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Thread: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

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    Banned Eric Stoner's Avatar
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    Default Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    In a trend unlike that for previous recessions, graduate school enrollments are DOWN. Fewer people are going to graduate school.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Not surprised because I've found out that having a Masters actually makes you overqualified and sometimes more unemployable. I got mine 7 years ago and yes it has opened doors, on the other hand it has prevented me from other fields because employers see it and think they can't afford me. At the same time though I am seeing more and more jobs requiring a Masters. I just interviewed for a job where it was a requirement.

    Honestly, graduate school was a waste. The two years I could have been spending them in a fulltime job instead of substitute teaching jobs and dancing part time.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellydancer View Post
    Not surprised because I've found out that having a Masters actually makes you overqualified and sometimes more unemployable. I got mine 7 years ago and yes it has opened doors, on the other hand it has prevented me from other fields because employers see it and think they can't afford me. At the same time though I am seeing more and more jobs requiring a Masters. I just interviewed for a job where it was a requirement.

    Honestly, graduate school was a waste. The two years I could have been spending them in a fulltime job instead of substitute teaching jobs and dancing part time.
    That is apparently what accounts for the drop-off. People are reluctant to invest the time and money to get an advanced degree and are content to devote themselves to the jobs they have now. For which they are more and more grateful to have these days.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    It really isn't worth the investment and I am not happy I got the degree. It's almost more like a bragging point to say I have one more than a positive for employers. I know I almost went to get a Ph.D, had the papers even filled out. Then I spoke to several people with Ph.D's or those with ABD (all but dissertation)and realized that would even be worse. That would really make me overqualified, with 2-5 years out of the workforce and likely $100,000+ in debt.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    ^^^ yup, especially for an exotic dancer who is capable of earning $100k+ per year via a serious full time dancing effort, passing up two additional years of dancing earnings in addition to taking on yet another $100k plus in student loan debt to seek a Doctorate degree creates a 'cost versus benefits' equation that almost certainly won't end on a positive note.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Yep, instead of dancing and going to school, if I could do it again I'd dance, then go to school after I socked away money. Instead I danced fulltime and often went to go school fulltime, and later on (in grad school)attended school full time and danced part time.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    I'm currently working on my Bachelors and looking at grad schools. The problem of being over qualified is a big concern of mine. I can't decide whether I want to enroll in a masters or phd program.. I just don't know if I want to spend 5+ years getting a PhD if it isn't going to pay off in the end. I'm in the sciences which changes things a bit, but I still anticipate problems getting a job I really want regardless of my level of education.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Overqualified doesn't just mean you have a Master's or Ph.D. It also can just be if you have been in the workforce for more than X years. Hence, getting a Master's or Ph.D can actually *prevent* you from being overqualified, because if you spend 1 year getting a Master's, when you come out you will be treated as having no experience, and after 3 years you will have 3 years' of experience.

    But if you start working right away, after 4 years you will have 4 years' experience, hence more likely to be overqualified. I guess it depends on the field. A Ph.D is usually 5 years minimum, but only 2-3 years of coursework, and up to 7 years or more to finish the dissertation. But it won't set you back as much as a Master's because Ph.D candidates are usually funded (tuition fully paid plus a small stipend). So it's often the equivalent of earning $50,000+ a year, while you are doing your Ph.D.

    It's a cliche but true: the only reason to do a Ph.D is if you are really passionate about the topic and just want to do it, other concerns be damned. If you are doing it for money or to get a certain job (except for academic) then it isn't worth it.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    I'm entering grad school within the next year and the idea of being considered over-qualified is pretty ridiculous to me. I want to be a secondary teacher, and most states REQUIRE a masters degree at the very least--NY state requires a BA just to sub a class. I guess it just depends on what field you're going into, and whether you're just getting a masters for the sake of having one, or if it's part of an actual plan you have for a future career.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    ^^^ agreed that New York and some other states now require a Masters for full time teaching positions. However, New York and some other states also now have relatively high teacher unemployment rates due to state and local budget cutbacks plus the ongoing loss of population outside of huge urban areas. Therefore one must question the 'risk/reward' equation of seeking a Masters in Education if one plans to keep residing in New York.

