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Thread: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

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    Question Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Are there any stripclubs that have only traveling dancers? No house dancers. If so, who? Links appreciated. If they exist, are they common or rare?

    If there isn't such a club, could such a club exist? Are there enough traveling dancers in the USA (and Canada, Mexico, etc. who can work in the USA) so a club that only had them would have enough dancers to be open from 6 pm to 2 am Monday - Thursday and noon to 2 am on Saturdays. Sundays off. The traveling dancers only staying for a week and not being allowed to work at the club until at least three months pass.

    In a very informal conversation with a county zoning administrator, we talked about overcoming resistance of the zoning board. I tossed out this idea and he thought it might help.

    If this were done, what do you think about the club also buying a nearby hotel and putting up the traveling dancers there for their week with the club? And/or buying a nearby campground for those traveling in RVs.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    I sincerely doubt that there's a large enough traveling dancer community to allow a club to stay open year round with no house girls, especially when they're so restrictive in terms of contracts (only one week every three months). Not to mention that many dancers may not find it worthwhile to travel all the way there for only one week.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    GoGoRama in Lawrence Harbor NJ is the closest thing to a 'travelling dancer only' business model that I have seen to date. They strictly limit the number of days per month that 'most' dancers are allowed to book.

    As to common ownership of a strip club and a motel, that's likely to CAUSE more problems than it solves ... since the common owner will be open to community accusations related to renting rooms by the hour !!!

    A few clubs have approached accomodations for a relatively large number of travelling dancers by buying a house within walking distance of the club.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Your friend on the zoning board is most likely wrong. Are there other clubs in your city already?
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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    As to common ownership of a strip club and a motel, that's likely to CAUSE more problems than it solves ... since the common owner will be open to community accusations related to renting rooms by the hour !!!
    All rooms would be rented by the week to traveling dancers only. No other paying hotel guests accepted. There's actually a small motel nearby that has 24 rooms. And I'm not sure I'd even charge for the hotel rooms. Might just be included in the deal if the traveling dancer is accepted for the week. Traveling dancers likely booking their week at the club months in advance to make it part of their next tour of clubs. Same with the campground.

    A few clubs have approached accomodations for a relatively large number of travelling dancers by buying a house within walking distance of the club.
    Plenty of houses for sale around the prospective location. None really large though. More along single-family ranch style. Though there is a half-million dollar home presently for sale near the location which is very large and it is relatively geographically isolated. But I wouldn't be surprised it's no longer on sale by the time this would go ahead. The prospective club would need to be built.

    Thanks for the input!

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    Your friend on the zoning board is most likely wrong.
    I wouldn't go so far as to call him a friend. Not even a friendly acquaintance. I stopped into the zoning office, asked to see the administrator (head person), he took me back into his office, and we had a off-the-cuff off-the-record chat. When he smiled when I said I was looking into bringing in a stripclub into the area, I opened up and told him the whole idea as it currently stands. He was very receptive to it and said he'd be one of my regular patrons. During the course of our chat, he did tell me about the zoning board and how to handle them. What they'll likely object to and what they likely won't. How if I were to offer to self-restrict my club in certain ways, they would take that as me not trying to steamroll them and trying to work with them to make this possible. That's when I tossed out this idea and he thought it might be a good bargaining chip with the board.

    Are there other clubs in your city already?
    No. And it isn't in the major city it would service. That city prohibits stripclubs and is in a different state so its power to influence is very little for the location I'm thinking about. In fact, the zoning administrator said that if that city's officials were to try to force their will on his county, it would backfire on them, as it has in the past. He said that if they did that pressure move, it would almost guarantee the zoning board would approve my application. Apparently there's quite a bit of bad blood between the county and that city.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twin Tattoo View Post
    Are there enough traveling dancers in the USA (and Canada, Mexico, etc. who can work in the USA)
    I know I already posted in this thread, but I didn't really notice these parentheses. You can only have American dancers, not Canadian or Mexican or anything else because the USA will not issue them work visas as there are plenty of able and willing American dancers - maybe not to support your proposed model, but certainly to dance in general. Just something to keep in mind and perhaps consider extending the length of time girls can work for you.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by shanna dior View Post
    I know I already posted in this thread, but I didn't really notice these parentheses. You can only have American dancers, not Canadian or Mexican or anything else because the USA will not issue them work visas as there are plenty of able and willing American dancers - maybe not to support your proposed model, but certainly to dance in general.
    But if they are not willing to work at my club, then there wouldn't actually be plenty of able and willing American dancers to service my club. When being a business consultant for other types of businesses, this was the burden of proof required by the government to bring in foreign workers to fill demand. It didn't matter how many engineers were in the US, if none would come and work in North Dakota, work visas for foreign engineers could be obtained.

    Just something to keep in mind and perhaps consider extending the length of time girls can work for you.
    I'm looking to get traveling dancers that normally do a club for a week and then move on. Some doing a quarterly/yearly circuit of clubs in this manner while others not having a set route but just booking as they go where they want to go.

