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Thread: Monogamy?

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    Default Monogamy?

    I'm going to introduce this thread by relating a story from a recent visit to my favorite club. I hadn't been seated for more than a couple of minutes when an absolutely gorgeous and new (to me) girl sat down with me. Instant rapport! In no time, we were laughing and enjoying each other's company. It occurred to me that I might just spend the whole evening with her and that she could become an ATF. Until ...

    She didn't have to ask for a dance - I asked her. The dance was completely legal, but probably about as hot as it can get (in these parts anyway). It was almost indescribable. But, for anyone who might be curious, I'll try.

    She massaged my ass and asked me to massage hers, while she grinded. The song ended - and I extended. She had me scratch her back and she reached under my shirt and scratched mine, while she grinded. The song ended - and I extended. She pressed her face against mine, uttered little breathless coos into me ear (damn - I love that), and nibbled my earlobe. She had me as close to popping as any dancer ever has (in my very limited experience). I'm sure she knew that too, because, unlike some guys with more sc experience, I haven't learned how to hide that very well. Throughout this whole thing, she kept constant eye contact (at least, every time I managed to open my eyes, she was looking straight at me - with a slight little smile).

    I told her she was sensational, but I had to take a break. She said she was sorry that I wasn't giving her the chance to finish what she started. We both laughed. Now I knew that I wasn't even going to look at anyone else this night. Then I blew it!

    During the afterglow, while she was dressing, and I was wondering how I could stand up, I asked her if she ever found that this job interfered with her real-life relationships (I know ... crucify me). She told me that she was going through a divorce, after several years of marriage. I said I was sorry (I swear - that's all I said). She got a furious look in her eye, and, without prompting, she said "the bastard cheated on me!"

    ... ??? ...

    I thought that was odd.

    It was obvious that she didn't want to talk about it any more. I respected that, and we changed the subject. But the mood was shattered, and back at the table, we went our separate ways.

    But, I've found myself thinking about this now for a couple of weeks. Which brings me (at long last) to the point of this thread. I'd like to ask the very articulate ladies on this site how strippers really feel about demanding complete fidelity from their real-life partners.

    My assumption would have been that, given what you must see and what you must feel everyday at work, that you would have a somewhat more liberal view on the question of monogamy than most people. Really, the only differences between what she and I did that night, and what her husband did, were a couple of layers of cloth and the $100 that I paid her. And I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that our experience was much more intimate than his.

    Now I'll shut up and listen. If this generates any comments, maybe I'll offer some opinions later.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    The thing is, stripping is work. Dancers do it for money. There's no real relationship between a dancer and a customer. It's a business transaction, though some customers may deny this to themselves. Dancers can be good actresses. The ones who make real money know how to create the illusion of intimacy. But it is not actual intimacy. Cheating, on the other hand, is not a business transaction. It's far more emotional than that, and often does involve real intimacy. It also involves lying and breaching the boundaries of a relationship.

    Presumably the dancer is open with her partner about what she does for work. If she isn't, then I can see that the ethical breaches in that are similar to the ones involved in cheating, minus the emotional involvement with someone else part. But if she is, then there is a world of difference between the nature of the two actions, even if they physically appear to be similar.

    I'd feel comfortable demanding fidelity from my partner whether or not I was dancing, for these very reasons. If a man is uncomfortable with his partner's work, he can tell her so and ask her to quit or, if push comes to shove, he can leave her if she isn't willing to quit.

    With respect to this particular dancer, you have no idea whether or not her husband was fine with her work, or even whether she started the job before they separated. You have no way to see inside her situation unless she tells you about it.

