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    Default media mad at being manipulated

    (snip)"Howard Kurtz's column in the Washington Post is surprisingly blunt and surprisingly revealing. The mainstream media, Kurtz says, are mad. Their anger, though, is oddly unidirectional:

    The media are getting mad.
    Whether it's the latest back-and-forth over attack ads, the silly lipstick flap or the continuing debate over Sarah and sexism, you can just feel the tension level rising several notches.

    Maybe it's a sense that this is crunch time, that the election is on the line, that the press is being manipulated (not that there's anything new about that).


    There certainly isn't. Barack Obama has been manipulating the press for years. His manipulation didn't make the media mad, though, because reporters were willing accomplices who have been trying to get Obama elected. It's the thought that John McCain could be manipulating them that has the media seeing red:

    News outlets are increasingly challenging false or questionable claims by the McCain campaign, whether it's the ad accusing Obama of supporting sex-ed for kindergartners (the Illinois legislation clearly describes "age-appropriate" programs) or Palin's repeated boast that she stopped the Bridge to Nowhere (after she had supported it, and after Congress had effectively killed the specific earmark).
    But the two examples Kurtz cites are ads that are indisputably true. Obama did support sex education down to kindergarten. Kurtz thinks that's OK, because the sex education for five-year-olds would be "age appropriate." He's entitled to that opinion, but my opinion, and that of most voters, is that any sex education for kindergartners is a terrible idea. In any event, whether you think teaching five-year-olds about sex is a good idea or a bad idea, the ad is true.

    Likewise with the ad that says Governor Palin killed the Bridge to Nowhere: it's a simple fact that no one, including the Democratic Party in Alaska, thought to deny until Palin was selected to run for Vice-President. We wrote about it here. As the Anchorage Daily News reported on March 12, 2008:

    Palin ruffled feathers when she announced - without giving the delegation advance notice - that the state was killing the Ketchikan bridge to Gravina Island, site of the airport and a few dozen residents.
    If Kurtz or other members of the media want to criticize some other aspect of Palin's record they are welcome to do so, but the suggestion that she didn't kill the famous bridge is ridiculous.

    That's not to say that there is no false advertising in the air this campaign season. We wrote here that Barack Obama's oft-repeated claim, in a television ad and elsewhere, that he "reach[ed] out to Senator Lugar...to help lock down loose nuclear weapons" is flatly untrue. It was Sam Nunn who "reached out to Senator Lugar" in 1991. Obama's minor amendment to the Nunn-Lugar Cooperative Threat Reduction Act in 2006 had nothing to do with "locking down loose nuclear weapons;" on the contrary, it specifically excluded them. Obama's amendment has turned out to be a bad idea, too. But these and other falsehoods by Obama aren't what the press is "getting mad" about, and reporters have no intention of reporting on them.

    While noting that the media in general are "getting mad," Kurtz himself is mad about the "lipstick on a pig" flap:

    The lipstick imbroglio is evidence that the Drudge/Fox/New York Post axis can drive just about any story into mainstream land. Does anyone seriously believe that Barack Obama was calling Sarah Palin a pig?
    I'm not sure what Obama had in mind, but I find it odd that in pages of outrage devoted to the supposed excesses of the McCain campaign, Kurtz finds no room to mention the fact that prominent Democrats (not anonymous emailers, who are much worse) have said that Governor Palin is Pontius Pilate and that her primary qualification seems to be that she hasn’t had an abortion.

    The truth is that Sarah Palin has been the object of the most vicious and concerted smear campaign in modern American history. But that fact doesn't cause the media (or Howard Kurtz) to get mad.

    It's not too hard to diagnose why, as Kurtz correctly says, "the media are getting mad." They're getting mad because their candidate is losing. They've spent years building him up and covering for his mistakes and shortcomings, and he is such a stiff that he can't coast across the finish line. I'd be mad too, I guess, but I think I'd have the decency not to take it out on Sarah Palin.

    PAUL adds: I'm not getting mad, but I find the nature of this campaign increasingly dismaying. Obama has been lying about McCain all along, from the nonsense about fighting in Iraq for 100 years to the claim (based on a joke) that McCain thinks the middle class extends to people making up to $5,000,000 a year.

