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Thread: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

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    Default Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    First Obama claims that he " WARNED about the condition of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac two years ago and tried to reform them " ??????? WHEN. I have scoured every news site on the net and could find NOTHING from Obama about ANYTHING concerning Fannie and Freddie .

    Then it was Barney Frank getting his pants pulled down by Bill O'Reilly. Not a pretty image btw. O'Reilly didn't even use the best stuff that Barney said back in 2003 that "Fannie and Freddie are not facing any kind of financial crisis". or during the House hearings in 2004. Instead he played a clip from Barney dated July 14, 2008 in which he said : "Fannie and Freddie are fundamentally sound" ; that they weren't in any danger of going under and had solid prospects.

    It would be funny, were it not so pathetic, to see these Dems running away from their own records and worse yet, pretending that it was THEY who wanted to reform Fannie and Freddie. They've had the Congress since January 2007 and NEVER lifted a finger and made a peep.

    At least Chris Cox was man enough to admit he and the SEC screwed up. At least Artur Davis was decent enough to admit that he ignored the warnings about Fannie and Freddie.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    It would be funny, were it not so pathetic, to see these Dems running away from their own records and worse yet, pretending that it was THEY who wanted to reform Fannie and Freddie. They've had the Congress since January 2007 and NEVER lifted a finger and made a peep.
    Democrats took control of congress in 2007, on 3/9/07 Barney Frank introduced H.R. 1427. I wouldn't call that hardly lifting a finger.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    cricket*cricket*

    Bill O'Reilly makes stuff up all the time. Am I old or does anyone else think "Buddy Hackett" every time they see Barney Frank?


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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Paris View Post
    cricket*cricket*

    Bill O'Reilly makes stuff up all the time. Am I old or does anyone else think "Buddy Hackett" every time they see Barney Frank?
    Let's see:




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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Just close your eyes and listen:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OabwugHKs10


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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    First Obama claims that he " WARNED about the condition of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac two years ago and tried to reform them " ??????? WHEN. I have scoured every news site on the net and could find NOTHING from Obama about ANYTHING concerning Fannie and Freddie .
    He apparently wrote a few letters claiming someting needed to happen. Now McCain, all he did was introduce some legislation to add regulation, and he only did it twice! Lazy ass!

    And Bush, that jerk, he just proposed legislation in 03'. Just because the democrats killed it, doesn't mean it was their fault!

    I was willing to blame congress as a whole and forgive the finger pointing but after reading some stuff today I hadn't seen... It's laughable, the Democrats (and a few Republicans) killed attempts at regulation more than once.

    Obama got more Fannie/Freddie Lobbyist money than anyone except for Chris Dodd. So I'm sure he really wanted to lose control of them!

    Just more and more proof for me that Obama is all talk, and what he says he'll do he hasn't tried to do, won't try, and wouldn't be able if he wanted.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    He apparently wrote a few letters claiming someting needed to happen. Now McCain, all he did was introduce some legislation to add regulation, and he only did it twice! Lazy ass!

    And Bush, that jerk, he just proposed legislation in 03'. Just because the democrats killed it, doesn't mean it was their fault!

    I was willing to blame congress as a whole and forgive the finger pointing but after reading some stuff today I hadn't seen... It's laughable, the Democrats (and a few Republicans) killed attempts at regulation more than once.

    Obama got more Fannie/Freddie Lobbyist money than anyone except for Chris Dodd. So I'm sure he really wanted to lose control of them!

    Just more and more proof for me that Obama is all talk, and what he says he'll do he hasn't tried to do, won't try, and wouldn't be able if he wanted.
    The best way to keep the populace unorganized and in shambles is to give them something to argue about. I'm talking about the "left" vs the "right" - the "democrats" vs the "republicans."

    I don't recognize either of these parties anymore. Conservative use to mean "keeping the government out of your life as much as possible." That is, "conserve the power of government."

    Meanwhile the shady politicians make more rules and barriers for new people to get into congress and collect all that K street money.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Meanwhile the shady politicians make more rules and barriers for new people to get into congress and collect all that K street money.
    You must have missed the fine point interpretation ... that ""conserve the power of government."" now means making sure that the power of government stays in the hands of the SAME senators and representatives i.e. a permanent ruling elite. Joe Biden, Barney Frank and Charlie Rangel serve as excellent examples of this 'conservative' principle LOL !

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    Democrats took control of congress in 2007, on 3/9/07 Barney Frank introduced H.R. 1427. I wouldn't call that hardly lifting a finger.
    A- Frank's PROPOSED legislation would not have done anything except clean up some of the accounting mess at Fannie and Freddie. It would have done little to curtail the issuance of bad mortgages and the securities based thereon.

    B- His bill was referred to the Senate where it died. Thank you, Cris Dodd.


