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Thread: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

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    Default DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    by Will Brink


    Have you ever noticed if a supplement, drug, etc is tried in men, and fails to work, it’s written off as being ineffective? Although improving, it’s well known that men have been the standard subjects in research, with the results often being applied to women as an afterthought. In recent years, that situation has improved and women are viewed as the physiologically distinct people they are from men, and studies looking at specific effects in women – using women as the test subjects – has grown dramatically. That’s the good news at least. The bad news is, there’s still plenty of research out there done on men, being applied to women, sometimes to the detriment of women. Obviously, men and women are not so different that a great deal of research fails to be perfectly applicable to both sexes, but the fact remains a great deal of prior research was done looking at men, and the results, good or bad, applied to women more as an after thought.


    Such is the case with DHEA in my view…


    What is it?

    Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) has been around as a supplement for a long time, so I’m not going to go into great depth on in this article as there’s a ton of info out there already on DHEA and it’s fully covered in my ebooks. To quickly summarize: DHEA is a hormone produced primarily in the adrenal glands with minor amounts produced by the testes. It is found in both men and women. DHEA is the most abundant steroid hormone in the human body, and like all steroid hormones, ultimately comes from cholesterol. Most DHEA in the body is found as DHEA-sulphate (DHEA-S). DHEA is a major precursor to other steroid hormones. That’s the basic run down of DHEA.


    From a strictly health perspective…

    From a strictly health perspective – for those deficient due to aging or other causes – DHEA appears beneficial when used as a supplement for general health and well being in both sexes. It’s well established that DHEA levels fall off as we age, and the research on health uses of DHEA justifies using small amounts to counter this age related drop off or deficiencies from other causes. DHEA levels rise slowly till they peak at around 30 years of age, and decline steadily after age 35, with levels reduced by 70-80% by age 75. This effect is one of the most consistent and predictable changes in aging known with lower endogenous levels of DHEA/DHEA-sulfate found in advancing age strongly correlated with a myriad of health conditions best avoided.(1) For example, levels of DHEA and or DHEA-s in older men is strongly predictive of death by cardio vascular disease .(2)


    Only blood tests will tell a person what their DHEA/DHEA-s levels are and where they are compared to others in their age group. As this is not an article focused on the potential health benefits of DHEA in deficient populations, that’s all I’m going to say on the matter here.


    What about DHEA as a “muscle builder” in healthy young men?

    DHEA often gets marketed as a “muscle builder” to men. As a muscle building supplement in young healthy men, DHEA is essentially worthless, and high intakes may in fact be counter–productive to gaining muscle as high doses also cause an increase in estrogen and the effects on testosterone are minimal. Studies have been conflicting in this area at best, and most “real world” users report no improvements in strength, muscle mass, etc from using DHEA. So, for healthy young men with normal DHEA levels, it’s a bust as a “muscle builder” due to the fact it converts to testosterone poorly and raises estrogens levels when used at high doses.


    “What About Us Women Will?!”


    OK, this finally brings us to women and DHEA after the long winded intro above, but finally, here we are! Although the research in men using DHEA has been unimpressive and contradictory, such is not the case with women. In women, research using DHEA is much more consistent and compelling and there appears to be some gender specific responses to DHEA use.(3)
    As a supplement that can improve mood, libido, memory, and possibly alter body composition (i.e., increase muscle, improve bone density, and reduce bodyfat), DHEA appears to be a winner for women. Most of the research has been done in DHEA deficient populations, but data – and real world experience- suggests it’s also a benefit to women not medically deficient in this hormone. Although the benefits of this hormone to women comes predomently from its conversion to testosterone, it also appears some of the effects may be due to other mechanisms.(4). One recent study concluded:


    The use of DHEA therapy may also be discussed in women of any age when a trial of androgen supplementation seems justified because of the existence of an inhibited sexual desire or a sexual arousal disorder associated with documented androgen deficiency. The rather weak conversion of DHEA into testosterone protects from the risk of overdosing associated with testosterone preparations.


