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Thread: Two infuriating questions.

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    Default Two infuriating questions.

    I am posting this here so I can get input from guys and girls alike. These two scenarios gave me a serious 'WTF just happened?' vibe so maybe someone can help me out.

    Situation A: Yesterday, I sat with a very nice gentleman and his friend. The man bought me a drink, told me how pretty I was, how much he liked me etc. I proceeded to ask him for a dance, and he said no, he doesn't do dances. I sat and chatted for approximately ten more minutes, then told him I had to go do some dances, but would be around. He looked upset, so I mentioned very tactfully that we also accept and appreciate tips for our time, if he would like me to stay. He then hands me $10 and says "You've ruined our relationship. Here's ten dollars, and don't come back." WTF HAPPENED? In my eyes, he didn't want me to leave, he didn't want dances, so I provided him with an alternative.

    Situation B: This has happened to me a milion god damn times. Guy seems super cool, we get along great, he asks what I like to do other than work. I list some of my hobbies. He then proceeds to ask me what I plan to do after dancing. Trusting my rapport with the customer, I am honest about it. He then tells me like likes me as a person and thinks I am cool, but can't get a dance because "Now I respect you too much and it would be weird", but generally tips me for the time. WTF? Respects me too much to get a dance? What the shit is that? This happens to me like once a week.

    Shed any light, anyone? This really annoys me.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    They're playing "pickup" games... plain and simple... There's a bunch of "guides" out there on how to "pick up" or "score" with strippers... They all agree that a guy should never pay for dances,... that's supposed to make you think he is "different" from all the other PLs at the SC...

    How to Pick Up a Stripper in 5 Simple Steps
    Step #4- Don't be like other guys
    Your actions inside the club will dictate how a stripper will perceive you. A stripper will be attracted to you if you appear to not care about her affections.

    This means sitting away from the main stage area where the girls are dancing, NOT tipping the dancers, tipping the bartender WELL, avoiding the standard "stripper services", and engaging other people in conversations.

    http://ezinearticles.com/?How-to-Pic...teps&id=435197

    Don’t Buy a Private Dance

    If you buy a lap dance you are instantly entered into a business transaction with the girl and you are just another sad bum who only wants her for her body. You, of course, understand that she is more deep and complex and has far more to offer a man than just her looks. Seriously though, this is the number one rule because if you are paying for her to rub her body against you then you are just a mark.

    http://www.gogetagirl.com/how-to-pick-up-strippers/

    Seducing strippers is a GAME where you don’t allow her to pull her “customer” frame on you. As long as you do not become her customer, you can get her.

    NEVER EVER act as a customer. Strippers make money off exploiting customers - and they know it. If you act at all like another customer, you'll just be another loser to them. They will use every trick in the book to get you to part with your money, like make you think that they’re all into you.

    http://www.seductiontuition.com/dere...strippers.html

    I googled "how to pickup a stripper" and found so many "guides" on picking up strippers,... its just ridiculous...

    http://www.pick-up-woman.com/10-how-...with-strippers
    http://www.adventures-of-a-pua.com/h...up-a-stripper/
    http://macktactics.com/how-to-pick-u...-a-strip-club/
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0TYkQkPklU
    http://www.theattractionforums.com/s...-veralynn.html
    http://www.stripclubseduction.com/
    http://pointlessbanter.net/2008/11/0...-money-on-her/
    http://www.askmen.com/dating/player_...ove_games.html
    http://www.bulletproofseduction.com/stripper/
    http://stripperpickupsecrets.com/

    Many more...
    Last edited by jack0177057; 06-26-2009 at 12:05 PM.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Yeah, this happens to me regularly too and leaves me wanting to knock them out. They're trying to be pick up artists. There's too much reality tv infiltrating their brains. By not being a PL like every other guy in the club and paying for it, and by telling you they "like you as a person" they think that's going to make you fall all over yourself for them. It all goes back to wanting to "bag a stripper" turning into a sport. They need lives.
    Last edited by JayATee; 06-26-2009 at 01:11 PM. Reason: typo
    Sorry I missed church. I was too busy practicing witchcraft and becoming a lesbian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lestat1 View Post
    ^^^ It's a penis, not a martini shaker.
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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    ^^ Sad thing is, that doesn't work for 98% of us, but the 2% that it does it what makes the guys keep doing it. Lame.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    ^yeah I find it lame that there are shows and books devoted to this "art". The fact that they can pull this off on any one of us is sad.
    Sorry I missed church. I was too busy practicing witchcraft and becoming a lesbian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lestat1 View Post
    ^^^ It's a penis, not a martini shaker.
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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    ^^^ I know. It's incredibly stupid. It's the most backwards, stupid advice I've ever heard.

