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Thread: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

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    Sad Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Okay these are my two questions but I don't want this turning into a huge political debate that causes conflict and problems. So I'm asking that you answer these questions short and sweet and just give a lil bit of why u think the way you do..Pls no page long posts!! Those seem to do damage lol

    1.) Do you think we are about to face another war?

    I'm thinking yes. And I'm thinking with Iran.

    2. ) Do you think the world is really coming to an end on 12.12.12 like everyone predicted a few yrs ago??

    I used to think no bc to me only God can give that answer. But with the predictions of Nostradamus saying something terrible would be happening around that time, it has me wondering. I'm terrified bc if we go to war, I feel that it is going to be a billion times worse than it ever was w/ Iraq. I pray im wrong.

    And I really hope some of you can tell me reasons as to why u possibly think NO..bc then it might calm my nerves about the sitch.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    1.) Yes. Unfortunately. The tension is just too high in that region, and history tends to repeat itself.

    2.) No. Do I think that it may be crazy around that time? Yep, but I think life will continue.
    I just gotta be me!

    taylor_sweet
    all day today i kept saying this aint burger king or mcdonalds u cant have it ur way till u pay then a guy was all i just want a sample im all this aint baskin robins either

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    I woundn't spend too much time worrying about the Mayan calander.... Or Nostradamus..... The Middle East on the other hand is always close to comming apart.
    The country has been looted.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    And the news depresses me too bpink, you are not alone!
    I just gotta be me!

    taylor_sweet
    all day today i kept saying this aint burger king or mcdonalds u cant have it ur way till u pay then a guy was all i just want a sample im all this aint baskin robins either

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    1) Yes, Nations are facing bankruptcy and dissolution. The population has grown to large and the numbers of military age males (16-50) unemployed in First World Nations is large. War stimulates economies putting people to work in factories, and putting men into uniform feeds them, and controls them. Rather than face a revolution at home, the Leaders will rally the People to War with someone else. War kills off the large surplus of population reducing demands on resources at home.

    2) No, I don't think any prophecies are going to come about. Actually I don't believe in any prophecies.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    im not gonna lie..im scared to death to go to war. Plus I feel so bad for the troops bc they literally JUST got back from our last war. Do you guys think that the coming war will be worse than this last one???

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    World War One started with a radical Socialist assassinating Arch Duke Ferdinand.

    Treaties of the day pulled Nations into a War that radically altered the political landscape. A weakened Russia was overthrown from within. The Ottoman Empire collapsed and fragmented into multiple countries. The Austro-Hungarian Empire fragmented into smaller countries. Borders were redrawn, some small countries were absorbed, and became ethnic minorities in countries they did not belong to before.

    War is inevitable when the population exceeds the resources of a Nation.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    You always know so much. I have read so many of ur posts..u amaze me at how much u know. I hardly know anything about wars in the past. I guess because they scare me sooo much I just try to act like they didn't happen. So therefore I refrain from learning about them. I need to get some balls and start doing some research. lol

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by bpink View Post
    You always know so much. I have read so many of ur posts..u amaze me at how much u know. I hardly know anything about wars in the past. I guess because they scare me sooo much I just try to act like they didn't happen. So therefore I refrain from learning about them. I need to get some balls and start doing some research. lol
    Well, Thank you.

    The current flashpoint that concerns me isn't Iran. It is the South China Sea. That area has multiple overlapping claims. The claims were hardly disputed when it was just uninhabited islands and fishing grounds. Oil was discovered and the possibility that the oil under the seabeds there may rival the size of that under Saudi Arabia.

    Claimants to this zone include the Peoples Republic of China, The Republic of China, South Korea, Japan, the Philippines, Vietnam, Indonesia, ................. and more. Quite a list. Some as you will note the United States has a mutual defense agreement with.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
    The current flashpoint that concerns me isn't Iran. It is the South China Sea. That area has multiple overlapping claims. The claims were hardly disputed when it was just uninhabited islands and fishing grounds. Oil was discovered and the possibility that the oil under the seabeds there may rival the size of that under Saudi Arabia.

    Claimants to this zone include the Peoples Republic of China, The Republic of China, South Korea, Japan, the Philippines, Vietnam, Indonesia, ................. and more. Quite a list. Some as you will note the United States has a mutual defense agreement with.
    Army, for the most part I have agreed with everything that you posted in this thread, but I have to admit to being less concerned about what is happening in the South China Sea than I am about Iran.

    For all of China's posturing, I have trouble imagining that they seriously want a war with the U.S. It is an industrialized nation with simply too much to lose. The economic ties between China and the U.S. are quite significant, particularly for China. The economic damage that would be sustained by China if the U.S. boycotted the country would be incalculable. China has always been prone to make noise from time to time and to see what they could get away with, but in modern times China has not shown itself to be stunningly irrational.

    Iran, on the other hand, is a hotbed of religious nuts that continues to provide aid and assistance to terrorists and refuses to desist from pursuing a nuclear program. I don't trust this country for a second and I believe that, eventually, Israel is going to be forced to act in order to prevent Iran from developing weapons grade plutonium. If that happens, the chances that we will get sucked in are high IMHO.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Nostradamus never predicted anything in the future, his writings have always been used to retroactively predict things that have already happened.
    "Well done. Here are the test results: You are a horrible person. I'm serious, that's what it says: 'A horrible person.' We weren't even testing for that."

