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Thread: if you want their time not just their dances

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    Default if you want their time not just their dances

    Not a newbie...... I've figured it out lol.

    If you wonder why the girl you 'love' won't wait till you're ready for a dance, condsider tipping her the $30 or so per song she should make if dancing (her cut plus fair tip) to hang till you're ready, otherwise evvery 2 songs or so she's gotta run the room to see what she's missing

    Just for the clueless.
    Last edited by pinups4; 12-10-2011 at 01:18 AM.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Now THAT is no kind of ROI my friend! If I want to spend $30 a song she's gonna be dancing for me!

    I would also add that, if you are an established and well spending regular, it is very possible to get your dance time and some quality but reasonable face time. This doesn't mean showing up and expecting her to sit for half an hour waiting for you to but one or two dances. If you do VIP or buy dances in large blocks it's not that complicated.
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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    I agree. As I posted before, I am the "parking spot" for girls who want a break from the hustle to sit, count money, and bitch about the nonpayin PLs.

    Normally I tip about $10 per half hr if they're hanging for my entertainment. More if its not her in one chair n me in other....

    The post was made last night after 3 girls and I tried to teach a PL how to tip. As I sat there with them (he wantted in) I passed each girl $50 per song (they gave it back after) telling him the table had a $10/song admission fee or $100 for a 3 girl makeout session right there

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Well....aren't you THE MAN ??? Tipping $10 a half hour when she could have done 6-8 dances in that time frame. Then tipping the ladies and taking it back. You tell us to tip the $30 per song they would have earned to sit with us yet you clearly don't.

    You very well may have cost them with the guy figuring if he needed to spend $50 a song to compete that he was better off moving on to another lady.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Wow...the venom! I'm always amazed in online forums how if people don't agree, they must attack.

    I never said $10/half hour was a lot...but if she doesn't see anything better in the room (I always remind them to find whatever money they can) or chooses to relax n smoke w me, its better than nothing on a dead night.

    As for the $50 trick....that was HER idea. He was being a drunk prick looking for a free feel...this was the last attempt to get the money flowing or get him to go away. It worked. He left. And they later got the $ as we knew they would...

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    I knew this was going to be retarded just by the title. But its like a car wreck on the turnpike and I had to stare.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Tipping girls that entertain me for their time is my primary means of paying girls ITC. IME there is no magic or inherently understood tip4time formula that can be used as a benchmark. Each girl will have a different idea of how much her time is worth, so some girls will happily stay by your side as long as you are shelling out $20-40 every so often while others are operating in a back room or bust mode.

    I will say that picking slower times of the week and lower hustle clubs helps a lot, but even then one will run across some girls that either do not understand that they have other ways to earn or just have no interest in sitting with customers, but IMHO some of the savvier girls understand what is happening and, when their clubs are otherwise dead or filled with non-spenders, will gladly earn decent money for sitting and gabbing.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    I'm not entirely sure.... what the point of this is....???

    Your initial post is telling guys to tip $30 per song the girl sits with you... then you come back and say that you actually only tip $10/half hour, and tell a story about how you shamed a low-tipper by pretending to tip $50 every song.... I just... I'm trying to figure out what the main message of this thread was... but....
    Don't try to win over the haters. You are not the Jerk Whisperer.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by Aurora_Sunset View Post
    I'm not entirely sure.... what the point of this is....???
    He fancies himself to be the cool guy in the club who is able to hang with dancers while not spending any money. My hunch is that the dancers who hang with him are probably not very serious about earning a living. Most girls who spend the night with a non-spender flapping their jaws and running scams are not serious earners.
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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    If you truly tip 30 per song then thats great. 10 per half hour is just plain cheap.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    IME there is no magic or inherently understood tip4time formula that can be used as a benchmark. Each girl will have a different idea of how much her time is worth, so some girls will happily stay by your side as long as you are shelling out $20-40 every so often while others are operating in a back room or bust mode.
    Rick (and whomever wants to answer) - it sounds like your guestimate formula for time-for-tip, especially when it's slow, is not quite the full price of a LD/song but a percentage that's still respectful? I know it's not an exact science, but something like that?

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    my logic is this. If you need her to wait, then tipping 30/song in my area at my club will work. If you're just hanging and she wants a place to drink n smoke (ours is byob) then 10 to 20/half plus good booze works for some girls. Clearly at that rate she goes to grab whatever money she can and you're one of several 'rest options'.