    Meanwhile, I think Kurtz is correct about the "lipstick" remark. The answer to his question, "does anyone seriously believe that Barack Obama was calling Sarah Palin a pig" may be "yes," but in my opinion it should be "no." And it's off-putting to hear Republican women like former Gov. Swift trying to parlay Obama's phrase (which, unhappily, has become common political jargon recently) into an identity politics "gotcha." This is the kind of thing I expect from Democrats, not Republicans.

    To be sure, Obama lacks credibility when he complains about the "gotcha," having been the beneficiary of, and perhaps a party to, a similarly invalid identity politics play against Bill Clinton. Many in the media also lack credibility since, as John points out, their sense of outrage runs in only one direction. "(snip)

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    with an update from Mark Steyn ...

    (snip)"The Washington Post's media man, Howard Kurtz, is mad as hell and he's not gonna take it for more than another couple decades or until the management buy-out offer improves:

    The media are getting mad.

    Whether it's the latest back-and-forth over attack ads, the silly lipstick flap or the continuing debate over Sarah and sexism, you can just feel the tension level rising several notches.

    Maybe it's a sense that this is crunch time, that the election is on the line, that the press is being manipulated...

    Yes, indeed. Howie feels the press is being "manipulated" by the McCain campaign.

    Maybe it is. A conventional launch strategy for a little-known vice-presidential nominee might have involved "manipulating" the media into running umpteen front-pagers on Sarah Palin's amazing primary challenge of a sitting governor and getting the sob-sisters to slough off a ton of heartwarming stories about her son shipping out to Iraq.

    But, if you were really savvy, you'd "manipulate" the media into a stampede of lurid drivel deriding her as a Stepford wife and a dominatrix, comparing her to Islamic fundamentalists, Pontius Pilate and porn stars, and dismissing her as a dysfunctional brood mare who can't possibly be the biological mother of the kid she was too dumb to abort. Who knows? It's a long shot, but if you could pull it off, a really cunning media manipulator might succeed in manipulating Howie's buddies into spending the month after Labor Day outbidding each other in some insane Who Wants To Be An Effete Condescending Media Snob? death-match. You'd not only make the press look like bozos, but that in turn might tarnish just a little the fellow these geniuses have chosen to anoint.

    John Hinderaker has more on Kurtz' descent into madness, while Roger Kimball calls the last two weeks an "act of auto-immolation" by the media. Alas, while setting their own pants on fire, Howie & co also managed to spill the lighter fluid all over Barack's coronation robes. The other day Boston's "alternative" paper ran a piece lamenting that MSNBC being so obviously in the tank for Obama is, in fact, damaging the Obama campaign. As Orrin Judd says:

    Even if it isn't particularly true, the notion that Keith Olbermann defeated Barack Obama needs to become conventional wisdom, just to drive the Left bonkers."(snip)

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Interesting you should bring this up today because there is a brand new Obama video that begins with the subject of the media coverage in this election. It's covered in the first half of this clip from a town hall meeting held today in Dover, NH.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    ^^^ arguably that's another Pandora's Box that Obama should think twice before opening ...


    (snip)"when Obama referred to his "Muslim faith" on Sunday and did not correct himself, Stephanopoulos rushed in at once to help him and emphasize that the senator had really meant to say his Christian faith.

    By contrast, Gibson tried to embarrass Palin by referring to her Christian faith in asking people to pray for U.S. soldiers in Iraq. Palin countered by pointing out she was following the precedent set by Abraham Lincoln.

    Palin also expressed her support for Georgia and Ukraine joining the U.S.-led NATO alliance. That statement was predictable and consistent with the current policy of the Bush administration. The policy has dangerously raised tensions with Russia, but Palin is hardly alone in the conservative/Republican consensus in expressing her support for it.

