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Thread: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

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    Veteran Member Morgan_TX's Avatar
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    Default Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I've had this idea, and I'd love to get some input on it. What if there was a voluntary stripper's union for dancers, club owners, and club employees? We'll call it the Strippers and Club Owners (SACO) for the sake of ease. Here's what I'm thinking:

    SACO's three primary platforms would be:
    1)To shed light on the problems that are common in exotic dancers, specifically substance abuse and domestic violence;
    2)To improve working conditions for exotic dancers and strip club professionals;
    3)To provide a clearinghouse of information for exotic dancers and club owners and group benefits such as health care, worker's compensation, and legal aid.

    For the first position, the campaign would be two-fold: First, education in member stripclubs through brochures and pamphlets, and perhaps (on down the line) a certification for some dancers as domestic violence crisis counselors or substance abuse counselors. Second, by providing financial assistance and relocation assistance to members affected by domestic violence, AND by providing substance abuse rehabilitation and referrals to stripper-friendly rehab organizations and resources.

    For the second position, union certification would be a direct result of clubs meeting the voluntary standards that SACO sets. There would also be a PR campaign.

    For the third position, we could offer group rates for health care and have SACO clubs contribute to a worker's comp fund. We could also provide legal assistance to dancers battling a work-related issue (discrimination in a day job as a result of dancing, lawsuits against clubs and owners, etc.) as well as legal aid for criminal prosecution that may occur from overzealous local cops.

    So the question is, how do we fund this, and how do we encourage dancers and club owners to join?

    We'd fund it through personal and business dues. Clubs who wanted to be SACO members would have to do a couple of things. First, they'd have to agree to follow the SACO club guidelines that would specify how they'd treat the dancers, etc. Second, they'd have to pay for an initial inspection of their club where our state/regional rep would go to their club, talk to the employees and dancers, and make a determination whether they were truly following the rules. Third, they'd have to pay an annual re-certification fee and have their SACO membership reviewed once a year. Their inspection and re-certification fees would be determined by two things: 1)the size of their club, as determined by annual sales and/or the size of their dancer roster, and 2)the percentage of dancers and employees who are SACO members (more on this later). So if I ran a large club with, say, 500 dancers on the roster, my annual re-certification fee might be $10,000. But if 250 of my dancers were SACO members, I could get a discount on my fees up to half, paying only $5,000. Therefore, it is to my personal advantage to encourage my dancers to join SACO.

    So what's the benefit to the clubs of SACO membership? First, SACO will maintain an online database of all their member clubs. Through advertising and public relations, we will begin to educate the general public on stripclub conditions and the purpose of SACO. If a young man wants to go to a stripclub, but wants to make sure that he's going to a "good" one, he can search for a nearby club on the SACO site. Secondly, SACO dancers will receive a discount on their dues for working in a SACO club. A dancer who goes the extra mile to join an organization like SACO is generally going to be a dancer who takes her business seriously, and thus is going to be much lower-drama and easier to manage than someone off the street. Therefore, it helps clubs to join SACO because they will then be able to recruit a higher-caliber entertainer and employee.

    Dancers and employees would pay annual dues. The cost would probably be minimal--I'm thinking like $50 a year for waitstaff, bartenders, VIP hosts, valets, etc. About $100 a year for dancers and DJs, and about $200 a year for managers. But if your "home club" is a SACO club, you can get a discount on your dues. You can also qualify for all of the SACO services (reduced medical insurance and legal aid, etc.). If you have a problem with your club, you can take the problem to your club/local union rep, and they will attempt to mediate a solution between you and your club. If the problem is serious, they will push it up to the state/regional reps, who will determine whether to impose sanctions or censure on the club. If it's VERY serious or it's part of a pattern of bad stuff, it could go to the national board, who may decide to revoke the club's SACO membership.

    What are the advantages to the dancers? First, they can qualify for all the SACO services. Second, they have increased bargaining power as members of SACO. Third, they can be assured that a SACO club has met SACO standards and it would help them choose a club.

