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Thread: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

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    Default Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    So, leads here I think.

    How do we increase demand? How do we do this in a meaningful way?

    Well the number one way would be to make NEW customers of all those guys out there in the world on a massive basis that out paces the hundreds of new camgirls every week that a massive worldwide recession has caused to explode.

    So, if we have 50,000 camgirls, we have quite an advertising force to actually compel more men into our cam rooms. I mean, the number of men who are completely unaware that cams and sexy stuff like this exists just a click away is staggering. So, making them aware should become a priority.

    I mean, if we could bring the comparative ratio of camgirl to customer more in line with 5 years ago, and curtail SOME of the free shows, it would go a long way to getting us back to the $2000 per week times.

    So what do you think? Fliers? TV Commercials? Camfomercials? e-mail blitz? youtube awareness campaign?

    What do you think could work to actually get these lazy guys off their butts and into the cam rooms?

    B
    Last edited by Bambalina; 06-29-2011 at 06:15 PM.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    bambalina in my opinion e-mails don't work because they might be perceived as spam which will make the cam industry look king of bad. When it comes to youtube I think that's the best source we have, because nowdays everybody uses youtube. The ads appear at the beginning of the video they want to see or a banner next to the video. It can get a little complicated because kids might watch it, so we gotta know what videos to target.
    We can also use google adwords, Im not sure if they allow sexual content, but the idea is to use something that works like that.
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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    I think YouTube can be good to reach a lot of customers, same with BackPage and similar online advertising venues. But I'm guessing many of these potential customers are the same ones who already get at least some of their "needs" met online already. Not that these are bad at all, but maybe some other media in addition to the internet.

    Television may be a good way to reach customers new to camsites (I realize SM has done this already with their cheesy commercial), I don't know how much tv ads cost, I assume it isn't cheap. What about print media in magazines/publications geared toward the strip club customer and related publications? I know my town has one of those. I don't know if adult stores allow flyers or advertising, but if they did there's another possibility.

    Okay, this is really an outside the box idea, but advertising as a collective in certain areas/venues could maybe bring in those customers who feel they are more "progressive", "woman-friendly", and would want to support such an endeavor. Not sure how that would work or what their spending habits would be, but it's a thought. Some guys might enjoy a bit of socially responsible wanking.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Quote Originally Posted by tropicalust View Post
    When it comes to youtube I think that's the best source we have, because nowdays everybody uses youtube. The ads appear at the beginning of the video they want to see or a banner next to the video. It can get a little complicated because kids might watch it, so we gotta know what videos to target.
    We can also use google adwords, Im not sure if they allow sexual content, but the idea is to use something that works like that.
    No, unfortunately google adwords does not allow anything remotely sexual.

    Youtube vids can be marked adult by viewers so that'd be our best bet I think (non-nude and very softcore).

    Quote Originally Posted by DMaribella View Post
    Okay, this is really an outside the box idea, but advertising as a collective in certain areas/venues could maybe bring in those customers who feel they are more "progressive", "woman-friendly", and would want to support such an endeavor. Not sure how that would work or what their spending habits would be, but it's a thought. Some guys might enjoy a bit of socially responsible wanking.
    I love that idea, and I love that phrase "socially responsible wanking" ! hahah omg im dying giggling here!

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    ...I keep thinking about how to go viral...

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Imho the biggest thing hurting us is free porn. Before you say free porn has been around forever you need to look at the accessibility. It used to be torrents, irc, p2p, or a few low key websites. Now you have these huge websites (xvideos, wide 6, pornmaxim, and the list goes on) updating constantly throughout the day. The ironic thing is, I know that streamate advertises heavily on these sites, if men can get off for free they will, if people can get music for free, the majority will. Do I think advertisements on these sites are pointless??? Of course not it brings in some new blood. Some men will always prefer an interactive experience, however as we are seeing business is declining and it will continue to, and the same goes for porn, people are going to make less and less. Its hard to make a profit on somthing people are giving away for free. This is what has changed and this is what it hurting us, because I assure you guys are not becoming less horny .