    Palin's assessment of foreign policy was competent and not embarrassing. Although she initially exhibited ignorance of the Bush Doctrine on pre-emptive strikes that has been a central pillar of U.S. foreign policy after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, she recovered quickly and then made the case clearly. Tactically, she made the mistake of trying to be friendly and informal with Gibson, who assumed a superior, professorial and critical stance toward her. She would have been far better going on the attack to rattle him.

    The double-standard Gibson applied to Palin, compared with the uncritical media platforms repeatedly offered to Obama, who has had zero executive experience running anything, was especially striking. ABC and Gibson focused on Palin as if she were running right now for the presidency rather than the vice presidency. He and other media pundits, by contrast, have never asked the Democratic vice presidential nominee, Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware, if he has ever had to make a decision on anything.

    Gibson's aggressive approach appeared to take Palin by surprise: He was clearly attempting to put her on point by presenting her as having extreme religious views. This again, however, appears to be a double-standard, as Palin grew up in the Assemblies of God, one of the largest Christian denominations in America with 16 million members, and is now a member of the Wasilla Bible Church. Even now, Obama has yet to receive any comparable grilling on his 20-year attendance in the congregation of the notoriously racist Rev. Jeremiah Wright."(snip)

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    But the two examples Kurtz cites are ads that are indisputably true. Obama did support sex education down to kindergarten. Kurtz thinks that's OK, because the sex education for five-year-olds would be "age appropriate." He's entitled to that opinion, but my opinion, and that of most voters, is that any sex education for kindergartners is a terrible idea. In any event, whether you think teaching five-year-olds about sex is a good idea or a bad idea, the ad is true.
    I stopped reading here. Why? Because the "sex ed" for kindergartner's they are referring to is talking about how to avoid being abducted and sexually molested by adults. The bill outlined recognition of inappropriate touching and to tell trusted adults if something someone did makes them feel bad.

    I mean, really, who wants to protect their kids from sexual predators, anyway?

    Spin, spin and more spin. The McCain campaign is reprehensible in what they are trying to do to America. Talk about sexual predators, they are trying to fuck America against her will.

    Is there such a term as political rapists?


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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Paris View Post
    I stopped reading here. Why? Because the "sex ed" for kindergartner's they are referring to is talking about how to avoid being abducted and sexually molested by adults. The bill outlined recognition of inappropriate touching and to tell trusted adults if something someone did makes them feel bad.

    I mean, really, who wants to protect their kids from sexual predators, anyway?

    Spin, spin and more spin. The McCain campaign is reprehensible in what they are trying to do to America. Talk about sexual predators, they are trying to fuck America against her will.

    Is there such a term as political rapists?
    THANK YOU, PARIS!! Sweet Geezus, this is gettin' fuckin ridiculous now.
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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    the point didn't involve the wisdom or foolhardiness of Obama's supporting 'sex education' for kindergarteners. It involved attempts by the Obama campaign to claim that such was not actually the case when the issue was raised by the republicans.

    The media frustration manifested itself because Drudge / Fox / NY Post kept publicizing the factual nature of the situation despite attempts by other media to kill the story or spin it off the table. Without this continued publicity, as in previous election years, Obama's denial or favorable spin would have ended mainstream media coverage (and with it taken the issue out of the minds of voters)

    The 'new' end result was that, unlike previous election years, this year Obama's support of 'sex education' for kindergarteners was actually brought to the attention of tens of millions of US voters rather than being 'buried'. Thus tens of millions of US voters can now add that fact into their decision making process, where in previous years they probably would have remained unaware or would have accepted Obama's denial (and chalked up the 'accusation' as an outrageous and desparate move on the part of Obama's opponents).

    I'm sure that some voters will feel that Obama's support of 'sex education' for kindergarteners is a positive thing. I'm equally sure that other voters will not feel the same way. But the actual point is that, because the majority of mainstream media was frustrated in their attempts to kill the story or spin it off the table, those voters now get the opportunity to choose.

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 09-13-2008 at 05:08 AM.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    the point didn't involve the wisdom or foolhardiness of Obama's supporting 'sex education' for kindergarteners. It involved attempts by the Obama campaign to claim that such was not actually the case when the issue was raised by the republicans.

