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Thread: Is soy protein bad for you?

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    Senior Member no.speak's Avatar
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    Is soy protein bad for you?

    Ugggghhh! I am really confused. I've been taking soy protein isolate for awhile now (I'm vegan and despise lentils). I have 25-30g of it per day.

    I can't get an impartial judgment. Every article I read is either all for it, or says it will give me cancer and atrophy my brain.

    I've asked my doctor, and he basically shrugged and suggested I go back to "lean meats".

    What do you guys know about this?

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    Member Cool Hand Lucy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    I've heard that before and it always makes my dander rise. Soy protein is NOT bad for you. It's not encouraged in the bodybuilding community because it's (supposedly) less usable by the body than animal-based proteins.

    Your doctor sounds pretty unenlightened if he's suggesting to a vegan that she start eating meat (I'm vegan as well BTW).

    Also I just pictured you trying to choke down cups and cups of lentils and I giggled. They're kind of awful little things.

    I think it's helpful to remember that soy is a widely eaten protein source in many cultures who have *longer* life expectancies and better general health than we. Not that those differences are all down to soy, but it's certainly not harmful.

    Here's a short article I found on a vegan website about soy safety.

    http://www.veganhealth.org/articles/soynorris

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    Senior Member no.speak's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    ^Thanks!

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    Member Cool Hand Lucy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Quote Originally Posted by no.speak View Post
    ^Thanks!
    You're welcome! Now I'm craving tempeh.

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    google soy dangers....

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    Member Cool Hand Lucy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Quote Originally Posted by ~Isabella View Post
    google soy dangers....
    Yeah but most of that is nonsense. Even the studies that indicate it might slightly increase the risk of breast cancer are starting with the assumption that someone would be eating absurdly large amounts.

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Soy Dangers Summarized

    SOY DANGERS:
    • High levels of phytic acid in soy reduce assimilation of calcium, magnesium, copper, iron and zinc. Phytic acid in soy is not neutralized by ordinary preparation methods such as soaking, sprouting and long, slow cooking. High phytate diets have caused growth problems in children.
    • Trypsin inhibitors in soy interfere with protein digestion and may cause pancreatic orders. In test animals soy containing trypsin inhibitors caused stunted growth.
    • Soy phytoestrogens disrupt endocrine function and have the potential to cause infertility and to promote breast cancer in adult women.
    • Soy phytoestrogens are potent antithyroid agents that cause hypothyroidism and may cause thyroid cancer. In infants, consumption of soy formula has been linked to autoimmune thyroid disease.
    • Vitamin B12 analogs in soy are not absorbed and actually increase the body’s requirement for B12.
    • Soy foods increase the body’s requirement for vitamin D.

    • Fragile proteins are denatured during high temperature processing to make soy protein isolate and textured vegetable protein.
    • Processing of soy protein results in the formation of toxic lysinoalanine and highly carcinogenic nitrosamines.
    • Free glutamic acid or MSG, a potent neurotoxin, is formed during soy food processing and added to many soy foods.
    • Soy foods contain high levels of aluminum which is toxic to the nervous system and the kidneys.

    SOY INFANT FORMULA — BIRTH CONTROL PILLS FOR BABIES
    • Babies fed soy-based formula have 13,000 to 22,000 times more estrogen compounds in their blood than babies fed milk-based formula.
    • Infants exclusively fed soy formula receive the estrogenic equivalent of at least five birth control pills per day.

    • Male infants undergo a “testosterone surge” during the first few months of life, when testosterone levels may be as high as those of an adult male. During this period, baby boys are programmed to express male characteristics after puberty, not only in the development of their sexual organs and other masculine physical traits, but also in setting patterns in the brain characteristic of male behavior.
    • Pediatricians are noticing greater numbers of boys whose physical maturation is delayed, or does not occur at all, including lack of development of the sexual organs. Learning disabilities, especially in male children, have reached epidemic proportions.
    • Soy infant feeding—which floods the bloodstream with female hormones that inhibit testosterone—cannot be ignored as a possible cause for these tragic developments. In animals, soy feeding indicates that phytoestrogens in soy are powerful endocrine disrupters.
    • Almost 15 percent of white girls and 50 percent of African-American girls show signs of puberty such as breast development and pubic hair, before the age of eight. Some girls are showing sexual development before the age of three. Premature development of girls has been linked to the use of soy formula and exposure to environmental estrogens such as PCBs and DDE.