    So that's my idea--the basic outline of it anyways. Now for the questions:

    1)If there was an organization like SACO, would you be likely to join?
    2)If there was an organization like SACO, do you think your club would be likely to join?
    3)What other things would you like to see in a labor organization for exotic dancers?
    4)Could something like this ever work? Why or why not?
    5)IF this is something that might work and you'd be interested in joining or helping out as a state/regional/local/club rep, PM me.

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    Veteran Member MysteriousMisty's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I once heard about a strippers union in San Francisco but I don't know if it still exists. It would be GREAT to have a union but whether or not it would do any good for Vegas strippers is questionable.

    Girls can seek an atty. if they've been sexually harassed or refused employment based on race or whatever but it will result in being black listed. The lousy bitch that stole $500from me at my old club last year is working at some other club and when I went in to audition, she told the mgr. not to hire me. But all three white girls who auditioned were hired. See what they're allowed to get away with theft whenever they're sleeping with mgrs or paying them a large sum of money out of their earnings? The only downside about having a union would result in earning less money than we already do at this time.

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    God/dess Kylea2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Yep, San Fran had one that was started by the workers of the Lusty Lady. Here's some relevant links:

    http://www.lustyladysf.com/history.html
    http://www.bayswan.org/
    http://www.bayswan.org/EDAindex.html

    Canada also has one.
    http://www.exoticdancerscanada.com/
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    God/dess Elvia's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I don't see how we could really join forces with club owners, seeing as how many of them are engaging in illegal practices to cheat us out of as much money as possible. The industry is built up on illegal practices now, no clubs are going to want to give that up.

    But I don't mean to discourage you. It's still a good idea, just needs a few thins worked out.

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    Veteran Member Alexis81's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I did a report last year on a strippers union. I'll email you all my research when my lap top gets fixed - hopefully in a week or so.
    Alexis



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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I totally wouldn't mind helping on this. I think the dues are a bit high considering what dancers are making these days... but I don't know what dues at most unions are. I'd like to see more regulation of clubs for sure! If I had my way though dancers would be regulated as well... so maybe I'm not the best person to ask. LOL
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Elvia View Post
    I don't see how we could really join forces with club owners, seeing as how many of them are engaging in illegal practices to cheat us out of as much money as possible. The industry is built up on illegal practices now, no clubs are going to want to give that up.

    But I don't mean to discourage you. It's still a good idea, just needs a few thins worked out.
    ^^^I agree. Also, unions for dancers have been tried many times, only to be shut down by high powered people(club owners and their connections).


    OP, I have also thought about doing a dancers union and have been told some stories about girls who have tried, one of them (an old timer) is actually living with me at the moment.

    I think the best thing would be to get a paycheck for minimum wage like everyone else who lives on tips as their primary income. Lots of clubs will not like to do that, because that means now they have to pay payroll taxes and part ss and medicare.

    Maybe if all the dancers started to boycott or strike against all these clubs, letting them know we are tired of their shit, and let them know once and for all that WE are what makes them money. Without us, they have nothing. NO overpriced beers, no cover, no cut of tip outs, funny money, nothing. But yet we still run and pay whatever house fees they give us, help sell their rediculously over priced drinks and bottles, tipping of many employess, spend money on our up keep and pay the highest taxes for being self employed. That is not fair. Not in my eyes anyway.

    If we got a minimum wage paycheck, we would not be considered self employed anymore and our taxes would be the same as those with a w-2 and we won't get that hefty self employment tax and pay full portion of our own medicare, social security and pay out of pocket for insurance. That is my biggest concern.

    The next thing for me would be the clubs need to stop hiring so many girls. Only a set amount of girls should be allowed to work each shift, therefor keeping the earning ratio fair for each girl to make a decent profit each and every night.