    One of the attractions of the idea to the zoning administrator is the dancers not setting up residency. Just as another attraction of buying a motel for their use is to not have dancers in local motels and hotels. In addition to getting a cheap (if not free) room, I would think that dancers would appreciate knowing they won't accidentally bump into a traveling salesman that they gave a lap dance to at the club that night.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twin Tattoo View Post
    But if they are not willing to work at my club, then there wouldn't actually be plenty of able and willing American dancers to service my club. When being a business consultant for other types of businesses, this was the burden of proof required by the government to bring in foreign workers to fill demand. It didn't matter how many engineers were in the US, if none would come and work in North Dakota, work visas for foreign engineers could be obtained.
    That's true to a certain extent, but you can't compare a highly specialized and valued field like engineering to stripping. You can certainly plead your case, but even feature dancers who have titles/credits to their name (specialized dancers, if you will) and clubs vouching that they have bookings and being willing to sponsor them, have a hard time getting work visas. Stripping just isn't a highly sought after skill that the US government is willing to hand out work visas for. Give it a shot, but have a Plan B.
    Last edited by shanna dior; 01-30-2013 at 05:41 PM.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    you also cant compare an entire industry (engineering) to strange business plan for an established industry....especially when said strange business plan cant compete without foreign workers.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    But if they are not willing to work at my club, then there wouldn't actually be plenty of able and willing American dancers to service my club. When being a business consultant for other types of businesses, this was the burden of proof required by the government to bring in foreign workers to fill demand. It didn't matter how many engineers were in the US, if none would come and work in North Dakota, work visas for foreign engineers could be obtained.
    you can't compare a highly specialized and valued field like engineering to stripping. You can certainly plead your case, but even feature dancers who have titles/credits to their name (specialized dancers, if you will) and clubs vouching that they have bookings and being willing to sponsor them, have a hard time getting work visas. Stripping just isn't a highly sought after skill that the US government is willing to hand out work visas for.

    By the 'letter of the law', Twin Tattoo is correct ! However, the 'real world' situation is usually very different where work visas for 'foreign' adult industry workers is concerned. However, anything is possible with a big enough political contribution to senators and representatives with ties to the State Dep't !!!

    Reading between the lines, it appears that your prospective location is an attempt to cash in on 'border economics' ... by exploiting much more relaxed laws and regulations that exist across some jurisdictional 'dotted line', while drawing customers ( and their money ) from the opposite side of that 'dotted line' by being able to offer 'content' that competitors located on the opposite side of that 'dotted line' can't effectively compete with. I know of a couple of particular examples where this business model has worked out EXTREMELY well for the clubowner.


    All rooms would be rented by the week to traveling dancers only. No other paying hotel guests accepted. There's actually a small motel nearby that has 24 rooms. And I'm not sure I'd even charge for the hotel rooms. Might just be included in the deal if the traveling dancer is accepted for the week.
    Agreed that 'free' accomodations would be a big 'drawing card' for travelling dancers ... since eliminating this expense item makes the risk / reward economics of booking your club improve significantly. Every 'serious, professional' travelling dancer is working with an equation that lumps together probable earnings, versus probable expenses, less 'lost opportunity' cost i.e. travel days, etc.

    However, beware the local bible thumpers. Opening a new strip club will be cause for public outcry by itself. Tying a motel into that equation, even if in fact said motel is not open to the public, is just handing 'ammunition' to your likely opponents. One successful 'secondary effects' based lawsuit / 'stay' order will put you ( and your investor money ) on 'ice' for months or years. Thus I'm still recommending a residential area facility with no obvious link to strip club ownership ... even if it is far enough away to warrant buying a second-hand van to transport multiple dancers before and after their shift. And the dancers would appreciate the 'security' such club supervised travel arrangements would provide for them at 'closing time' in an unknown town.

    How large of a club are you thinking about initially ? Typically, it's possible to achieve 'critical mass' with just a dozen dancers per shift, providing they are able to offer 'quality' to club customers. Also, keeping control of the number of dancers working per shift A) creates a 'busy' club vibe even if the total number of new club customers is initially fairly low, B) provides higher per-capita earnings for the dancers, meaning it will be easier to attract more dancers / 'quality' dancers in the future, and C) allows you to achieve a viable business model without having to invest in an 'aircraft hangar' sized club before you're sure how large of a customer clientele you can actually draw.

    Once you have established a successful business model, and have a successful track record of working with local officials and against local opposition, if you find enough potential customer demand to justify 'expanding' in terms of real estate and dancer head count, it will be FAR easier to attract venture capital plus far easier to overcome new local bible thumper objections for a phased brick and mortar expansion.
    Last edited by Melonie; 02-04-2013 at 02:38 PM.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    By the 'letter of the law', Twin Tattoo is correct ! However, the 'real world' situation is usually very different where work visas for 'foreign' adult industry workers is concerned. However, anything is possible with a big enough political contribution to senators and representatives with ties to the State Dep't!!!
    Understood. I wasn't actually thinking of getting work visas for foreign dancers. Just suggested a possible solution if there aren't enough traveling dancers, as another poster said there might not be. What I would MUCH rather do is do things that will make traveling dancers want to work the club. To make it part of their circuit and book it months in advance.