    The media frustration manifested itself because Drudge / Fox / NY Post kept publicizing the factual nature of the situation despite attempts by other media to kill the story or spin it off the table. Without this continued publicity, as in previous election years, Obama's denial or favorable spin would have ended mainstream media coverage (and with it taken the issue out of the minds of voters)

    The 'new' end result was that, unlike previous election years, this year Obama's support of 'sex education' for kindergarteners was actually brought to the attention of tens of millions of US voters rather than being 'buried'. Thus tens of millions of US voters can now add that fact into their decision making process, where in previous years they probably would have remained unaware or would have accepted Obama's denial (and chalked up the 'accusation' as an outrageous and desparate move on the part of Obama's opponents).

    I'm sure that some voters will feel that Obama's support of 'sex education' for kindergarteners is a positive thing. I'm equally sure that other voters will not feel the same way. But the actual point is that, because the majority of mainstream media was frustrated in their attempts to kill the story or spin it off the table, those voters now get the opportunity to choose.

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    WTF are you talking about??

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    the point didn't involve the wisdom or foolhardiness of Obama's supporting 'sex education' for kindergarteners. It involved attempts by the Obama campaign to claim that such was not actually the case when the issue was raised by the republicans.
    It wasn't the case and anyone who tries to say to was, including you, is a LIAR

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Here is a quote regarding the media coverage and McCain campaign ads:

    “Every day not talking about the economy, the war and how to fix a broken system is a victory for McCain,” said John Weaver, a former top strategist to the nominee




    But is this a victory for the American people? Is talking about the important issues of the day and how he plans to handle them going to help undecided voters make an intelligent choice?

    Doesn't that attitude lend itself to how they would handle issues should they win the White House? Is that the kind of Prez we need at this very delicate point in our history as a nation?

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    It's pretty sad when we have to depend upon "The View" for tough questions to presidential candidates. Here's a link that shows several clips from yesterday's "The View" show. McCain continues with his lies, he makes no secret of his desire to have Roe v Wade overturned, talks about his feelings on the separation of church and state. Very informative.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    It's pretty sad when we have to depend upon "The View" for tough questions to presidential candidates. Here's a link that shows several clips from yesterday's "The View" show. McCain continues with his lies, he makes no secret of his desire to have Roe v Wade overturned, talks about his feelings on the separation of church and state. Very informative.
    "The View", Richard? If it weren't for Elizabeth Hasselback, the show would be 100% unwatchable. What happened was an attempted mugging on the show. Compare the way they treated McCain and the way Gibson treated Palin with the much more even-handed way O'Reilly treated Obama. I saw no lies, agree Roe v. Wade should go back to the states and don't see how you can see views of separation of church and state representing anything radical.
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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    There is plenty of "media manipulation" by both sides in this campaign as in every other major political campaign.

    FACT- Obama NEVER called Palin a "pig" yet Rush, Sean, Mark and today, Monica Crowley repeated the calumny that he did.

    FACT- There is NO EVIDENCE that Sarah Palin is not the birth mother of Trig Palin but that didn't stop Bill Maher and others from claiming otherwise. Ooops. I just did it a bit myself. Actually what Maher said was that he wasn't sure Sarah was the mother and that Bristol wasn't.
    Others flat out claimed that Sarah was bearding for Bristol.

    FACT- Sarah Palin did fire the Wasilla librarian who was rehired after a storm of protest. She DID inquire about removing books from the PUBLIC library including the "Harry Potter" series.

    FACT- While Palin may not have dotted all her "i's" and crossed all her "t's" in observing all the applicable protocols there ARE excellent reasons why her former brother in law ought to be fired as an Alaska State Trooper including but not limited to his admitted tasering of a 10 ( TEN ! ) year old boy- his OWN SON !
    Is anyone going to seriously argue this kind of creep ought to carry a gun & badge ?

    FACT- Obama NEVER attended a "madrassah". He DID attend a S E C U L A R school where many of the teachers and most of the students were Muslim while living in Indonesia. At the time he was in GRADE SCHOOL. Quick show of hands - Who can remember ANYTHING they were taught in grade school besides "Dick & Jane" ? This hasn't stopped the usual suspects from outright claims that he did. The FIRST ones to bring this out in the press were members of HILLARY'S campaign.