    What they don't realize is that the dancer is simply NOT going to see them as anything other than a customer when they walk through the door. All they accomplish by acting irritated and not tipping is proving to us what a BAD CUSTOMER they are. And that's not going to impress us.

    There have been very few men that have walked through the strip club doors that I have ever been interested in. Of the very few that did, they all tipped me (and the other girls) something for our time. I wouldn't respect them otherwise, and would have immediately written them off. Because coming into a place of business and acting like that just shows me how rude and inconsiderate and juvenile they are. I can understand not wanting to spend too much, because then on the off chance that she did become interested, she would then be faced with the difficult dilemma of having to choose forgoing a good regular. But to go into a stripclub with the obvious intention of not tipping anything to the dancers will get you branded as a douchebag faster than anything.

    I don't think they're all "pick up artists" though. I think many (even most) of them are just genuinely confused by the concept of a strip club. I sense defensiveness and emotional anguish from too many of them to be pick up artists. They're just lonely and desperate, and want actual companionship, but then feel that it's disingenuous (which of course it is) when they realize we want to get paid for it, and get all butthurt. These people have no business trying to get those needs met in the sex industry, but it sure takes them awhile to figure it out.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vamp View Post
    As Katherine Hepburn put it so eloquently " Nature is what we were put here to rise above"

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Situation A: Yesterday, I sat with a very nice gentleman and his friend. The man bought me a drink, told me how pretty I was, how much he liked me etc. I proceeded to ask him for a dance, and he said no, he doesn't do dances. I sat and chatted for approximately ten more minutes, then told him I had to go do some dances, but would be around. He looked upset, so I mentioned very tactfully that we also accept and appreciate tips for our time, if he would like me to stay. He then hands me $10 and says "You've ruined our relationship. Here's ten dollars, and don't come back." WTF HAPPENED? In my eyes, he didn't want me to leave, he didn't want dances, so I provided him with an alternative.
    1. He doesnt understand the concept of a strip club or just doesnt care.
    2. He is a dumbass to think you have a relationship after 10 minutes.
    3. Many men who seem nice are very far from that.
    4. He is there for the wrong reasons.

    Situation B: This has happened to me a milion god damn times. Guy seems super cool, we get along great, he asks what I like to do other than work. I list some of my hobbies. He then proceeds to ask me what I plan to do after dancing. Trusting my rapport with the customer, I am honest about it. He then tells me like likes me as a person and thinks I am cool, but can't get a dance because "Now I respect you too much and it would be weird", but generally tips me for the time. WTF? Respects me too much to get a dance? What the shit is that? This happens to me like once a week.
    take #1 and #4 and add
    If he really respected you he would respect all of you including what you do for a living.

    I will never understand why a man cant wrap his mind around this shit. It's like we lose our minds when we walk through the doors. On occasion i have to remind myself of the situation, as i find myself going into the Patrick mode from spongebob square pants.

    I am perfectly fine getting dances from young ladies that i grow fond of. What many men do not realize is that indeed he can build a FRIENDship with a dancer. We all love to have friends. The problem is these guys are not wanting a friendship. I have had both friendships and relationships over the years but i am happy with either one. And of course i have had many many one night lap dances of which i do not even remember their name, nor do i care too.

    I am happy with the way i go into a club and always have a good time, i doubt seriously these guys can say the same.

    One last thing. You can have more fun with a dancer that knows you inside and out and you have become friends with. You can be silly, and be really laid back. Maybe i am the screwed up one.....who knows. Life is too short - have a good time.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    ^^^ You're definitely not the screwed up one. Your post was right on, and very refreshing.