    Reading between the lines, it appears that your prospective location is an attempt to cash in on 'border economics' ... by exploiting much more relaxed laws and regulations that exist across some jurisdictional 'dotted line', while drawing customers ( and their money ) from the opposite side of that 'dotted line' by being able to offer 'content' that competitors located on the opposite side of that 'dotted line' can't effectively compete with. I know of a couple of particular examples where this business model has worked out EXTREMELY well for the clubowner.
    EXACTLY THAT!

    I'll lay my cards on the table so possibly I can get better advice. I will run the risk someone reads this thread, has the initiative, has the HUGE bucks to invest into this, and wants to do the same thing. Hell, if anyone here wants to be one of the investors, fire me a PM.

    The location is the very tip of southwest Wisconsin. Across the border is Dubuque, Iowa (which is to the west) and East Dubuque, Illinois (which is to the south). Right now there is 50 acres for sale just off of Exit 1 on Hwy 151 in Wisconsin. Coming from Dubuque, you cross the new bridge over the Mississippi River and the first exit is Exit 1. After you take the ramp and turn right, the 50 acres is to your left. Roughly the address is 480 Badger Road, Hazel Green. Click on that address and it should take you to a Google maps view of the property. The thing to the northwest of the intersection of Badger Road and Hwy 11 is a weigh station. The 50 acres for sale is the empty land to the west and northwest of the weigh station.

    Dubuque, Iowa has never had a stripclub in recent memory and city ordinances prohibit such. East Dubuque, Illinois used to have many stripclubs (most dives) in its downtown district. It was the region's Sin City. But then city elders didn't like their raunchy image and outlawed all stripclubs. They publicly said that by doing so it would bring a Golden Age to East Dubuque. It has been over a decade and the Golden Age has yet to come. Now what East Dubuque has is a completely dead downtown district, not a single business has moved into the old stripclub buildings, and the Bible thumpers will prevent the city from reversing itself.

    Now while the address of the 50 acres says Hazel Green, it isn't in its jurisdiction (which explicitly prohibits stripclubs) but eight miles to the west. The reason it has a Hazel Green address is that is where the post office that services that address is located.

    Agreed that 'free' accomodations would be a big 'drawing card' for travelling dancers ... since eliminating this expense item makes the risk / reward economics of booking your club improve significantly. Every 'serious, professional' travelling dancer is working with an equation that lumps together probable earnings, versus probable expenses, less 'lost opportunity' cost i.e. travel days, etc.
    That was why I was proposing it. My thinking is the more I can sweeten the deal, the more traveling dancers will book to work the club.

    However, beware the local bible thumpers. Opening a new strip club will be cause for public outcry by itself. Tying a motel into that equation, even if in fact said motel is not open to the public, is just handing 'ammunition' to your likely opponents.
    Since my cards are already on the table, the for-sale motel that has 24 rooms is the Country Heights Motor Inn. It is at the end of a deadend frontage road off of Hwy 151. The frontage road rises on a hill above the superhighway so the restaurant/motel is actually hard to see by motorists. I would simply remove its one little sign that drivers can see and it would completely disappear. It has a very small restaurant (see the photographs at the link) which I'd simply convert that into a daytime lounge area for the traveling dancers. Possibly put in a pool table and an all-in-one workout machine.

    One successful 'secondary effects' based lawsuit / 'stay' order will put you ( and your investor money ) on 'ice' for months or years.
    What do you mean by "secondary effects"?

    Thus I'm still recommending a residential area facility with no obvious link to strip club ownership
    The above motel is two miles from the prospective club location. I would not advertise the link to locals. Only to traveling dancers. I would simply buy the restaurant/motel and shut it down. Remove its tiny highway sign. Remove all signage and let it go dormant. I'd just put a big "Gone Out of Business" sign on its front and, by the time the club opens, the restaurant/motel will be forgotten. Then I'd take off the "Gone Out of Business" sign and quietly open it for just the traveling dancers. No fanfare. No signage. Nothing.

    ... even if it is far enough away to warrant buying a second-hand van to transport multiple dancers before and after their shift. And the dancers would appreciate the 'security' such club supervised travel arrangements would provide for them at 'closing time' in an unknown town.
    That sounds like a great idea. I'd get a shuttle bus that can seat at least 24 and have the bouncers drive it to the former motel to pick up the dancers and then bring them back. The shuttle parked at the club. The traveling dancers can then leave their cars at the former motel. I'd simply hire 24/7 security for the former motel. Female guards, one per shift. Security cameras on the parking lot and exteriors.

    How large of a club are you thinking about initially?
    Quite large actually. Before East Dubuque closed them down, there were many good-size stripclubs operating in East Dubuque. I think a club of 40,000 square feet could easily be done.

    Typically, it's possible to achieve 'critical mass' with just a dozen dancers per shift, providing they are able to offer 'quality' to club customers. Also, keeping control of the number of dancers working per shift A) creates a 'busy' club vibe even if the total number of new club customers is initially fairly low, B) provides higher per-capita earnings for the dancers, meaning it will be easier to attract more dancers / 'quality' dancers in the future, and C) allows you to achieve a viable business model without having to invest in an 'aircraft hangar' sized club before you're sure how large of a customer clientele you can actually draw.
    As stripclubs don't want windows and because the area is a cold climate, my thought is build an underground parking ramp for the club and then also build the club underground. I'd have grass on top of the parking ramp and club. Unless you knew otherwise, it would look like just a beautiful open field. There's a big dip in the road right where you'd want an entrance on Badger Road. I would have a very cool entrance to the underground ramp there and bath it in red light. I won't tell you the name I'm thinking of for the club (that would be showing too many of my cards) but I'm sure you can think of some cool names for a club that has that kind of an entrance.