    Most dancers that I've known are very much monogamous. I don't see any more liberal attitudes towards cheating than I do in the general population. Of course, you do see the odd open relationship, but these are very much not the norm.
    Last edited by flickad; 07-30-2010 at 11:19 PM.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    While many dancers I've known have had open marriages, far more were monogamous. While dancing (I did strictly no touch air dances) I was completely monogamous to my boyfriends and expected it from them. I'd never tolerate a boyfriend (or later husband) cheating, and if he did, then that's the end of it.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    My assumption would have been that, given what you must see and what you must feel everyday at work, that you would have a somewhat more liberal view on the question of monogamy than most people. Really, the only differences between what she and I did that night, and what her husband did, were a couple of layers of cloth and the $100 that I paid her. And I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that our experience was much more intimate than his.
    The hundred dollars IS the difference between a job and an emotional commitment to another person.
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    yoda, I want you so bad it aches in the swimsuit area.
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    Sophia_Starina is a sensible stripper...Naked all the way.....
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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    i would expect my SO to remain monogamous.

    if someone paid them to 100$ to grind on them though i wouldnt be mad. i might raise an eyebrow though at the situation and wonder what strange circumstances lead to it, unless i was dating a dancer of course-- which i have done in the past.


    but yoda put it well. i will pretend to love you as much as you pay me . and as soon as the money stops so does the affection, because after a while this job really does turn you into a cold bitch-- towards the customers at least. and such is business. now to my personal friends im not cold at all. to my personal friends i am actually a very warm and caring and loyal person, for free. wowza.
    The best thing i have heard in a strip club to date:
    customer: we should get married right now! we should get a shotgun marriage!
    me: uhh... i think you are misunderstanding what a shotgun marriage means. A shotgun marriage means you knock me up and my daddy shows up at your door with a gun and forces you to marry me and raise the baby. You mean elope.
    customer: hmm... nah actually i will take the shotgun marriage. At least then we would be having sex.


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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    First, to Flickad, you're right of course- I know nothing about that particular dancer's situation. I didn't mean to make this about her at all. I'm sure she's a good person and I wish her nothing but the best. I just used that story to raise the question.

    Next, I agree with all of you that if a spouse (or committed so) engages in a love affair, or makes any kind of an emotional committment to another, that is a betrayal of the promises made to you. Almost everyone would agree that is cheating, and that it would be a deal breaker for your relationship.

    But, wouldn't you agree that people are perfectly capable of having sex without an emotional committment? The really good strippers come pretty close to it constantly. A lot of guys I have known seem to as well.

    What if your partner, who you have no doubt loves you completely, was simply horny one night - an attractive person offered themself - they fucked - and then said goodbye.

    It seems that most people call that cheating too. Would that still be a deal breaker for you?

    Just askin ...

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    ^^^ Yes, it would be.

    Now, if he wants to become a sex worker (and talks with me about it ahead of time) that would be a different story. I would consider it hypocritical to not be ok with him doing sex work after he's been ok with me doing it.
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    As Katherine Hepburn put it so eloquently " Nature is what we were put here to rise above"

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    But, wouldn't you agree that people are perfectly capable of having sex without an emotional committment? The really good strippers come pretty close to it constantly. A lot of guys I have known seem to as well.
    Yes, I think anyone is capable of having sex without emotional commitment. I think it's just dandy for people who are not involved in a committed relationship.


    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    What if your partner, who you have no doubt loves you completely, was simply horny one night - an attractive person offered themself - they fucked - and then said goodbye.
    And where does it stop? What if that same partner gets horny every night that his dancer SO is working and goes out to a bar, picks up a stranger and fucks her? It's OK because it was only a one night stand? If you love some one and you are horny you wait until she comes home from work and then the two of you screw your brains out T-O-G-E-T-H-E-R.

    You can rephrase the question as many ways as you like but the bottom line is that dancing is a job that women do for money. The BF or spouse knows exactly what his lady does for a living. Sneaking around behind her back is not the same thing. There is a reason why they call it cheating.
    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    yoda, I want you so bad it aches in the swimsuit area.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tempest666 View Post
    Double team! 2 latinas with big tits!!

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    Yes, I think anyone is capable of having sex without emotional commitment. I think it's just dandy for people who are not involved in a committed relationship.




    And where does it stop? What if that same partner gets horny every night that his dancer SO is working and goes out to a bar, picks up a stranger and fucks her? It's OK because it was only a one night stand? If you love some one and you are horny you wait until she comes home from work and then the two of you screw your brains out T-O-G-E-T-H-E-R.

