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Thread: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

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    Default 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    A perfect storm of circumstances is coming together to make 2011 look like a bad year economically. First, the Bush tax cuts will have expired. Less disposable income = fewer lap dances and VIP's. Secondly , Ken Feinberg, the White House Pay Czar is slapping salary and bonus limits on the seven companies still getting TARP- AIG, Citicorp,BOA, GM, GMAC, Chrysler and Chrysler Financial. He also wants to limit perks to $25,000. Bernanke wants to apply similar guidelines to all member banks of the Federal Reserve and the village idiot aka Senator Chuck "The Schmuck" Schumer wants to limit pay at ALL publicly traded corporations. Together this will ignite a brain drain as many top Wall St. minds will go to London,Hong Kong, Canada and Australia to evade these income limits.

    By 2011 the current bull market will be a distant memory and higher commodity and import prices coupled with huge budget deficits will cause a serious decline. Higher energy prices and higher taxes will spell disaster. Obama et. al. want higher oil and gas prices.
    The Stock Market now is like the last cocktail party on the Titanic. Everybody knows the party can't last. Everybody knows what the tax situation will be and that we don't have an inflation indexed tax system. Everybody knows we can't sustain trillion dollar deficits and that the Treasury has to raise interest rates to sell our debt.
    Last edited by Eric Stoner; 10-26-2009 at 06:27 AM.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Debbie Downer. 2011 is going to be good for some dancers and bad for some others...just like every year.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by hockeybobby View Post
    Debbie Downer. 2011 is going to be good for some dancers and bad for some others...just like every year.
    You're right. Dancers in Canada and Europe might do pretty well. The U.S. ?
    Fuhgeddaboudit !

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    I can make a positive comment for every negative you've mentioned, and we'd go round and round for a while...then someone would make yet another negative thread about the U.S. going down the drain/to hell in a hand basket...and so it would continue.

    Y'all are so laughing in the U.S. of A. You have the sweetest piece of real estate in the whole world, the climate, the resources, the water, the parks, the scenery, capitalism, democracy, a nice mix of conservatism and socialism, freedom, a nation of entrepreneurs and innovators, a mountain of wealth, and all the fearsome military power anyone could want...
    Everything. All the marbles.
    Just relax. Have a margarita.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    The sky is falling! The sky is falling! Lmao.

    Informational post. My sc clientel don't fall in to the affected groups so much. Either way my $is higher each year. Even thru 9/11 and last years recession.

    Unless something about me or my areas change my avg. Will prob. Be ok.

    However I see how other areas and dancers w/white collar clientel will suffer.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    ...Secondly , Ken Feinberg, the White House Pay Czar is slapping salary and bonus limits on the seven companies still getting TARP- AIG, Citicorp,BOA, GM, GMAC, Chrysler and Wells Fargo. He also wants to limit perks to $25,000.
    Why should that be bad for the rest of the economy?

    I've amazed that bank shareholders put up with banks paying out >25% of their profit from some divisions in bonuses, etc. I can't think of any other industry that puts that percentage of profits into bonus pots.

    Maybe if bankers are discouraged from taking high risks for high rewards:

    (a) Banks products would cost less
    (b) There would be far less risk of asset bubbles.

    Frankly, the continual selling and reselling of CDO's, SUV's, etc had all the hallmarks of 'churning'. It's a matter of wonder to me that the regulators didn't step in way before the bubble burst. Sub prime mortages can't go up in value no matter how many times they're resold - it's just the same old debt being given a new coat of paint.

    Phil.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    I rubbed my always dependable Crystal Ball and it told me not to worry about tomorrow, just to go into my local GC, buy drinks, lap dances and have a good time.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Why should that be bad for the rest of the economy?
    Well for starters, consider New York governor Paterson's latest estimate that New York will lose over 1 billion in state income tax revenues as a direct result of Wall St. salary caps on these firms' top earners. It has also been noted that every Wall St. firm's top 25 employee list has already lost 10 or more employees in the months since the original filing was made. Those 10 or more top notch employees are now working for international competitor investment firms, where their salaries are not subject to caps. And as announced by Obama's Pay Czar today, the salary caps will now be extended to the top 100 employees of these firms.

    Plus congress is discussing new legislation that would implement salary caps on the highest paid employees of ALL publicly owned American companies. If passed, this would similarly stimulate the highest paid 'stars' of publicly owned US corporation to relocate ( similarly taking their tax revenue dollars with them )

    Also consider the fact that of New York City's population of 8 million people, the 44,000 top earning New York City workers actually pay 50% of the tax dollars collected by New York City. Every one of the salary capped employees, and every one of the former employees who have changed to international competitor investment firms, will be contributing far fewer tax revenue dollars.

    Now this wouldn't matter much if New York state / NYC would actually cut gov't spending by an amount equal to the 'lost' tax revenues resulting from the salary caps. But they simply won't. Instead, tax rates will have to be raised on New Yorkers earning far less money in order to make up for the lost $1 billion a year. And THAT is seriously bad for the New York state / NYC economy !

