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Thread: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

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    Default IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    hmmmm ..... from


    (snip)IQ scores are decreasing - and some experts argue it's because humans have reached their intellectual peak

    IQs have largely increased since the 1930s thanks to better living conditions and education - a trend known as the Flynn effect

    But IQ test results suggest people in the UK, Denmark and Australia have become less intelligent in the past decade

    Opinion is divided as to whether the downwards trend is long-term

    Some studies have shown the average IQ of Westerners has plunged 10 points or more since Victorian times and others claim it will keep decreasing

    But other experts argue that even if we are becoming more stupid, better healthcare and technology means the 'problem' will regulate itself(snip)

    (snip)An IQ test used to determine whether Danish men are fit to serve in the military has revealed scores have fallen by 1.5 points since 1998.


    And standard tests issued in the UK and Australia echo the results, according to journalist Bob Holmes, writing in New Scientist.

    The most pessimistic explanation as to why humans seem to be becoming less intelligent is that we have effectively reached our intellectual peak.


    Between the 1930s and 1980s, the average IQ score in the US rose by three points and in post-war Japan and Denmark, test scores also increased significantly - a trend known as the ‘Flynn effect’.(snip)

    (snip)Now some experts believe we are starting to see the end of the Flynn effect in developed countries – and that IQ scores are not just levelling out, but declining.

    Scientists including Dr Flynn think better education can reverse the trend and point out the perceived decline could just be a blip. However, other scientists are not so optimistic.

    Some believe the Flynn effect has masked a decline in the genetic basis for intelligence, so that while more people have been reaching their full potential, that potential itself has been declining.

    Some have even contentiously said this could be because educated people are deciding to have fewer children, so that subsequent generations are largely made up of less intelligent people.(snip)

    (snip)It has previously been claimed that quick-witted people have fast reactions and Dr Woodley’s study showed people’s reaction times have slowed over the century – the equivalent to one IQ point per decade.

    Jan te Nijenhuis, a psychology professor at the University of Amsterdam, says Westerners have lost an average of 14 IQ points since the Victoria Era.

    He believes this is due to more intelligent women have fewer children than those who are less clever,The Huffington Post reported.

    Dr Woodley and others think humans will gradually become less and less intelligent.

    But Dr Flynn says if the decline in IQ scores is the end of the Flynn effect, scores should stabilise.

    He thinks that even if humans do become more stupid, better healthcare and technology will mean that all people will have fewer children and the ‘problem’ will regulate itself.(snip)

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    I am not surprised that people are dumber overall.

    On a different note, wasn't it considered rude back in the day to express some of the "quick witted" types of things we talk about freely today? One of my favorite things is to remind people some stories are not for "mixed company." IE some people choose to play dumb when it is beneficial to appear stupid or unobservant.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    i don't put a lot of stock in the traditional IQ tests they use, i think it test how you well you "test", and doesn't take into account the myriad of other ways you could be intelligent, but interesting study

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    IE some people choose to play dumb when it is beneficial to appear stupid
    ... well, many dancers have grown very skilled at doing precisely this to help pursuade customers to part with their money !


    i think it test how you well you "test", and doesn't take into account the myriad of other ways you could be intelligent
    ... very possibly true as well. However, the correlated results showing that people's reaction times are also slowing down would appear to indicate that some sort of negative 'real' change is in fact taking place.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Ahh, yes the IQ test. When I'm in the mood to take an IQ test, I score around 130. When I don't feel like taking an IQ test, or I'm in a bad mood (or pissed off) while taking the test, I score around 120. That's a 10-point difference simply based on my mood.
    "Tests" are not as infallible as people make them out to be.
    Quote Originally Posted by AmyLynne View Post
    I don't care what customers think. I care about separating them from their wallet.
    The only people who get rich off of Get Rich Quick Schemes are the ones who sell them, not the ones who buy them.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    I believe this and there are many factors. It boils down to two factors: education and who is having babies. There have been studies where it is stated the higher educated a woman is the less likely she is to have kids. Couple that with the fact that 56% of all babies are born on welfare and you see the bigger picture. Also, look at the education system we have now where many things that used to be taught such as cursive are not taught as often. Let's not forget the media dumbing down and spending more time talking about Kim Kardashian or the Bachelor over the economy, wars, etc.