    You can rephrase the question as many ways as you like but the bottom line is that dancing is a job that women do for money. The BF or spouse knows exactly what his lady does for a living. Sneaking around behind her back is not the same thing. There is a reason why they call it cheating.
    Once again Yoda is on the mark completely. I'd be livid if any guy I was serious about was cheating on me with anyone. I'd even get jealous if the guy I love now was sleeping with someone else, though we aren't official. I know he's not because sex is special to him and that's why I won't sleep with anyone else now either. Now if it was a situation where there was absolutely nobody in the picture and I wanted a FWB, I see no problem.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    First, to Flickad, you're right of course- I know nothing about that particular dancer's situation. I didn't mean to make this about her at all. I'm sure she's a good person and I wish her nothing but the best. I just used that story to raise the question.

    Next, I agree with all of you that if a spouse (or committed so) engages in a love affair, or makes any kind of an emotional committment to another, that is a betrayal of the promises made to you. Almost everyone would agree that is cheating, and that it would be a deal breaker for your relationship.

    But, wouldn't you agree that people are perfectly capable of having sex without an emotional committment? The really good strippers come pretty close to it constantly. A lot of guys I have known seem to as well.

    What if your partner, who you have no doubt loves you completely, was simply horny one night - an attractive person offered themself - they fucked - and then said goodbye.

    It seems that most people call that cheating too. Would that still be a deal breaker for you?

    Just askin ...
    For me, yes it would be, because it still breaches the boundaries of the relationship and thus is a betrayal of me. There is also the possibility of emotion in that situation. Even if on that occasion it doesn't go further, there is the potential for it to.

    However, I would feel less betrayed if my partner visited a prostitute. That is still betrayal, yes, and again is a violation of the promises we've made to each other (unless we discuss it and agree that it's fine). But there is no possibility of any real intimacy there. It's a business transaction, much like stripping. Now, I still think that if my partner wants to visit a prostitute, he should discuss it with me first. But that's no different to my view that a stripper should be open about her work with her partner, too.

    I would also be completely fine about my partner visiting a strip club, which is basically the moral equivalent of working at one. It's a business transaction, again, and in most clubs no touching is involved. It's possible that I'd feel insecure about it (hard to tell until you're in that situation), but I wouldn't consider it cheating.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    iAnd I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that our experience was much more intimate than his.
    It was intimate for YOU.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    So does that mean that television and movie actors don't care if their partner cheats on them because they acted in a movie that involved their character falling in love with another character? A dance is one-way. We don't get sexual gratification from it. We get financial gratification. Also as a side note... who knows maybe she was just bull shitting you anyway. I used to always make up crap and say weird things if I was bored. Kinda see what bullshit I could spin and if guys would believe it.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    well, i'm a hypocrite. i'm the jealous type (though i don't like to show it). i'm possessive. i expect complete loyalty. and i expect a guy to let me do what i'm going to do. now, i wouldn't cheat. if i'm into one person enough to be involved with them, i wouldn't be interested in another. but for work? i'll dance. i've done porn and probably will again, possibly while seeing someone. one day i might get into escorting. all would be work. and i can keep my feelings seperate. but if someone i was with wanted to get into sex work, i'd say hell no. that dick belongs to me. the end.

    the most i'd tolerate would be a guy who was a server or bartender or barista or something like that flirting as part of his job. hell, i'd probably be ok with webcam.

    this isn't really related to me being a stripper though. i just don't share well.

    as for other girls...i haven't talked to enough of them about their personal lives to really know. i know some expect fidelity. some are open.
    -love everyone but keep them far from your soul-

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Still waiting to see who will be the first to figure out the real point behind this thread. So far, no one's got it.

    Think creatively. Any quesses?

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    You are trying to bring about world peace through promoting dialogue?

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    Still waiting to see who will be the first to figure out the real point behind this thread. So far, no one's got it.

    Think creatively. Any quesses?
    Besides looking like a dumbass? To that girl you were just another asshole who almost came in his pants from a few lap dances, there was no "connection" or "rapport" or whatever other word you want to use that implies you were anything other than just another shmuck she had to deal with at work.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy
    Now I'll shut up and listen. If this generates any comments, maybe I'll offer some opinions later.
    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    Still waiting to see who will be the first to figure out the real point behind this thread. So far, no one's got it.

