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Thread: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

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    Angry Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Today I discovered something that's a bit disturbing to me.

    I need some help understanding how geo-restrictions affect placement. As soon as SM started allowing geo-restrictions, I blocked a random place b/c I knew I couldn't possibly lose much traffic from there. That was back in April and I've had a geo-restriction since then.

    I figured, well I might have a few customers from there but not many. What could it hurt? SM has a disclaimer on that page that specifically says that it could hurt your traffic. I assumed that's because they don't want people complaining about it when they accidentally block the state that most of their regulars are from. If you block the U.S. b/c you live there, for example, you're probably not going to make much money on the site.

    But after an hour-long discussion with my husband today in which we analyzed how much money I have been making in which months, how long it takes me to make my goal, etc., we realized that I have had a steady decline in traffic since about April. That's when I added a geo-restriction.

    Coincidence? No, I don't think so. When you put up a geo-restriction, SM no longer uses you for any kind of advertising. That's exactly WHY I chose some random place; I just didn't want to be used for advertising. But anyone who has read SM's performer contract knows that they are extremely good at disclosing only what legally needs to be disclosed to cover their own asses & not really cluing in the models to the specifics. I think that if you have a geo-restriction on your page they are placing you lower on the site because they cannot use you for advertising. They're not telling us that, but internally they're just automatically fucking up the placement. I don't think my traffic has gotten thinner because I'm not getting as much exposure; I think it's because they actually changed my placement. They're not benefiting from me as much so why should I benefit from them? Is that what's going on? I also have to wonder how many of the sites that they own do they consider to be "advertising." So maybe they're not even placing me at all on some of those sites & I don't show up even when the customer is signed in?

    (I added my own area to my blocked regions a while back, so I haven't checked my placement in months, by the way, that's why I don't know for sure.)

    Anyway, my husband is apparently aware of how SM uses models' content for advertising and he showed me all the sites and pop-ups etc. All I can say is that it's extremely disturbing for someone like me who doesn't care to be outed. However, I'm pretty sure that I'm going to have to remove my geo-restriction. For the past couple of weeks I've been struggling to make about 50% of what I normally make and staying online longer. I've been quite discouraged, depressed, & angry, and I've been trying new things online to make money and it's just not working.

    I know I'm not the hottest thing online or anything like that, but looking at other models on SM, there's just no way to explain how I can't make $1 for a shower show and other models who are less attractive can regularly make $750 in their Gold Shows. I'm attractive, I have personality, and I'm nice to customers as long as they're not jerks. I'm never overly negative and I give great shows. Yet each week is more of a struggle and I just watch, completely baffled, while models who are- quite frankly- nothing special make 10x more money that I do... raking it in like I used to. I've done a dozen Gold Show countdowns in the past week and haven't had more than 25 guys in my free chat during the countdown. I canceled every single show. I did a shower show & had 3 guys "jump" my show and not a single one pay. And not even that many guys bothered to come into my free chat while I was in the show. I was in the shower playing with myself for ten minutes and didn't make a penny. Explanation?????? I'm baffled.

    Is SM bullying us into allowing them to use our content?????
    I think so.

    Does anyone know anything about this? Has anyone experienced a drop in placement since adding a geo-restriction?

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Jess - It's not so, at least not to the extent you think it is. When they say you may lose traffic.. well yeah, that's a given, you've just excluded 1 million in their eyes so yeah.. "your earning potential goes down".

    As with ANY site, they have their own formula as to whom they choose to place on the front page. This is how the our industry has ALWAYS been run. We only see it now because our income is not what it used to be. When I first came back to camming, ifriends had me on their front page, they contacted all of my old members by digging out old e-mails and included me in a very specific way (by calling me one of the internets camming, "pioneers") in one of their mass marketing spam mails and even marketed me in a way that was against my wishes. I have ALWAYS used blocked zones. I block my entire state because I am connected to too many parts of my state to block by zip code.

    The fact is I under performed so they sent me back a page.

