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Thread: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployment

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    Default new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployment

    ... never at a lack for 'entertainment' ...

    (snip)WASHINGTON, June 16 (UPI) -- Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, says he wants federal legislation requiring people seeking welfare or unemployment benefits to pass a drug test first.

    Hatch intends to attach his proposal to legislation extending the social safety net during a time of economic stress, The Salt Lake Tribune reported. He said Tuesday he will try to get the Senate to attach his amendment to the $140 billion bill extending social programs and tax breaks.

    He said his idea could reduce the nation's debt and help battle drug addiction, the Tribune reported.

    "This amendment is a way to help people get off of drugs to become productive and healthy members of society, while ensuring that valuable taxpayer dollars aren't wasted," Hatch said. "Too many Americans are locked into a life of a dangerous dependency not only on drugs, but the federal assistance that serves to enable their addiction."

    An advocate for low-income people in Utah called the proposal "outrageous" and "immoral."

    "If people who need all kinds of help can't get certain kinds of help, that is just not right," said Linda Hilton of the Crossroads Urban Center in Salt Lake City.

    Hilton said she couldn't fathom the idea of denying help to a person with alcohol dependency and she said she worries it could make an entire family suffer for the addiction of a parent, the Tribune said."(snip)

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    How in the hell would this help people overcome addiction? Addiction is a disease. And what about the children of these individuals? Should they be denied food/shelter/healthcare assistance because their parents can't pass a piss test? I agree with what's said above about the whole family suffering.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    As opposed to, I dunno, giving these people the therapy they need, they're going to deny them money?

    Do they not seriously realise that some people are going to be like "Oh look, a life of petty crime and/or prostitution! Why yes, I think I will fund my crack habit this way instead of getting clean."

    Um derr.
    Get the fuck off my harbl, yo'.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    I bet hes going to be against raising taxes to pay for the billions upon billions of dollars testing everyone would cost.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    Quote Originally Posted by Trem View Post
    I bet hes going to be against raising taxes to pay for the billions upon billions of dollars testing everyone would cost.
    Probably. Instead he'll likely cut social programs to pay for this. First off, people on unemployment actually pay taxes on the money and in most cases their employer paid for it (In some cases the employee also paid in, depends on the state). Why this jackass thinks unemployment is a social program I don't know. Many people on unemployment receive it because many companies outsourced their job! He's probably one of those politicians who support outsourcing. People on welfare don't pay taxes I don't think.

    Having said that, while none of us want to pay for druggies on assistance it opens the floodgates. I think it's a bad idea.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    It's not just a bad idea, its incredibly expensive to test people for drugs. About 350 bucks a pop, that is probably more than the benefits they would be getting.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    Quote Originally Posted by Trem View Post
    It's not just a bad idea, its incredibly expensive to test people for drugs. About 350 bucks a pop, that is probably more than the benefits they would be getting.

    Well, you know they'll just use taxpayer money to pay for the drug tests. Therefore increasing taxes yet again....

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    Orrin Hatch is not a stupid man, he knows something that ridiculous has no chance of ever passing. It's just cheap pandering to score points, obviously nobody wants drug addicts getting free money so its easy to suggest something stupid like this with no chance of passing just to look good.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    There really needs to be more visibility on what these legislators stand for and how they vote. They promise to represent the voters but then totally ignore their interests. Nobody seems to care that well paying jobs get sent to other countries. Maybe that's part of the unemployment problem. Lets worry about whether the people who had their jobs stolen have a beer once in a while.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellydancer View Post
    Probably. Instead he'll likely cut social programs to pay for this. First off, people on unemployment actually pay taxes on the money and in most cases their employer paid for it (In some cases the employee also paid in, depends on the state). Why this jackass thinks unemployment is a social program I don't know. Many people on unemployment receive it because many companies outsourced their job! He's probably one of those politicians who support outsourcing. People on welfare don't pay taxes I don't think.

    Having said that, while none of us want to pay for druggies on assistance it opens the floodgates. I think it's a bad idea.
    Utah has an extensive private social welfare and support system, so they don't really have the same need for public welfare or even unemployment as other states.

    As for his proposal, it should be pilot tested on politicians before they can accept public money.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerBall View Post
    There really needs to be more visibility on what these legislators stand for and how they vote. They promise to represent the voters but then totally ignore their interests. Nobody seems to care that well paying jobs get sent to other countries. Maybe that's part of the unemployment problem. Lets worry about whether the people who had their jobs stolen have a beer once in a while.
    That is part of the problem. I frequent an unemployment board (having lost my white collar professional job) and the amount of people who lost jobs due to outsourcing is astounding. Add in H1-B visas, and illegals taking many of the lower end jobs, and there is a definite problem. I blame both parties for this. I won't do business with companies that send jobs overseas unless I have to (and this is partly why I loathe Indians).