    But perhaps more relevant to this thread, if one does obtain a Masters in Education but is unable to find a full time teaching position upon graduation, that Masters degree could actually serve as a negative attribute when seeking 'other' employment. The obvious reason for this is that potential employers in 'other' fields will immediately recognize that the fully qualified but unemployed teacher is almost certainly going to keep submitting resume's for teaching positions throughout the area, and is going to quit to take the first open full time teaching position that they find ... thus essentially 'wasting' the investment in learning curve related low productivity and/or job specific training that the 'other' employer must make in any new employee. Arguably, given current conditions, seeking a Masters in Education in hopes of pursuing a career in secondary education in upstate New York constitutes a major financial 'risk'.

    Fortunately, as an exotic dancer, in a 'worst case' scenario of failing to obtain a full time teaching position upon graduation from the Masters program, and also failing to be hired for an acceptable position in another 'straight job' field, you can always continue to dance in order to make those additional student loan payments ! But not everyone pursuing a Masters degree will have this 'worst case' option open to them. And for the vast majority of students that do not have an option of generating immediate and significant income via dancing after graduation from a Masters program after failing to find a teaching job, the additional student loan payments and the potentially increased difficulty in finding 'other' work could be financially painful. THIS is the reason that Grad school enrollments are down.

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 10-02-2011 at 04:35 PM.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    ^I'm planning on moving to Arkansas, or maybe some southwestern state--preferably New Mexico; no way in hell am I staying in this state. I'll wait till after I'm moved to enroll in grad school. I know Arkansas really needs teachers for middle school/junior high school, so I'm not really going on the NY budget cutbacks in making this decision. I know this is what I want to do, and I'm good at it, and I have no problem waiting a few years after I graduate with my MA to get a teaching job. As you said, I can always take strip trips and what-not in the meantime--I wouldn't like the idea of stripping in the same area that I plan on teaching in. Too much of a risk.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    ^^^ it sounds like you've got a pretty good handle on the 'real world' situation. And as mentioned before you also have the 'if all else fails' option of exotic dancing to help fill any income gaps. Unfortunately, you're in a tiny minority versus typical Grad students ... who arguably risk a major 'squeeze play' by racking up huge student loan debts ( with sizeable new monthly payments after graduation ) in exchange for a Masters degree that may not translate into a job in their desired field nor a well paying job in some 'other' partially related field, given the current ( and short term forseeable ) economic climate.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    In Illinois most schools seem to prefer Masters but most teachers have Bachelors. However, I know many teachers who are unemployed and many for years. Most of the unemployed have a Masters.

    However for most jobs it does make you overqualified for. For the field I am pursuing a Masters is preferred but for my former fields (broadcasting and PR) a Masters is vastly overqualified.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    I like the idea of going to grad school, especially after spending several years working on the field that I want to do the master. The master (or a Ph.D) is like a sign of expertise in a specific field after years of working on it, and discovering things about it.

    However, I hate when people that are fresh out of college go to graduate school (especially the ones who graduated with a BA instead of a BS); but people that are aiming to be doctors, lawyers, or engineers in very specific fields are exempt from this since they are required to attend grad school in order to obtain the licenses to do their jobs.

    I have a friend who went to college with me that as soon as she graduated, enrolled in grad school in Spain to be a...sitcom writer! I honestly think she wasted a lot on money on that because she has zero working experience as a scrip writer. Doing a master like that one would make more sense for someone like, say, Tina Fey who's a well known comedy script writer with tons of experience. Now, my friend cannot find a job anywhere because of her lack of experience.