    Why I underperformed is between me, my conscience and my sense of limits. You may be fabulous, and you REALLY might be fabulous in every sense of the word but the fact is no one appreciates your fabulosity as much as you do.

    You know... it's also summer. This is a norotious time of year for not only cam girls but every internet based sales site. We are in the northern hemisphere which is also where the majority of the worlds population is. If you had a choice, especially in a still very downed economy, would you be out there getting face time or would you be on your computer?
    Last edited by CammingSince97; 08-31-2011 at 05:00 PM. Reason: My spelling sucks

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    I was thinking the same thing my traffic is so low and I have 2 cities blocked. It's so hard for me to make money there yet I see other girls constantly in private and I know I'm pretty lol. This is really making me upset.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    I don't think this is true...if you guys don't know when you have ANY region blocked you don't show up to anyone who is not logged in. For example if you blocked some random city in wyoming you are not going to show up if you just type in streamate.com, you have to be logged in and then you will show up (as long as you did not block your own city).

    So..I just did a test, I went to streamate not logged in..and then opened another browser and went to streamate and logged in. Then I refreshed them both and I can see that the girl with the highest placement has a block on somewhere (because she doesn't show up, when I'm not logged in). I also noticed a few other really high placed girls (1st and 2nd row) that had a geo-restriction on somewhere.

    I guess it is possible that it still affects placement somehow but not very much because there is definitely girls on the 1st and 2nd row that are using geo-restrictions.
    "Achieving success is a challenge but so is struggling so you may as well choose success."

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    I know this about streamate. I am NOT included in their search tool. If you enter my cam name, it comes up as, "your search has turned up no results".

    It's their own formula. You'll never know the equation. Just do what you know works for you.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Yes, that's what I assume they meant at first when they said my traffic would drop. But I'm just wondering is it's the geo-restrictions. But, as I said, I can't even check my placement until my gep-restrictions drop off. I decided to take them off for a week and see what happens.

    I'm in a precarious position because I'm trying to get a job in the field that I went to school for, and if they were to find out about me, I won't be working in that field, at least not in this state.

    But I just drained my savings account in a cross-country move. There's no way that I can go on this way much longer, making half of what I made a few months ago. So I have to support myself until I can get another job and I feel like it might be worth the risk to take off the restriction and see what happens.

    I know traffic drops in the summer, and with kids going back to school next week, people's vacationing coming to a close, I'm really hoping that it picks up. I was going to wait for next week and see what happens, but I just can't afford to wait that long. I'm going to leave the restrictions off for a couple weeks and then put them back on for a week, experiment.

    I really just don't know what to think about all this, and of course they probably wouldn't be straight with me if I came right out and asked.

    The thing that I don't understand is that, despite the summer drop in traffic, there are people on SM who didn't do nearly as well who are now making a whole lot more than I am. I'm really struggling on there. Maybe there's something about them that's appealing that I just don't understand, and some people seem to have better luck with getting Gold Show goals than others. Maybe I'm just clueless about what it takes to get people to pay for that. Who knows. I know that I've decreased my traffic by blocking the guys who rip me off after the first time they do it. But I also know that it shouldn't be enough guys to so drastically decrease my earnings.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by CammingSince97 View Post
    I know this about streamate. I am NOT included in their search tool. If you enter my cam name, it comes up as, "your search has turned up no results".

    It's their own formula. You'll never know the equation. Just do what you know works for you.
    i have to be logged in to search myself.
    "Achieving success is a challenge but so is struggling so you may as well choose success."

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cam_Model_Jess View Post

    I'm in a precarious position because I'm trying to get a job in the field that I went to school for, and if they were to find out about me, I won't be working in that field, at least not in this state.

    But I just drained my savings account in a cross-country move. There's no way that I can go on this way much longer,
    Same boat. Feel free to message me. I feel you dolly.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by h0ttie View Post
    I don't think this is true...if you guys don't know when you have ANY region blocked you don't show up to anyone who is not logged in. For example if you blocked some random city in wyoming you are not going to show up if you just type in streamate.com, you have to be logged in and then you will show up (as long as you did not block your own city).