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    My friend sent me a text that read this I couldnt help but laugh.

    Like most folks in this country, I have a job. I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit. In order to get that paycheck in my case, I am required to pass a random urine test (with which I have no problem). What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people who don't have to pass a urine test. So, here is my Question: Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test to get a welfare check because I have to pass one to earn it for them? Please understand, I have no problem with helping people get back on their feet. I do, on the other hand, have a problem with helping someone sitting on their ass; doing drugs, while I work. . . Can you imagine how much money each state would save if people had to pass a urine test to get a public assistance check? I guess we could title that program, Urine or You're Out'.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    ^^^ I was having thoughts along similar lines ... that if I was forced to pass a 'piss test' in order to receive a paycheck as a Respiratory Therapist then why is it unreasonable to expect the same from other people who are receiving 'paychecks' financed by my 'piss tested' tax money ?

    Of course, it's easy to support being a compassionate spender when the money being spent isn't coming out of your own personal pocket I suppose.

    Yes, obviously, this proposal has zero chance of becoming actual law ... and was probably proposed for the express purpose of prompting discussion.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    That sorta misses the point though doesn't it? It is unreasonable for YOU to have to pass a urine test in order to collect a pay check, that is the actual problem. A corporation should have no rights to dictate what you do in your personal lives, extending the same injustice to everyone else just exarberates the problem. And frankly anyone who thinks giving urine tests to everyone is going to SAVE money is either stupid at math or simply stupid and thinks every single person receiving government assistance is on drugs.

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    Thumbs down Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    The way things are going we will all have to wear a scram bracelet like Linsday Lohan and our company badge will have gps in it so our company can make sure we don't go to strip clubs. Long sentence but that's where we are heading soon. kiss privacy and freedom goodbye.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    An amazing percentage of younger people who don't work (of those I've encountered) are on drugs. Their habits are enormously expensive to themselves and to society.

    There is a big difference between someone using drugs for kicks and someone really hooked and addicted (often because of psych reasons). Those real;ly hooked usually require multiple detox and 28 day rehab clinics and often it is never successful until they die, are incarcerated, or the like.

    The only thing this idea may affect is the former (kicks users), but then so many 'clean-up kits' would be sold for testing on a predictable basis that even then testing would have to be random (show up at the person's home) that it would be very expensive.

    Still putting a huge dent in the drug industry would have enormous benefits, though that thought is merely theoretical. The last several generations, having such a strong me-first psych component, probably the only thing that would stop drugs very much is to plant a lot of 'poison-tainted' batches out there to uncomfortably sicken the users. Certainly the knowledge that drugs directly and indirectly cause so much death and suffering will not stop these narcissists from getting their kicks.
    Last edited by threlayer; 06-21-2010 at 09:00 AM. Reason: add last 2 paras
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    Maybe I'm the oddball here. but I don't think it's such a bad idea. I mean, don't deny the benefit because of a positive test, but maybe require a drug class or some sort of rehabilitation. I'd be down for my tax money to go towards something like that.

    Only thing that sucks is it'd be PUBLIC assistance. So I'd imagine any "addiction" would also be public. Tricky situation. Idea sounds okay, but execution would be tough.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    At first it seems like a good idea, until you stop and think about all the ways in which it would cause more trouble than help.

    I guess he figures people can and will have to quit cold turkey if they want welfare...
    Quote Originally Posted by lagirl View Post
    Those housewives need to stop being vain lushes and making us look like criminals

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    ^^ Maybe you don't realize all the trouble it is actually causing.
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    An amazing percentage of younger people who don't work (of those I've encountered) are on drugs. Their habits are enormously expensive to themselves and to society.
    This may be true (I'm not totally familiar with the US data) but does it follow that a large number of people on public assistance are on drugs? People who receive welfare or unemployment include those who have been laid off and cannot find work right away, or even the working poor ( I assume this is also true in the US) and you have to prove that you're eligible, so I'm not sure I believe the stereotype that welfare money is being pissed away on drugs.

    I don't think it's unreasonable to want to minimize the 'misuse' of such funds but this seems, like others have said, to be just a stunt for quick political points.

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    Default Re: new Washington proposal ... must pass 'piss test' to receive welfare / unemployme

    ^^ No. not necessarily. Many on drugs move in the shadows and never appear in places where their ID must be used.


    Let's put it this way ---- drug addiction is a plague that is destropying the well-being and even the life of many people

    "It's all fun and games until someone gets stabbed in the eye."
    Last edited by threlayer; 06-24-2010 at 08:01 PM.
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

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