    On the other hand, I have this other friend (a guy) who also went to college with me and went to do a master right after college (the first person, this guy and I took many classes together). But him, unlike the first person, had several work already published (he went to have a master in creative writing), and the master was funded with money he earned from his printed work. It made more sense for my second friend to pursuit the master.





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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellydancer View Post

    However for most jobs it does make you overqualified for. For the field I am pursuing a Masters is preferred but for my former fields (broadcasting and PR) a Masters is vastly overqualified.
    Please, please tell this to the majority of people that went to college with me: I have a BS in communications (the minor is in IT), and most of the people that went to college with me (classmates, under and upper classmates) are in chunks of debt for doing masters, especially right after finishing the BS.





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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    hahaha!!! I just read the subject as "Grade School Enrollments Down". Too good!

    end thread jack.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay12 View Post
    Please, please tell this to the majority of people that went to college with me: I have a BS in communications (the minor is in IT), and most of the people that went to college with me (classmates, under and upper classmates) are in chunks of debt for doing masters, especially right after finishing the BS.
    I'll probably be paying for another ten years or so. It was the biggest mistake of my life. If I could do it again I'd dance then save my money and go parttime.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Yeah, I've always been all RAH RAH for school, but a graduate education hasn't done shit for me. It's depressing to think about all the time, energy, and money I've invested, only to see no return.

    I agree with Kelly's sentiment about being overqualified. I have excellent grades, professional experience, awesome recommendations and a strong history of success and innovation - but I have been looking for a full time job since LAST November.

    I know that the current job market is a big factor, but I can't help but wonder if the education bubble has just...burst :/

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Dancing is still more lucrative than most vanilla jobs anyways.





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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay12 View Post
    Dancing is still more lucrative than most vanilla jobs anyways.
    Sometimes, yes. However, you can't dance forever. And personally, I have way too much to offer intellectually -and I want SO badly to do so. I mean really, I have a nice figure because I work out and eat well - but I'm smart and super fucking educated... and I am way more proud of my education/intellect than my body.

    But because I'm good looking, I've always felt like I had to "prove" that I am smart too. I think that's a big part of why I went to grad school... I wanted a piece of paper to certify my intelligence.

    But anyways...

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Quote Originally Posted by tampadancer View Post
    Sometimes, yes. However, you can't dance forever. And personally, I have way too much to offer intellectually -and I want SO badly to do so. I mean really, I have a nice figure because I work out and eat well - but I'm smart and super fucking educated... and I am way more proud of my education/intellect than my body.

    But because I'm good looking, I've always felt like I had to "prove" that I am smart too. I think that's a big part of why I went to grad school... I wanted a piece of paper to certify my intelligence.

    But anyways...
    Agreed. I've always been proud of my intelligence but when people see me they often think "pretty brainless woman". I am 40, look much younger but know in the next few years I will not be as pretty then what? This is why many years ago I went into the corporate world before it was too late. I am proud of my graduate education and proud I graduated with a Masters and a 3.7. Far more proud than the fact I look amazing for my age.

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    Default Re: Grad School Enrollments DOWN !

    Unfortunately these days, its all about EFFORT and less about whatever degree. Most jobs look at your personality, how motivated you are, and your internships way before they look at anything else. In addition, they will only hire someone who looks and seemingly fits the part.

    I believe hiring based on EFFORT is the way it SHOULD be. Not everyone can afford college, and a lot of people are stuck in bad situations (parents won't give tax info so they can't fill out FAFSA, etc.)

    I went to graduate school, but I knew what I was getting into before I went. I knew it was just a passion or hobby, but that I did not want a formal career in that industry. In addition, I know I learned a lot, but I learned wayyyyy more just going to the library and checking out books FOR FREE that interested me. You aren't required to finish reading a library book you realize you aren't interested in after you've checked it out, but you will be required to finish courses you aren't interested in. That's wasted time & money in my opinion. Our system is so flawed.

    You can always create your own business. You don't need a degree for that. Just know what you're doing, and you can learn that from library books and the internet.

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