    Pieces of shit like this cunt are the reason IQ's are falling: . Then there's this piece of shit asshole who fathered 22 kids by 14 women:

    These are extremes but are part of the reason IQ is going down.

    This is one of the studies I found that the higher educated women are less likely to have kids. Among the reasons of course is she more interested in a career and it's still hard to have both.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    I'm proud of my IQ! It's funny to me when people try and say, "Oh your just a dumb stripper" or say, "Fuck it, I'll be a stripper" I'm over here like... Hi, I'm a genius! I feel like a unicorn.
    It's a shame IQs are dropping. Only stupid people are breeding...

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    The western diet. And even the nutrient-less soil healthy foods are grown in.

    And the western control of the mass media guiding people to not think for themselves in order to create minion workers (i.e. work for someone else for your whole life! don't question what you're taught!).

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    ^agreed
    also with the women not having kids, that's about education, not IQ. so on the other hand, there's a big difference between having a high IQ and having a lot of education..
    Last edited by simone87; 08-21-2014 at 04:12 PM.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by simone87 View Post
    ^ agreed. and the way public schools are set up, it was started by people wanting to teach children to be good little factory workers who sit down and shut the hell up and do as they are told. sounds like some "conspiracy theory" but its actually true
    there's also a world of difference between IQ and education.
    It is SO blatantly obvious, I don't know what is wrong with people. In school, you're not taught things that actually matter and are useful! You're not taught investing, cooking, home repair, grooming (makeup, beauty, skin care), effective exercising (P.E. - come on really), how to save money, NOTHING of useful substance! All you're taught are random facts that you later forget because they have nothing to do with anything... and maybe .01% helpful information that you actually carry with you the rest of your life.

    Not only that, but the way in which you're taught to "learn" is very disturbing. To memorize what you're TOLD and then repeat it back, and that determines your GRADE, which equals how "smart" you are?? ...Really??? Like, how disturbing is that! That's just priming people to be taught to absorb any of the propaganda the media spews out. It primes you to be the ideal target for debt and life in a hyper-consumerist society! So disturbing.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    ^ yeah so i'm wondering if IQ and education ARE tied, only some kinds of education can actually lower your IQ?

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by simone87 View Post
    ^ yeah so i'm wondering if IQ and education ARE tied, only some kinds of education can actually lower your IQ?
    I firmly believe education and IQ have absolutely no correlation. And the only correlation it does have, is that people with booksmart intelligence (which is also only one form of intelligence) will often be more motivated to pursue higher education. <--- And now, that trend is going to (and has) start to reverse because intelligent people know that a pointless degree won't get you anywhere.

    Unfortunately, majority of children born in the late70s-80s-early90s (80s especially) were forced into getting a degree by their parents. Their parents, who came from a spoiled generation of a booming economy and job security. As we know, a lot of those kids had no business getting degree because they couldn't pay for them, and are now in massive debt & without a job. School (especially private school) should only be for those who really want to study a passion, or those who have a clear path that's logical for a job (engineer, etc). Otherwise, it just gets you into pointless debt and without a job, or a job you could have received without a degree.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    i wonder how the EQ of the population has changed

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    I blame technology. We've become eerily dependent on it.

    I also agree with GR, in that the SAD sux balls so hard.

    Wall-E comes to mind.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by simone87 View Post
    ^agreed
    also with the women not having kids, that's about education, not IQ. so on the other hand, there's a big difference between having a high IQ and having a lot of education..
    There is a correlation because someone dumb will not generally make it far in school. Yes some colleges admit morons, but generally to move up in the world you have to be smart. There are smart people who don't go to college (and btw educated doesn't always mean college)but they too will generally either work hard or go to school.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by GlamourRouge View Post
    The western diet. And even the nutrient-less soil healthy foods are grown in.

    And the western control of the mass media guiding people to not think for themselves in order to create minion workers (i.e. work for someone else for your whole life! don't question what you're taught!).
    The diet does have a lot to do with it, like all the fructose. I believe (my personal belief)that we are being fed all those chemicals and things like that so we become more dependent on doctors and other people.

    Quote Originally Posted by GlamourRouge View Post
    It is SO blatantly obvious, I don't know what is wrong with people. In school, you're not taught things that actually matter and are useful! You're not taught investing, cooking, home repair, grooming (makeup, beauty, skin care), effective exercising (P.E. - come on really), how to save money, NOTHING of useful substance! All you're taught are random facts that you later forget because they have nothing to do with anything... and maybe .01% helpful information that you actually carry with you the rest of your life.