    C- Frank did NOTHING to sound the alarm and make this a high-profile issue.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    A- Frank's PROPOSED legislation would not have done anything except clean up some of the accounting mess at Fannie and Freddie. It would have done little to curtail the issuance of bad mortgages and the securities based thereon.
    But you said no finger was lifted? Looks like a finger was lifted doesn't it? And for the record, Fannie and Freddie weren't the ones issuing the bad mortgages.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    C- Frank did NOTHING to sound the alarm and make this a high-profile issue.
    Again, Republicans were in the majority, what did they actually do to stem this problem? Besides push for more loans to those who couldn't afford them? From 1992 to 2006 nothing was done and the Republicans were in control of the House for almost that entire period. Go on keep rewriting history though, it's rather interesting.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Actually since 1993 to 2002 or so the republicans COULDN'T do anything because democrats repeatedly played the race card ! Beyond 2002 republicans worked up the courage to bring serious proposals to the house and senate despite media accusations of racism. But committee votes including one wall street RINO republican or the threat of a 40 vote Senate veto by democrats kept these proposals from ever being voted on.

    Also, Fannie and Freddie absolutely enabled and encouraged the issuance of bad mortgages, even if (as you point out) they did not deal directly with the low income homeowners.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    But you said no finger was lifted? Looks like a finger was lifted doesn't it? And for the record, Fannie and Freddie weren't the ones issuing the bad mortgages.

    Again, Republicans were in the majority, what did they actually do to stem this problem? Besides push for more loans to those who couldn't afford them? From 1992 to 2006 nothing was done and the Republicans were in control of the House for almost that entire period. Go on keep rewriting history though, it's rather interesting.
    O.K He lifted his pinkie. Frank has been the CHAIRMAN of the House Banking Committee since January, 2007. Name one thing he did to try to warn the American people about this financial mess. As late as JULY 2008 he was publicly saying they were "fundamentally sound."

    I'm NOT the one re-writing history Richard and it's perverse to get that from YOU. Bush wanted to shrink Fannie and Freddie as far back as 2001. The Dems
    in the Senate blocked it every time.

    The Republican House held hearings in 2004. You did review the youtube C-Span re-runs didn't you ?

    McCain co-sponsored a bill in 2005 to curtail Fannie and Freddie involvement in mortgages but Dodd and other Dems blocked it in the Senate. Please tell me I won't have to review the Senate cloture rule for you again. You like to forget about it whenever it's convenient.

    Fannie and Freddie were permitted to control 80% of the mortgage market in the U.S. While they didn't write the mortgages ( that was done by banks and private mortgage companies ) they BOUGHT them and securitized them or guaranteed them.

    Let me ask you something. Who in their right mind would have EVER written most of these crap mortgages UNLESS Fannie and Freddie existed ? Wtf was GOVERNMENT doing in the mortgage business in the first place ?

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    ^^^You're both trying to make this so black and white. There's plenty of blame to go around.

    Here's a few comments directly from Barney Frank:

    (snip)Dealey then cites comments I made in 2003 that the GSEs are not in trouble as evidence that I did not support reform. Wrong. I supported reform then, I support reform now and I delivered. Dealey also fails to report that the Bush Administration did not support the reform efforts of Republican former House Financial Services Committee Chairman Mike Oxley, who recently told the Financial Times that the White House gave him "the one-finger salute" for his efforts to bring about GSE reform.

    I also supported—with major opposition from the Bush Administration and their conservative Congressional allies—a tough federal law against predatory lending, and I urged then-Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan to write regulations based on the Home Owners Equity Protection Act passed by a Democratic Congress in 1994. Those regulations would have outlawed many of the irresponsible lending practices that fueled the housing bubble and now threaten the entire economy. His successor, Ben Bernanke, issued these regulations last July after seeing the economically disastrous impact of an unregulated market. If we had a predatory lending law and had Greenspan acted on authority he was given, we might have avoided the subprime crisis entirely. The Democratic majority also delivered, with the help of our Committee's Ranking Member, Rep. Spencer Bachus (R-AL), on a mortgage reform and anti-predatory lending law in 2007.

    In addition, the author points to the fact that I voted against GSE reform in 2005, but does not tell readers why. The Republican majority inserted language at the last minute that would prohibit religious organizations from participating. The Catholic and Lutheran churches, and many others, sponsor some of the best not- for-profit housing development organizations in the country. It is only because of this ridiculous action by arch-conservative Republicans that I cast my vote "no". It was not because I was opposed to tougher regulations and oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

    The House Financial Services Committee, which I chair, moved aggressively after we took over as the majority party in January, 2007, and passed GSE Reform in March of 2007. We worked cooperatively with Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson to strengthen the bill and the full house voted for GSE reform in early May 2007. I also proposed to Secretary Paulson that we include GSE reform in the stimulus package passed by Congress in January 2008, but he declined, citing problems with the White House with this approach. Now, thanks to the efforts of the Democratic majority, and thanks to the work of former-Chairman Mike Oxley, President Bush can finally count GSE reform as an accomplishment. (snip)

    http://www.usnews.com/blogs/sam-deal...eddie-mac.html

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    ^^^You're both trying to make this so black and white. There's plenty of blame to go around.