    For me, tipping during rest periods shows you know she's working, helps cover tip out, and let's her feel like she's getting something ($20/hr beats mcdonalds). Plus, my club 'friends' know dances are a matter of when, not if.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    If you're not tipping a dancer for her time then you're not worth hanging out with until you're "ready" for a dance.

    If you're not tipping me a decent amount to compensate me for my time - time that I could be spending making bank doing dances for other guys - I'm not going to waste my time with you, ever. I'll give you maybe one song of my time, and if I don't see any tips coming my way, or you're not buying, I'm moving on.
    Last edited by MiaStarr; 12-11-2011 at 05:52 PM.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by MiaStarr View Post
    If you're not tipping a dancer for her time then you're not worth hanging out with until you're "ready" for a dance.

    If you're not tipping me a decent amount to compensate me for my time - time that I could be spending making bank doing dances for other guys - I'm not going to waste my time with you, ever. I'll give you maybe one song of my time, and if I don't see any tips coming my way, or you're not buying, I'm moving on.


    I WHOLEHEARTEDLY AGREE

    In fact on Friday I pointed out 2 guys to my one friend, she said 'nah I'm cool here'. I pushed herm handed her a $20 and reminded her that in here she's (stage name) not (real name) and to go get it. one guy was a dud, and one did 2 CRs and kept her busy till 4am closing.

    I remind everyone to go find the money and ditch me anytime. If they hang out, I tip what I can for secondhand smoke lol. I never hesitate to approach emn when I'm ready

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by BringOnTheMen View Post

    And do you know what's even better than $10/half hour? Sitting on my ass in the DR smoking a cigarette for nothing. I would rather leave the club with nothing than put myself on sale.
    Yup....

    Honestly, I have favs that sit with with me, no tipping involved, but it's part of our time together and it includes me buying dances in bulk or VIP on every visit. It does not include a guessing game every time I go to their club leaving them hoping that if they sit with me I might buy dances.

    In every club there are dancers who hustle and earn and dancers who screw around and lose opportunities. I always seem to wind up attracted to the ones who are there to earn. Some times a girl just isn't feeling it and will take a break when they see a friendly face but, over-all, the concept of having dancers just sit with me and whine about other customers or play games with them is pretty foreign to me.

    Takes all kinds I guess..
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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    Honestly, I have favs that sit with with me, no tipping involved, but it's part of our time together and it includes me buying dances in bulk or VIP on every visit.
    Okay, now I don't feel so bad.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    ^ LOL, well, it is a fine line and it's not one you want to push too hard. I have a routine with a few ladies that revolves around how much I spend, what day of the week I go and, well, not being a dickhead wen she sees a regular and needs to go!

    I have a fav that works in a small club about an hour from my house. I make the trip on Mondays or Tuesdays because those are very slow days for her. The club doesn't really pick-up until after 4pm so I go in at around 1pm, spend an hour chatting and tipping her at the stage, an hour in VIP and another hour or so chatting while we have lunch. I head out right around 4pm. Everyone is happy! A few weeks ago I was slammed with work, hadn't seen her for a while and went in on a Friday. Needless to say the club is much busier. We chatted for a bit and then did our VIP for an hour. When we came out the club was packed. I gave her a hug and said my good-bye's.

    The key to getting a dancer to spend face time with you is your attitude. Never forget her need to earn all day, not just when you are buying dances from her and, for myself personally, I never like to put a lady in a position where she feels like she owes me the face time when there is money on the floor to be made.
    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    yoda, I want you so bad it aches in the swimsuit area.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sophia_Starina View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by tempest666 View Post
    Double team! 2 latinas with big tits!!

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    The key to getting a dancer to spend face time with you is your attitude. Never forget her need to earn all day, not just when you are buying dances from her and, for myself personally, I never like to put a lady in a position where she feels like she owes me the face time when there is money on the floor to be made.
    Great advice. I've actually started going during slower times - the start or end of a shift - so it's not so busy and I know I'm not taking away from her time too much. And I've told her that I totally get it if a regular walks in or someone wants a dance, VIP, etc. Me walking into her club is like her coming into my office - she wouldn't get pissed if I stopped chatting to answer my line, so why should I get pissed if she stops chatting to attend to another customer (as long as I haven't already plunked the $$ down, of course).