    Seniority goes to house girls, out of town girls should not be allowed to work the better shifts(without working slower weekday shifts) like late night weekends and take away from girls who have been there far longer. That isn't fair either. NO matter how pretty you are. Business ethics go a long way and more girls would be happier and more appreciative if management and club owners would start being more considerate about the fact that we the women make the club and not the other way around.

    My last request would be that rules are fully enforced, AT ALL TIMES!!!!
    There is no reason to have extras girls working in a strip club. We sell fantasies and entertainment, not sex. This would also put the clubs who do follow the rules at less risk of losing liquor licenses and going out of business. Get these fucking manager 'pimps' out. They are only in it for themselves. We need REAL managers, not some high school buddies who are trying to line their pockets. I enjoy working at clubs where the manager runs the club like any other business, 'by the books'. Too much illegal activity going on and favortism or what not, is not good for business, for either the customer or the girls. Customers risk getting diseases from extras girls, girls risk going to jail and everyone sees them, the club gets put under investigation and faces possible convictions and jail/prison sentences and so on.

    Well thats my imput. I will apologize in advance if these concerns were already brought up. I dind't read through the whole thing. I just had to chime in because I had talked to some girl friends at work about doing this and also my room mate. The only thing I had a hard time trying to figure out was how I was going to convince thousands of Vegas ladies to strike against the clubs when we all pretty much have to work to make money. It would be great to see though. I will keep dreaming until it happens. But until it does happen and things change in this industry, I am done.

    Well MorganTX, I say go for it and hopefully lots of us SWers will support you and bring our friends in on the action to make a change.
    Last edited by greeneyedgrl; 01-31-2009 at 10:33 AM.

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    Veteran Member chris91's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I have a hard time believing that any club would go in for this.

    If they did, then they would have to stop making us work schedules, forcing girls to sell drinks in states where b-drinking is illegal, requiring mandatory tip outs to employees, yelling at us for sitting in the dressing room for more than 5 minutes, and fining us for leaving early even though we've already paid to be there. They'd have to actually treat us like the independent contractors that we are, and that would cost them more than they would gain from union advertising and drama free dancers.

    The only clubs that I think would be down for something like this are the very few who already meet our standards, and If you're working at one of them, then you don't really need a union.
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    ^^^ Well you would be surprised to learn that way way back all the clubs actually DID do this. Its been in the past 20 or so years that clubs are just popping up everywhere, and started setting a trend charging girls to work instead of them paying the girls.

    Of course the clubs aren't going to WANT to do this. No business is going to want to take a pay cut. That's where the union comes in. The women in this industry need work together and take a stand if they want to make a change. It is not going to happen just by people talking about it and doing nothing.

    Also, there are still quite a few clubs around in the midwest and I'm sure other areas that DO run by these guidelines and they were the best clubs I have ever worked at and I made great money all the time, not just on weekends or during big events. Now, the clubs may take a cut of your dance money to make a profit, but you don't really pay a house fee and the house fee you do pay is to tip the employees.

    As far as the minimum wage (EXAMPLE): Shot gun Willies in Denver gives you a minimum wage to work there for tax purposes. That is awesome. Takes the tax burden off of you. I don't know how the tip out system works there since I didn't work there(no ss card), but still that puts you as an employee and not independent contractor.

    Also some clubs pay you for every drink you sell, etc. etc, give you base pay for your booking (as long as you work the entire week) and offer health care. But these clubs are almost non existent in bigger cities. This is where the union benefits would help the most.

    When you are in a union, you can strike against your employer/company for not meeting your needs. We do need a union, but all the entertainers need to realize what the goal is that they are trying to pursue by joining one.

    Of course the clubs owners are NOT going to WANT to participate, but what choice would they have if ALL OF US striked against them????? Think about that.