    So the question is how to combat these sites, well I see two ways, one way is to go after their ad affiliates, these people make money from the ads on their porn site. They entice men with free porn (that they did not pay for) and get money on every click, or in some cases every page view. If there was a way to convince these companies to walk away from these companies, they would have no incentive to continue. The second way is what they mpiaa is trying, and thats sorting authority on copyright infringement. I havent a clue why these porn companies arent asserting their ownership of these materials, as it is hurting the adult entertainment business as a whole. Perhaps they have trouble prooving its theirs, perhaps they do not wish to extend the money, perhaps they do not see it as a threat as I do, but at the end of the day its going to be tougher and tougher to charge 4.99 a minute when you can get off for free.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    http://www.usatoday.com/money/media/...orn02_ST_N.htm

    Relevent article for above response. The real kicker is, sites like streamate are partnering up with these tube sites, paying them revenue. Essentially supporting those, who are taking away business. When a better advertisment model would be a mix of targetted advertising, and search engine optimzationg. Targetted advertising on youtube, or picture sites, google, etc. Guys will not ignore the advertising already in place if they can find nowhere else to fap too .

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Quote Originally Posted by laurielegs View Post
    No, unfortunately google adwords does not allow anything remotely sexual.
    Above is a common misconception. I use google adwords to market my xxx tgirl (tranny) affiliate blog with no problems. It's adsense that they don't accept adult sites in. As a random example just google "sex cams" and you'll see adult sites showing up in the adwords section to the right (and normally on top of page too for competitive terms like that).

    You can use adwords, but it takes some time for them to approve your site and they have a lot of rules around it, so read their terms carefully if you use them. Examples: can't use the word "teen" or market teen content, cannot use them for an escort site, etc. Otherwise it's a great marketing tool if you know your market and invest some time in learning about ad copywriting (especially headlines) and a/b split testing.

    http://adwords.google.com/support/aw...&answer=118297
    Last edited by tashataboo; 07-01-2011 at 06:35 PM. Reason: added link

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    YouTube Awareness en masse sounds like a great idea! Especially is camgirls who know each other in real life (and virtually as well, I suppose!) could do doubles cam promos together on YouTube with a specific time and date for a future show. Maybe a weekly commercial or something, advertising which site, profile link, and time and date for one or two specfic shows the viewers should tune into and then greeting the cam room on those specific nights and mentioning some promo code that the viewers who came in due to the YouTube would be able to reference. Great way to build loyalty and customer retention, I would think. I totally plan on implementing this sort of marketing campaign. Great thread, Bambalina!
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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    DMaribella,

    Some Adult Retail Stores may allow you to leave business cards at their check out stands/registers, especially if you offer to promote their store's site on your website and your website appeals to their customer base and appears to be an attractive venue for their site link's placement. Totally.
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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Quote Originally Posted by tashataboo View Post
    Above is a common misconception. I use google adwords to market my xxx tgirl (tranny) affiliate blog with no problems. It's adsense that they don't accept adult sites in. As a random example just google "sex cams" and you'll see adult sites showing up in the adwords section to the right (and normally on top of page too for competitive terms like that).

    You can use adwords, but it takes some time for them to approve your site and they have a lot of rules around it, so read their terms carefully if you use them. Examples: can't use the word "teen" or market teen content, cannot use them for an escort site, etc. Otherwise it's a great marketing tool if you know your market and invest some time in learning about ad copywriting (especially headlines) and a/b split testing.

    http://adwords.google.com/support/aw...&answer=118297
    AH! That's how it is. Thank you for clarifying that.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    As for cam sites, I think the biggest let down has been the "tipping" scheme. Sure some girls are banking, but for how long? And how much harder do they have to work?

    I have been camming for quite a few years, and once upon a time, ALL men paid or they didn't see shit. Now, instead of getting back to back privates, we have to deal with a room full of freeloaders... 90 people in your room.. and if your lucky in an hour you will finally be paid 15-20 bucks by 2-3 men to strip and do a show for all of the freeloaders. I have seen it.

    I won't accept tips, If they tip because they think I'm hot, fine. But I won't play with a dildo, or even show my tits for 10.00 in an hour, in front of a hundred free loading men jerking off. it's private or nothing. I still do good, but I feel like eventually, all men are going to turn into freeloaders like the ones who expect something for nothing now.