    Here's a few comments directly from Barney Frank:

    (snip)Dealey then cites comments I made in 2003 that the GSEs are not in trouble as evidence that I did not support reform. Wrong. I supported reform then, I support reform now and I delivered. Dealey also fails to report that the Bush Administration did not support the reform efforts of Republican former House Financial Services Committee Chairman Mike Oxley, who recently told the Financial Times that the White House gave him "the one-finger salute" for his efforts to bring about GSE reform.

    I also supported—with major opposition from the Bush Administration and their conservative Congressional allies—a tough federal law against predatory lending, and I urged then-Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan to write regulations based on the Home Owners Equity Protection Act passed by a Democratic Congress in 1994. Those regulations would have outlawed many of the irresponsible lending practices that fueled the housing bubble and now threaten the entire economy. His successor, Ben Bernanke, issued these regulations last July after seeing the economically disastrous impact of an unregulated market. If we had a predatory lending law and had Greenspan acted on authority he was given, we might have avoided the subprime crisis entirely. The Democratic majority also delivered, with the help of our Committee's Ranking Member, Rep. Spencer Bachus (R-AL), on a mortgage reform and anti-predatory lending law in 2007.

    In addition, the author points to the fact that I voted against GSE reform in 2005, but does not tell readers why. The Republican majority inserted language at the last minute that would prohibit religious organizations from participating. The Catholic and Lutheran churches, and many others, sponsor some of the best not- for-profit housing development organizations in the country. It is only because of this ridiculous action by arch-conservative Republicans that I cast my vote "no". It was not because I was opposed to tougher regulations and oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

    The House Financial Services Committee, which I chair, moved aggressively after we took over as the majority party in January, 2007, and passed GSE Reform in March of 2007. We worked cooperatively with Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson to strengthen the bill and the full house voted for GSE reform in early May 2007. I also proposed to Secretary Paulson that we include GSE reform in the stimulus package passed by Congress in January 2008, but he declined, citing problems with the White House with this approach. Now, thanks to the efforts of the Democratic majority, and thanks to the work of former-Chairman Mike Oxley, President Bush can finally count GSE reform as an accomplishment. (snip)

    http://www.usnews.com/blogs/sam-deal...eddie-mac.html
    Frank is full of shit. Aside from the obvious conflict of interest of having his BOYFRIEND working for Fannie Mae; Frank did NOTHING to publicly sound the alarm about Fannie and Freddie. On the one hand he claims that he saw the need to reform them but he was PUBLICLY saying in 2004 that there was NO NEED for increased oversight or reform. LET"S GO TO THE VIDEOTAPE and look at those C-Span broadcast House hearings. Who are we supposed to believe ? Barney or our own eyes and ears ? As late as July of this year he was publicly saying they were both "fundamentally sound". Frank was either ignorant
    of the facts or deliberately lied about the condition of Fan & Fred.

    Fannie and Freddie had NOTHING to do with predatory lending. They were NOT lending the money and writing the mortgages. And Frank KNOWS it ! Where was his effort to rein in Countrywide which WAS lending ? Again, let's review the House hearings in 2004. Not one Democrat said anything about "predatory lending". All, including Frank lauded Fan. & Fred and lionized Franklin Raines.

    Frank and his fellow Dems stymied every Republican/ Bush effort to regulate Fannie and Freddie. Frank knows it and he knows WHY- the millions Fannie and Freddie execs were doling out in political contributions.Not to mention the largesse of Countrywide in both campaign contribs and sweetheart mortgages at below market interest rates to Democrat Congressmen and Senators.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    ^^^You're hopeless Stoner.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    ^^^ this is exactly why America NEEDS 4 years of an Obama presidency with democratic majorities in both houses of congress... so there can be absolutely no possible way that the results of Democratic policies / actions can be blamed on anyone else but the Democrats who established those policies and took those actions !

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ^^^ this is exactly why America NEEDS 4 years of an Obama presidency with democratic majorities in both houses of congress... so there can be absolutely no possible way that the results of Democratic policies / actions can be blamed on anyone else but the Democrats who established those policies and took those actions !
    Yet we just had 6 years of a republican presidency with a republican majority in both houses of congress and some on the right still won't take any of the blame for the end results of their policies/actions.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    Yet we just had 6 years of a republican presidency with a republican majority in both houses of congress and some on the right still won't take any of the blame for the end results of their policies/actions.
    Right? But you know it was the last 2 years when the dems were in there that caused allll the problems. Oh, and Clinton. and Carter. and every other democratic president. Never the Republicans though, things go swimmingly when they are in office.
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    Ya'll bitches need to calm down. Cerously.
    In other words: Boo-motherfucking-hoo

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Miss_Luscious View Post
    Right? But you know it was the last 2 years when the dems were in there that caused allll the problems. Oh, and Clinton. and Carter. and every other democratic president. Never the Republicans though, things go swimmingly when they are in office.