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    Member Cool Hand Lucy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    We'll start with the breast cancer myth:

    Research findings are not clear on whether soy products are safe for women who have had estrogen-receptor positive breast cancer. Some researchers believe that two servings per day of soy products such as soymilk, tofu, or tempeh are fine for these women, and others discourage soy consumption completely. Soy products do not appear to have any effect on women who have had estrogen-receptor negative breast cancer. However, soy foods can interfere with the effectiveness of certain cancer medications, so speak to your oncologist or physician before adding more soy to your diet.
    Like all foods, soy has its advantages and disadvantages. Soybeans are rich in essential omega-3 fatty acids, but tend to be higher in total fat than other beans. Many soy products derive roughly half their calories from fat, while black beans, pinto beans, or other varieties are only about 4 percent fat. Also, soy extracts, such as genistein, may not have the same beneficial effects as products made with the whole bean.
    However, it’s also to remember that a vegan diet of beans, vegetables, grains, and fruits does not have to include soy products to be nutritionally complete. Soy products make convenient and tasty substitutes for meat and other unhealthy foods that people, quite rightly, are looking to avoid. However, the benefits of complete protein and soluble fiber can easily be found in an array of plant foods.
    In human research studies, soy products have been shown to lower serum cholesterol levels, in part due to their rich content of soluble fiber, and the isoflavones also play a role in bone formation. Soy products have been shown to reduce estrogen activity, at least in premenopausal women, which, over the long run, reduces cancer risk. The evidence is not as clear for postmenopausal women.

    A handful of individuals and organizations have taken an anti-soy position and have questioned the safety of soy products. In general, this position latches to statistically insignificant findings, understates how powerfully the research refutes many of the main anti-soy points, and relies heavily on animal research studies, which are medically irrelevant to human health.

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    Member Cool Hand Lucy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    More:

    www.llu.edu//llu/vegetarian/soy2.html
    www.foodrevolution.org/what_about_soy.htm
    www.soybean.com/drsuz.htm



    Soy and Breast Cancer

    Claim : Soy increases risk of breast cancer.
    Among the very first health claims made for soy is that it may reduce incidence of breast cancer. It seemed so obvious when one compared the very low rates of breast cancer in Asian countries using large amounts of soy with rates in North American countries that used comparatively small amounts of soy. The risk reduction was thought to be due to the isoflavones (mainly genestein and daidzen) in soy. Isoflavones are a type of phytoestrogen (plant estrogen) that has been thought to interfere with the ability of the potent human form of estrogen to increase cell proliferation and, therefore, cancer risk. However, studies have been mixed. While some do indeed show soy acting as an anti-estrogen, others suggest soy may act as a weak estrogen itself, increasing cancer risk. Interestingly, some studies have shown that while small amounts of genestein increase cell growth, large amounts inhibit it. Finally, there is some evidence that women eating soy from an early age (especially during puberty) do reduce their breast cancer risk, while there seems to be less protection for those who begin to eat soy later in life.

    Conclusion: We still do not know all the answers where soy and breast cancer are concerned. However, the evidence is sufficient to say that soy consumption does not increase risk of breast cancer and may reduce risk in some people, especially if soy is consumed from an early age. For those who have estrogen-positive breast cancer, it also appears safe to use soy in moderation.

    Soy and Thyroid

    Claim : Soy contains natural chemicals known as goitrogens that interfere with thyroid function. These can cause an enlargement of the thyroid gland (a “goiter”) and symptoms of hypothyroidism, such as lethargy, dullness, coldness, and depression.
    It is true that soy contains goitrogens, as do many other foods such as cruciferous vegetables (cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli, and brussel sprouts), sweet potatoes, lima beans, and millet. However, these foods have been found only to cause problems when iodine intake is low , because goitrogens do their damage by interfering with the thyroid gland's ability to utilize iodine. Between 1951 and 1961, several cases of goiter were diagnosed in infants who had been fed infant formula made from soy flour. These cases are frequently cited by the anti-soy lobbyists to prove soy damages thyroid function (especially in infants). But not a single case of goiter in infants has been caused by soy formula since the 1960s. At that time the soy formula base was changed from soy flour to soy protein isolates, which are low in goitrogens, and manufacturers began fortifying soy formula with iodine.
    Soy does not cause thyroid problems in healthy, well-nourished people who are not deficient in iodine. However, people who do not have a reliable source of iodine could increase their risk of thyroid problems if they eat a lot of soy and/or other foods rich in goitrogens. Iodized salt, dairy products, and fish are the main dietary sources of iodine, and most multivitamin/mineral supplements provide the recommended daily allowance. So the answer is not to avoid soy or cruciferous vegetables, but to get enough iodine.
    Conclusion : There is no evidence that eating soy foods regularly causes thyroid problems in healthy people who include sufficient iodine in the diet.


    Soy and Cognitive Function

    Claim: Soyfoods, especially tofu, can cause mental deterioration and accelerate aging.
    One study done in Hawaii (the Honolulu Heart Study) found that Japanese-American men who ate the most tofu in middle age had the greatest mental deterioration and dementia as seniors. This study is widely cited as evidence that tofu may cause a reduction in cognitive function. Interestingly, there have been at least three other studies that have suggested that soy provides significant beneficial effects on cognitive function. In addition populations with relatively high soy intake (about a serving a day), including people in Asia and Seventh-day Adventists, experience lower rates of dementia than those populations who eat little if any soy. While this does not prove that soy is beneficial, it does suggest that moderate soy consumption is likely not detrimental.
    Conclusion. The weight of the evidence suggests that soy may offer some benefits to cognitive function, although more research is needed before firm conclusions can be made on this issue.