    Side Bar: Testosterone myths. Testosterone is often viewed as a “male” hormone. Although testosterone is the dominant androgen in men, it’s a hormone essential to the health and well being of both sexes, just as men produce and require some estrogen. How important can this hormone be to women? Karlis Ullis, MD, a faculty member of the UCLA School of Medicine, who treats women with hormone imbalances states:


    It is clear to me, both from my clinical practice and from research, that testosterone is vital for women to preserve their lean mass and to prevent obesity. Not only will testosterone help mobilize body fat and negate some of the fat storing effects of estrogen, it is also extremely effective in building lean mass in women – even at small doses. Hormone replacement therapy that only includes estrogen and progesterone but leaves out testosterone is a curse of many a women’s fat loss program. This is not only a concern for postmenopausal women. Young women should think twice about using birth control pills. Birth control pills elevate estrogen and progesterone levels while drastically lowering testosterone levels. This is reason why many women experience large gains in fat as well as a decreased libido when using birth control pills.


    In women with established adrenal insufficiency, studies find 50mg DHEA corrects low serum concentrations of DHEA/DHEA-S, and brings testosterone into the “normal” range. With one recent study finding



    DHEA treatment significantly improved overall wellbeing as well as scores for depression, anxiety, and their physical correlates. Furthermore, DHEA significantly increased both sexual interest and the level of satisfaction with sex.”(5)

    Side Effects


    Are there any side effects to DHEA use for women? Generally, they are easily dealt with by lowering the dose and “… are mostly mild and related to androgenic activity of DHEA in women and include increased sebum production, facial acne, and changes in hair status.” (6)


    In my experience, the above is related to dose. The low-normal dose recommended (see below) rarely if ever causes side effects, but there’s no free lunch in biology, and adjusting any hormone up or down, comes with potential for side effects along with the benefits. The issue – as in the case with any drug, supplement, etc – is whether the benefits outweigh the risks/side effects. As the (potential) benefits of DHEA high, and the side effects at best mild to non existent, my opinion is the risk/benefit ratio is very much in favor of using DHEA, but everyone has to decide for themselves on that score.


    Conclusions and Recommendations

    Believe me, there’s a lot more research I could cover, but I hope the above covers the essential points regarding DHEA and it’s potential value to women specifically. So, let’s sum it all up: For women over 40, or those with diagnosed adrenal insufficiency (AI), DHEA could be of considerable value to general well being as well as libido, mood, etc. Typical doses are 25 – 50mg and working with a medical professional to fine tune dosages is recommended.


    For “normal” women under 40, and or have not been diagnosed with AI, 25 – 50mg seems to do the trick, and starting at the lower dose and assessing over a few months is recommended. Most women will notice improvements in mood, libido, and possibly muscle mass and or bodyfat, at lower doses. The effect is increased at higher doses, but possible side effects mentioned above also become more common. At 50-100mg+, DHEA does act as a mild anabolic agent in women in my experience, and I have seen some fairly impressive results of increased muscle mass and decreased bodyfat at the higher doses, but it’s not dramatic compared to other anabolic hormones used by some female athletes. High doses of DHEA will also elevate estrogen levels, so that too should be kept in mind.


    See you in the gym ladies!


    Citations:


    (1,3) Cameron DR, Braunstein GD. The use of dehydroepiandrosterone therapy in clinical practice. Treat Endocrinol. 2005;4(2):95-114.


    (2) XV International Symposium on Atherosclerosis.


    (4) Buvat J. Androgen therapy with dehydroepiandrosterone..World J Urol. Nov;21(5):346-55. – 2003


    (5) Arlt W, et al. DHEA replacement in women with adrenal insufficiency–pharmacokinetics, bioconversion and clinical effects on well-being, sexuality and cognition. Endocr Res. 2000 Nov;26(4):505-11.


    (6) DHEA: why, when, and how much–DHEA replacement in adrenal insufficiency.Ann Endocrinol (Paris). 2007 Sep;68(4):268-73. Epub 2007 Aug 8.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Sounds like side effects you want..improved mood, libido, weight loss, build muscle.

    How do I get this stuff and what brand do you recommend Will?

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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by KS_Stevia View Post
    Sounds like side effects you want..improved mood, libido, weight loss, build muscle.
    Obviously I make no promises. Just reporting da facts/data as I see it.

    Quote Originally Posted by KS_Stevia View Post
    How do I get this stuff and what brand do you recommend Will?
    If you are in the US, there's few places you can't find it. I get mine however from Life Extension Foundation as they are a company I know well and trust their QC, etc. See:

    http://search.lef.org/search/default...s=1&QUERY=dhea

    Also good additional info on DHEA at their site.
    Last edited by Will; 05-27-2010 at 04:19 PM.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    interesting...i take pre-natals for anemia/healthy skin & nails (maybe silly, but i swear it works) and the most recent one i got has dhea in it. i was wondering what it was exactly, so thanks will and anyone looking for it...check the prenatal section? lol!