    So..I just did a test, I went to streamate not logged in..and then opened another browser and went to streamate and logged in. Then I refreshed them both and I can see that the girl with the highest placement has a block on somewhere (because she doesn't show up, when I'm not logged in). I also noticed a few other really high placed girls (1st and 2nd row) that had a geo-restriction on somewhere.

    I guess it is possible that it still affects placement somehow but not very much because there is definitely girls on the 1st and 2nd row that are using geo-restrictions.
    Yep, I know I don't show up to people who aren't logged in. But I didn't think it would affect much, you know? I guess it could...

    As far as checking out other people's placements, that's interesting. I hadn't thought of looking at that, but I'll have my husband sign on to his account and check it out. Of course, it might be because they just added the restrictions.

    Thanks ladies. I'm just confused and frustrated and don't know what to do to make money on this site anymore.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by h0ttie View Post
    i have to be logged in to search myself.
    I have had site members, nonsite members, cam girls and i have searched myself. I am excluded from search. After all I've said I'm pretty sure you know who I am by now lol. Try it.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by h0ttie View Post
    i have to be logged in to search myself.
    I have been logged in and I have been logged out. I have asked my Yahoo list which is 14 years old to help me. They have no account, they can't find me. They have an account, they can't find me. AmberXXX can't find me logged in or out.

    My traffic is my own. Thank GOD at this age and after this much time I can say that. The only other way to find me is by using specifics.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by CammingSince97 View Post
    I know this about streamate. I am NOT included in their search tool. If you enter my cam name, it comes up as, "your search has turned up no results".

    It's their own formula. You'll never know the equation. Just do what you know works for you.
    Same here. I can never find myself on there, even when logged in and streaming.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by MissKatie View Post
    Same here. I can never find myself on there, even when logged in and streaming.
    I'm curious about this. Is this something you did by choice? Do you have a geo-restriction? Or are you saying that for some unknown reason you just don't show up? I'm asking because I'm wondering if, with the restriction I have, I'm not showing up for anyone and they're finding me by searching for specifics like hair color etc.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by CammingSince97 View Post
    I have been logged in and I have been logged out. I have asked my Yahoo list which is 14 years old to help me. They have no account, they can't find me. They have an account, they can't find me. AmberXXX can't find me logged in or out.

    My traffic is my own. Thank GOD at this age and after this much time I can say that. The only other way to find me is by using specifics.
    thats weird..have you asked sm about it? and what about when you go to ur direct link?
    urscreenname.cammodels.com/
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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    delete

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cam_Model_Jess View Post
    Ok, my husband just signed in using his customer account. He said that it saves your preferences by your log-in name and that clearing cookies doesn't help. So that's why the models are on different places on the page when you're signed in and when you're not signed in. It's not whether or not they have restrictions.

    ...unless you've never clicked on a model's page with your account... then they wouldn't be in a different order.
    its not that they are in a different order..its that they don't appear anywhere at all until logged in.
    "Achieving success is a challenge but so is struggling so you may as well choose success."

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by h0ttie View Post
    its not that they are in a different order..its that they don't appear anywhere at all until logged in.
    you're right. that's why i went back and deleted my last post. my husband just said, "she's right." so i came in and deleted my mistake.

    apparently you and i were posting at the same time.

    and... i should've known that was wrong anyway, because i already said in a post that i know they don't show up. i think i'm just so confused and frantic trying to figure out what's going on so that i can get my earnings up that my brain cells are having trouble keeping up.

    sorry

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by h0ttie View Post
    its not that they are in a different order..its that they don't appear anywhere at all until logged in.
    Yes, the only way I can see myself is if I use my direct link and that doesnt show me placement, just my profile and stream.

    There have been times where I will be sitting in an empty chat room which is extremely unusual not to have the constant in and out's and I would try to check my placement but I have never been able to actually see my little thumbnail among thumbnails.