    It infuriates me when guys say that- "can't get a dance from you now because I respect you!" What exactly is that supposed to imply? "I'm sorry, but I can't enjoy even the slightest sexual experience with someone I actually respect! If I had disdain and contempt for you, then I could really enjoy myself!" WTF?
    Quote Originally Posted by Vamp View Post
    As Katherine Hepburn put it so eloquently " Nature is what we were put here to rise above"

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Lots of great replies here. Keeping it simple OP, they are doing you a service by self-identifying as poor prospects.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by JayATee View Post
    Yeah, this happens to me regularly too and leaves me wanting to knock them out. They're trying to be pick up artists. There's too much reality tv infiltrating their brains. By not being a PL like every other guy in the club and paying for it, and by telling you they "like you as a person" they think that's going to make you fall all over yourself for them. It all goes back to wanting to "bag a stripper" turning into a sport. They need lives.
    Hey everyone needs a hobby

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by mediocrity View Post
    I am posting this here so I can get input from guys and girls alike. These two scenarios gave me a serious 'WTF just happened?' vibe so maybe someone can help me out.

    Situation A: Yesterday, I sat with a very nice gentleman and his friend. The man bought me a drink, told me how pretty I was, how much he liked me etc. I proceeded to ask him for a dance, and he said no, he doesn't do dances. I sat and chatted for approximately ten more minutes, then told him I had to go do some dances, but would be around. He looked upset, so I mentioned very tactfully that we also accept and appreciate tips for our time, if he would like me to stay. He then hands me $10 and says "You've ruined our relationship. Here's ten dollars, and don't come back." WTF HAPPENED? In my eyes, he didn't want me to leave, he didn't want dances, so I provided him with an alternative.

    Situation B: This has happened to me a milion god damn times. Guy seems super cool, we get along great, he asks what I like to do other than work. I list some of my hobbies. He then proceeds to ask me what I plan to do after dancing. Trusting my rapport with the customer, I am honest about it. He then tells me like likes me as a person and thinks I am cool, but can't get a dance because "Now I respect you too much and it would be weird", but generally tips me for the time. WTF? Respects me too much to get a dance? What the shit is that? This happens to me like once a week.

    Shed any light, anyone? This really annoys me.
    Neither one of them wanted a dance from you but they did not have the balls to say "I don't want a dance from you".
    “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elvia View Post
    These people have no business trying to get those needs met in the sex industry, but it sure takes them awhile to figure it out.
    Some never figure it out; of course dancers bank by playing on that.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    They are the problem for sure, they are there to find a relationship which is ridiculous..
    You might be being too friendly. I used to get this kind of shit, but after reading this post about bitchy vs. nice I've switched up my technique and have been getting less of this and making more $$$$!
    I used to be an open book, now I talk a lot less and try not to be as friendly. I think being overly friendly makes them think they have a real relationship going... instead of what it's supposed to be--FANTASY!

    http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/sho...ht=bitchy+nice
    Last edited by Christyismyalias; 06-26-2009 at 05:45 PM.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Situation A: He's a misogynist in denial. So, in a strip club he wants something for nothing IOW a Mooch.

    Situation B: He's Jack. A Pedestal man. Objects of affection get put on a pedestal and once on it's hard, damn near impossible, for you to get off. IOW like Elvira said and I have noted many times before, disdain and contempt are a big part of the equation on the male side of relationships with women. Most men hold it in until the breakup or divorce, I like to get it out there post haste.

    As I've proven on this board, this subject facinates me so I will elaborate if interested. But you should really read City of Women.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Too bad you can't make guys like that wear an "I'm a TOOL" button that was issued to them at the front door from a doorperson who could pick up on their tool-like scent.

    Would save you all alot of time and aggravation.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Honestly, I think a lot of casual club goers don''t have a clue how the girls make their money. I think they think you all get paid buy the house to dance, make conversation, and be eye candy, while guys drink. Read some of the male review sites, guys stopping into a club maybe once a year to 'have a drink and enjoy the view'.

    I think B either came just to play games or really didn't want a dance from you.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elvia View Post
    I don't think they're all "pick up artists" though. I think many (even most) of them are just genuinely confused by the concept of a strip club. I sense defensiveness and emotional anguish from too many of them to be pick up artists. They're just lonely and desperate, and want actual companionship, but then feel that it's disingenuous (which of course it is) when they realize we want to get paid for it, and get all butthurt.
    ...agree, For "B", the sexual aspect of it all merely elevates it in their minds. They think a dancer is low on the moralistic/skill food chain. When she describes her normal life or accomplishments, he kind of sees it as if you have "saved yourself from a terrible life". In his mind, he "respects you for saving yourself". In his mind, higher class women dont get paid, while strippers get paid. By not paying you, he is trying to compliment you for no longer having lowly stripper status. ...did i say all in his mind? He could just be a broke player too, i guess.