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    Veteran Member chris91's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I think the idea of a union is wonderful and it would be pretty great if all of us striked against the bad clubs. But how would we even find all the dancers to get them in on it? Every year there's a crapton of girls who turn 18 and go off to become strippers. Plus, I'm seeing more and more girls coming in from other countries, and they hustle their asses off every damn day. What would keep the clubs from just hiring scabs and forgetting about us?
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    AudreyLeigh
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Never Gonna Happen. I wouldn't sign up for a union because I know its not going to work. And a stripper strike is just laughable... I mean really - MOST dancers are not like SW girls... there's no way they would go on strike... Unions have failed again and again. Strippers are disposable - and stripping is disposable.. its not like we're going to be getting a pension from this union - is it really going to fight for its girls with attorneys, etc? I highly doubt it. A pipe dream really...

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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Quote Originally Posted by AudreyLeigh View Post
    Never Gonna Happen. I wouldn't sign up for a union because I know its not going to work. And a stripper strike is just laughable... I mean really - MOST dancers are not like SW girls... there's no way they would go on strike... Unions have failed again and again. Strippers are disposable - and stripping is disposable.. its not like we're going to be getting a pension from this union - is it really going to fight for its girls with attorneys, etc? I highly doubt it. A pipe dream really...
    I couldn't have said this better!

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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Actually the problem is getting organized. It's hard to reach a group where the majority are younger and tend to want to party. That means they aren't as into organization for the most part.

    Now, if by some chance a group was able to pull this off, yes it would be a good thing for dancers. The girls of Lusty Lady did it and ended up buying out the club.

    If dancers went on strike everywhere clubs might survive for a little bit, but not very long. It's hard to get new girls working if there's no one to train them, and they don't have anyone to watch or study. The problem is that all of us would need to be gone from the clubs so long to let the clubs realize it that a large portion of dancers wouldn't be able to survive and would be forced to go back to work.

    In all seriousness, education is the key. Programs like Dancer Wealth show dancers how to make money, save money, and invest money so that they have residual income even if they aren't working. Residual income is key, because then dancers can step away, get organized/unionized and strike if need be. Even then though, you are dependent on getting enough dancers being able to step away that the clubs are forced to look at the situation and react.

    If you really believe in this my suggestion is to start by contacting the local Employers Council, and a few large unions for advice. They will be able to lead you in the right direction in regards to laws and how to set up the union. You might also read this:
    http://www.bayswan.org/EDAunionLL.html

    Begin with your own club, then expand into other clubs around the city and keep reaching out further. By the way, the Exotic Dancers Union of the Lusty Lady is apparently still active:
    http://www.usatoday.com/travel/cruis...&tid=000000000

    Why not give them a call for advice and see if there is a way to start a new chapter?
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Quote Originally Posted by AudreyLeigh View Post
    I wouldn't sign up for a union because I know its not going to work.
    It worked for the girls at the Lusty Lady. The fact is a union doesn't mean you get exactly what you want, but it does force the company to re-evaluate how they are running things.

    I'm going to say something here that is not going to be popular opinion. Dancer's are treated bad by many clubs because we let them. We went from high class burlesque where dancers weren't going out and talking to customers, not taking as much off, and not getting down on the floor to letting things slide into a situation that many dancers don't like. It was the slippery slope syndrome. The classy dancers didn't want to do it, but if they didn't some other dancer who needed the money was going to. At some point you have to stop the vicious circle, get people educated, organized and let those who are willing to work in bad conditions know that they are not doing themselves or anyone else any favors.

