japan in WWII? Who saved Kuwait from Saddam? Who led the relief for the tsunami victims? Who just sent $60B to Africa to fight AIDS? The answer is "we did".

    And if we are held in such low regard by the rest of the world , why do so many people immigrate her, both legally and illegally?
    Because without support form the rest of the world, we will not have help when we need it. We are strong because of our allies and our respect in the world. When that goes, we're in trouble. They won't want to deal with us, buy our products, help us in our wars, etc. We have a global economy now and it's important for countries to work together. If other countries hold our president in high regard, that can only be a good thing as they will be more wiling to talk to us, work with us to achieve goals, and help us. How could it be bad?
    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand." - Bertrand Russell

    "It's just a matter of people having low self esteem and being way too easily offended." -Random Guy on a Internet Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    Ya'll bitches need to calm down. Cerously.
    In other words: Boo-motherfucking-hoo

  2. #27
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Quote Originally Posted by Miss_Luscious View Post
    Because without support form the rest of the world, we will not have help when we need it. We are strong because of our allies and our respect in the world. When that goes, we're in trouble. They won't want to deal with us, buy our products, help us in our wars, etc. We have a global economy now and it's important for countries to work together. If other countries hold our president in high regard, that can only be a good thing as they will be more wiling to talk to us, work with us to achieve goals, and help us. How could it be bad?
    With all due respect, Miss L, in this post you imply we currently have the respect and support of the world and a half-dozen posts ago, you said everybody currently disliked us because of Bush. I don't see how you can have it both ways.

    The US needs all those countries a lot less than they need us. Its not a bad thing to have their support to do what's in our best interests, but its not essential we have their support either. These countries are only concerned with what they think we think of them to the extent that they need something from us, be it issues of commerce or security or whatever. We realy don't need anything from them and don't think we need to be making excuses or apologizing for American actions ( especially to Germany, who sought to rule the world not 70 years ago).

    Anything deemed necessary to the US will be done with or without international support.
    "never trust a big butt and a smile"-- Bell Biv DeVoe

    If you're in your twenties and aren't a liberal, you have no heart. If you're in you're forties and aren't a conservative, you have no brain - Winston Churchill

  3. #28
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    We should all support Obama because as long as we invest more smartly ( whatever that means )
    Actually, she's right on this issue. Investing 'smartly' under an Obama administration will mean investing in solar energy companies, ethanol companies etc. which will be the beneficiaries of massive new taxpayer funded gov't subsidies. The direct (partner) investors will also be granted 'production tax credits' by the gov't which can in turn be used to offset other tax liabilities. However, the latter only applies to investors with hundreds of thousands of dollars available.


    Anything deemed necessary to the US will be done with or without international support.
    this is a highly dubious claim under an Obama administration. This is also the reason that Israeli's / Jewish American voters are extremely wary of Obama, given Obama's position of 'concensus' international politics and given the vested interests that France, Germany etc. have in the middle east.

  4. #29
    Featured Member Miss_Luscious's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    With all due respect, Miss L, in this post you imply we currently have the respect and support of the world and a half-dozen posts ago, you said everybody currently disliked us because of Bush. I don't see how you can have it both ways.

    The US needs all those countries a lot less than they need us. Its not a bad thing to have their support to do what's in our best interests, but its not essential we have their support either. These countries are only concerned with what they think we think of them to the extent that they need something from us, be it issues of commerce or security or whatever. We realy don't need anything from them and don't think we need to be making excuses or apologizing for American actions ( especially to Germany, who sought to rule the world not 70 years ago).

    Maybe you don't know how global economies work so I'd suggest you read up on that. Here's a start on the basics of a global economy. Here and here are articles on how the US affects the global economy. If our money is fucked up then guess what, other countries money will get fucked up too. And then they will not be able to buy our goods and services which will, in turn, further hurt us (after all, Exports make up a good precentage of our GDP). Further more, who's going to help us when we need it? No one will have the money to do so. We ALL need each other at this point. We can not just be our own country anymore. It just won't work.

    My point is this:

    If the policies and actions of President Bush have caused an economic downturn (they have) AND Obama is more well liked in the world than Bush and his policies at this point AND if history shows us that McCain agrees with most of these policies and will continue them THEN it follows that our standing in the world will increase with an Obama presidency as opposed to a McCain one and that is a good thing. See what I did there? I just formed a logical and SOUND argument.

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    Anything deemed necessary to the US will be done with or without international support.
    Yes, just like the war in Iraq which is going swimmingly and has been a resounding success!
    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand." - Bertrand Russell

    "It's just a matter of people having low self esteem and being way too easily offended." -Random Guy on a Internet Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    Ya'll bitches need to calm down. Cerously.
    In other words: Boo-motherfucking-hoo

  5. #30
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    Actually, she's right on this issue. Investing 'smartly' under an Obama administration will mean investing in solar energy companies, ethanol companies etc. which will be the beneficiaries of massive new taxpayer funded gov't subsidies. The direct (partner) investors will also be granted 'production tax credits' by the gov't which can in turn be used to offset other tax liabilities. However, the latter only applies to investors with hundreds of thousands of dollars available.
    My point was : who isn't already investing as smartly as they can or budgeting as best they can?