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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Miss Svea View Post
    interesting...i take pre-natals for anemia/healthy skin & nails (maybe silly, but i swear it works) and the most recent one i got has dhea in it. i was wondering what it was exactly, so thanks will and anyone looking for it...check the prenatal section? lol!
    Never heard of DHEA being put into a pre natal product nor would I recommend it. You sure it's not DHA?
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    HAha! you are right, it's dha, my bad.

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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Miss Svea View Post
    HAha! you are right, it's dha, my bad.
    Good to hear, there's a major difference between them. One would not be in a pre natal product.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    thanks Will. Someone told me that it could cause slight hairloss, which of course I don't need or want, and that it is possible that it may cause facial hair (black chin hair) on woman. I trust your opinion much more than the person who told me this. What do you think?

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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by tommy'sgirl View Post
    thanks Will. Someone told me that it could cause slight hairloss, which of course I don't need or want, and that it is possible that it may cause facial hair (black chin hair) on woman. I trust your opinion much more than the person who told me this. What do you think?
    The article above mentions the possible side effects. As with any hormone, it's a balancing act. Side effects of overly high androgen levels, can = acne, etc. However, the "money shot" sentence to understand:

    "The rather weak conversion of DHEA into testosterone protects from the risk of overdosing associated with testosterone preparations.”

    That's why I stress the importance of regular blood work to really fine tune such things. On the converse, low androgen levels in women (and men, but the topic here is women, so we will stick to that...) also have real negatives as outlined briefly above. Let's put it like this: for improved mood, libido, less bodyfat, and other potential benefits, is a few extra hairs to pluck worth it, assuming that even happens? I can't decide that for you, and there's a risk/benefit to every decision there. Hope that helps.
    Last edited by Will; 05-31-2010 at 10:52 AM.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Another possible benefit of DHEA specific to women, fertility. That's potentially huge for women considering how big the fertility business is...If confirmed via additional studies, would be another potential benefit of DHEA specific to women.


    Increasing Fertility Threefold With DHEA?

    ScienceDaily (July 1, 2010) — According to the American Pregnancy Association, six million women a year deal with infertility. Now, a Tel Aviv University study is giving new hope to women who want to conceive -- in the form of a pill they can find on their drugstore shelves right now.

    Prof. Adrian Shulman of Tel Aviv University's Sackler Faculty of Medicine and the Meir Medical Center has found a statistical connection between the over-the-counter vitamin supplement DHEA, used to counter the effects of aging, and successful pregnancy rates in women undergoing treatment for infertility.

    In the first controlled study on the effects of the supplement, Prof. Shulman found that women being treated for infertility who also received supplements of DHEA were three times more likely to conceive than women being treated without the additional drug. The results were recently published in AYALA, the journal of the Israeli Fertility Association.

    A natural supplement to fertility treatments

    After hearing anecdotal evidence from his patients and the medical community on the benefits of combining fertility treatments with DHEA, a supplement marketed as an anti-aging drug around the world, Prof. Shulman decided to put this old wives' tale to the statistical test.

    He and his fellow researchers conducted a study in which a control group of women received treatment for poor ovulation, and another group received the same treatment with the addition of the DHEA supplement. The latter group took 75mg of the supplement daily for 40 days before starting fertility treatments, and continued for up to five months.

    Not only were women who combined infertility treatment with DHEA more likely to conceive, the researchers discovered, they were also more likely to experience a healthy pregnancy and delivery.

    "In the DHEA group, there was a 23% live birth rate as opposed to a 4% rate in the control group," explains Shulman. "More than that, of the pregnancies in the DHEA group, all but one ended in healthy deliveries."

    Making grade-A eggs?

    Shulman believes that women who are finding little success with their current fertility treatments could look to DHEA to improve their chances of conceiving. "We recommend that women try this DHEA treatment, in conjunction with fertility treatments, for four to five months," says Prof. Shulman. It could also be used as a regular "vitamin" for women who have already conceived and are pregnant, but more research would need to be done on the compound to determine its effects, says Prof. Shulman.