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    I totally agree with you Rick.
    I just gotta be me!

    taylor_sweet
    all day today i kept saying this aint burger king or mcdonalds u cant have it ur way till u pay then a guy was all i just want a sample im all this aint baskin robins either

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    1. We are not going to war with Iran or anybody else, so you can rest easy there. The whole reason Obama has Netanyahu in a headlock right now is to block Israel from attacking various nuclear enrichment sites in Iran (principally Fordow) and causing a flare up in the Strait of Hormuz which is the only way you can ship oil out of the Persian Gulf via tankers and into open sea shipping lanes. $10/gallon gasoline would make Obama a very sad panda.

    The other reason is that Netanyahu has failed to convince Obama to strike for him – not something you read in the media – because U.S. deep-penetration ordinance, targeting and stealth technology are so far ahead of Israel’s technology that any bombing mission the Israelis could run would fail because the facilities would just be swiftly rebuilt, submerged deeper than they are now, and then hardened.

    Iran is not nearly as far along in enrichment as believed. They can’t even spin up their centrifuges without them crashing constantly because the U.S. and Israel keep infecting them with nasty bugs. (hehehe).

    So all the posturing that’s been going on about Iran right now is an attempt to prevent war.

    2. No worries about the world ending in 2012 either. People will continue living their lives while other people dream up new scenarios for the end of the world three, five and seven years from then. It’s been this way for many millennia. The human mind is constructed to explain current misery in terms of either conspiracies or doomsday scenarios. This is where mythology came from and also why all those conspiracies and doomsday scenarios sound exactly the same, only with different characters.

    It’s also why new ones spring up like mushrooms after the rain and everybody forgets the 40,000 predictions of catastrophic world-crushing disaster that never happened. It’s a lot more fun to just make up new stories.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    1. I think it is very possible that we will be at war with Iran. Prime Minister Netanyahu claims Iran has completed the first stage of uranium enrichment. Israel will strike Iran when they are 90% of the way to developing a nuclear weapon. If they do this we will have to back them up. We are timid because we don't want to piss off China and Russia who have natural gas interests in Iran.

    2. Dec. 21, 2012 thing based on the Mayan calendar has been debunked. It is where the calendar ends in that it has to be reset at that time as opposed to the world ending. The Mayans developed calendars and tracked the movement of the stars primarily for agricultural reasons.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    Army, for the most part I have agreed with everything that you posted in this thread, but I have to admit to being less concerned about what is happening in the South China Sea than I am about Iran.
    I am really less concerned about Iran because of their inability to project power outside of their borders and the Straits of Hormuz. The very competent air forces of Saudi Arabia, Dubai, Kuwait, and the Emirates could easily clean Iran up.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    *shrugs* I think something crazy is going to happen in December.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by MyButter View Post
    *shrugs* I think something crazy is going to happen in December.
    Probably a bunch of people doing a mass freak out for absolutely nothing like Y2K.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
    I am really less concerned about Iran because of their inability to project power outside of their borders and the Straits of Hormuz. The very competent air forces of Saudi Arabia, Dubai, Kuwait, and the Emirates could easily clean Iran up.
    Well yeah, obviously nobody is concerned about what Iran can do NOW. The concern is about what Iran could do if they had nuclear weapons, the ultimate projection of power.
    "Well done. Here are the test results: You are a horrible person. I'm serious, that's what it says: 'A horrible person.' We weren't even testing for that."

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Don't worry about December. I read somewhere that the Mayans didn't factor in leap days so according to their calendar it's already 2013. As far as wars and such go, there will always be something to worry about. All you can really do is live your life to the fullest, realizing that a nuclear attack, an asteroid, flesh-eating bacteria, or the much more likely tragedy of a car crash could end it at any time; vote for leaders you believe will do the best job of making good decisions for our country and the world; and put it in God's hands (if you believe in God). Being scared of something you really can't change doesn't do anyone one bit of good.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trem View Post
    Well yeah, obviously nobody is concerned about what Iran can do NOW. The concern is about what Iran could do if they had nuclear weapons, the ultimate projection of power.
    China just sailed her Aircraft Carrier into the South China Sea. Years ahead of what others were predicting. Current speculation as it can only support recon and air superiority operations, with some ASW support by carried helos. Couple this with the anti aircraft ballistic missiles china is fielding and we can kinda guess who they expect to go up against.

    Currently if Iran produced a nuclear weapon they can only field a theater weapon. Arguably that is pretty important if your a neighbor or Israel. Patriot systems and THAAD are already in Israel, Kuwait, Bahrain, and Saudi Arabia, additionally AEGIS equipped Destroyers are part of the Naval groups there. Iran would have to smuggle a nuke in a commercial carrier or launch double digit numbers of nuclear missiles hoping saturation overwhelms ballistic missile defenses.