    FACT- McCain was the only one of the "Keating Five" who was cleared of any wrongdoing whatsoever. He was the only one who was able to clearly show there never was a quid pro quo i.e. he took LEGAL campaign contributions from Keating and there were no specific votes he cast in return. McCain claimed he was so chastened by the resulting investigation that he pushed for campaign finance reform = McCain - Feingold.

    FACT- Obama served on a board with William Ayers. He has described Ayers acts during the '60's as "despicable" and hasn't even seen him in a year and a half. He NEVER spoke a word of approval of anything Ayers did.

    FACT- The "Bush Doctrine" has changed in meaning over the years. Originally it meant that the U.S. would not wait to be attacked and thus would engage in preemptive war. In Bush's Second Inaugural it had morphed into promotion of democracy throughout the world and there are at least two other versions of the "Bush Doctrine". Not one Dem. Primary Candidate had to field a question about the "Bush Doctrine" or any other complex doctrinal issue without the questioner FIRST explaining what it was i.e. they FIRST explained what the "Bush Doctrine" was and then asked their question.

    I could go on and on with examples of what Obama has rightly described as "The Political Silly Season ". If one campaign has strayed more or further from genuine issue discussion by instead engaging in "silly stuff" it is clearly MCCain's and so far, it's been working.

    Some in the press are "pissed" because inter alia they think they got "manipulated" into giving the "pig with lipstick" story too much play ! As far as I know, McCain does not control their editor's desks and thus they have nobody to blame but themselves. Likewise both the press and Obama's campaign were caught flatfooted by McCain's choice of Palin and have been clumsily searching for ways to attack her that do not appear to be overtly sexist or Anti-Christian. To put it mildly, the results have been varied.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    WTF are you talking about??
    I'm talking about the majority of mainstream media having lost their ability to simply 'kill' news stories which are contrary to 'old media' editorial policy (which typically means getting the Democratic candidate elected).

    I'm talking about at least some portion of US voters now being made aware of the existance of news stories which are contrary to 'old media' editorial policy ( which typically means news stories that raise questions / reflect badly on Democratic candidates) - which could have been successfully 'killed' in the past thus leaving US voters ignorant of their existance.
    Last edited by Melonie; 09-13-2008 at 02:28 PM.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    How about the latest ad ridiculing McCain because he doesn't know how to email?

    Turns out he can't use a keyboard or tie a knot because of injuries suffered during his military service. What's next ? McCain can't tie his own shoelaces?
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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    "The View", Richard? If it weren't for Elizabeth Hasselback, the show would be 100% unwatchable.
    I never said I was a fan of the show, I was just pointing out how silly it is that they seem to be the only one's asking tough questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    What happened was an attempted mugging on the show. Compare the way they treated McCain and the way Gibson treated Palin with the much more even-handed way O'Reilly treated Obama.
    A mugging? How so? By asking tough question? Are tough questions suppose to be off limit? I applaud them. I'm sure that Sean Hannity will ask Sarah Palin lots of hardhitting questions in their interview.

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    I saw no lies
    Are you for real?
    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/712/
    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/706/

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    agree Roe v. Wade should go back to the states
    I'm fine with it the way it is as I'm guessing much of "The Views" target audience is.

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    and don't see how you can see views of separation of church and state representing anything radical.
    So it has to be "radical" to get your attention? I prefer a clear distinction between the two.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    I'm talking about the majority of mainstream media having lost their ability to simply 'kill' news stories which are contrary to 'old media' editorial policy (which typically means getting the Democratic candidate elected).
    You do know that Bush won the last two elections don't you? And that we've had a republican majority in Congress most of the last decade?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    I'm talking about at least some portion of US voters now being made aware of the existance of news stories which are contrary to 'old media' editorial policy ( which typically means news stories that raise questions / reflect badly on Democratic candidates).
    You mean contrary in that many of them are not entirely true?