    DHEA, for 5-Dehydroepiandrosterone (5-DHEA), is a naturally-occurring steroid found in the brain, which plays an important biological role in humans and other mammals. Produced in the adrenal glands, it is also synthesized in the brain. The pharmaceutical version of this molecule is known as Prastera, Prasterone, Fidelin and Fluasterone, and identical generics are widely available over the counter in the United States without a prescription. Women interested in using DHEA to conceive, however, should consult their practitioner first, suggests Prof. Shulman, a gynecologist and director of the IVF Unit of the Obstetric and Gynecology Department at Meir Medical Center.

    While studies on the effects of DHEA are far from complete -- his test group only included around 20 women -- Prof. Shulman hopes that further research will unlock the secrets of why the supplement aids in successful conception in women with an otherwise poor response to fertility treatments. "We need to look into what the drug actually does to make the body more fertile," he says. "It could be affecting components such as the quality of the eggs or the follicles."
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by KS_Stevia View Post
    Sounds like side effects you want..improved mood, libido, weight loss, build muscle.

    How do I get this stuff and what brand do you recommend Will?
    So any follow up on this KS?
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    I have written in the past that DHEA may have unique benefits to women (article above...) and this is additional support for that conclusion. And NO, it's not just for women with menopause...


    Hormone Might Ease Menopause, Boost Women's Sex Life: Study

    TUESDAY, Dec. 20 (HealthDay News)

    -- A hormone called DHEA appears to help ease women's menopausal symptoms and also improve their sex life, a small, new study says.

    This is the first evidence that low doses of DHEA (dehydroepiandrosterone), a hormone secreted by the adrenal glands, can help sexual function as well as menopausal symptoms, according to the researchers at the University of Pisa in Italy.

    The study included 48 postmenopausal women who'd experienced troubling symptoms for a year. They were divided into four groups: 12 took vitamin D and calcium to prevent osteoporosis; 12 took a low dose of DHEA; 12 were given standard hormone replacement therapy (HRT) of estrogen plus progesterone; and 12 took tibolone, a synthetic steroid.

    The women's menopausal symptoms and levels of sexual interest and activity were monitored for a year.

    At the end of that time, all the women receiving the hormone replacements showed improvements in menopausal symptoms, but there was no significant improvement among those taking vitamin D and calcium.

    The study also found that women taking DHEA had a statistically significant increase in sexual interest and activity, with similar results for women in the HRT group. Sexual activity was also higher among the women taking tiboline, but the increase was not statistically significant.

    The findings, published in the December issue of the journal Climacteric, indicate the need for larger clinical trials to confirm the benefits of DHEA in women after menopause.

    "This is the first time that a controlled trial has shown that low doses of the hormone DHEA may be able to help women deal better with menopausal symptoms, as well as helping their sex life. The work shows that DHEA has potential, especially for those women who may have problems in taking more conventional HRT. But this is a small study, a proof of concept. What we need to do now is to look at a larger study, to confirm that these initial results are valid," study leader Professor Andrea Genazzani said in an International Menopause Society news release.

    "This is an interesting result, although we must bear in mind that this is a pilot study with a small sample. Nevertheless, it does indicate that DHEA has potential as a therapy to help women deal with the physical discomfort of the menopause, as well as helping them sexually," journal co-editor Dr. Anna Fenton said in the release.

    "We can't yet say that this study means that DHEA is a viable alternative to HRT, but what we can say is that we should be looking to do larger studies to confirm these initial results," she added.

    More information

    The U.S. government's Office of Women's Health has more about menopause symptom relief and treatment.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Will, thank you for sharing. I am going to order this. My question would be- what kind of "dose" should I take? Since it is formulated for men it is hard for me to figure out. Thank you!

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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by LAChloe View Post
    Will, thank you for sharing. I am going to order this. My question would be- what kind of "dose" should I take? Since it is formulated for men it is hard for me to figure out. Thank you!
    You will find recommended doses in the first article above along with other advice important to its use in women.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    I think I've even seen this at Whole Foods so I'm going to have to take a closer look.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by FiendishGyrator View Post
    I think I've even seen this at Whole Foods so I'm going to have to take a closer look.
    It's a very common supplement found on the shelves of any health food store. Of course Whole Foods (Whole Paycheck) is about the least cost effective place to buy such a thing.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    ^ yeah, but a good place to start out with a supplement you don't have experience with, as you can try it, and if you have a bad reaction, you can return it even after you've used some.