    Last time I checked, men want what they can't have. Show it all and they won't pay. The business is all off course. SM is banking now.. but wait until the newness wears off.

    We only make a percentage of those tips, and I'm amazed at the girls on "naked' who say 10 in tips and I will do whatever. I can dig in my couch and earn more than what those girls are working for. Go to that site and see what it did to them.

    It's all going to get bad. This tip concept is not good at all. How many men would willingly pay 100.00 to get a private, but then stop because they know if they hang around in free chat, because they know the cheap girl will settle with 50 from other guys - and he gets a free show?

    Makes no sense to me.

    Tipping, and the "show it all in free chat" will eventually end camming as we know it. Wait and see.

    My motto is work smarter and not harder, but it seems like many camgirls are screwing that for all of us.
    Last edited by Lusty Laken; 07-02-2011 at 03:06 AM.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    [QUOTE=Holly Sn I havent a clue why these porn companies arent asserting their ownership of these materials, as it is hurting the adult entertainment business as a whole. Perhaps they have trouble prooving its theirs, perhaps they do not wish to extend the money, perhaps they do not see it as a threat as I do,

    Many porn companies are always trying to sue the tube sites and get their stuff taken down...but unfortunately many of those sites are out of the country, or when the stuff is taken down its put right back up again for free. so most porn companies just dont have the money or time to fight the free stuff. Trust me, I work in porn and most of the people that run these porn companies HATE tube sites...theres just not much they can do against it.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Bambina mentioned the 100's of new camgirls every week. That was an awesome mention.. because notice those girls, most you never see the next week. For some reason they think they are going to get privates by sitting there with no personality, shoving a dildo in their pussies. Or rubbing themselves. Or looking pretty with their layers of eyeshadow, saying "tip me and I will show you my tits" (and they show tits for .35 cents after the big boy cut... come on, really?) I don't feel business is threatened by those girls. Men can see pussy all day on redtube, they want to interact with a real woman.

    If there was a site, focused on the interaction and conversations leading up to the "privates", and not girls looking like dildo zombies, or parading around for free, then we would have some real money.

    Considering that some girls just don't get it, Rules and regulations, or some influential training should be there for a $$ reason.
    Last edited by Lusty Laken; 07-02-2011 at 03:52 AM.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Quote Originally Posted by Holly Snow View Post
    Imho the biggest thing hurting us is free porn. Before you say free porn has been around forever you need to look at the accessibility. It used to be torrents, irc, p2p, or a few low key websites. Now you have these huge websites (xvideos, wide 6, pornmaxim, and the list goes on) updating constantly throughout the day. The ironic thing is, I know that streamate advertises heavily on these sites, if men can get off for free they will, if people can get music for free, the majority will. Do I think advertisements on these sites are pointless??? Of course not it brings in some new blood. Some men will always prefer an interactive experience, however as we are seeing business is declining and it will continue to, and the same goes for porn, people are going to make less and less. Its hard to make a profit on somthing people are giving away for free. This is what has changed and this is what it hurting us, because I assure you guys are not becoming less horny .

    So the question is how to combat these sites, well I see two ways, one way is to go after their ad affiliates, these people make money from the ads on their porn site. They entice men with free porn (that they did not pay for) and get money on every click, or in some cases every page view. If there was a way to convince these companies to walk away from these companies, they would have no incentive to continue. The second way is what they mpiaa is trying, and thats sorting authority on copyright infringement. I havent a clue why these porn companies arent asserting their ownership of these materials, as it is hurting the adult entertainment business as a whole. Perhaps they have trouble prooving its theirs, perhaps they do not wish to extend the money, perhaps they do not see it as a threat as I do, but at the end of the day its going to be tougher and tougher to charge 4.99 a minute when you can get off for free.

    ^^^^

    Men who come to sites like SM don't want to see theatrical porn. They want to interact with real women.. That's the whole purpose. They want a chance to interact with a hot woman that wants to willingly have fun with them. It's a fantasy. For the most part they can't have a woman like us in real life, and sometimes they try asking us out. Porn is no competition to us. That's in a field of it's own.

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Well said Laken!