    Once you have established a successful business model, and have a successful track record of working with local officials and against local opposition, if you find enough potential customer demand to justify 'expanding' in terms of real estate and dancer head count, it will be FAR easier to attract venture capital plus far easier to overcome new local bible thumper objections for a phased brick and mortar expansion.
    This could be the way to go. The underground club could be designed to be expandable. However, in talking to local business consultants, ALL of them (both male and female consultants) thought there would be instant huge customer demand from the very beginning given the history of East Dubuque.

    Thanks for the input, Melonie!

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Sorry, I got two nearby businesses that are currently up for sale mixed up in my head. The Country Heights Motor Inn is located here and not where mentioned in my previous post. The wrongly described location was for the Red Top Restaurant.

    The Country Heights Motor Inn is on a road that parallels Hwy 151. Since the superhighway came in, the inn's road is dead. Only used by local residents now that live on it. No longer a high traffic location and thus why the restaurant/inn is failing and up for sale. It does have a big sign on the superhighway but if that was removed, it would disappear from the public's consciousness. The motel is separate from the restaurant with blacktop connecting them. There are actually four houses whose driveways stem off of the restaurant/motel's parking lots and, the realtor told me, their owners would also be happy to sell their homes as part of the sale. If this were done, I'd possibly have the part-time "motel" manager live in one and the motel's security guards live the other three. As the restaurant has a big parking lot, I'd let traveling dancers who have motorhomes and camper trailers camp there and even put full utility hook-ups around the parameter of the parking lots for this purpose. Easily ten RVs could be comfortably put around the parameter of the restaurant's parking lot and connected driveways. Lastly, I'd plant tall bushes around the parameter of the property to further remove it from public view.

    The restaurant/motel would still be about 2 miles from the prospective club location.

    THEN AGAIN...

    In talking to realtor today, she suggested simply making the restaurant into the stripclub. Maybe that's what I should do. It would be much smaller club than what I was envisioning for the other location though, BUT, as suggested in a way by Melonie, maybe this should be the "first" club and if it is a roaring success, the other location can be bought and developed for a bigger grander new club. If this were done, no RVs would be allowed to set up camp as I'd need the parking spaces for patrons ... though at least two RVs could be allowed on the parameter of the motel's parking lot. The motel would still just be for the traveling dancers. Then if the other location is developed into a larger grander club, I'd do as I outlined in the second paragraph above with this motel/restaurant.

    Another thing in favor of this alternative plan is that it can be done MUCH faster, cheaper, and I wouldn't need to get a new liquor license since the restaurant already has one. There would need to be major remodeling done of everything and the parking lot should be re-surfaced but that's a lot cheaper than building from scratch.

    Not sure what I'd do with the four connected homes. Supposedly, each has four bedrooms but the realtor didn't have a write-up on them. If I had dancers put up in them, that's be another 16 traveling dancers the club could have. If this were done, I'd have to have 24/7 security for the compound. An all-plexiglass entry airlock added to the front of the motel. Regardless if the club is open or not, two security guards (rotate the club bouncers with them) working a shift. Have one guard seated in the airlock while the other does an exterior round of all the buildings. When the walking guard gets done with his round, he replaces the seated guard and then that guard goes on a round. Everything covered by security cameras with their monitors in the large airlock for the guards to watch.

    The biggest negative I see with this alternative plan is the motel and homes are right next to the club.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    This sounds like very 'fertile' territory, given the two fairly large population centers located so close to your location in a much 'friendlier' jurisdiction.

    I'm still sticking with the smaller scale, less capital intensive, quicker to realize option ... i.e. converting the existing restaurant, with it's existing ( and hopefully transferrable ) liquor license, into a gentlemen's club and converting the adjacent motel into accomodations for travelling dancers. If local politicians are as 'accomodating' to ANY business as you tend to indicate, the fact that this restaurant location is clearly visible from the adjacent interstate highway, and already has 'rights' to signage that is clearly visible from the adjacent interstate highway, is a huge positive !!!

    As to the close proximity of the restaurant / gentlemen's club to the motel, the vulnerability of that arrangement to local bible thumpers will be conditional on whether or not ALL access to the rooms must be passed by your newly constructed security station at the entranceway, versus having 24 individual exterior doors where access would be uncontrolled. As long as you can make the verifiable claim that nothing can be 'going on' except travelling dancers staying in rooms when they aren't working at the club, and as long as all external references to the structure being a motel are removed, this shouldn't be too problematic. However, the four adjacent houses don't fit well into this scenario due to lack of enforceable access security. But in reality the ability to accomodate 20 travelling dancers in the restaurant / gentlemen's club's limited square footage plus the former motel for dancer accomodations would provide you with the ability to have a 2 hour stage rotation even if individual dancers only did two songs = 6 minutes each. And that would leave you with a few extra rooms to set up workout equipment, tanning beds, a mini-kitchen, a lounge etc.