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Those salary reductions will be money in the pockets of corporations and their shareholders who will also pay taxes. Those salaries and benefits are outrageous and insulting to the common working man as well. Let them run to another country, there'll be a hundred more people, just as competent or more, to take their place at a more reasonable compensation.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    In the 9 years I spent dancing, I never, ever, ever danced even a single song for anyone who worked in the banking or financial industry. Since I frequently worked in the state capitol, I did dance for a lot of political types. Also danced for a lot of tech-sector types, too. Tons of blue collar guys and girls also, of course.

    Finance and banking sector customers make up a very small percentage of strip club customers outside of Manhattan.

    I get the funny feeling that this post is about politics and is somehow trying to be a Dollar Den topic to complain about the government limiting corporate welfare of taxpayer dollars.


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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    ^^^ the fact remains that salary caps will vastly reduce the total amount of taxable private sector income in New York. This will directly translate into reduced spending in the New York area, either via the employees who stay and collect far lower salaries, or via former employees relocating to Switzerland / Hong Kong / Dubai etc. to collect even larger salaries from new employers.

    The fact remains that in the absence of tax revenues lost due to the capped salaries, taxes will be raised on middle class New Yorkers. This will serve to further reduce the level of spending in the New York area.

    there'll be a hundred more people, just as competent or more, to take their place at a more reasonable compensation.
    This involves a MAJOR leap of faith ! It's equally possible that the departing financial 'stars' will drag a lot of business to their new employers, and that the 'substitute' dealmakers hired to replace them at far lower salaries will also have far lower performance re earning money for the employer.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Well that's just a leap of faith in the opposite (negative) direction....isn't it?

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    A perfect storm of circumstances is coming together to make 2011 look like a bad year economically. First, the Bush tax cuts will have expired.
    From what I remember, dancers, and pretty much everyone else in the US, were doing a lot better before Bush's tax cuts were passed.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by hockeybobby View Post
    You have the sweetest piece of real estate in the whole world,
    It would be except for the people living just north of US; they bring down our property value.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ^^^ the fact remains that salary caps will vastly reduce the total amount of taxable private sector income in New York. This will directly translate into reduced spending in the New York area, either via the employees who stay and collect far lower salaries, or via former employees relocating to Switzerland / Hong Kong / Dubai etc. to collect even larger salaries from new employers.
    Remember the idiots that got my money screwed up and should be out of a job; don't let the door hit them on the ass on the way out.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    *** oh, are you referring to Janet Reno, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, Acorn etc. who were instrumental in forcing banks to write mortgages to non-creditworthy low income / inner city homeowners that they otherwise never would have written ... and in turn prodded banks to come up with 'derivatives' products in an attempt to shift the risk of these subprime mortgages onto 3rd parties and/or the US taxpayer via Fannie / Freddie ? If so, then some of them are out of a job already.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ^^^ the fact remains that salary caps will vastly reduce the total amount of taxable private sector income in New York. This will directly translate into reduced spending in the New York area, either via the employees who stay and collect far lower salaries, or via former employees relocating to Switzerland / Hong Kong / Dubai etc. to collect even larger salaries from new employers...
    Melonie,

    You're looking at this from just one view point. The alternative one is:

    (a) Salary caps reduce the amount of risk taking by banks.
    (b) Individual bankers are worse off and pay less tax
    (c) The broader economy is better off because it has a more stable, lower cost money supply and expands at a faster rate - thus offsetting the lower salaries paid to bankers.

    Remember high bankers bonuses are a de facto tax on businesses - businesses have to pay higher charges to the banks to finance these massive bonuses.

    If businesses pay lower charges, they can invest more into their businesses and hence grow the businesses faster.

    Most of the financial instruments that blew up in our faces were no use to the great majority of businesses - who just wanted the best possible cost for loans or maybe to hedge against currency or material price changes: bog standard banking.

    The more exotic financial instruments primarily served to enrich bankers - and judging from the destruction of their value in the financial crisis, they were worth way less in practice than their paper value.

    To my mind CDO's and SUV's were on a par with the tulip mania of the 1630's - and about as much use.

    Phil.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    nm....

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    *** oh, are you referring to Janet Reno, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, Acorn etc. who were instrumental in forcing banks to write mortgages to non-creditworthy low income / inner city homeowners that they otherwise never would have written ... and in turn prodded banks to come up with 'derivatives' products in an attempt to shift the risk of these subprime mortgages onto 3rd parties and/or the US taxpayer via Fannie / Freddie ? If so, then some of them are out of a job already.
    No one forced people to make bad loans. It was all about greed and not being in touch with reality. The simple fact is that for some reason all of these super smart financial types thought that real estate could grow at nearly 30-70% a year while the population numbers were stagnant, housing supply grew at a whopping 6% a year and incomes were dropping*.

