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Thread: Sales training for dancers?

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    WWW Sales training for dancers?

    Opinions please: A friend and I hatched this idea to conduct sales training classes specifically for dancers. We are in sales for a living and we also both give sales seminars around the country for retail stores. We also tend to visit various clubs when we travel, and one thing we know for sure: A lot of girls can shake it, but they can't sell it. And we couldn't sell all that well either until we were taught. Selling dances and rooms is really no different than selling cars or boats when you break it right down to the core. You qualify, pitch, trial close, overcome objection, and then close it and take the cash....its the exact same process no matter what. We think we could run these seminars at a reasonable fee, and any girl could increase her take every night by simply being taught the sales process. Are we nuts, or is this a decent idea?
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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Floridaclubber View Post
    Selling dances and rooms is really no different than selling cars or boats when you break it right down to the core. You qualify, pitch, trial close, overcome objection, and then close it and take the cash....its the exact same process no matter what.
    That's easy for a guy to say. Try growing breasts, putting on a thong and stripper shoes and then trying to get a guy to spend money on a luxury item that, in many cases, he didn't come into the club with any intention of buying.
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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Yeah if some guy pulled this shit I would go off on him. Dancers HATE men who use the job as a way for them to make money. I couldn't begin to mention all the men I met dancing who tried to sell me some product or another to help me make more money. I was smart enough not to fall for it. Yoda is completely right, and while it's the same thing at the core it's different too. Car salesmen (or other sales people)don't have to dress sexy to sell cars, they just have to know how to sell. Dancers have to know how to sell while dress skimpy (or nothing at all). Other sales people don't have to endure nasty comments about their looks or anything like it.

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    This sort of training already exists, and it's successful because it's delivered by a dancer who has actually sold dances and rooms -- not a pair of dudes who have no experience doing either. Having worked in other types of sales, I can assure you that it's different enough that your experience selling cars or whatever else won't translate well enough into seminars for dancers.

    Think of it this way -- would a car salesman want to take a seminar from a person who had never sold a car in their life, even if they were the best damn jewelry salesperson around? Probably not, because it's just not the same thing. He might buy a sales book, sure, to get the general idea, but invest in a seminar? Then again, there's a sucker born every minute, and naive people (including strippers) will dish out lots of money on self help, training, etc., so by all means, give it a shot.
    Last edited by shanna dior; 11-25-2013 at 06:14 PM.

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    There are several programs already like this, and they are run by former or current dancers, which is how I think it should be. I love the above comment about how a car salesman can just point each different person in the direction of the car they choose, but you can't just instantly turn yourself into every guy's dream girl on a whim. I think the analogy of dance sales to other kinds of expensive sales also falls apart in the amount of money to be made off each sale. Other salespeople can sometimes make hundreds of dollars off a sale, which is why they take so much time on it, whereas if you're just trying to sell a $20 lapdance... there is a far different way to quickly try to close that sale. I was also in a different branch of sales before dancing, and I agree it's far different. Basic sales principles apply, but the actual techniques and ways to appeal to customers and how quickly to close are different. Also, as was said earlier, when people walk onto a car lot or into a jewelry store, they probably have an intention buy, they just don't know what yet. They also usually aren't drunk and "out with their buddies" partying it up by checking out cars lol Whereas, a lot of guys who go to clubs are freeloaders with no intention of spending anything unless they can get a BJ for $10. Way different breed of customers.

    If you want to teach sales, just go teach sales. Don't try to market to dancers and tell them how to do their job. I agree, a lot of girls don't know how to sell, but that's not for you to fix, especially since you don't actually know how to sell a dance. You may think that as a customer, if you got xyz approach and xyz deal, you would buy and you should impart that knowledge. But IME, what a customer thinks makes a good pitch or deal and what a dancer thinks makes a good approach and deal vary widely. And if I closed sales by offering what the cheap customers thought they should get for $20, I would go fucking nuts. As well as if I attempted to just morph myself drastically for every demanding customer. Dancing is much harder mentally than most jobs, because you - your body and personality - are the "product," and doing anything that is going to make you go crazier faster is not a good idea for anyone's mental health.
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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Look up the "DancerWealth" threads on this site. Sales Training for strippers has been around almost as long as this site has; despite what the above dancers might say about it, it was initially conceived and run by a man, who then sold the concept to local Phoenix dancer/SW contributor Brittany Ireland, who has been running it and training dancers with it for years.

    Having seen much of DW's curriculum (and also having been a National Sales Trainer for a Fortune 200 company), I can tell you it's mostly a knockoff of Tom Hopkins' sales methods, with 8" heels added to the mix. In some cases, it's downright copyright infringe-y on TH's material, but that's just my humble opinion. Frankly, I find it quite annoying when a dancer tries these techniques on me, and I'll shut down instantly in a club. Most dancers using it don't understand how to make an initial conversation flow (the warm up), and instead they take the basics and turn it into a customer interrogation for five minutes before finally asking for a dance.

    All us "smart" PLs "know" how to get a dancer to increase her sales. The reality is, while you or I can probably sell almost anything to almost anyone, we aren't doing it in a T-bar and a bikini top, and we aren't trying to get our customers aroused to the point of an inability to think properly anymore. FWIW, if you tried to train me or were my sales manager and never actually sold my product or service that you were training me on, I'd take everything you said with a huuuge grain of salt and then go find someone who'd actually been in the trenches and picked his/her brain instead. Much more productive.

    If a dancer wants our help, she'll ask for it. Most don't, and thinking you've "unlocked the secret" is more than a bit presumptuous.