    This increasingly sounds like a winning business model with little risk of failure, if your customer research re the two nearby cities is indeed correct, and IF you are able to enforce an 'upscale' image that will attract top shelf dancers as well as 'upscale' clientele. However, your comments about 'sleazeballs' in the former city clubs gives rise to concern i.e. your limited square footage and limited number of dancers could potentially be 'swamped' by sleazeball customers. However, with an adequate 'face lift' to the restaurant structure which projects an upscale image, a hefty cover charge etc., the risk of being over-run with sleazeball customers can be minimized. And if word gets out in the local area that you indeed have established an upscale club with respectable earnings potential, good security, and freedom from prostitution etc., it's likely that you'll wind up getting at least a few top shelf local dancers knocking on your door who won't need accomodations. Again it helps to keep Pareto's principle in mind ... which in this context means that 80% of the available money will actually come from 20% of potential customers. So if you can latch onto that 20% of customers for an upscale club that presents a SAFE, DISCREET environment, and discourage the other 80% sleazeballs / cheapasses / lowlifes who will both drive upscale customers away plus reduce average club / dancer earnings , you and your dancers will wind up realizing the best possible situation.
    Last edited by Melonie; 02-07-2013 at 05:52 PM.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    If local politicians are as 'accomodating' to ANY business as you tend to indicate,...
    They would be IF the major city from the other state tries to pressure them to do as they say. Now if the major city doesn't put on such pressure, I think I can still get this through. I've read the county ordinances and zoning laws as well as talked to a zoning official. Nothing prohibits a stripclub.

    the fact that this restaurant location is clearly visible from the adjacent interstate highway, and already has 'rights' to signage that is clearly visible from the adjacent interstate highway, is a huge positive !!!
    The restaurant/motel isn't clearly visible from the superhighway. Its big-ass sign is but not really the club itself. And the sign faces southbound traffic and not the more desirable northbound traffic from the major city. The motel/restaurant is visible IF you knew where you're looking to see it and then you'd have to know what you're looking at since you wouldn't see it all. On the other hand, driving down the old highway (which is now the "road" the motel/restaurant is located on), it is clear as day. You'd have to be blind not to see it.

    As to the close proximity of the restaurant / gentlemen's club to the motel, the vulnerability of that arrangement to local bible thumpers will be conditional on whether or not ALL access to the rooms must be passed by your newly constructed security station at the entranceway, versus having 24 individual exterior doors where access would be uncontrolled. As long as you can make the verifiable claim that nothing can be 'going on' except travelling dancers staying in rooms when they aren't working at the club, and as long as all external references to the structure being a motel are removed, this shouldn't be too problematic.
    Right now, the front half of the first floor motel rooms are accessible from the outside with the back half accessible from an inner hallway. Same for the second floor but in reverse. Back half of the second floor motel rooms are accessible from the outside and the front half accessible from an inner hallway. Think of a two-story building that is built into the side of a hill with the top floor viewed as a one-story from the top of the hill. In talking to the realtor, she thinks (and she isn't a carpenter so I take her word with a lot of salt) that I can "simply" move all room entrances to the inside hallways. However, the second floor has a parking lot that is at the same level as it is. You drive up a little one-story incline to get to the back parking lot that is on the same level as the second floor rooms. There is an inner staircase so I can have everyone come from the first floor entryway BUT then it would suck to have to park in the back. What do you think about swipe-card entry "keys" for the back entrance? The back entrance can have a security camera that the downstairs guard can always monitor.

    However, the four adjacent houses don't fit well into this scenario due to lack of enforceable access security.
    But what about the weird situation of bringing a patron into a house where three other dancers are staying? I don't think a dancer would think she could get away with it as I know I would get upset if someone brought a stranger like that in where I was sleeping. And I'm a guy so I imagine women would react even worse. And I can make the entrances into the houses also swipe-card access only and when they use their swipe cards or open the door to leave, security cameras trained on the door from both sides could automatically alert the sitting guard when the door is being used so he can watch who goes in and out. And I would have security cameras covering the entire exteriors of all three dancer-filled houses. Mainly to protect against intruders but they would also eliminate anyone from sneaking a patron through a first-floor window.

    As for the fourth house, that is a trailer home and I wouldn't put dancers up in it. Instead I'd put up the compound manager (like a house mom) there as it is right in the center of the compound and directly behind the restaurant that I would convert into the stripclub. Besides, it could at most accommodate 2 dancers.

    But in reality the ability to accomodate 20 travelling dancers in the restaurant / gentlemen's club's limited square footage...
    Actually, there is more space in the restaurant than I had originally thought. As the realtor pointed out when I commented that it didn't have a lot of space. She took me in and showed me a banquet room that I totally forgot was there. I forgot about it because I've never known anyone to ever use it. And she said if I didn't offer meals (and she wondered why would I in a stripclub), I could gut the kitchen and turn that in a lot more space to either expand the main room or divide up into VIP rooms.

    The restaurant area also has a HUGE rectangular bar (seating on all four sides) that goes long and deep into the dining area. About a third of the dining area is taken up by this huge bar. It is one of the oddest restaurant floor plans I've ever seen. If I take the bar out, it would really open up the space. The restaurant also has a dropped ceiling that I could rip out and that would visually open it up even more.