    Iran needs a successful space program or someone willing to sell them one to build intercontinental ballistic missiles.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by All Good Things View Post
    1. We are not going to war with Iran or anybody else, so you can rest easy there. The whole reason Obama has Netanyahu in a headlock right now is to block Israel from attacking various nuclear enrichment sites in Iran (principally Fordow) and causing a flare up in the Strait of Hormuz which is the only way you can ship oil out of the Persian Gulf via tankers and into open sea shipping lanes. $10/gallon gasoline would make Obama a very sad panda.

    The other reason is that Netanyahu has failed to convince Obama to strike for him – not something you read in the media – because U.S. deep-penetration ordinance, targeting and stealth technology are so far ahead of Israel’s technology that any bombing mission the Israelis could run would fail because the facilities would just be swiftly rebuilt, submerged deeper than they are now, and then hardened.

    Iran is not nearly as far along in enrichment as believed. They can’t even spin up their centrifuges without them crashing constantly because the U.S. and Israel keep infecting them with nasty bugs. (hehehe).

    So all the posturing that’s been going on about Iran right now is an attempt to prevent war.
    Israel won't sit back forever if it believes that Iran has made too much headway in its enrichment program. IMHO it is a mistake to try to apply Western sensibilities to a situation where emotional/religious beliefs can drive the actions and policies of a country such as Iran.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmySGT. View Post
    I am really less concerned about Iran because of their inability to project power outside of their borders and the Straits of Hormuz. The very competent air forces of Saudi Arabia, Dubai, Kuwait, and the Emirates could easily clean Iran up.
    I am less concerned about Iran as a standalone power than I am about other Arab countries coming to its defense should Israel strike. Lest memories fade, the last Arab-Israeli war was only 45 years ago. There is still a lot of hatred for Israel in those countries.
    Last edited by rickdugan; 09-28-2012 at 08:38 PM.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Yes I think we could be heading into a war with Iran but here's an interesting thing. Many don't know (I didn't actually until I read)but most of the Mideast countries hate Iran. The reason has to do with culture and that Iran is Persian not Arabian and they even speak a different language (Farsi). I'd have to look but I'm not sure how many countries get along with Iran but definitely not most of the Mideastern countries. This goes back many years but back when the Iranian hostage crisis happened, Anwar Sadat, who was then the leader of Egypt made it known he was supporting the US, not Iran. He was killed likely because of this but it was something he was outspoken about.

    I don't trust China but they have too much to lose by going to war. They know this and are more interested in financial aspects of the US. I don't know about North Korea though and that country does concern me.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    I am less concerned about Iran as a standalone power than I am about other Arab countries coming to its defense should Israel strike. Lest memories fade, the last Arab-Israeli war was only 45 years ago. There is still a lot of hatred for Israel in those countries.
    Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, and Kuwait besides being Sunni, really did not appreciate the Iranians aiding a funding their Shi'ite Brothers in last years Arab Spring. Jordan owes Israel for aid in putting the attempted coup to displace the King of Jordan. Syria is busy with a civil war. Lebanon can't function on its own as its factions are all controlled by powers that are not Lebanese. Egypt is in the news so you can follow their problems.

    Iran needs to stir up trouble on its own borders to distract their own citizens from the internal problems the country is facing. It is War or Revolution for Iran.

    Except that all the trouble for Iran has caused for it neighbors is coming back home.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    Israel won't sit back forever if it believes that Iran has made too much headway in its enrichment program. IMHO it is a mistake to try to apply Western sensibilities to a situation where emotional/religious beliefs can drive the actions and policies of a country such as Iran.
    Iran has been extraordinarily shrewd and calculating in all its dealings with the IAEA, the Group of Six and other Western states. There has been some internal disarray on the topic within their leadership, but their negotiations are the picture of discipline and successful manipulation. It’s certainly not religion driving them, but great-power politics.

    I understand the impulse to say that the Israelis will take a stand when they feel it’s absolutely necessary. But the intelligence and military world in the West has changed dramatically in the last decade. Israel no longer has the best strategic or technical intelligence on Fordow or the other enrichment sites nor the military means to do anything near the damage we could. The U.S. could destroy Fordow. Israel cannot. In fact, it’s very likely that an Israeli strike on any of the facilities today would not only be ineffective, but would cause the Iranians to dig even deeper and farther beyond the limited weaponry Israel has at its disposal. Israel knows this.

    This is why Netanyahu has been jumping up and down for months, trying to push the U.S. – the guys who can actually do the job of destroying the sites – to take a stand against Iran by drawing the endlessly discussed “red line,” most recently at the U.N. on Thursday with that silly bomb picture which was not even technically accurate on the subject of enrichment.

    If Israel thought it had the means and mechanisms to strike Fordow effectively, we would not hear a peep out of them about the subject at all. The facility would just suddenly disappear in a few thundering explosions in the early morning darkness one day when we were all distracted by thoughts of NFL officiating and the coming fall foliage.

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    Default Re: Are we going to war & Is the world about to really come to an end?

    I dont know when the world will end but honestly I find it exciting and terrifying all at once.

    Because if hell really does exist...well then I am fudged.

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