    If Thomas Philips and others had succeeded in getting a REPUTABLE burlesque union started before all of the regular strip clubs became popular, many dancers wouldn't have to put up with the things they do these days.
    http://books.google.com/books?id=fEt...sult#PPA161,M1

    I really believe that part of the reason that the Lusty Lady's union worked is because it was just one club. The Exotic Dancer Alliance worked for awhile too, but there were some other issues at play that I'm not going to state here - which I believe is one of the reasons they aren't around anymore. One important this is that your top people in the organization need to have a very good reputation and be able to continue acting appropriately.
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kylea2 View Post

    I really believe that part of the reason that the Lusty Lady's union worked is because it was just one club.
    I want to add that the Lusty Lady employees were comprised of dancers who had formed a pretty tight-knit community, wherein they were willing to work together and accept perhaps slightly lower wages to continue to work at a job they liked and in which they wanted to be secure. In my opinion it also bears noting that lapdancing is not the primary business of that club, and I do believe that lapdancing has a huge effect on solidarity. When the work is pretty much the same for each dancer and there is little opportunity to undermine someone else's earnings (intentionally or not) it is easier to get on the same side.

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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I work at the Lusty Lady and the reason it works there is because it's a peep show. We get paid by the hour to dance behind glass. Most clubs have an independent contractor-like structure, which makes things a bit more complicated.

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    God/dess Kylea2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    ^^^ Why is it that the gals from Lusty Lady only ever come on here when the discussion turns to their club?

    FYI, I would LOVE to see many of you on here more often! Particularly when these topics are being brought up.

    An independent contractor status doesn't mean that you can't unionize, by the way, simply that it takes more effort and organization.
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Yes you are right that independent contractors can also unionize, with time and effort...it just sounds a lot more complicated to me. I think the reason more strip clubs haven't is because it would take all the strippers unanimously deciding to strike, or whatever. And the majority (or at least more than half) of dancers, I think, see stripping as a way to make a quick buck and get out; not as a long term career (like working in a factory or something). The clubs already take a cut of their money, and I don't think a lot of girls might think it worth it to pay union dues on top. Also, any unionizing would involve publicity and a lot of girls want to stay anonymous.
    Most of the girls at the Lusty are college students, feminists, and/or (psueudo)intellectuals, not "(stereo)typical" strippers who are young single mothers or who come from poverty. LL dancers have less to lose, I think, in making a stand loudly. (btw, as well as being unionized, 5 years ago they became a worker-owned co-op).
    None of this means I think Lusty girls are "better" in any way than girls at other more traditional clubs; in fact I also work at the Hungry i here in town and in many ways prefer that format (more potential income), as well as the girls there (more real).
    Anyway those are my vague conclusions on the subject. There are actually a lot of things that annoy me about the LL; it's certainly not a SC utopia (although many of the girls there seem to smugly think so, even when they have never worked at another club so haven't even experienced the difference), and it pisses me off that they have done this amazing thing but haven't done any kind of outreach (afaik) to other clubs out there struggling against corruption, abuse, and exploitation.
    I know I've used a lot of extreme generalizations here, but hopefully you get my drift. I'm not trying to offend or discourage anyone. Just giving you my impressions after a lot of thought on the subject
    As far as not posting unless my club is mentioned: I have posted on here a few times but I'm new, and I mostly just lurk because I'm lazy and am afraid I will sound stupid or not as eloquent as I would like to be, and would just annoy everyone. Sorry.
    Last edited by rocketgirl; 02-05-2009 at 04:07 AM.

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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    This is absurd!!!!! A bunch of strippers going to union meetings? Hillarious.
    I once thought that a union was a shot in the dark idea... that we might benifit from - until I walked into The Lusty Lady in Seattle,Wa. I talked to managment about getting hired there. What I observed was lude acts, girls outdoing themselves for their tips. The base pay there is only 13/hr. They are union.
    What ever happened to the American Dream?
    Stripping is the most lucrative entry level position in the U.S. and you get the quickest raises(pun intended).
    What other job can a woman start off $100/hr.? Yes, I have seen terrible nights.... but it is a #s game and I always come out on top. I would be so mad if I had a base pay. Why would I want to pay dues to a union when I can just get healthcare on my own?
    I have been fortunate to have the freedom to dance wherever I want so I may be bias. It just seems so simple to me. If I am not being treated like a lady, I dance elsewhere. There is plenty of $ in the world and my attitude is I will prosper regardless, union or not. I am not trying to be rude , just thought I'd share my honest opinion.