    Barney Fwank can spin this anyway he wants, but this whole mess was a s a result of a liberal initiative: the crazy notion that everyone should own their own house. They created an environment that essentially forced banks to loan money to people they wouldn't have gone near otherwise. The Republicans are guilty of not standing up for their principles, but whenever they broached the subject, the liberals were quick to play the race card.

    All the proof you need to know this is almost an exclusively a democratic problem is that the democratic congress hasn't held hearings because they can't find a republican as with as much to answer for as several democrats.
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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ^^^ this is exactly why America NEEDS 4 years of an Obama presidency with democratic majorities in both houses of congress... so there can be absolutely no possible way that the results of Democratic policies / actions can be blamed on anyone else but the Democrats who established those policies and took those actions !
    I wish. More like Republicans and Bush and Big Business, and rich people will take the blame. Every side always finds someone else to blame. Just like every side finds a way to take credit.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    ^^^You're hopeless Stoner.
    After I take apart one of your arguments, I can always count on you coming up with a pithy response.

    I blame Republicans for reckless Federal spending.
    I blame Chris Cox and his fellow Republicans for inadequate regulation of Wall Street. Cox eliminated the "uptick rule" and relied on voluntary compliance with leveraging and other regs. Cox has stood up and taken responsibility .
    I blame Bush and McCain for NOT publicizing the Fannie and Freddie mess. It's all well and good that they tried and the Dems stymied them. If it was that potentially dangerous (and obviously it was) why didn't Bush go on National T.V. or put it in a SOTU message or hammer on it at one of his infrequent press conferences ? Why didn't he call a meeting of all the major banks and tell them NOT to buy or sell Fannie and Freddie related securities ?

    The Republicans are NOT blameless and I NEVER said they were.
    Last edited by Eric Stoner; 10-09-2008 at 08:29 AM.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    After I take apart one of your arguments, I can always count on you coming up with a pithy response.
    That's just it, you didn't take my argument apart, you just chose to disregard it. That's what makes you hopeless.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    I blame Republicans for reckless Federal spending.
    I blame Chris Cox and his fellow Republicans for inadequate regulation of Wall Street. Cox eliminated the "uptick rule" on relied on voluntary compliance with leveraging and other regs. Cox has stood up and taken responsibility .
    I blame Bush and McCain for NOT publicizing the Fannie and Freddie mess. It's all well and good that they tried and the Dems stymied them. If it was that potentially dangerous (and obviously it was) why didn't Bush go on National T.V. or put it in a SOTU message or hammer on it at one of his infrequent press conferences ? Why didn't he call a meeting of all the major banks and tell them NOT to buy or sell Fannie and Freddie related securities ?

    The Republicans are NOT blameless and I NEVER said they were.
    You actually did say they were blameless in regards to the housing problems. All I'm saying is that there is equal blame to go around, it's good to see that you are finally acknowledging that fact.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    You actually did say they were blameless in regards to the housing problems. All I'm saying is that there is equal blame to go around, it's good to see that you are finally acknowledging that fact.
    Nobody in Washington is blameless here, RH, but this is overwhelmingly the fault of Democrats. The only excuse the Republicans can use is that they're not as responsible as the Democrats in this
    case, which is no excuse at all.
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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    That's just it, you didn't take my argument apart, you just chose to disregard it. That's what makes you hopeless.

    You actually did say they were blameless in regards to the housing problems. All I'm saying is that there is equal blame to go around, it's good to see that you are finally acknowledging that fact.
    Unless I missed something, you claimed that Barney Frank was PROACTIVE in trying to prevent Fannie and Freddie from going broke AND that Republicans were EQUALLY responsible for the housing bubble. I'm sorry but the facts say otherwise. Melonie and I have repeatedly posted on this and anyone can look at the C-Span tapes for themselves.

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    Default Re: Obama and Frank try to rewrite history

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    Unless I missed something, you claimed that Barney Frank was PROACTIVE in trying to prevent Fannie and Freddie from going broke AND that Republicans were EQUALLY responsible for the housing bubble. I'm sorry but the facts say otherwise. Melonie and I have repeatedly posted on this and anyone can look at the C-Span tapes for themselves.
    Sorry, the fact that you and Melonie have posted out of context quotes/congressional votes does not make you correct. If anything, republican led deregulation had a much bigger impact in this mess than Barney Frank.

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