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    I tried a lot of the things suggested above with very limited success ... and concluded that PAID search engine placement is the only method that actually produces results that are worth the 'investment'. Of course this now involves an 'economy of scale' i.e. the fees are virtually the same whether you're plugging a webcam site involving 1 girl or 10000 girls.

    As to 'supply and demand', these days there are extremely few guys who remain unaware of the existance of adult webcams ( and if they ARE unaware they also probably couldn't afford to patronize adult webcams LOL ). Thus you aren't actually able to 'create' new demand. Instead you must 'steal' existing demand away from other webcam sites !!!

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lusty Laken View Post

    If there was a site, focused on the interaction and conversations leading up to the "privates", and not girls looking like dildo zombies, or parading around for free, then we would have some real money.

    Considering that some girls just don't get it, Rules and regulations, or some influential training should be there for a $$ reason.

    Well, great minds think alike.

    A few points though. While we are obviously working on the Collective and I am working on my little projects (I use the word LITTLE very tongue in cheek) that should go far to help these situations in the specific, so those sites are coming.

    But the RULES thing is the most important. We probably disagree some on the degree of shows that are appropriate. I believe every camgirl (I'm getting kind of sick of that word...camgirl...we all use it, and it's kind of demeaning...I can see why it is a GREAT word to use around the men of the world...they want "CamGirls" but I'd love to find something better for us to call ourselves that is just as easy to type...)...anyway I believe every camgirl has the right to design her show as she sees fit. I also think that TIPS are a GREAT way to extend more money into the cam realm, and that you are throwing out the baby with the bathwater to just black and white tips into the negative column. I do not think you actually DID that, but you went a long way toward it.

    I think TIPS are great. Under a structure which doesn't allow the tips to become the focus of destroying camming. But it is very easy NOT to have a structure like that. MFC does the EXACT opposite and now SM is following suit. They have the structure to destroy camming in place and then tips come into play and what do you think is going to happen?

    Rules are very important because they keep your camsite from becoming a cam tubesite (which I believe MFC, which used to be awesome, if now becoming)...meaning a place where the FULL show can be viewed free.

    I think that the rules on MFC are reasonable, that simple nudity without any hardcore and lascivious action is acceptable, no close-up or focusing on genitalia in free chat, no insertion, no sexual interaction on girl/girl shows, etc. However, we ALL know how extremely POORLY they interpret their rules and how they even seem to to encourage the free insertion cucmber show with camscores and so on.

    I believe that any good camgirl should be able to play her style and make money in almost any environment, which I believe is some of Noa's point in our discussion in the other thread, and I think she is right...I think women need to be able to step up and make their room interesting, different, exciting, fun and original...and then it doesn;t generally matter what the girls in the other room are doing.

    HOWEVER, where I differ with some is that shows designed to get mass amounts of customers OFF...to allow them to easily masturbate to orgasm...Fap material...the stuff jerkoff fantasies are made of...has NO place in free chat EVER. It causes a loss in cistomers, no matter how you look at it, since it gives away our main product for free. This is NEVER a good idea in any business, to give away the main sale-able product for free! So that is where I believe (and this is my opinion, not something I state as fact) the LINE MUST be drawn in the "rules". You not only can compete with tit flashes, pole dances, body painting, etc. I believe they can help you, since as guys hop around room to room, they get more and more turned on, but nothing ever quite is the hardcore BUMP they need to jerk one out....And you very well could be the beneficiary of that.

    So for me, there is a VERY clear line of demarcation, and yes, there will be some questionable calls...but generally MOST men don;t get off from a tit flash, and MOST men DO get off from a girl sensually fucking herself with life-like dildo, and so the difference is HUGE.

    Group or Private for the hardcore stuff, and I think that guys who solicit you to break the rules should get letter in their mailboxes asking them to stop, because it puts the girls in a bad position and can cause them to lose status, be put on "un-paid vacation" and to even be fined. And that along with DOING those things to the girls who break the rules, will make for a truly entertaining and fun camsite that doesn't cannibalize itself.

    Ok....now, enough about that (unless you really got something to say) and lets get back to the actual subject here....supply and demand and Getting new customers.