    For "A", he built a relationship castle in his head with his princess (you) by his side. Discussing business makes him feel less special than the next guy because he hasn't separated reality from fantasy & business.
    "Peter, did you take Stewie to a strip-club? He smells like sweat and fear." - Lois and Stewie (Family Guy) ... "Through early morning fog I see, Visions of the things to be, The pains that are withheld for me, I realize and I can see..."

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    [quote=fast tan77;1819099]Honestly, I think a lot of casual club goers don''t have a clue how the girls make their money. I think they think you all get paid buy the house to dance, make conversation, and be eye candy, while guys drink. Read some of the male review sites, guys stopping into a club maybe once a year to 'have a drink and enjoy the view'.
    quote]
    seriously. we've had broke guys come in amd reuse to spend a dollar while going around the room talking to the girls. when i finally called him out on it, he said "but you're suppose to be social. its your job." to which i said "yeah, its my job if youre paying me"

    as for the guys mentioned in the OP, either pick up artists or genuinely confused idiots.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinkkitten View Post

    as for the guys mentioned in the OP, either pick up artists or genuinely confused idiots.
    I vote confused as a true pick up artist knows picking up a stripper in the club isn't going to happen. The pickings are much easier in the real world.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by mediocrity View Post
    I am posting this here so I can get input from guys and girls alike. These two scenarios gave me a serious 'WTF just happened?' vibe so maybe someone can help me out.

    Situation A: Yesterday, I sat with a very nice gentleman and his friend. The man bought me a drink, told me how pretty I was, how much he liked me etc. I proceeded to ask him for a dance, and he said no, he doesn't do dances. I sat and chatted for approximately ten more minutes, then told him I had to go do some dances, but would be around. He looked upset, so I mentioned very tactfully that we also accept and appreciate tips for our time, if he would like me to stay. He then hands me $10 and says "You've ruined our relationship. Here's ten dollars, and don't come back." WTF HAPPENED? In my eyes, he didn't want me to leave, he didn't want dances, so I provided him with an alternative.

    Situation B: This has happened to me a milion god damn times. Guy seems super cool, we get along great, he asks what I like to do other than work. I list some of my hobbies. He then proceeds to ask me what I plan to do after dancing. Trusting my rapport with the customer, I am honest about it. He then tells me like likes me as a person and thinks I am cool, but can't get a dance because "Now I respect you too much and it would be weird", but generally tips me for the time. WTF? Respects me too much to get a dance? What the shit is that? This happens to me like once a week.

    Shed any light, anyone? This really annoys me.
    WOW, I hear this a lot from the different dancers I see at my local SC. They are just PL's who don't have a clue that dancers work in a SC to make a living. Usually the way I approach a dancer is to first tip her on stage and then ask her if she's available for drinks and dances in VIP when she is done. Seems to me that 99.9% of the time that approach works best for both me and the dancer. That other PL customer BS I just don't really get, but then I'm a known regular and learned a long time ago that if you really want to show a dancer some "respect", give her a good tip on stage, buy her a drink and get some dances. The SC experience is all about entertainment and having a good time. Life in VIP has been very good to me and the lady I'm with always seems to be very happy and asks when I will be back again. Usually that's sometime the following week.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Psychology aside, with those types I keep steering the conversation back to sexiness, fun, dances. You can find cute creative ways to do this with your answers. Hobbies is a great one It's almost like giving them permission to think about (and go get) lap dances versus thinking of you as a girl in a bar and playing mind games. How tiring for them when all they really want is a dance anyhow. haha. I know there are customers who really like a "genuine" dancer, but I try to read carefully as to who that customer is versus treating every customer like they actually want real answers to their questions. The ones who bombard me with 50 million questions are usually the A and B types you just mentioned. Get control of the conversation so it's going where YOU want it to go because you need to know if they are potential customers or definite time-wasters.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by abcd View Post


    Some customers may feel insulted if a stripper asks to be paid for conversation/time. They may know that there are other customers who spend time with strippers and do not pay them. If a customer gets rejected by a stripper and asked to pay for her time in front of a friend of his, it may even be embarassing to that customer.
    Would you work for free? I didn't think so.