    I have had people remove me from their fav's list so they can tell me where I am. I know I have been on the front page frequently based on that alone but lately I'm not so sure. My traffic hasn't been great lately so i assume I have been pushed back. Not sure why though because I have 5 stars, run HD video and audio, earn an average of $65 to $100/hr and have never broken a rule. I thought maybe it was because i don't usually stay looged in for more than 1 to 2 hours at a time or for the fact I sent a screenshot of a girl using a toy in one hole and a fist in the other in free chat. (I hate to admit I ratted someone out but I did).

    I think they don't care about all of the free crap going on, to them it's marketing which translates to more traffic so perhaps I'm not on the top of their favorites list anymore.

    Anyway, I have no way of checking. I thought it was because I have my state blocked so obviously if I'm in my own blocked zone then it would make sense but.. yeah... I'm pretty excluded.

    I don't dare contact SM about it because I feel like contacting them is heavily discouraged based on their previous responses which have for the most part been rude.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by CammingSince97 View Post
    I thought maybe it was because i don't usually stay looged in for more than 1 to 2 hours at a time or for the fact I sent a screenshot of a girl using a toy in one hole and a fist in the other in free chat. (I hate to admit I ratted someone out but I did).

    I think they don't care about all of the free crap going on, to them it's marketing which translates to more traffic so perhaps I'm not on the top of their favorites list anymore.

    Anyway, I have no way of checking. I thought it was because I have my state blocked so obviously if I'm in my own blocked zone then it would make sense but.. yeah... I'm pretty excluded.

    I don't dare contact SM about it because I feel like contacting them is heavily discouraged based on their previous responses which have for the most part been rude.
    If you feel the need to contact them with a screenshot, I'd recommend using a separate e-mail account and just put something in your e-mail name that shows you are a cam model. The couple times I ever sent them screenshots, I've had positive responses. There was one porn star who was really bad about sticking her pussy in the cam during her whole countdown. A couple days after my screenshot, she wasn't doing it anymore. So I assume they said something to her. Their responses to me, in that regard, have been positive. I think they know that they can't patrol the site, so they seem to be ok with models sending screenshots of other models. But I don't think they care about the nudity for the most part. I'm not advocating doing this, but I'm just saying that if you're gonna send them e-mails, you might want to do it from a different e-mail b/c I've been reading on here that people are getting suspended for some stupid stuff lately.

    If you blocked your own state, then yes it would make sense that you can't see yourself. I had my own state blocked for a while, so I couldn't see myself. I unblocked it recently and am just waiting until the restriction drops off. Then I'll be able to check my placement. As long as I'm still near the top of the site, I'll put the restriction back on.

    Yes, I've gotten some very rude e-mail responses from them when I e-mail about site/customer issues. Overall, they really don't care what you need from them, they don't read long e-mails and often just skim the e-mail and answer the question they think you're asking. Often when I've asked a question, it has not been answered or they've answered a different question that I didn't ask. However, if you send a very direct e-mail with a request in it, I've found that they often give you what you want. For example, I requested a feature on my account, told them to give it to me (phrased it as though I had no doubt that they would give it to me but was still respectful) and they responded within a couple hours and also gave me the requested feature.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    i had been curious about this too. i have no problem getting prvts/excl. on sm but i dont get alot of traffic to my room so i have been mainly wrking mfc. i have 3 states blocked including my own...so i was wondering since i wasn't being used in they're advertisement, i wonder if that is the reason for less traffic to my room. i think i might have to unblock all that sometime soon and experiment and see if i get more traffic.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Okay, this is weird....

    Someone sent me a PM about this thread and asked me to post some info he/she sent me.

    I asked why can't you post it yourself and why should I post it for you? Who are you?

    The reply: I run Streamate and I can't post because you have to be a camgirl to post on here.