    But after reading some of these posts, I was feeling kinda bad. My regular usually sits and chats with me for a while before our VIPs. I always tip her after our dances, but I started wondering if I should be tipping her for her time pre-VIPs, as well. From what I've read, given the amount of time we talk, it sounds like it's understood that this time is included in the VIP 'package' as well. If we talk longer, I can increase my tip a little. I may even experiment with finding a good price to just chat (floats my boat, not yours, I know). She's a sweetheart, so the last thing I wanna do is disrespect her time by not tipping enough. At the same time, I'm trying to do what's fair for both of us

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    It's always such a foreign concept to me that there are girls who just sit around w/ customers to "relax" or "take a break". There are a couple of girls like this at my club. They pretty much just work for booze. It's sad.

    I don't care if no one else is buying dances, I'd rather sit in the DR, eat, text message, read a book, go online, chat w/ other dancers, ANYTHING but aimlessly sit w/ customers for free or $10 a half-hour. Doing a half-hour of talking w/ some guy I have to put up a facade around (and yes, even if you think you really know a dancer ITC she almost always is, to an extent, maintaining some sort of facade for privacy or image or whatever), is actually a lot of energy. Energy that could be better reserved for when spending-customers actually come in, not to mention saving my voice not having to yell over loud music that whole time.

    I wouldn't even sit with a guy for a half-hour to get a single dance, and I make $20 a dance at my club. Time flies when you're having fun, so to customers I dont think a half-hour seems very long, but it's for-fucking-ever for most profit-minded strippers. I think it encourages bad customer-habits too. Oh well, to each their own

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    Honestly, I have favs that sit with with me, no tipping involved, but it's part of our time together and it includes me buying dances in bulk or VIP on every visit. It does not include a guessing game every time I go to their club leaving them hoping that if they sit with me I might buy dances.

    In every club there are dancers who hustle and earn and dancers who screw around and lose opportunities. I always seem to wind up attracted to the ones who are there to earn. Some times a girl just isn't feeling it and will take a break when they see a friendly face but, over-all, the concept of having dancers just sit with me and whine about other customers or play games with them is pretty foreign to me.

    Funny, in all the years that I've been doing this, the allure of lapdances has been equally foreign to me. I've done a fair number of them over time and I just don't get it. I have no interest in simulated physical and emotional intimacy, nor do I crave simple physical contact. And even in those rare times when they did do something for me, usually because a girl had just the right mix of charms, so what? Sorry to say it this way, but I struggle to view a hard-on as a great end goal for any activity and, IMHO, walking back out into the main area of a club with one is just flat out undignified.

    In fact, when I was younger, the only use I had for clubs was as a source of ITC p4p activities. Many moons ago, my clubbing activities picked up dramatically once I learned of the existence of this stuff, courtesy of a few clubs in RI and CT as well as business trips to some great clubs down south. I was one of those "douchebag" customers who would only drop real money if there was a fine finish involved and I targeted clubs where this was possible. I was also, I will admit, a little less picky than I am today on the quality and personality fronts.

    As I have gotten older, my interests have evolved. I am now much less inclined to handle my business ITC. I also tip much better than I used to, which includes tipping girls if they spend time with me. Now I will admit that this started as a means of giving hungry girls a "taste" ITC in order to encourage them to meet me OTC, but now I tip much more broadly. I have come to appreciate sexy and savvy dancers, even when dicier activities are not in the cards, so when a girl delights and entertains me ITC I am happy to give her money for her efforts.

    We all have different tastes and interests, so I suppose that, as long as the girl involved in providing a particular service is happy with what she is being paid, then everyone leaves happy.
    Last edited by rickdugan; 12-12-2011 at 09:03 AM.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by Kessler View Post
    Rick (and whomever wants to answer) - it sounds like your guestimate formula for time-for-tip, especially when it's slow, is not quite the full price of a LD/song but a percentage that's still respectful? I know it's not an exact science, but something like that?
    Kessler, it usually works out to a certain amount per hour, though it is not an exact science. How often I reach into my pocket depends upon how entertained I am and how often she has left to do other things. On top of this, of course, she has an open bar tab while she is sitting with me, so this approach works really well on slow nights when a girl wants to earn AND drink.

    I am not really advocating this approach per se, but rather simply pointing out that it works out well for me given my general preferences. There are a lot of potential pitfalls to this approach as it depends largely upon the particular clubs in question and the personalities of the girls that you are interested in. In one exteme, I have had girls who stayed glued to me for hours simply because I opened up my wallet, but yet in another extreme, I actually had one girl who was confused about why I gave her a fairly large tip simply for sitting for a short time (I was a bit drunk and I found her both very alluring and entertaining) and she promptly headed for the hills.