    ...plus the former motel for dancer accomodations would provide you with the ability to have a 2 hour stage rotation even if individual dancers only did two songs = 6 minutes each.
    Instead of stage performances, what about more of a gogo bar set-up? Dancers group dancing on the stage and mini-stages throughout the main floor area. Dancers rotated into the main room. Every song those with clothes on remove one article of clothing and change to a new dancing spot. Once nude, do a couple songs and then rotate off for a break. No big acrobatic show. No solo performances. More of a "scene" atmosphere.

    The reason for the above is local resistance to table hustling by dancers that I have been hearing from others as being a potential problem. The zoning guy I talked to and a couple of people "in the know" about how local politicians will react felt that if I could eliminate table hustling, it would be viewed as less like streetwalking by local politicians. Dancers do gogo dancing on the stages and if the patron wants a lap dance or VIP room from one of them, they turn on a table light, their waitress comes over, and they point out the one they'd like a lap dance or take to the VIP room. The waitress then acts as the go-between for the patron and the dancer until a deal has been made. This idea of inserting a middleman (or, more accurately, a middlewoman, as they would be waitresses) was well received in "solving" the negative image of "Wanna dance?" table hustling.

    The gogo dancers then only gogo dancing until they get hired by a patron for a lap dance or VIP ... or, if not picked by any patron by the time they're dancing nude a couple songs, rotate off the stage for a break.

    And that would leave you with a few extra rooms to set up workout equipment, tanning beds, a mini-kitchen, a lounge etc.
    Actually, I have been testing the local waters and I think I could get some sweet barter deals with local businesses that could enable me to get the dancers free week memberships at a local gym, free tanning sessions at a tanning salon, free meals at local restaurants, free hairstyling from a hair salon, free session at a nail salon, free teeth whitening at a local dental clinic, and more. I've done a TON of barter deals over the decades I've been a marketer so I know how to structure, pitch, negotiate, and land them. Done right, I might be able to get so many perks for the dancers that they won't have any living expenses while at the club for a week and lots of fun entertainment perks. Hell, I might even get them free tune-ups and oil changes for their cars as well as free 24/7 taxi service while they're here for the week.

    This increasingly sounds like a winning business model with little risk of failure, if your customer research re the two nearby cities is indeed correct, and IF you are able to enforce an 'upscale' image that will attract top shelf dancers as well as 'upscale' clientele. However, your comments about 'sleazeballs' in the former city clubs gives rise to concern i.e. your limited square footage and limited number of dancers could potentially be 'swamped' by sleazeball customers. However, with an adequate 'face lift' to the restaurant structure which projects an upscale image, a hefty cover charge etc., the risk of being over-run with sleazeball customers can be minimized.
    The restaurant as it is now is very low-brow. It even has a Miller beer poster on one of the dining room walls. If I were to do this, I'd bring in an architect to raise the class of the place. The removal of the huge bar alone would help in this regards. Out would also go the aluminum-tube chairs and dining tables. Put in heavy small round drinks tables made of redwood with their rims lit up by color neon behind protective cloudly plastic. Press a button in the center of the table and the rim lights up. [This is how patrons would signal over their waitress.] Alligator skin for the padded seats and backs on the heavy redwood chairs. If redwood is used for the drink tables and chairs, green marble tile the floor. Mirror all the walls to create the optical illusion of visually expanding the interior.

    As for the catwalk stage, by not allowing anyone to sit up at the stage (this upping the class of the place and, besides, the dollar is almost worthless so I'd prohibit tipping the dancers on the stage to up the class even more), I could make the stage very futuristic. Shiny molded brass on all the sides. As no gymnastic routines will be done on it (no solo performances), I can light the stage floor and even have it be lit by color lights. Sync the colored lights with the music and/or give the DJ control over the lights and it could be quite a dance show. What I would also like to do is build in hidden air vents into the parameter of the catwalk stage so the dancers are having a constant breeze hit them from below. This breeze should play with their hair like how fashion photographers use fans for their shoots. That and by either heating or cooling the blown air, the dancers can always feel comfortable and not sweaty on stage.

    As for lap dances, plush alligator-skin lounge chairs ringing the main room's walls. As for the VIP room, same chairs as the ones for the lap dances but in one or two lounge chair rooms. Maybe have a medium-size (six chair?) VIP room with a stripper pole on a tiny stage in the center.

    What do you think of the above face-lift?

    And a simple $20 cover charge will keep away the cheapskates. There is a growing well-off class in Dubuque. There is even one restaurant in Dubuque whose average plate is $240 each. THAT is the customer base I'd be aiming for.

    And if word gets out in the local area that you indeed have established an upscale club with respectable earnings potential, good security, and freedom from prostitution etc., it's likely that you'll wind up getting at least a few top shelf local dancers knocking on your door who won't need accomodations. Again it helps to keep Pareto's principle in mind ... which in this context means that 80% of the available money will actually come from 20% of potential customers. So if you can latch onto that 20% of customers for an upscale club that presents a SAFE, DISCREET environment, and discourage the other 80% sleazeballs / cheapasses / lowlifes who will both drive upscale customers away plus reduce average club / dancer earnings , you and your dancers will wind up realizing the best possible situation.
    That's my thought ... though no local dancers. The pitch I've been making and getting a good response to is all traveling dancers. But that doesn't mean all the dancers are full-time traveling dancers. I think the VAST majority will be house dancers at other clubs (at least 75 miles from mine) that come to my club for one week out over every three or more months. They would then be "new" to my patrons.

