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Thread: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    The US Supreme Court is rapidly rolling the US back the the old wild west days. Warning to dancers for clubs that have no gun check policy.... Not presented here for political discussion, but instead for consideration for personal safety when in the presence of a wide range of individuals in a confined area.
    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    I might get a gun permit , buy a double belt level holster, two 45's and a double ammo belt over each shoulder . and wear a 20 gallon black hat. What good is a gun if no one sees you wearing it?
    So if you can't argue facts, hystrionics, name-calling, gross charactrizations, and other ridiculous diversions will serve?

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    I've referred to gangsters carrying guns into clubs if bans on gun checks become law. not that many clubs screen for that anyway. Just how far does the USSC think we will go to enable this so-called "right?"

    You know a lot of pretty seedy characters populate strip clubs. Last thing I want for anyone is to be caught between a couple of gangsters fighting it out in a club over which extras dancer they will be taking home. Or some such insanity.

    To me this gun things seems like such a RADICAL policy, not conservative at all!
    Hmmmm I live in a concealed carry and Castle doctrine state (colorado!) home invasions and murder are on the decline, as are many violent crimes.

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    Some idiot entered my house without asking for entry. He pointed a huge pistol at my guests who told me that he said stole his toilet plunger. I was just outside my house at the time, but I heard a strange's voice as I entered downstairs, walked up the stairs and saw him and the pistol in profile. I waked back down the stairs trying to cause very little disturbance and called the Cops. Four cars came within 3 minutes, but while I was doing the 911 call, he left. My guests pointed out who this creep was and the cops went after him. (Long story ensues about how he got out of his mess with his VFW buddy, a police Lt. He actually did try to fire the gun but one of my guests foiled the revolver's hammer.)

    If I had had a gun (I don't) in the house I would have had no opportunity to get it. But if I did have that opportunity, I would have thought it would cause a gunfight and someone could have gotten really hurt. Even if I had carried a weapon as I came up the stairway, I couldn't have used it because of the angles involved.

    Experts say that the average gun-owner would cause way more trouble than he would be able to solve. Maybe some of you hot shots think differently, but guns against guns is not a sport nor a game. You would be taking the biggest chance in your life to get killed or to kill someone else, not necessarily the perpetrator.

    And now I'm going to have to buy a couple of 45's and a double holster (see above). Thanks to the wild west idiots in the USSC. My opinion and you won't change it.
    Thats planning and training (despite the hystrionic bit at the end). Something in most concealed carry classes. You get your gun and call 911. If the guy starts shooting then nothing to lose, shoot back. Otherwise wait for the cops. Even Cops have what they call "shoot, no shoot" situations.

    btw the way someone had their hads on the guys revolver and everyone the room didn't kick the bad boys ass. Your friends are cowards.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by Trem View Post
    I can't understand the ridiculous desire to own a gun but the law is very clear on the subject. Trying to pass stupid gun control laws is as pointless as when (DEMOCRATS) try to pass stupid (SOCIAL ENGINEERING) laws just to cause trouble, they both know it won't stand up in court but they are just trying to make a point. I gotta say it's kind of funny watching (DEMOCRATS) defend the sanctity of the constitution on issues they agree with while trying to change the parts they don't like.
    Works the same way, whatever titles one chooses to offend someone else.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trem View Post
    I can't understand the ridiculous desire to own a gun but the law is very clear on the subject. Trying to pass stupid gun control laws is as pointless as when Tyrannosaurs try to pass stupid anti herbivore laws just to cause trouble, they both know it won't stand up in court but they are just trying to make a point. I gotta say it's kind of funny watching Carnivores defend the sanctity of the constitution on issues they agree with while trying to change the parts they don't like.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trem View Post
    I can't understand the ridiculous desire to own a gun but the law is very clear on the subject. Trying to pass stupid gun control laws is as pointless as when Mimes try to pass stupid silent speech laws just to cause trouble, they both know it won't stand up in court but they are just trying to make a point. I gotta say it's kind of funny watching speechless defend the sanctity of the constitution on issues they agree with while trying to change the parts they don't like.