    Not only that, but the way in which you're taught to "learn" is very disturbing. To memorize what you're TOLD and then repeat it back, and that determines your GRADE, which equals how "smart" you are?? ...Really??? Like, how disturbing is that! That's just priming people to be taught to absorb any of the propaganda the media spews out. It primes you to be the ideal target for debt and life in a hyper-consumerist society! So disturbing.
    Depends on the school. When I was in high school I had to take a semester of consumer education (required by the state)where we learned how to balance checkbooks, invest, even career paths. This was both genders. I mention this because when my parents were in school only my mom had to take classes on cooking, sewing checkbooks. So in that respect it was brainwashing girls they were supposed to be wives and mothers. If both genders had to take classes like this I'd all be for it. I'd also be for everyone to take a class in mechanics. I learned a bit of this from helping my dad (he is a mechanic)but most don't.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellydancer View Post
    There is a correlation because someone dumb will not generally make it far in school. Yes some colleges admit morons, but generally to move up in the world you have to be smart. There are smart people who don't go to college (and btw educated doesn't always mean college)but they too will generally either work hard or go to school.
    i think it completely depends on the kind of intelligence you have, and in this day and age ( and country) going to college isn't always financially possible or even the right thing to do for some people. doesn't mean they aren't smart though, like bare intelligence. i also think moving up in the world has far more to do with social aptitude, socio economic background, luck, being attractive, etc. maybe i'm just cynical

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by simone87 View Post
    i think it completely depends on the kind of intelligence you have, and in this day and age ( and country) going to college isn't always financially possible or even the right thing to do for some people. doesn't mean they aren't smart though, like bare intelligence. i also think moving up in the world has far more to do with social aptitude, socio economic background, luck, being attractive, etc. maybe i'm just cynical
    I'm not one of those people who believes college equals success, brains or any of it. In fact I think it's being dumbed down. However, that is part of it because the kids going to college now are the ones years ago who would have been rejected. I do think some successful people get by on looks, especially if it's a look based industry like stripping, modeling, acting etc. The reality is though without any form of training, whether it's college, trade school even on the job people won't get far. Btw, I'm not always talking about moving up in jobs because we all know that is often politics. I'm talking starting businesses, etc. I have friends who never attended college yet own successful businesses. They are definitely smart.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    I'm still mulling over how god-awful our food is in this country.

    Basically, the same mutagen ooze that made the teenage mutant ninja turtles was used to enhance my corn on a molecular level.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    I watched something on genetic modified food yesterday and it was scary. It has a lot to do with the increase in diseases and likely brain activity. For instance years ago food allergies weren't that common, now one in 13 kids has one.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by MyButter View Post
    I blame technology. We've become eerily dependent on it.

    I also agree with GR, in that the SAD sux balls so hard.

    Wall-E comes to mind.
    I completely agree. People are becoming way too dependent on technology. So of course when people start becoming lazy and depending completely on technology to do the work for them then the intelligence of the population is going to keep gradually decreasing. I also believe IQ is natural intelligence and the education level you have doesn't mean a thing to what your IQ is. That doesn't mean that you never need to use your brain to keep it up to par, but that is what it seems is happening these days with so much technology doing the work for everyone.

    An example is how many times do you come across some high school or even college kid posting in an online forum to get the answer to their math question or whatever? Someone gives them the answer and they don't learn a thing from it. When I was in school I had to figure that out myself. I didn't have access to the internet like many others in my generation, but now it is accessible to pretty much everyone in western countries.
    Last edited by MiraMichele; 08-21-2014 at 09:04 PM.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    I can see this becoming our future, seriously. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJIjoE27F-Q

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellydancer View Post
    Depends on the school. When I was in high school I had to take a semester of consumer education (required by the state)where we learned how to balance checkbooks, invest, even career paths. This was both genders. I mention this because when my parents were in school only my mom had to take classes on cooking, sewing checkbooks. So in that respect it was brainwashing girls they were supposed to be wives and mothers. If both genders had to take classes like this I'd all be for it. I'd also be for everyone to take a class in mechanics. I learned a bit of this from helping my dad (he is a mechanic)but most don't.
    I had that class too, but it was like common sense 101


    Quote Originally Posted by simone87 View Post
    i think it completely depends on the kind of intelligence you have, and in this day and age ( and country) going to college isn't always financially possible or even the right thing to do for some people. doesn't mean they aren't smart though, like bare intelligence. i also think moving up in the world has far more to do with social aptitude, socio economic background, luck, being attractive, etc. maybe i'm just cynical
    IA completely. A degree is pointless for 80% of the population TBH. Probably more.