    B

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    I tried a lot of the things suggested above with very limited success ... and concluded that PAID search engine placement is the only method that actually produces results that are worth the 'investment'. Of course this now involves an 'economy of scale' i.e. the fees are virtually the same whether you're plugging a webcam sit
    e involving 1 girl or 10000 girls.
    But what we're talking about here is a different sort of beast. I am not referring to advertising your camsite as much as advertising the wonderfulness and benefits of CAMMING in general. I mean, a prime time commercial during the SuperBowl (not that they would let it run) would go far in changing our industry.

    We cannot stop the influx of new camgirls, but we can definitely expand the use of camsites by customers.

    As to 'supply and demand', these days there are extremely few guys who remain unaware of the existance of adult webcams ( and if they ARE unaware they also probably couldn't afford to patronize adult webcams LOL ). Thus you aren't actually able to 'create' new demand. Instead you must 'steal' existing demand away from other webcam sites !!!
    We mostly agree about everything so far it seems, but this is one place I seriously DISAGREE. In doing promotion I have done some stuff quite un-connected to adult biz, and I have met many many many rich men, and a few of them ended up spending quite a lot of money on me camming (and other things ), just because they asked me what I normally do that made me such an innovative promoter and I responded with that I promote for the adult industry...this leads to "Live? On camera? You!?" and then let the fun begin...

    The point is, what I learned is that while you first statement is MOSTLY true, your premise from there falls apart in my experience.

    Yes, MOST men are aware of the existence of webcams. That is true. But of those who are not aware of them, they are a major cross-section of male humanity at every income level, first off, since 45-65 years old men are NOT the most likely to be internet savvy, but those younger, and 45-65 year old men are by far the largest Whale and Big-Spender demographic in camming. But this isn't the biggest reason for advertising in the way I'm talking about, or for this whole thread.

    Those of you who like Subway, or Quiznos....Did you go to them the first day they opened? How about the first time you passed one? FIRST time you saw a commercial?

    Twitter...did you get an account opening day? the VERY first time you heard there was a twitter.com, did you go there? And let me ask further...NOW, is there anyone in the WORLD who has never heard of Twitter? So, I guess that Twitter will never get new accounts? No, obviously, Twitter is getting more accounts now, and new users than every before, it is one of the most popular websites on the planet and people are joining in droves, and you know what? They will be joining in droves next year as well. Facebook, same thing...and overall, much of THIS is because social networking gets huge promotion and advertising from Egypt liberating itself using twitter, and so on.

    7 BILLION people on Earth, and at least 7 Million (one/one thousandth) of them are horny men who have money. The number is much bigger, but I wanted to point out scale...1/1000th of humans is a miniscule amount, yet comes out at 7 million men. So to say that the customer base is "tapped out" is literally thinking inside the box. Because from the world of camming, it SEEMS like we have tried to reach all the men.

    But this is where the outside the box thinking comes in. And yes, I think the youtube idea is great! But I think it is CRAP when compared to having all the adult shops carry a postcard about camming on their counter. In exchange of advertising. Because MANY of those men are the men who are NOT aware they can get a real live squirmy sexy to talk dirty to them and fuck herself for their pleasure, and those guys are in the adult store because they HAVE money.

    The point here is, reaching new guys on the internet = Good
    reaching new guys off the internet = great
    putting your mind to this and actually working out how to blow this up =stellar

    Outside the box is the way to go here....

    B

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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    I love the idea of putting cards in adult stores. At one point in time I was talking to one of my favorite shop clerks (we always have so much fun she likes to dress me up when I go in even if im not going to buy anything, she just likes a fashion show break ) anyway! She was helping me pick out camming outfits and we were talking a about the idea of leaving business cards there for custies. Only problem with this is it's a SMALL city. I'm actually a bit terrified over who might stumble across me. *shifty eye* while I like the idea of promoting camming in general I would rather be promoting MYSELF camming. Then again this could also be a good way to promote a white label cam site. You promote camming, the entire site, but stay personally discreet.

  29. The Following User Says Thank You to Arialandre For This Useful Post:


  30. #21
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    Default Re: Getting more customers! How to affect Supply and Demand...

    Any other ideas for completely slamming us with new customers?

    C'mon! You're the most creative women in the world! Work with me here!

    B

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