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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Actually the Seattle club isn't unionized, only the SF one is.... and we don't really get tips . One of the things the girls are so proud of is how non-competitive it is there. We have a tip box, but none of that money goes to our paychecks. If you get tips in the private booth the club takes half, which I personally think is bullshit.

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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Quote Originally Posted by rocketgirl View Post
    I mostly just lurk because I'm lazy and am afraid I will sound stupid or not as eloquent as I would like to be, and would just annoy everyone. Sorry.
    I would venture to say that for the most part SW is probably one of the friendliest forums on the web... so don't be afraid to post!

    Quote Originally Posted by rocketgirl View Post
    I think, see stripping as a way to make a quick buck and get out; not as a long term career (like working in a factory or something). The clubs already take a cut of their money, and I don't think a lot of girls might think it worth it to pay union dues on top. Also, any unionizing would involve publicity and a lot of girls want to stay anonymous.
    Most of the girls at the Lusty are college students, feminists, and/or (psueudo)intellectuals, not "(stereo)typical" strippers who are young single mothers or who come from poverty.
    A LOT of girls do see stripping as a way to make a quick buck, Britney Ireland and I have been discussing that recently. However, there are some of us that look at it more long term. I've gone to college, graduated, and had the 9 to 5 desk job for many years... and hated it. I'd rather be at a SC any day over sitting in front of a computer, at a desk filled with papers and dealing with co-workers who I don't get along with. Oh, and hoarding Hostess cupcakes and soda to try to down how miserable I am. No, offices are not for me... I love the club environment. I'm sorry for those of you who don't like this industry, truly I am. However, for those of us who have been doing this for awhile and love it, unionizing or having laws changed gives us the opportunity to make the clubs better. Even if you don't enjoy working at a SC, would you be against other people helping to make your work environment better?

    To the OP: I think I may have just hit on something else. Do you really want to start a union? Maybe a solution that would work better is just to get some of the industry leaders including dancers, DJs, SC owners, and Management together to form "Legislative Group". This group could research the current club environments, take complaints/ideas from dancers about their current club, and create proposals for new laws. Really the issue with SC is that they get away with so much stuff because the laws are not well written for our industry! How many of you would like to see the clubs kept to a certain minimum temperature? How many would like to see laws regarding the cleanliness of the clubs? What about dressing room size requirements? Rocketgirl, working in San Francisco you probably know that the dressing room at the Garden of Eden is teeny tiny, and they have a lot of dancers! I've also heard of girls complaining of cockroaches in the dressing rooms of MANY of the San Fran clubs. In those areas there should be laws on how often the dressing rooms are sprayed. Dancer's shouldn't have to work in those conditions. Theoretically, yes, they don't have to... there are always other jobs - but you get my point. Why not work on making things better?

    Dancers haven't gotten anything from standing by the wayside and letting ill intentioned or mis-informed club managers make all the decisions other than being treated worse. If you want this industry to be more respectable, and you want better working conditions, then you have to actually DO SOMETHING about it! That's why a lot of us have started teaching others about this industry. Britney teaches DancerWealth... because it makes things better for other dancers by earning them more money. Clubs don't want to lose their top earners, because they are the ones paying the most in tip-outs. Nakita is teaching the feature school, which helps dancers understand what goes into featuring and contracts so the dancers don't get screwed over. There are many of us that teach dance and use those same classes to talk to students about how to actually work in the club enviroment and the things they can to to find a better club, better customers etc. Why should this be limited to teaching though? Why not reach out and help get the laws changed?
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  22. #22
    Veteran Member Jo Weldon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    I wrote a piece about why I'm ambivalent about stripper unions, which I presented at the Socialist Scholar's Conference in NYC about ten years ago

    http://www.gstringsforever.com/stripperunion.html

    Ambivalent means "of two minds," so it's not that I think it's a bad idea...I just don't know how might work for dancers who don't intend to keep working at the same place, or even in the stripping industry, for more than a few years.
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  23. #23
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    In every example spanning the last 70+ years, unions ultimately result in the following ...