    And IA, the people who "do well" in school are solely the ones that put in a lot of effort. Effort to "learn" and regurgitate the information, as well as effort to complete all assignments with thought put into it.

    And IA again, social intelligence is what leads people to move up in the work force. Being social, networking, an outgoing personality. Add a scoop of motivation/determination, and that's about it to move up the latter. And of course part of it has to do if you physically "look" like you should have that position, sadly.


    Quote Originally Posted by MyButter View Post
    I'm still mulling over how god-awful our food is in this country.

    Basically, the same mutagen ooze that made the teenage mutant ninja turtles was used to enhance my corn on a molecular level.
    Not only that, but even the soil is devoid of nutrients that are necessary for human consumption. This totally affects the quality of even our organic fruits and vegetables. for example.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    This may be controversial, but I'm surprised that this hasn't been brought up on the other comment section either - is it possible that these numbers are also affected by immigration and increasing proportions of certain "minority" populations that tend to have lower test results?

    I'm not suggesting that these populations are unintelligent, but iq tests were basically made for and by western/primarily white populations, at least that is one theory as to why many "minority" populations tend to score lower, because the tests are biased. It might not really translate well for people who come from certain backgrounds. Plus the fact that it only tests for certain types of intelligence, and the fact that a lot of these populations receive less education overall, or are not as encouraged to, have less exposure to, or in some cases unable to access certain types of resources due to a variety of complex socioeconomic and cultural factors.

    But beyond that, I agree that there are other factors that play into this, such as intelligent people having less children. It could be argued that the women's rights movement and access to birth control has something to do with this (another controversial idea, I know...but bear with me). Like, back in the day women were basically expected to have children, and on top of that it was difficult to have much of a choice on the matter. So it all kind of equaled out between less intelligent and more intelligent women. Now, an intelligent woman would be discouraged by many of her peers to have children, and there's a lot more pressure to have a career and "make use of your intelligence/abilities" in other ways (and she may very well prefer this, too). Whereas the "less intelligent" women continue to have more children for a variety of reasons, and though she may have access to birth control as well, she may be less concerned about the implications of it in terms of her career, the "use of her abilities", how her peers will view it, etc. (Totally not trying to say that if you have kids at a young age you're less intelligent. There are plenty of very intelligent and gifted, thoughtful women with kids and it's an extremely important and immense task. But at the very least where I'm from, the social pressure to not have children could be enough to change the mind of someone who is on the fence).

    I'm not really sure what the solution is to the above dilemma because I imagine that with the way we currently address it, less intelligent and educated people will probably always have more kids, on average, than women who are more intelligent. Touting the benefits of not having or waiting to have children will prob always seem more appealing and accessible to intelligent and ambitious women. But I'm not saying we all need to start pumping out babies. Maybe part of the solution is cultural, such as valuing intelligence more (both emotional and cognitive) and being less accepting of the garbage our society consumes via the media. Being less complacent. Having more resources for children and young adults who come from disadvantaged families and backgrounds, whether their family is just poor, or is supportive of poor life decisions, or is abusive, or they are facing discrimination, so then as adults they can break away from the cycle, whether they choose to have children or not.

    And I agree that our environment and quality of our food, and other cultural factors, such as our use of technology, having lower standards (arguably, or perhaps it's more complex then that), and increased social isolation play a role as well.
    Last edited by Naiad; 03-02-2015 at 10:52 PM.

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    Default Re: IQ scores are Decreasing in Western Countries

    That's a great movie and I recommend everyone watching that movie (Idiocracy). That is the future and so many things in there are starting to happen.

    I read something not long ago where it stated what people learned in high school or lower are learning in college now. College really is an extension of high school. It was when I was there 20+ years ago and it's getting worse. Regarding technology, kids today have it easy. Back when I was in college we had to go to school and type on a typewriter. Now kids can do research completely online then write a paper and edit it without much effort. I was in graduate school from 2002-2004 and found how much easier it was to write papers, even when I had to write papers of 20-30 pages.

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