  3. #28
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    I have a concealed carry permit (CCW) here in Vegas. Our instructor (8 hours class plus qualification required) told us once we received our permits and started to carry, the biggest threat to our lives would be rookie or under-trained cops. This was two years ago.

    This weekend LVMPD killed a West Point graduate, war hero, Duke University Masters Degree and CCW permit holder, at a local COSTCO.

    Witness accounts vary, but majority said Police were called when an employee at the store noticed the guys weapon when he bent down to open a sealed carton, panicked, called cops saying an armed man was tearing up the store, and at that point the mans fate was sealed.

    A couple of witnesses said it looked like the guy was reaching for his gun, but most witnesses said, at most, he was just lifting up his shirt to show Metro he was armed (as per class training).

    COSTCO security told patrons to exit store immediately via intercom, and he was exiting the store per instructions along with everyone else. It is believed he was completely unaware the police in the parking lot were after him, may have been confused by the sudden confrontation, prompting 3 LVMPD officers to fire 17 rounds at him (and, of course, everyone else exiting the store).

    He was shopping with his girlfriend, purchasing household goods, as they had decided to move in together.

    Anyway, that's my 2nd Amendment story for the day.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by VegasM View Post
    I have a concealed carry permit (CCW) here in Vegas. Our instructor (8 hours class plus qualification required) told us once we received our permits and started to carry, the biggest threat to our lives would be rookie or under-trained cops. This was two years ago.

    This weekend LVMPD killed a West Point graduate, war hero, Duke University Masters Degree and CCW permit holder, at a local COSTCO.

    Witness accounts vary, but majority said Police were called when an employee at the store noticed the guys weapon when he bent down to open a sealed carton, panicked, called cops saying an armed man was tearing up the store, and at that point the mans fate was sealed.

    A couple of witnesses said it looked like the guy was reaching for his gun, but most witnesses said, at most, he was just lifting up his shirt to show Metro he was armed (as per class training).

    COSTCO security told patrons to exit store immediately via intercom, and he was exiting the store per instructions along with everyone else. It is believed he was completely unaware the police in the parking lot were after him, may have been confused by the sudden confrontation, prompting 3 LVMPD officers to fire 17 rounds at him (and, of course, everyone else exiting the store).

    He was shopping with his girlfriend, purchasing household goods, as they had decided to move in together.

    Anyway, that's my 2nd Amendment story for the day.

    Luckily this woman wasn't armed:



    Raw Video: Woman Calls Police, Gets Zapped

    Call the police, get tazered and thrown in the back of the car.

    Lesson learned: Kill the prowler and then call the police to pick up the body.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    Some idiot entered my house without asking for entry. He pointed a huge pistol at my guests who told me that he said stole his toilet plunger. I was just outside my house at the time, but I heard a strange's voice as I entered downstairs, walked up the stairs and saw him and the pistol in profile. I waked back down the stairs trying to cause very little disturbance and called the Cops. Four cars came within 3 minutes, but while I was doing the 911 call, he left. My guests pointed out who this creep was and the cops went after him. (Long story ensues about how he got out of his mess with his VFW buddy, a police Lt. He actually did try to fire the gun but one of my guests foiled the revolver's hammer.)

    If I had had a gun (I don't) in the house I would have had no opportunity to get it. But if I did have that opportunity, I would have thought it would cause a gunfight and someone could have gotten really hurt. Even if I had carried a weapon as I came up the stairway, I couldn't have used it because of the angles involved.

    Experts say that the average gun-owner would cause way more trouble than he would be able to solve. Maybe some of you hot shots think differently, but guns against guns is not a sport nor a game. You would be taking the biggest chance in your life to get killed or to kill someone else, not necessarily the perpetrator.

    And now I'm going to have to buy a couple of 45's and a double holster (see above). Thanks to the wild west idiots in the USSC. My opinion and you won't change it.
    The decision does not require anyone to have a firearm. All it does is protect our fundamental right to do so.

  6. #31
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Check out this court case

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distric...mbia_v._Heller

    I think this case largely influenced the decision for this recent case...

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
    So if you can't argue facts, hystrionics, name-calling, gross charactrizations, and other ridiculous diversions will serve?