    Again, thanks for the input, Melonie!

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    prohibit stage tipping? wtf? not only would you cut into girls $$, you would limit the guys who come in (since a lot like to come in just to sit and tip), and bore the rest because the girls arent going to want to dance onstage if they arent making $$. if you force them to they will resent you and half ass it.

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    Senior Member Sqrlbby's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    In hurley wi where I work they will only hire girls who travel, it's a tourist area and my club refuses to hire local girls. There are also clubs in South Dakota who opporate the same way

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Twin Tattoo View Post
    Instead of stage performances, what about more of a gogo bar set-up? Dancers group dancing on the stage and mini-stages throughout the main floor area. Dancers rotated into the main room. Every song those with clothes on remove one article of clothing and change to a new dancing spot. Once nude, do a couple songs and then rotate off for a break. No big acrobatic show. No solo performances. More of a "scene" atmosphere.

    The reason for the above is local resistance to table hustling by dancers that I have been hearing from others as being a potential problem. The zoning guy I talked to and a couple of people "in the know" about how local politicians will react felt that if I could eliminate table hustling, it would be viewed as less like streetwalking by local politicians. Dancers do gogo dancing on the stages and if the patron wants a lap dance or VIP room from one of them, they turn on a table light, their waitress comes over, and they point out the one they'd like a lap dance or take to the VIP room. The waitress then acts as the go-between for the patron and the dancer until a deal has been made. This idea of inserting a middleman (or, more accurately, a middlewoman, as they would be waitresses) was well received in "solving" the negative image of "Wanna dance?" table hustling.

    The gogo dancers then only gogo dancing until they get hired by a patron for a lap dance or VIP ... or, if not picked by any patron by the time they're dancing nude a couple songs, rotate off the stage for a break.

    As for the catwalk stage, by not allowing anyone to sit up at the stage (this upping the class of the place and, besides, the dollar is almost worthless so I'd prohibit tipping the dancers on the stage to up the class even more)
    These are all huge drawbacks for quality/top earning dancers.

    Not allowing stage tipping aside (which, I mean, is a little odd given how often you want girls to be on the stages, but also makes it harder for the dancers to sell from the stage if the customers can't be close to them), you're not letting the dancers sell for themselves at all. I get your reasoning to appeal to the local politicians, but this will not appeal to the traveling dancers who have to depend on the waitress for their sales. It doesn't matter how many free deals you can get dancers in terms of gym membership, make up, whatever, if you make it hard for them to make money, the quality girls won't go.

    Now, if you offer a base pay, you could try and adopt a more European-style set-up - there's a club like that in Oslo, where the manager sends girls to tables and only then can they hustle, so there's no wandering around to tables on their own; it works relatively well because there's a high guaranteed base pay and he somehow manages to rather fairly distribute the clientele in regards to spending.

    But, if you're only offering free living expenses and either charging a house fee or not offering any sort of base pay, quality dancers will avoid this club because the earning potential will be so precarious. As much as strippers earn a living because of their dancing, the only reason they make money is because they can hustle. It's a waste of my time to prance around on a ton of stages for a few songs (which I'm not even allowed to get tipped for) and then sit around in the dressing room until it's my turn to go up again or someone decides to switch on their table light and inquire about me to the waitress.

    What incentive is there for the waitress to sell VIPs for all 20 girls? And really, if the customers come into the club, have paid their $20 cover, don't have to tip, and aren't being approached by girls, they probably won't all be inclined to switch on their table light to indicate that they want a girl, if they can sit around and watch so many dancers get naked for free on all these stages you have set up. Many customers are shy, socially awkward, or just need some actual attention before wanting to spend their money. They come to the club because it's the one place where they are approached and made to feel special. Your set-up totally detracts from that.

    If you just want 20 girls a week and don't really care about the quality or earning potential (ie. if you're not taking a cut of VIP rooms), your set-up might work. I'd still say you'd have to offer some sort of base pay if you're not letting girls hustle though.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    assuming there is a base pay, this sounds like an intriguing club but no girl would ever travel to work there.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Good luck with all of this I suppose, but I am skeptical that you'd be able to meet your roster needs solely with traveling dancers, or at least profitably. The area you are talking about is not exactly bursting with high population density (Dubuque with 60k and E. Dubuque with 2k) and it is hard hit in the winter, so you are definitely going to have slow periods during parts of the year. The traveling dancers that I've met normally migrate to seasonally advantaged areas with high population densities and tourism/business travelers. Idk, but I suspect that the middle of nowhere, WI, is going to be a tough draw for traveling dancers, at least unless you guarantee a certain minimum income. But how can you guarantee income when the club itself is going to be revenue challenged during those slow periods?