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    How about the latest ad ridiculing McCain because he doesn't know how to email?

    Turns out he can't use a keyboard or tie a knot because of injuries suffered during his military service. What's next ? McCain can't tie his own shoelaces?
    Blind people can use email, I'd think he could too.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    A mugging? How so? By asking tough question? Are tough questions suppose to be off limit? I applaud them. I'm sure that Sean Hannity will ask Sarah Palin lots of hardhitting questions in their interview.
    The clips I heard ( granted I heard them on Hannity's radio show ) were hard to distinguish because the women were all asking questions simultaneously, hence it seemed like piling on. Hannity has already said he will ask the questions ( and I sure hope some of them are tough and relevant ) and give her the time to answer them fully. I think Gibson's interview particularly good because he did interrupt her mid-answer a few times that I heard ( again on Hannity )


    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    So it has to be "radical" to get your attention? I prefer a clear distinction between the two.
    I don't see where the State is threatened by his views ( hence the radical statement ) or where there are any blurred lines.
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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    The clips I heard ( granted I heard them on Hannity's radio show ) were hard to distinguish because the women were all asking questions simultaneously, hence it seemed like piling on. Hannity has already said he will ask the questions ( and I sure hope some of them are tough and relevant ) and give her the time to answer them fully. I think Gibson's interview particularly good because he did interrupt her mid-answer a few times that I heard ( again on Hannity )




    I don't see where the State is threatened by his views ( hence the radical statement ) or where there are any blurred lines.
    Don't hold your breath waiting for Sean to put Palin's feet to the fire. He has a long history of "softball" interviews of right wing darlings like Palin. Why do you think she's going on his show ?

    The curious thing about Gibson's interview was the editing. Palin's answers were clearly shortened in the "prime time" version while her answers that aired on Nightline were much longer and displayed far greater knowledge; nuance and grasp of the issues.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    Blind people can use email, I'd think he could too.
    You have to be able to type. McCain's ability to do so is limited by his permanently crippled arms. He also can't do his own tie; comb his hair or tie his shoes. Bill Clinton does not use a computer or send e-mail. So what ?

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    Don't hold your breath waiting for Sean to put Palin's feet to the fire. He has a long history of "softball" interviews of right wing darlings like Palin. Why do you think she's going on his show ?
    That's why I said I hoped he'd ask tough questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    The curious thing about Gibson's interview was the editing. Palin's answers were clearly shortened in the "prime time" version while her answers that aired on Nightline were much longer and displayed far greater knowledge; nuance and grasp of the issues.
    Yes, the "prime-time" version apparently made her look far less well-informed. Coincidence? I think not. There were double the viewers than as there were later.
    "never trust a big butt and a smile"-- Bell Biv DeVoe

    If you're in your twenties and aren't a liberal, you have no heart. If you're in you're forties and aren't a conservative, you have no brain - Winston Churchill

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    By asking tough question? Are tough questions suppose to be off limit? I applaud them
    Circling back on topic, this is EXACTLY what the point of this thread refers to. In past election cycles, do you think that Rev. Jeremiah Wright would ever have been investigated or reported on ? Do you think that Obama's Tony Rezko connection would ever have been reported on ? Granted that the mainstream media has apparently 'chosen' to avoid the pursuit of these subjects in any depth, but at least the stories haven't been 'killed' altogether.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    Quote Originally Posted by bem401 View Post
    "The View", Richard? If it weren't for Elizabeth Hasselback, the show would be 100% unwatchable. What happened was an attempted mugging on the show. Compare the way they treated McCain and the way Gibson treated Palin with the much more even-handed way O'Reilly treated Obama. I saw no lies, agree Roe v. Wade should go back to the states and don't see how you can see views of separation of church and state representing anything radical.

    uhhhhhh.....Hasselback was downright disgusting towards Michele Obama.

    What's wrong with the other women on the view...or do men only care about what women look like...a la Hasselback.

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    Default Re: media mad at being manipulated

    the day I accept that mainstream media is fair and balanced towards political candidates will be the day that CBS does a '60 minutes' investigative segment on Hamdi Auchi !!!

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