    Thats planning and training (despite the hystrionic bit at the end). Something in most concealed carry classes. You get your gun and call 911. If the guy starts shooting then nothing to lose, shoot back. Otherwise wait for the cops. Even Cops have what they call "shoot, no shoot" situations.
    Apparently you don't understand/believe in sarcastic humor.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
    btw the way someone had their hads on the guys revolver and everyone the room didn't kick the bad boys ass. Your friends are cowards.
    I don't know the whole story about the hammer foil and the obviously loaded revolver. But I'd guess those two were stunned by the attempt to fire and relieved by the foil. Now, this was some old fart (probably near 80) known to them. Maybe he agreed to retreat and they agreed not to escalate it. But you're right, about not planning. I just don't go around thinking I may have to use a concealed gun at any time (and so carry it) and I live in a pretty quiet area. Not everyone thinks about armaments all the time.

    The worst things about the incident are (looking back) :

    • the police did confiscate the weapon cache at his residence and lift his permit (maybe not permanently) but they didn't charge him with trespassing, reckless endangerment, attempted murder, drunken driving, etc.
    • the policeman who shielded him from the punishment was a buddy of his also a member of the same VFW clan
    • the old fart apparently is still just as drunk, mean and exploitative as ever, still pretending to be a friend.

    This suburban guy is not alone in his abuse of the gun permit system. The gun permit system is just too permissive and is just not as thorough as is reasonable, considering the possibilities of abuse.

    BTW, you got the SW quote system down well.
    Last edited by threlayer; 07-16-2010 at 09:05 AM.
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    I'm going to do a bit of grammar here...

    "The amendment states: "A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.""

    These are NOT separate provisions, but the latter phrase is conditional on the leading phrase. It does not state without strings, the following :

    "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed"

    It DOES state the following :

    "well-regulated militia being necessary"

    So I ask you, does it not imply at the very least, that arms shall be well-regulated? A conservative, strict constructionist would have to admit that it in fact does at the very least state just that.
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

  9. #34
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    I have several different opinions about this. First off, I don't like guns, but was raised around them and taught to shoot at like 4 or 5. Some people having a gun makes me very nervous, they don't know how to handle them and I consider this dangerous as hell.

    Everyone back in WV carries a gun and everyone knows this. Back when I was a kid there was virtually no crime (in the southern part of the state where everyone carries, up north were virtually no one does was another story). Seriously if you KNEW that someone had a gun in their house and would shoot you before you made it through the door or window, would YOU try and break in? Of course not. Only the mentally incapacitated ever did shit like that. Now is a different story though. Oxycontin has taken over the area and these morons will do damn near anything....they are completely out of their minds. So, even with guns a LOT of druggies end up doing stupid shit. Luckily most gun owners don't actually shoot them, they just pistol whip them till their unconcious and then wait on the police.....which takes from 2-3 hrs to 2-3 days (not kidding there, sometimes they won't show up at all, someone shot through a friends house and they never came to look around). Soon I may be forced to get a gun for my own protection. Arrgghhh!! Don't want one in the house though. Booo!
    "I hear you calling and it's needles and pins. I wanna hurt you just to hear you screaming my name...You're poision. but I don't wanna break these chains.... I wanna love you but I'd better not touch."

  10. #35
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    I'm going to do a bit of grammar here...

    "The amendment states: "A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.""

    These are NOT separate provisions, but the latter phrase is conditional on the leading phrase. It does not state without strings, the following :

    "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed"

    It DOES state the following :

    "well-regulated militia being necessary"

    So I ask you, does it not imply at the very least, that arms shall be well-regulated? A conservative, strict constructionist would have to admit that it in fact does at the very least state just that.
    It doesn't matter what your grammar parser comes to - the decision has been made. If you or any other reader wishes to understand the reasoning behind it, I recommend you read the opinion: . It may be quite enlightening to about history, militias, and responsibilities of the citizenship there of.

  11. #36
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Interesting bit of grammar discussion.

    Think of the use of arms envisioned by the framers as :
    1. hunting for food (or sport),
    2. keeping one's skills up (for a valid purpose),
    3. protection of self, family, and possessions, and possibly even
    4. defending oneself from a despotic government, either domestic or foreign. Other uses would be
    5. for some intimidating or criminal act.