    Really????
    Last edited by Cam_Model_Jess; 09-03-2011 at 08:05 PM.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Update: I have been doing pretty well for the past couple days using Party Chat w/ Gold Show instead of regular shows. I did about 3 shows per day for the last two days and I made enough that I didn't have to do anymore privates the rest of the day. It's not like I made a ton of money like a lot of you ladies do, but it was enough that as long as I can do the same thing with the PC/GS today and tomorrow, I'll have more than my goal for the week.

    The geo-restrictions dropped off yesterday before I did the shows. I had about the same number of guys in my room as I did the day before when there were geo-restrictions. It's not that I expected immediate results or anything. But now this experiment is going to run into my Labor Day experiment. Oh well. At least I'm making money now!!

    Happyhappyjoyjoy

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    This is the same thing going on with me but I'm so affraid to take the block off. I might just have to.


    Quote Originally Posted by bubblegumbitch View Post
    i had been curious about this too. i have no problem getting prvts/excl. on sm but i dont get alot of traffic to my room so i have been mainly wrking mfc. i have 3 states blocked including my own...so i was wondering since i wasn't being used in they're advertisement, i wonder if that is the reason for less traffic to my room. i think i might have to unblock all that sometime soon and experiment and see if i get more traffic.

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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cam_Model_Jess View Post
    Okay, this is weird....

    Someone sent me a PM about this thread and asked me to post some info he/she sent me.

    I asked why can't you post it yourself and why should I post it for you? Who are you?

    The reply: I run Streamate and I can't post because you have to be a camgirl to post on here.

    I must seem really stupid. And, if you run Streamate, then I'm sure you're not lurking on forums like this. And, if you run Streamate, I'm pretty sure you could figure out how to post on here w/o being a camgirl.
    I can totally see why you were skeptical. I would be too. it's always good to be really cautious.

    But... I have to say, actually the owner is a pretty hands-on person and he has been known to personally participate in message boards. I've been in an online chat where he attended when a bunch of former Ifriends hosts (including me) first went to Streamate. It is entirely possible it was him.



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    Default Re: Geo-restriction on SM... how it affects your placement.

    Quote Originally Posted by laurielegs View Post
    I can totally see why you were skeptical. I would be too. it's always good to be really cautious.

    But... I have to say, actually the owner is a pretty hands-on person and he has been known to personally participate in message boards. I've been in an online chat where he attended when a bunch of former Ifriends hosts (including me) first went to Streamate. It is entirely possible it was him.
    That's really interesting. I might've been a bit more "chill" on some of my posts had I known the owner of Streamate might be reading them. But it really surprises me to hear someone describe him as "hands on." I have only been on there for a year, but my experiences with the company would not have made me think that. The people responding to SM e-mail messages (model help) have either not been trained very well, don't do their job very well, or have been trained to respond in a manner that makes it seem like one or both of the former is true. In the time that I have been on there, I have received a few helpful e-mail responses but the majority have been entirely frustrating. I've been given info from one employee that was contrary to the info another employee gave me, I've received responses that made it clear to me that my e-mail was not read all the way thru or read at all, etc. It's maddening. I've resorted to only e-mailing when absolutely necessary, and even then the help I get it shoddy at best.

    Now, that's just my own personal experience. Maybe there are models on there who make more money than I, who receive better attention & fewer rude e-mails; maybe I've just had bad luck in that department. I also realize that there is so much more to being the owner of a company than making sure that your employees are trained and helpful. And more to being the owner of a company than making sure that your models are following rules that you set forth as a condition for employment. I have no idea who he is. Hell, I suppose he could be a great guy for all I know, but I guess that's not the image I have in my head

    Of course, I would never have guessed that the owner of Streamate would send an anonymous message to someone on this forum, least of all me, and least of all for this particular topic. Who knows, maybe it was him. I'm guessing it's more likely that it was some dude who just wanted to give an opinion on something. Or maybe it's some guy who's getting off on the fact that we're actually discussing it. But I guess it doesn't really matter.

    Thanks for the info tho. It's certainly interesting to think of the owner in that manner. Definately gave me pause.

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