    IMHO your proposed business model is not going to help either. By eliminating face time tableside, you not only limit the dancers' ability to hustle for income (as some have already mentioned), but you also limit a key draw for certain types of customers. This is especially true for clubs in areas with low population density, which tend to rely heavily upon regulars for a high percentage of their income. A lot of older customers, as well as other guys who tend to find one dancer with whom they can develop rapport (and visit her over and over), are going to be turned off by this approach. Now I'm not saying that you will not be able to put butts in chairs, though even this will be a challenge during slow periods, but getting those guys to spend is an entirely different matter.

    Idk. Like I said, I wish you luck with this, but I'm not convinced that creating a club that is essentially a ongoing stage show with pick by light LD/VIP options, staffed only with an endless parade of new and unfamiliar faces, is going to fly in the neck of the woods that you are in.

    Anyway, just my for whatever it is actually worth.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    I am thinking of having a two-drink-or-one-bottle minimum for patrons. Another way to weed out cheapskates.

    BUT WHAT IF INSTEAD...

    I were to require the patrons buy at least one dancer a drink. Not per group but per patron. This gets patrons from being simply spectators to having to engage dancers and earns the dancer at least a commission on their drink. [And the patrons would naturally buy themselves a drink while buying the dancer her drink. The waitresses are to see to that.] More importantly, this gives the dancers a chance to sell lap dances or VIP room to the patron(s) at the table. Patrons would naturally pick the dancer they most like to join them for a drink so that dancer knows the patron finds them attractive. Unlike the blind hit-and-miss "Wanna dance?" table hustling. This would likely quickly depopulate the stage of dancers but likely not all of them. And even if it totally depopulates the stage, so what? It gets the patrons and dancers to talking to each other so the dancers can get the patrons to hire them for lap dances or VIP room. That and drink sales should go through the roof. Besides, eventually, a dancer will drink her drink(s) and return to the stage if there's obviously not going to be a lap/VIP sale at a table and then another table can have their waitress fetch her for them.

    I'd also allow patrons to point out dancers currently at other tables and have their waitress add them to the dancer's waiting list. The waitress passing the dancer and whispering in her ear who also wants her. The dancer then can make a decision when to leave her current table. The dancer could even use the awaiting patron(s) at the other table to help pressure a sale at her current table. "Listen, boys, I'd love to continue chatting with you, but I got another table wanting my sunny personality. So any of you like a lap dance or VIP room from me before I go?"

    Or I can be even more heavy handed and also require patrons to buy a lap dance or VIP room within a half hour or hour of coming in. And then the clock resets from the last lap/VIP done. This gets the spectators out the door and keeps the Big Spenders in. By going the everyone-on-stage gogo route (as opposed to the solo stage performances) except for the few on break, all the dancers are on stage so the patrons cannot complain that they haven't seen all the dancers yet. And the gogo route also gets the spectators to naturally leave sooner since, in their minds, there's no rotation for them to sit through to see all the dancers. They're all up on stage right from when they enter.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sqrlbby View Post
    In hurley wi where I work they will only hire girls who travel, it's a tourist area and my club refuses to hire local girls. There are also clubs in South Dakota who opporate the same way
    And does your club have a problem getting enough traveling dancers to fill its roster?

    I've always found it humorous that Hurley has a population of only about 1,500 and yet has something like 30 stripclubs.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    It sounds like you need someone whose sole job is hustling the customers for the dancers and keeping track of which customer wants which dancers (and waiting lists...). There's no way a waitress can effectively sell and serve drinks AND do all that. And if you're bringing someone in to do that, you may as well just let the dancers do what they do best: hustle. What you think is blind hit-and-miss table hustling is so far off what it really is. Dancers know what they're doing when they go from table to table.

    And, as much as I love the idea of having a minimum purchase by customers every half hour or hour or whatever, what a PITA to keep track of! You'll need another employee to just watch customers and track their spending. Not to mention that there are many customers who need to warm up for a while before they start being big spenders. I mean, I often complain that I wish there was a minimum dance purchase by customers, but it's just too complicated to be feasible unless you're making them purchase a dance ticket at the door and then have dancers trade them in for cash.

    Also-
    Quote Originally Posted by Twin Tattoo View Post
    They're all up on stage right from when they enter.
    Why???? You will not get girls willing to spend all their time on stage until a customer maybe finally points them out unless you're paying them quite handsomely.

    I know you think this is a great way to appease the local politicians, but it's certainly not going to appease the dancers, waitress, or customers.
    Last edited by shanna dior; 02-08-2013 at 02:26 PM.

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sqrlbby View Post
    In hurley wi where I work they will only hire girls who travel, it's a tourist area and my club refuses to hire local girls. There are also clubs in South Dakota who opporate the same way
    If you don't mind me asking Sqr, how many girls are dancing on any given night in your club? I am in WI a fair amount and did some reading on Hurley. Everything I read suggested that the clubs were small and only had a few dancers on the roster each night (and these were weekend nights).

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    Default Re: Are there clubs that only have traveling dancers?

    I can't speak for others. But in my club tue/we'd/thur we have 7 dancers. Frida and Saturday 10-15. Yes they're small but I walk out with at least 300 a night. Obviously more on weekends. During winter the clubs here are packed wall to wall with guys who fight over you which makes you more money. There are six clubs all right next to each other on one block so it is a great atmosphere and great money if your able to work a room.

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