    I HATE buying supplements, using a few times, and getting weird reactions-- headaches, zits, a weird buzzing feeling all over my body.

    Good place to try something out for the first time.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by FiendishGyrator View Post
    - headaches, zits, a weird buzzing feeling all over my body..
    If that's a common response you have with supplements, I'd probably recommend skipping the DHEA perhaps.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Good info Will...I'm not a big supplement guy but DHEA is one I would take.

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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    If that's a common response you have with supplements, I'd probably recommend skipping the DHEA perhaps.



    *eye roll*

    Yeah, because if my responses to vitamin b pills and certain oil based supplements
    are any indication, I may as well completely forego any supplements ever and not experiment
    at all when people do have different reactions to supplements and should experiment so they
    know their own body better. Whole foods may not be to your liking, however it is good place
    to experiment if you're worred about not getting your money's worth out of
    something you've never tried. Then, one can move online to buy a product they know they can trust.

    If you don't read my responses and posts enough to realize I do a lot of supplement experimentation
    on my own, I would be surprised. But being that person who enjoys seeing another write on the same topic,
    I must say you show an astounding lack of good taste and sense in your response.

    Because if I was someone who didn't know a lot about alternative healing, you might have scared me away
    and made me feel like my body is somehow unusual, when anyone who's supplemented with different vitamins
    and natural substances knows that one thing may work great for one person and hav iffy or awful reactions in another. So good to potentially alienate experimenters and high-handedly treat someone else's body chemistry,
    which I also find hypocritical considering your article talking about how men and women have different needs an how women have had to make due for what worked for men, and how this is a rather stupid basis for science.

    Way to go.

    and putting a little wink emoticon a the end of your statememt doesn't make you any less of a condescending twat. Consider putting aside your huge ego next time you disagree with someone, and consider that their stated reason actually has logic, even if, *gasp* they don't roll over once you trot out that tired little pun on whole foods' name. I'm not their biggest fan either but they do have an excellent return policy.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by FiendishGyrator View Post

    Way to go.
    Now i remember why I post here so rarely these days. I recommended you may want to avoid DHEA if you tend to have bad reactions to supplements (as I didn't want feel responsible should you have a bad response to DHEA) and I get this goofy ass insulting rambling response. As you said "way to go"

    And now one of these ->

    Good luck kid.
    Last edited by Will; 12-24-2011 at 07:39 AM.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    All supplements are different and can affect people differently

    I get not wanting someone to blame you for a bad reaction (which
    would be stupid on their part as everyone should do their own research
    and even then, their reactions may differ from others or they may not.)

    It's silly to think that because someone had a few negative reactions to
    a small proportion of the dozens of supplemen she's tried that she should forego
    using any supplements at all. You were essentially wanting to throw the baby out
    with the bathwater because I advocated getting your first sample of a supplement
    from a place that has a good return policy. it doesn't have to be whole foods, but
    Unless one has a lot of friends who experiment with supplements too that one could
    trade with, you my as well be able to try it without worrying about wasting money, though
    this supplement in particular might be fairly inexpensive.
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    ^^Fiendishgyrator you are overreacting slightly. Saying that the OP could potentially scare people away, does not give responsible advice etc. etc. Well anyone with half a brain would do their own research before taking any supplement rather than believing that Will from Stripperweb is the definitive source. Also I'm sure he doesn't care to read your other responses/posts if thats how you reply.

  28. #24
    God/dess Will's Avatar
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    Quote Originally Posted by katerina29 View Post
    rather than believing that Will from Stripperweb is the definitive source.
    Well, actually, I am, but I know what you're trying to say.

    Quote Originally Posted by katerina29 View Post
    Also I'm sure he doesn't care to read your other responses/posts if thats how you reply.
    Word...
    A cunning linguist...

  29. #25
    Featured Member FiendishGyrator's Avatar
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    Default Re: DHEA; The Most Underrated Supplement For Women?

    I actually like his posts and find them informative, and think everyone should do their own research.
    It's retarded to say that one shouldn't use any supplements because one is worried enough about negative effects that returning a supplement for a refund is important to someone. I don't take issue with the original
    post. I have an issue with the stupid snark because he takes issue with whole foods and people who find the store useful.
    Ungoogle yourself:


    Also, now offering phone sexins!

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