    Our time is worth big money to us. Either pay for it or get lost. Getting embarrassed bc a dancer wants to be paid means you don't belong ITC.
    Sorry I missed church. I was too busy practicing witchcraft and becoming a lesbian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lestat1 View Post
    ^^^ It's a penis, not a martini shaker.
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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    Hi, this is Dean Cortez, I'm the author of the "Strip Club Seduction" book that was mentioned earlier, so I'd like to respond. Basically, my book is a how-to guide for guys who want to flirt with dancers and try to have a relationship with them outside of the club.

    Now, I know that dancers want to BASH me for writing such a book (and profiting handsomely from it), but I'd like to explain a few things. And, I'm curious to get your feedback.

    Years ago, I met my girlfriend when she was dancing at one of the top clubs in Las Vegas. I wound up becoming friends with her friends. All of them were dancers. We all hung out and partied together. So, I got sort of a "locker room" perspective on how these women approach their work, how they view their jobs, how they view customers, and so forth.

    ALL of these girls had boyfriends, and in some cases they met their boyfriend for the first time while they were working. Generally, these were not rich, studly guys. They were regular dudes with regular jobs. And yet, their girlfriends were earning $2000-$4000 for a single shift on a weekend. (Mind you, this was in 2005, when Vegas was booming.)

    So, how did these regular guys manage to date women that were the object of desire for millionaire high rollers and celebrities -- and these women were TOTALLY faithful to their boyfriends? Interesting question.

    This was the basis of the Strip Club Seduction program. I think it's silly to say for a dancer to say that she WILL NEVER date a customer. What if that "customer" is a sincere, fun, cool, attractive guy who she would love to chat with, if she'd met him in any other environment?

    And before you condemn the existence of these "pickup books," realize that your next customer who spends $200 on you might be a guy who read my book and was inspired to visit your club because of it.

    I'm a Vegas guy, so let me put this in gambling terms. Every time a Hollywood movie comes out, in which a character figures out the secrets to "beating the house," it inspires a ton of people to try to do the same (and in the process, most of them blow their money).

    The most recent example would be the movie "21," which was about college students who learned how to "count cards" at blackjack, and won a fortune. When the movie came out, were the casinos worried about people learning this same skill and cleaning them out? Hell no! The casinos welcomed the business. They welcomed the action. A few people had the discipline and talent to legitimately learn how to count cards, and did okay, and the rest just lost their money.

    It's the same as the clubs. Some guys will test out their skills and see if they can make a genuine connection with you, and the rest will buy dances and feel intimidated by your beauty and forget about trying to pick you up.

    I love going to the clubs, I have a ton of friends who are dancers and I respect the job and have no tolerance for guys who disrespect the women. But isn't it sort of crazy to say "I NEVER DATE CUSTOMERS" when once in a while, you wind up talking to a guy who actually is pretty cool, and single, and into you? Why not give it a shot, as long as he understands your job and your situation?

    Dean Cortez

  29. #24
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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    ^^ well, its just that to those of us who are taken, it is a complete and total waste of our time. its not so much saying "i'll never date a customer" as it is saying "i'm taken so therefore not interested." but the problem is that the guys are persistent and seem to think it will work on every single girl, instead of maybe a relatively few girls a very small percent of the time. so they come in the club and act as though any girl in there is there for the purpose of finding a date and hearing that all night long is extremely aggravating.
    i mean, it's our job, not a dating service. it's kinda like going to a restaurant, refusing to buy anything and just trying to convince the waitress (who quite possibly already has a boyfriend and is unavailable) to go out with you.

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    Default Re: Two infuriating questions.

    I think the last two posts are a derail, especially as to Guy B, who I don't think is playing a game.

    Call it PL or "white knight syndrome" or whatever, but I think the majority of guys who go to strip clubs, especially non-regulars, have a starting point that strippers are sluts or whores. That's just a given.

    So Guy B starts talking to you, and after awhile he feels (although in reality a simple club conversation can never tell you this one way or the other) that you are no longer a slut or whore. You're just a person.

    So when you ask for a dance, the natural reaction of Guy B is to let you know he no longer considers you a slut or a whore. In his mind, this is worth a WHOLE lot more than $30 or whatever you would get for a dance.

    IOW,

    Drink.....$10
    Slutty dance...$30
    Letting you know a "normal" human sees you as more than a slut....priceless


    This logic probably seems ridiculous to anyone who has worked in a club for more than a week, but to most guy casual visitors, it makes perfect sense.

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