    - siphoning off of some percentage of worker 'productivity' to fund union activities
    - higher costs / lower profits for owners / operators of unionized businesses
    - redistribution of worker 'earnings' i.e. the best / hardest working / most talented get to keep less, and the worst / slackers / least talented get subsidized

    Anybody who invests the time to research the actual history of the Lusty Lady will find that their 'unionization' was not so co-incidentally accompanied by a rash of bankruptcies. Based on the latest information I have heard, the business is now employee owned (since no private business owner can turn a profit), the owner / dancers have had to enact across the board pay cuts in order to keep the business solvent, and none of the owner / dancers are able to earn major bucks.


    I also concur that, while dated, Jo's treatise covers the one essential issue of exotic dancing very well. Like professional athletes, professional 'strippers' have a limited career time window in which to 'sell' their talents and assets. Thus the 'equalizing' effect of unionization is guaranteed to minimize the potential of girls with exceptional talents and assets, while at the same time subsidizing girls whose attributes, work ethic etc. are 'below average'. In other words, while the Screen Actor's Guild may be perceived as a good thing for 'extras' actors, the movie industry would collapse if those with exceptional talents and assets i.e. 'stars' were bound by the same financial / work constraints. And just like the fact that very few customers want to pay full price to see a movie without any 'stars', very few strip club customers want to pay full price to enter a club without any 'top shelf' dancers.

    To make matters worse, if you combine the two points above, i.e. unionized dancers earnings potential being 'regulated' thus driving girls with exceptional talents and assets to non-union clubs in other areas, plus some degree of financial 'subsidy' allowing below average dancers to financially survive in unionized clubs, it creates an extremely fertile breeding ground for 'extras' ... because 'extras' money becomes the only remaining source of individual earnings that will not have to be 'shared' with the club. the union, and other dancers.
    Last edited by Melonie; 02-08-2009 at 10:07 PM.

  24. #24
    God/dess Kylea2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stripper's Union? Opinions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jo Weldon View Post
    I just don't know how might work for dancers who don't intend to keep working at the same place, or even in the stripping industry, for more than a few years.
    This is EXACTLY why I mentioned that a Legislative Group might be better than a union. All you would need for such a group is a few passionate people who want to make things better for all dancers by getting the laws changed. After all, many of the things dancers complain about could be fixed by having better laws about the working conditions in the clubs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    In every example spanning the last 70+ years, unions ultimately result in the following ...

    - siphoning off of some percentage of worker 'productivity' to fund union activities
    - higher costs / lower profits for owners / operators of unionized businesses
    - redistribution of worker 'earnings' i.e. the best / hardest working / most talented get to keep less, and the worst / slackers / least talented get subsidized

    Anybody who invests the time to research the actual history of the Lusty Lady will find that their 'unionization' was not so co-incidentally accompanied by a rash of bankruptcies. Based on the latest information I have heard, the business is now employee owned (since no private business owner can turn a profit), the owner / dancers have had to enact across the board pay cuts in order to keep the business solvent, and none of the owner / dancers are able to earn major bucks.
    You are right in that workers need more freedom in order to make more money without having to worry about giving away more of what they make. I have done a lot of research on the Lusty Lady and since I worked right next door, I also knew a lot of the dancers and worked with them at other clubs. Back then the Lusty Lady didn't have such a good reputation, and from what I hear it's cleaned up a lot. I think for them the union may have worked in their favor to create a "median" environment. They aren't really thriving, but not doing bad - exactly as you pointed out. Some people are okay with that though in the same way that they see being "middle class" okay rather than striving to have more money and things.

    Really though, the more I think about it and with the points both Jo & Melonie have brought up, a Legislative Group would be far better.
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