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    Member Cool Hand Lucy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Babies:

    Babies who drink soy formula receive significant amounts of estrogen-like compounds (phytoestrogens) in the form of soy isoflavones. This happens at a developmental time when permanent effects are theoretically possible. Some have speculated that soy formula might be responsible for early puberty in girls or infertility in boys. The August 15, 2001 issue of The Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA) contains the results of a study of 811 adults, some of who drank soy formula as children and others who drank milk-based formulas. No statistically significant differences were observed between the groups in either women or men.

    Isabella-- btw I'm hope this isn't coming across as bitchy. It isn't meant to at all
    I've totally read those reports as well, but the problem with this (or really any) health question is that you can always find just as many sources to refute as to support.

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    Featured Member Paintbaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/ar...ink-it-is.aspx

    Yes, most soy is bad for you. Soy that has been fermented, such as miso or tempeh, is not. Big soy is big business---and it is finding its way into almost everything these days.

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    I'm on the fence about soy. The only time I completely gave it up though was when I was carrying and bfing my sons. There has been major evidence that the phytoestrogens can harm a male fetus and I couldn't find much evidence to dispute that (& it's the only one of the claims that made sense didn't smack of a desperate scare tactic to me).

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    Veteran Member naughty_princess's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    all things in moderation.

    the end

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Soy is not health food. I agree with all the posters who basically said the same thing. Check out www.westonaprice.org, enter site, do a search on "soy" and you'll get all the information on it you'll ever need!

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Use sparingly! Non-fermented soy = bad.

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintbaby View Post
    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/ar...ink-it-is.aspx

    Yes, most soy is bad for you. Soy that has been fermented, such as miso or tempeh, is not. Big soy is big business---and it is finding its way into almost everything these days.
    ^^^^^Yes!

    I used to be all about the soy products.....but not at all anymore...its just not worth it

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    Veteran Member BeBe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    I also think it depends on your body and how it works to break down foods. I eventually developed an allergic reaction to soy, but many of my friends can down it with no problems. Everyone's body is different so be aware of the best fuels for your body. As with anything, I would use it sparingly and be aware of its uses and complaints.

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    Senior Member Aline's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    I have mixed feelings about this as well - I am currently under treatment for major depression, which I have suffered from for as long as I can remember, and the naturopath I have been seeing suggested to avoid soy as it will adversely affect thyroid function (I was diagnosed as hypothyroid), thereby exacerbating the depression. I guess in cases of people that suffer from hypothyroidism or also from severe PMS (contrary to popular belief) it is suggested to worsen the situation.

    On the other hand it seems like EVERYTHING at some point or another has been classified as "bad," so everything in moderation I guess.

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    Veteran Member ediblecrayonz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Why don't you just eat soy beans? You can find them in the freezer section of most grocery stores. I refuse to believe that any vegetables are that unhealthy for you. I wish you guys would post your sources and think about who is publishing this data and paying for the studies. Obviously if the Dairy Farmers of America are publishing it, well, they have their reasons. Think FDA, ADA, and peer reviewed scientific journals. Anyway, back to the beans. If you can find them with shell-on, look up "Alan Wong's Spicy Edamame." It's my favorite dish ever. They serve them at The Pineapple Room at Ala Moana Mall in Honolulu.

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    Senior Member Aline's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    The reason I did not cite sources is that it takes too much time. The people/articles I got my information from are all legit sources, mostly independent researchers not affiliated with any particular organization. There will always be differing opinions about this subject, even in professional circles, however, there have been numerous studies that seem to confirm potential risks involved in consuming soy products on a regular basis. A lot of these studies conducted were done supplying subjects with such large amounts of soy that results are probably not applicable to the "real world," however, a lot of them were done using quantities people would normally consume.

    I think you must also take into account that it depends on the person's unique makeup: I do NOT find it hard to believe that a person with pre-existing problems (problems that are exacerbated by soy) can notice a worsening of their symptoms when consuming even small amounts of soy, whereas another person may feel nothing at all, even when consuming large quantities. The fact is that more and more research is being done on soy, and there are facts coming to light about it that were not previously known. That doesn't necessarily mean it's bad for you, but I also think it is possible that it's not quite the "miracle food" it was once thought to be.

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    ^^^^completely agree!

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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    Here's my 2 cents. As a vegetarian, I added soy protein to my diet daily.
    Even more when I got into lifting weights and would need an intake of 100+ grams of protein. For some reason about a year or so ago I noticed I would have bizarre reactions everytime I digested it and I'm not referring to the modified versions. I swell everytime I eat it, after doing more research I decided to eliminate it from my diet all together. I just feel there are better options for our bodies.
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    God/dess ahmeerah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    ^^^ I used to swell too. My waist would grow like 5 inches after eating something like soy yogurt. It was awful.

    I'm all for better options for my body. Now I'm loving the poultry and fish for my protein needs.

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    Senior Member DarkMoon08's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is soy protein bad for you?

    I cut my soy intake to 25 grams or less a day and haven't had a problem, but I don't eat the fake 'meat' and fake 'dairy' soy products either (outside of soy milk).

    I personally don't agree with the 'everything in moderation' theory. I think it's the biggest lie ever told by the so called 'health' experts. But that's just me...and who am I right.
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