    *(for all but the top 1%)

    Hence a bubble. A bubble of delusion and greed is what brought us to the place we are now. I say good riddance to the stupid greedy types that said crap like "Wow! I had no idea that this would happen!"

    Isn't it the JOB of the bankers to look at the numbers and make a determination of how sustainable a trend can be, and then invest wisely?

    F*cking Idiots.


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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    I think they knew exactly what they were doing, and even though the outcome was well understood, the aggregate income over the years of following this would put more money in their pockets than what would be taken out at the end.

    Especially with bankruptcy reform being what it was.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    *** oh, are you referring to Janet Reno, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, Acorn etc.
    I voted for Perot, Dole, Gore and Obama. Don't blame me; yet. I also always vote for Rodney; I know he is a commie pinko.

    His daddy donated some of the most valuable real estate in the US of A for the birds. His "town meetings" take place on Mt. Bikes as we enjoy and learn together.
    An arboretum is a collection of woody trees and shrubs cultivated and labeled for educational and scientific purposes. The beautiful 127-acre Frelinghuysen Arboretum more than satisfies that definition, offering visitors a serene place to relax as well as to learn more about plants well-suited to the soils and climate of Morris County.

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    Can you see an AIG executive that thinks it is his right to slop at the public trough donating $72,000,000 worth of land for the public good? BTW that is today's depressed worth of the land.



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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    Well for starters, consider New York governor Paterson's
    Don't worry about Paterson; even the Democrats don't want him. New York hear comes another Cuomo. Catholic men have the fear of Yahweh and don't pay over $100 for pussy. I though those people were frugal.

    Jersey Girl or no not on the best day of her life was she worth $2000.00 an hour. She gave it away for a few shots of Vodka on "Girls Gone Wild".


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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Why is it that everyone complains about an executives salary being too high, but hollywood and sports stars get a pass for the most part. Shouldnt we cap them, i mean what they do is no harder than what a ceo does rightttttt. oh wait unless you run a company, you wouldnt know that would you. the only difference is you see the skill of a michael jordan.

    I dont know about the rest of the country but it is real simple around here. I make more money...(Congress tax cuts) and my employees all got raises. You take money from me and guess where i will be filling the hole from......I feel for my employees when it happens, but pointing the finger at me, is wrong. I will not be FORCED into it. It amazes me people do not understand this. My senior staff that make decisions everyday that affects my companies bottom line get paid a lot more than my drivers do. If they screw up i fire them. My decision, no one elses.
    I understand with the govt getting involved with these companies it complicates things. I didnt agree with it, but yet i didnt have a solution either. Thats why congress is there, and if they screw up WE fire them.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by stressed View Post
    Why is it that everyone complains about an executives salary being too high, but hollywood and sports stars get a pass for the most part.
    A-Rod makes $27,000,000 a year guarantied. He will make 3/4 of a billion dollars. I do not go to Yankee's games, I do not like the Yankees, and I do not like green eggs and spam. That does not bother me. Tom Cruise does not make me wet in the crotch; I do not pay to watch his movies. They cost me nothing.

    The evil money changers that are too important of fail take my money; I have no legal say. Not only do they take my money they get sky boxes at Mets' games as sponsor (city field) and don't even watch the game while children that dream, eat and live Mets can't a ticket even if they sold themselves into slavery. Something that makes the money changers salivate.

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    Default Re: 2011 will be a bad year for dancers.

    Quote Originally Posted by stressed View Post
    Why is it that everyone complains about an executives salary being too high, but hollywood and sports stars get a pass for the most part. Shouldnt we cap them, i mean what they do is no harder than what a ceo does rightttttt. oh wait unless you run a company, you wouldnt know that would you. the only difference is you see the skill of a michael jordan.

    I dont know about the rest of the country but it is real simple around here. I make more money...(Congress tax cuts) and my employees all got raises. You take money from me and guess where i will be filling the hole from......I feel for my employees when it happens, but pointing the finger at me, is wrong. I will not be FORCED into it. It amazes me people do not understand this. My senior staff that make decisions everyday that affects my companies bottom line get paid a lot more than my drivers do. If they screw up i fire them. My decision, no one elses.
    I understand with the govt getting involved with these companies it complicates things. I didnt agree with it, but yet i didnt have a solution either. Thats why congress is there, and if they screw up WE fire them.
    How I think about it is, those executives would not be getting anything right now if the government hadn't stepped in. (Personally I think they should have been allowed to fail and the money given to second tier banks.)

    Also, the American taxpayer loaned the bankers that money for a specific purpose - getting credit out there to the masses. They have not followed the purpose of the loan (ie, they bought a car instead of a house.)

    Some spankings are deserved out there.

    As a financier of movies, I also can speak a little bit about Hollywood these days - do you know why you are seeing a lot of new faces out there? Because the A listers of yore have priced themselves out of the job. You can read a bit more here () - couple years ago but it has only gotten worse.

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