    CP

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    FWIW, I have never been "sold" a dance because of salesmanship. When I used to buy dances, I pretty much was going in to see a particular dancer. Other than that, I made my decisions at first sight so I don't see much value in salesmanship though I do see the value of making a good initial impression.
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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    I have been selling for a chunk of my adult life and in my teenage years before that. In my current role as the owner of a small business which sells big ticket professional services, half of my job is sales. When I was in my 20s, I read countless books on how to sell. IMHO it boils down to convincing the target, through conviction in your product/service, that you can satisfy a need or greed (including "educating" the target, if necessary, about what he/she needs or wants, lol) while at the same time being like-able and trustworthy. It is a little more complicated than that of course, but those are really the core components IMHO.

    But I would never dream of telling a dancer how to sell because, IMHO, it is completely different from selling most anything else. Most of us don't have to sell when lust is part of the decision making process, nor are the emotions of our targets quite as personal or uniquely intense. Further, they are quite literally selling their barely clothed selves (in a sense), which requires an enormous amount of self confidence, particularly since they have to do so in the face of a lot of rejections for every acceptance.

    Anyway, just my

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chili Palmer View Post
    Having seen much of DW's curriculum (and also having been a National Sales Trainer for a Fortune 200 company), I can tell you it's mostly a knockoff of Tom Hopkins' sales methods, with 8" heels added to the mix. In some cases, it's downright copyright infringe-y on TH's material, but that's just my humble opinion. Frankly, I find it quite annoying when a dancer tries these techniques on me, and I'll shut down instantly in a club. Most dancers using it don't understand how to make an initial conversation flow (the warm up), and instead they take the basics and turn it into a customer interrogation for five minutes before finally asking for a dance.
    This, in spades!

    I won't say that I have never been "sold" a dance but it's really more a matter of looking around the room for a while and deciding what my options are. If my ATF is in the room or on her way in there is no dancer other than her that is going to get my money that day. Plopping your ass down next to me and trying to pitch me is only going to annoy me. On the other hand, if my fave isn't there and I still want dances there are girls who will have a shot at getting my money. Treating me like a "prospect" isn't going to make it happen. I won't bore you all with my likes and dislikes other than to say that friendly and reserved wins out over pushy and loud every day and twice on Sundays.
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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Floridaclubber View Post
    Are we nuts, or is this a decent idea?
    ^You are nuts .

    In theory, I do understand where you are coming from. But, no dancer would attend a public seminar on "sales training" hosted by a salesman with no industry experience when she can learn in a hands on environment (while she is earning a living)-at work. There are already numerous books, websites etc out there that would be more beneficial and professional...and to be honest, the best of "us" could teach any sales man a thing or two .
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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    I don't think it's a bad idea! I'm going against the norm here and agree with you on that there are many sales techniques you can use, especially in recent years with the ever growing competition. Too many of them are just that, techniques, and can be used when trying to convince a person into doing something you want, whether it's buying a toaster or a lapdance. Anyone can personalize whatever they learn. There is sexism when it comes to teaching independent women something about their line of work from a man, but maybe partnering up with one (you're a salesman, make a pitch!) could get you somewhere if you're open minded.
    Last edited by MomoMania; 12-06-2013 at 12:52 PM.
    Momo

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Floridaclubber View Post
    Opinions please: A friend and I hatched this idea to conduct sales training classes specifically for dancers. We are in sales for a living and we also both give sales seminars around the country for retail stores. We also tend to visit various clubs when we travel, and one thing we know for sure: A lot of girls can shake it, but they can't sell it. And we couldn't sell all that well either until we were taught. Selling dances and rooms is really no different than selling cars or boats when you break it right down to the core. You qualify, pitch, trial close, overcome objection, and then close it and take the cash....its the exact same process no matter what. We think we could run these seminars at a reasonable fee, and any girl could increase her take every night by simply being taught the sales process. Are we nuts, or is this a decent idea?
    Thanks!
    The only way to know is to try doing it.

    The people on this thread saying "No way! It won't work!", really have no idea because they've never tried it to see if it's profitable.

    It may work, it may not. Just go by real world results, not opinions.

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    I appreciate all the feedback, except for the one that called me "presumptuous". I was presuming anything, I was just asking. And I do apologize for over-simplifying the process of selling dances in my original post. I certainly didn't mean it in a demeaning sense at all.

    MomoMania, thats a great idea. A particular dancer was actually the catalyst for this idea so I may be able to bring her on board. She was an excellent dancer but didn't make any money in a competitive environment because the girls that were stronger sellers were taking all of the money. I was talking to her in the club one night and she was looking for a daytime job and I ended up giving her a job in a retail store that I own, and she did a great job. She sat through a few sales trainings that we had there and she's the one that told me that she could use the things she learned at club to make more money. At the time I didn't really think more of at the time, until later.

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Floridaclubber View Post
    A particular dancer was actually the catalyst for this idea so I may be able to bring her on board. She was an excellent dancer but didn't make any money in a competitive environment because the girls that were stronger sellers were taking all of the money.
    I can't imagine a dancer who can't sell in a competitive environment would be a good training partner… I'd be more inclined to approach those stronger sellers if I were you!

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    Default Re: Sales training for dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by shanna dior View Post
    I can't imagine a dancer who can't sell in a competitive environment would be a good training partner… I'd be more inclined to approach those stronger sellers if I were you!


    A more experienced, higher earning lady would be someone to collaborate with. The lesser earning lady would be a good way to see if his process works though.

    Personally, I would invest in Dancer Wealth first. Because it has been around longer and has proven results. But who are we to say OP's method may not work? I am in the camp of club sales being far different and more complicated than stated in the OP. But if he were to do his homework, consult with the right people, and refine the "product", he may have a fighting chance.

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