    Think creatively. Any quesses?
    So what happened to the "shut up"?

    FBR
    Once again I have embraced my addiction and have put off the moral dilemma to another day.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    Still waiting to see who will be the first to figure out the real point behind this thread. So far, no one's got it.

    Think creatively. Any quesses?

    Wow. Deep. Real...deep.

    You've really opened my eyes classyguy. The hypocrisy inherent in the "He cheated" statement when she just rubbed you to completion was subtle, yet quite obviously present. After all, what she did with you was clearly similar to what she does with her husband, or even akin to casual sex with a stranger. Hmmm, it really makes me think...

    ...that you are WRONG.

    She was grinding you over at least two layers of clothing, not sucking your dick or sticking it in her vagina. The fact that you blew your load does not mean that you were having intimate sex, only that you get excited and cum too easily.

    And nice job raising that crap with her after she gave you a lap dance.

    But hey, if a lap dance is the same as sex for you then I wish you many happy explosions.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    I've wracked my brain, and I can't figure out the true point to this thread... IT'S FREAKING ME OUT MAN!!

    C'mon, the suspense is killing me.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    OK

    I was trying to introduce a very particular fantasy. Its my fantasy, but I assure you that I'm not alone.

    The fantasy is that of a loving, strong, and free spirited woman - who is not jealous and who is not possessive. She is confident enough in herself to accept that her man might want to be with another woman - simply for sex, and for the sake of trying something different. She would expect the same respect and understanding from her partner for decisions that she makes in her life.

    If I find that woman in the real world, I'm going to pursue her with all I have. If I find that character in a strip club, sher's going to get all of my money (and maybe even send me to the ATM).

    Only you can decide if any part of that is something that you want to aspire to OTC. But, I'm suggesting that if you can at least master that persona ITC, you're going to make some money with it. IMHO it would make you that much more interesting and irresitible to a significant percentage of your customers.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post

    Only you can decide if any part of that is something that you want to aspire to OTC. But, I'm suggesting that if you can at least master that persona ITC, you're going to make some money with it. IMHO it would make you that much more interesting and irresitible to a significant percentage of your customers.


    Me thinks this won't end well.


    Pass the popcorn, please

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Just another good reason to leave the fantasy at the door as your leaving the club.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    Only you can decide if any part of that is something that you want to aspire to OTC. But, I'm suggesting that if you can at least master that persona ITC, you're going to make some money with it. IMHO it would make you that much more interesting and irresitible to a significant percentage of your customers.
    Ugh! Is that all? Sorry dude, I thought you had some sort of earth shattering revelation for us. If I had know you were just another know-it-all telling dancers how to make money I wouldn't have bothered to read any of this...
    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    yoda, I want you so bad it aches in the swimsuit area.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sophia_Starina View Post
    Sophia_Starina is a sensible stripper...Naked all the way.....
    Quote Originally Posted by tempest666 View Post
    Double team! 2 latinas with big tits!!

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Yeah - that's completely presumptious. Sorry.

    If I could take it back, I would, but I can't - so fire away.

    Now I'm going to take FBR's wise advice.

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    Default Re: Monogamy?

    Quote Originally Posted by classyguy View Post
    OK

    I was trying to introduce a very particular fantasy. Its my fantasy, but I assure you that I'm not alone.

    The fantasy is that of a loving, strong, and free spirited woman - who is not jealous and who is not possessive. She is confident enough in herself to accept that her man might want to be with another woman - simply for sex, and for the sake of trying something different. She would expect the same respect and understanding from her partner for decisions that she makes in her life.

    If I find that woman in the real world, I'm going to pursue her with all I have. If I find that character in a strip club, sher's going to get all of my money (and maybe even send me to the ATM).

    Only you can decide if any part of that is something that you want to aspire to OTC. But, I'm suggesting that if you can at least master that persona ITC, you're going to make some money with it. IMHO it would make you that much more interesting and irresitible to a significant percentage of your customers.
    There are lots of women like that. Many women in open relationships are like that. Get out there and find yours.

    It's not something I'd personally aspire to - my days of open relationships are done and I'm no longer interested in sharing - but there are plenty of women who don't share this view.

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