    The critical moment with a new girl is what she does when you give her the first thank you tip. If I said "yes" when she initially asked to sit down, she will get something from me. When she tries to close the dance sale, I will say "no thank you" to the dances but will give her money for her efforts. At that moment, she can either decide to walk away or see where things might lead. If she stays, then an informal tip for time situation may evolve. If she leaves, then either (1) she didn't understand that there was potentially more behind that; (2) she understood that there may be more, but felt that her prospects were better elsewhere; or (3) just had no interest in sitting and chatting with a customer, period.

    Anyway, as I've said, my brand of SC enjoyment is not for everyone and is not as readily available in high volume clubs. It is just my particular gig.
    Last edited by rickdugan; 12-12-2011 at 11:01 AM.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    On top of this, of course, she has an open bar tab while she is sitting with me, so this approach works really well on slow nights when a girl wants to earn AND drink.
    A couple of years ago in the dead of winter I got a text one afternoon from my ATF. "If you have nothing better to do I'm dying out here and I'd love some company" Now, this girl is a hustler but she's also a good friend. She never texts me to come and spend money on her. She was stuck working a double and there were no customers in the club. I was off that day so I texted her back that I'd be there in a couple of hours. Her response was "Awesome. I don't care if you spend any money but can you buy me adult beverages?" LOL, I laughed my ass off and then texted her back that it would be no problem..

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    I am not really advocating this approach per se, but rather simply pointing out that it works out well for me given my general preferences.
    Good point rick. I know a lot of dancers who would never go for your approach or mine. Finding a lady, or several, who are simpatico with our respective approaches is part of the fun!
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    Quote Originally Posted by tempest666 View Post
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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by Kessler View Post
    Rick (and whomever wants to answer) - it sounds like your guestimate formula for time-for-tip, especially when it's slow, is not quite the full price of a LD/song but a percentage that's still respectful? I know it's not an exact science, but something like that?
    Rick and Yoda have already given you some sound guidelines here.

    It's also helpful to remember that there is such dramatic variability among clubs in the industry that the business models alone -- and by that I mean how the dancers make their money -- are literally all over the map.

    That means that when you travel outside your home club circle you would be well advised to:

    1) Do your due diligence on the club in advance (recommendations from like-minded customers are good; direct invitations from dancers you know are best);

    2) Chat with a few dancers in each club early in your visit about how you might take care of them in a way that maximizes their cash -- this can make a huge difference to them at the end of the shift because of the mind-boggling array of different compensation rules, tricks, tip-outs, payouts, funny money, percentage breakdown on CRs, etc., and

    3) Pick a day and time that works for that club and the dancers you are visiting.

    My personal opinion is that SCs are by their very nature luxury venues and that means that you are much better served by focusing on finding the right dancers to spend time with, setting up the CR or arrangement that works best for that club, and then determining how you will take care of the dancers in the optimal way rather than running a mental clock tied to some fractional hourly dance rate.

    I recognize that this sounds highly dancer-focused and less self-focused. In my experience, though, if you take care of the former, the latter not only self-resolves, it sort of blooms into a little miracle.

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

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    Default Re: if you want their time not just their dances

    Quote Originally Posted by pinups4 View Post
    I WHOLEHEARTEDLY AGREE

    In fact on Friday I pointed out 2 guys to my one friend, she said 'nah I'm cool here'. I pushed herm handed her a $20 and reminded her that in here she's (stage name) not (real name) and to go get it. one guy was a dud, and one did 2 CRs and kept her busy till 4am closing.

    I remind everyone to go find the money and ditch me anytime. If they hang out, I tip what I can for secondhand smoke lol. I never hesitate to approach emn when I'm ready
    Well, realistically, its not up to the customers to make sure the girls get paid. If these dancers can't hustle for themselves, then they wind up getting stuck in situations like these...leaving more opportunity for everyone else to earn.

    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    ^ LOL, well, it is a fine line and it's not one you want to push too hard. I have a routine with a few ladies that revolves around how much I spend, what day of the week I go and, well, not being a dickhead wen she sees a regular and needs to go!

    I have a fav that works in a small club about an hour from my house. I make the trip on Mondays or Tuesdays because those are very slow days for her. The club doesn't really pick-up until after 4pm so I go in at around 1pm, spend an hour chatting and tipping her at the stage, an hour in VIP and another hour or so chatting while we have lunch. I head out right around 4pm. Everyone is happy! A few weeks ago I was slammed with work, hadn't seen her for a while and went in on a Friday. Needless to say the club is much busier. We chatted for a bit and then did our VIP for an hour. When we came out the club was packed. I gave her a hug and said my good-bye's.