    The implication that people aren't already doing that was what caught my attention.

    Granted, there will be new investment opportunities down the road, but then that's always the case.
    "never trust a big butt and a smile"-- Bell Biv DeVoe

    If you're in your twenties and aren't a liberal, you have no heart. If you're in you're forties and aren't a conservative, you have no brain - Winston Churchill

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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    this is a highly dubious claim under an Obama administration. This is also the reason that Israeli's / Jewish American voters are extremely wary of Obama, given Obama's position of 'concensus' international politics and given the vested interests that France, Germany etc. have in the middle east.

    My point was that the US has to do what's best for the US, not what's best for the US as long as Europe agrees, so I think we agree here.
    "never trust a big butt and a smile"-- Bell Biv DeVoe

    If you're in your twenties and aren't a liberal, you have no heart. If you're in you're forties and aren't a conservative, you have no brain - Winston Churchill

  7. #32
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    In one speech (I believe in front of AIPAC) he said Jerusalem should be undivided and a part of Israel. In another, he said the fate of J should be up for negotiation. I can see how the flipping and flopping would be more distressful to strong supporters of Israel than Obama just stating a position and sticking to it.

    FBR
    Once again I have embraced my addiction and have put off the moral dilemma to another day.

  8. #33
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Quote Originally Posted by Miss_Luscious View Post
    My point is this:

    If the policies and actions of President Bush have caused an economic downturn (they have) AND Obama is more well liked in the world than Bush and his policies at this point AND if history shows us that McCain agrees with most of these policies and will continue them THEN it follows that our standing in the world will increase with an Obama presidency as opposed to a McCain one and that is a good thing. See what I did there? I just formed a logical and SOUND argument.
    Not really. People ( and countries ) buy things where they can get the best deal, not necessarily from those they like. We buy oil from Saudi Arabia and from Venezuela, and we don't particularly care for their leaders. Why? Because we have no choice.

    You may well have a point that Bush's policies haven't worked ( I'm not saying you're right, but you may be ) and may never work were McCain to continue them ( at this point an assumption, probably correct, on your part ). That doesn't mean Obama's policies will work better, though. Most of what he proposes to does not appear to me to bode well for our economy. If he makes our economy worse, I don't think his popularity abroad will do much good at all.

    My primary thrust in this argument was more militarily based than yours. That was my focus when i said we really don't need the other countries.

    As far as the war in Iraq is concerned, it may well have been a mistake to go there, and it may have been executed poorly, but none of that had to do with whether or not we were getting international support. Actually, the war part of it went fairly well. It was the stabilization process that followed that was bungled so badly, at least up till the surge.
    "never trust a big butt and a smile"-- Bell Biv DeVoe

    If you're in your twenties and aren't a liberal, you have no heart. If you're in you're forties and aren't a conservative, you have no brain - Winston Churchill

  9. #34
    Featured Member Miss_Luscious's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    If you want to argue that we don't need anyone else militarily then I guess you're right. We do have the strongest military in the world right now. But what do you mean "the War part"? We're still at war. When did the war end?
    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand." - Bertrand Russell

    "It's just a matter of people having low self esteem and being way too easily offended." -Random Guy on a Internet Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    Ya'll bitches need to calm down. Cerously.
    In other words: Boo-motherfucking-hoo

  10. #35
    Veteran Member Zia_Abq's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    As the person who started this topic I would like to request that it PLEASE stay on topic. Lots of these threads get so diluted it creates chaos. The topic here is Biden's response to the RNC convention. Ok. great.Thanks

  11. #36
    Featured Member Miss_Luscious's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    ^^^You're right, my bad for my part of the derail.
    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand." - Bertrand Russell

    "It's just a matter of people having low self esteem and being way too easily offended." -Random Guy on a Internet Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    Ya'll bitches need to calm down. Cerously.
    In other words: Boo-motherfucking-hoo

  12. #37
    Veteran Member Zia_Abq's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Thankyou, Miss Luscious. I really appreciate that

  13. #38
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    Granted, there will be new investment opportunities down the road, but then that's always the case
    and maybe it's just me, but I prefer investments whose profits are earned via the private sector rather than investments whose profits don't really exist but whose apparent profits are funded by the involuntary transfer of tax money subsidies ... especially when collected from people who least afford it (i.e. the stealth ethanol gas pump tax).


    When did the war end?
    when the number of average daily American deaths due to violence in Iraq fell below the number of average daily deaths due to voilence in Detroit ... or Chicago ... or New York ... or Los Angeles ... (i.e. cities with strict gun control laws)


    The topic here is Biden's response to the RNC convention
    Biden's speech covered proposed political policies that directly impact all of these issues !!!

  14. #39
    Veteran Member Zia_Abq's Avatar
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    Default Re: Biden Response to the RNC Convention

    arg! Thanks for respecting the request to stay on topic, Mel.

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