    This is not some abstract, theoretical right such as 'liberty', but the the right to posses something tangible; therefore the nature and usage of such tangible things needs to be considered.

    Considering the above, the nature of the weapons, just how they are regulated becomes critical. Items 1, 2 and 3 certainly imply no need for highly powerful and automatic weapons. The people are not given the right to perform criminal acts on one another, so item 5 allows no rights at all.

    So item 4, "defending oneself from a despotic government, either domestic or foreign" is the heart of the discussion. I can see no way at all for individuals to defend against despotic governments because such will have weapons far beyond the ability of individuals. The people individually cannot defend the country; that would be the responsibility of the federal and state governments to administer. Who is insane enough to lead an armed rebellion against the US military?

    Before we had a strong federal government with its armies and militias and its massive technology, there was a need for individuals to assist in protecting the country. There is no need nor ability now, so that individuals should not be allowed to possess powerful and automatic weapons, and in fact such weapons can fall into the hands of criminals and be used for illegal purposes. Those types of weapons should be illegal for possession by citizens. Finally all weapons that have an effect at a distance (particularly, but not limited to handguns and long guns), should be licensed by the states, subject to federal minimum licensing requirements, and traceable on demand to the owners and during any transfer of ownership. Requirements for all hidden weapons should be particularly strict and include behavior analysis. Any such weapons not properly in possession of a licensed owner should be confiscated, and the possessor should be punished appropriately.

    Regardless of what the USSC currently says. IMHO.
    Last edited by threlayer; 07-28-2010 at 01:56 PM. Reason: reworked same content for better readability
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post


    ...

    Regardless of what the USSC currently says. IMHO.
    An opinion that wrong certainly OUGHT to be humble.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by slowpoke View Post
    An opinion that wrong certainly OUGHT to be humble.
    OK, so what is YOUR justification for semi-automatic weapons, hollow point bullets, permissive and unchecked guy-buying, liberal concealed weapons permits, etc?

    Wrong indeed, not so humbly stated..
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    OK, so what is YOUR justification for semi-automatic weapons, hollow point bullets, permissive and unchecked guy-buying, liberal concealed weapons permits, etc?

    Wrong indeed, not so humbly stated..
    I think you have pretty much pointed out no justification is good enough for you.

    I, however, do not need any justification for those items.

    I think you are as crazy as you think I am crazy.

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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    OK, so what is YOUR justification for semi-automatic weapons, hollow point bullets, permissive and unchecked guy-buying, liberal concealed weapons permits, etc?

    Wrong indeed, not so humbly stated..
    The Constitution of the United States.

  16. #41
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Why stop there? Why not a howitzer or an anti-tank weapon? Remember that rifles, pistols and cannons is what thee Framers knew at the time. The Constitution has been successful because they were not specific because they knew things would change with the times.

    Anyhow, you could at least TRY to explain it, unless you have no valid rationalization. So, let's hear it.

    I'd guess you think you have that right because of your own personal interpretation of the US Constitution.
    Last edited by threlayer; 08-01-2010 at 08:07 PM.
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

  17. #42
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    Quote Originally Posted by threlayer View Post
    Why stop there? Why not a howitzer or an anti-tank weapon?
    Ammunition for them is more expensive than I want to pay for, but just because I don’t want one does not mean others should be precluded.

    There is nothing at all sinister about semi autos, and hollow points, and no reason at all to get so agitated about them.

  18. #43
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    Default Re: Another "Brilliant" USSC Decision that unstablilizes us

    ^^ You seem to love heavy weaponry so much that you are blind to any reasonable discussion of their necessity. WHAT THE BLOODY HELL DO YOU NEED THOSE FOR ??
    I loved going to strip clubs; I actually made some friends there. Now things are different for the clubs and for me. As a result I am not as happy.

    Customers are not entitled to grope, disrespect, or rob strippers. This is their job, not their hobby, and they all need income. Clubs are not just some erotic show for guys to view while drinking.

    NOTE: anything I post here, outside of a direct quote, is my opinion only, which I am entitled to. Take it for what you estimate it is worth.

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