    The key to getting a dancer to spend face time with you is your attitude. Never forget her need to earn all day, not just when you are buying dances from her and, for myself personally, I never like to put a lady in a position where she feels like she owes me the face time when there is money on the floor to be made.
    You are excellent company, and as its been stated here, great customers get perks that assholes do not. But that perk doesn't mean extra time when there are more financially lucrative opportunities around. But you've learned that.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kessler View Post
    Great advice. I've actually started going during slower times - the start or end of a shift - so it's not so busy and I know I'm not taking away from her time too much. And I've told her that I totally get it if a regular walks in or someone wants a dance, VIP, etc. Me walking into her club is like her coming into my office - she wouldn't get pissed if I stopped chatting to answer my line, so why should I get pissed if she stops chatting to attend to another customer (as long as I haven't already plunked the $$ down, of course).

    But after reading some of these posts, I was feeling kinda bad. My regular usually sits and chats with me for a while before our VIPs. I always tip her after our dances, but I started wondering if I should be tipping her for her time pre-VIPs, as well. From what I've read, given the amount of time we talk, it sounds like it's understood that this time is included in the VIP 'package' as well. If we talk longer, I can increase my tip a little. I may even experiment with finding a good price to just chat (floats my boat, not yours, I know). She's a sweetheart, so the last thing I wanna do is disrespect her time by not tipping enough. At the same time, I'm trying to do what's fair for both of us
    Again, its up to her to seek more compensation if she feels her time with you is preventing her from profiting otherwise. AND, if you feel that you should tip her more for her time because of the benefit to you, then by all means, do so! As is done in restaurants, the 15-18% is a guideline, feel free to give more!

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna123 View Post
    It's always such a foreign concept to me that there are girls who just sit around w/ customers to "relax" or "take a break". There are a couple of girls like this at my club. They pretty much just work for booze. It's sad.

    I don't care if no one else is buying dances, I'd rather sit in the DR, eat, text message, read a book, go online, chat w/ other dancers, ANYTHING but aimlessly sit w/ customers for free or $10 a half-hour. Doing a half-hour of talking w/ some guy I have to put up a facade around (and yes, even if you think you really know a dancer ITC she almost always is, to an extent, maintaining some sort of facade for privacy or image or whatever), is actually a lot of energy. Energy that could be better reserved for when spending-customers actually come in, not to mention saving my voice not having to yell over loud music that whole time.

    I wouldn't even sit with a guy for a half-hour to get a single dance, and I make $20 a dance at my club. Time flies when you're having fun, so to customers I dont think a half-hour seems very long, but it's for-fucking-ever for most profit-minded strippers. I think it encourages bad customer-habits too. Oh well, to each their own
    Exactly. Its opportunity cost. The time and energy expended upon non-revenue generating activities, or activities that generate so little revenue...could be better utilized scanning the floor, chatting up "colder" prospects at the bar, improving social capital among staff, catching up with Words with Friends...whatever....

    But the fact that dancers agree to do the $10/half hour thing means he's getting what he wants out of the experience, so if that's what makes them happy, so be it. As long as he doesn't expect that I'll ever sit around for 30 minutes for 10 bucks.

    Because...here's the thing. Customers are like buses..one usually rolls around every 10-15 minutes. So if I have to wait 30 minutes to make my $10 dollars and miss out on the opportunity to prospect fresh meat...then I'd rather go risk/reward and forego the $10 or even ANY money from the prospective customer, because eventually I'll run into one that I make some money from, or serious money from, and that's completely worth it.

    I've known lots of these $10/half hour guys and they generally never shut the fuck up and will keep you distracted for the time you are with them. I'd rather sit in a barstool with the owner's cousin who doesn't buy dances, but tips me $5 every time I go onstage, is funny as shit, and doesn't get offended if he's in the middle of a joke and I just walk the fuck away from him to close a deal.

    So, yes, there are a few relatively "cool" regulars who aren't spenders...but the ones who really don't have any expectations are few and far between.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Holliday View Post
    Strippers are like athletes and actors, they earn what the market will pay. Just be sure not to spend $14.5 mil on a LeBron James.

    They are giving Pujols $250million...for the most boring fucking game ever. Professional athlete salaries go well beyond market forces, to the force of "ludicrous"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFqbAGqKTsE

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