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Thread: This is why I hate going outside

  1. #51
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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by lol1337a View Post
    Plus, calling a historically black neighborhood "uncivilized" makes a lot of people cringe. Rethink your choice of words?
    That an area is historically black (or white, or Asian, or whatever) isn't what makes it uncivilised, it's the behaviour of the ppl who live there. I know in DC, I encountered all colours of street harassers. I think that in the context of this thread, you may be looking for smtg that's not there.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    To be fair he didn't call some the inhabitants of the neighborhood uncivilized, he was calling the neighborhood itself uncivilized ("Those Harlem neighborhoods aren't known to be terribly civilized").

    And I feel you on being harassed by men from all walks of life. I'm the most scared, though, when I'm harassed by wealthy white men because statistically they tend to get away with whatever the hell the want to in court to the greatest degree.
    Last edited by lol1337a; 10-31-2014 at 12:01 AM.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside


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  6. #54
    God/dess rickdugan's Avatar
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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by lol1337a View Post
    I live in Harlem and used to live in Washington Heights. The scariest harassment I've experienced was in Midtown and Park Slope. Like, "Is this man going to rape me?" run away harassment. In my neighborhoods it's obnoxious but I haven't usually felt endangered.

    Plus, calling a historically black neighborhood "uncivilized" makes a lot of people cringe. Rethink your choice of words?
    I'm perfectly fine with my choice of words here. I don't think it's any secret that Harlem neighborhoods can be a bit rough, with guys hanging around the streets all day long with nothing to do but be "obnoxious" (as you called it), behavior which I do not find to be terribly civilized. I was not focusing on any racial element, nor was I targeting an entire geographic population. The people who made the video seemed to be targeting the Harlem area due to the same issues that we are discussing and, quite predictably, the girl who was walking received the "obnoxious" behavior that they were seeking.
    Last edited by rickdugan; 10-31-2014 at 05:53 AM.

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  8. #55
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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside


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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by simone87 View Post
    this was on my fb, and what made me even more angry was all the comments of " oh, i would take this as flattery" or " i'm a man so i know that most of these guy's had pure intentions and were just being polite" * face palm*
    Polite is keeping your pie hole shut and trying not to get caught looking. I feel bad if I even get caught looking as men don't like to make women feel uncomfortable. Boys, jerks, idiots, and A-holes don't care. I grew up in NYC, and that behavior is almost NYC culture as it always seemed worse to me in NYC than any major city I have been to, but obviously it happens everywhere.
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  12. #57
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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    NYC (ALL areas) are bad, but I think SF might be even worse. Anyone want to continue the dialogue that's been started about what it's like in specific cities? (Of course we all know it happens everywhere).

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    I just ignore these idiots and go on about my day. Most of the time I go out I am with my bf though, who is skilled in self-defense & martial arts, so I always feel safe with him. When I'm with him, there is usually never an issue, other than getting stared at by men, which I just ignore too. Men are going to look at anything they want, it doesn't bother me that much. What did bother me was a guy who was walking in front of my car in a parking lot, so of course I slowed down to let him pass, but he looked at me, grabbed his crotch & stuck his tongue out, mouthing something obscene. It pissed me off at the time, but I got over it. That was years ago though.

    Mind you, there is a huge difference between catcalling and rape. Obviously the 2 can correlate at times. But most catcalling does not lead to rape. Just sayin'.
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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Here's an interview with the lady in the video:

    http://www.msnbc.com/alex-witt/watch...p-350975043806

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    About a page back, somebody made a comment to the effect of "I wonder how often it actually works for them?". This is more a part of the issue than one might realize at first glance. This video, and most discussions of it, completely leave out a crucial element of the problem - women that encourage the behavior. I'm not blaming women in general, and I'm certainly not saying that street harassment isn't the "perpetrator's" problem - it is and it is. But the fact that there's a large subculture of females that react positively and even encourage this behavior is ignored.

    One can also note that with a very few exceptions, it's lower-class citizens that both perpetrate, and encourage this behavior. Men raised in middle-class households are less likely to behve this way, regardless of race; women raised in middle class homes are less likely to encourage it. I believe this is why many women here have commented to the effect that they are actually harassed LESS when they go out fully made up and looking classy - while few guys might still take a shot, most of them inherently understand that this probably isn't a woman who feeds off of that kind of attention.

    Sadly, this amounts to a lost cause in many ways. Raise all the awareness in the world - that isn't gonna change the behavior of some asshole who already doesn't care. You might get a small percentage of these guys to change their attitudes, but really - does being bothered 7 times per block instead of 9 really fix the problem? :-(

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by Half Empty View Post
    About a page back, somebody made a comment to the effect of "I wonder how often it actually works for them?". This is more a part of the issue than one might realize at first glance. This video, and most discussions of it, completely leave out a crucial element of the problem - women that encourage the behavior. I'm not blaming women in general, and I'm certainly not saying that street harassment isn't the "perpetrator's" problem - it is and it is. But the fact that there's a large subculture of females that react positively and even encourage this behavior is ignored.

    One can also note that with a very few exceptions, it's lower-class citizens that both perpetrate, and encourage this behavior. Men raised in middle-class households are less likely to behve this way, regardless of race; women raised in middle class homes are less likely to encourage it. I believe this is why many women here have commented to the effect that they are actually harassed LESS when they go out fully made up and looking classy - while few guys might still take a shot, most of them inherently understand that this probably isn't a woman who feeds off of that kind of attention.

    Sadly, this amounts to a lost cause in many ways. Raise all the awareness in the world - that isn't gonna change the behavior of some asshole who already doesn't care. You might get a small percentage of these guys to change their attitudes, but really - does being bothered 7 times per block instead of 9 really fix the problem? :-(
    This is a very good point. Kinda makes me think of this discussion from awhile back



    … along w/ the links in this thread to other similar discussions. One thing that comes up in each of the discussions is the 'sm girls don't like it, but sm do, so that's why guys feel so good abt rolling the dice & doing XYZ w/o permission' argument.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    It would be interesting to put a camera on a few random guys and have them cat call women walking by and see the results. I wouldn't condone such a thing simply bcause - who needs more harassment regardless of the purpose - but from a "scientific" POV, it'd be interesting.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    This is a brave woman in the video. Only a woman understands the every day annoyance and sometimes even fear - these mindless guys subject us to.
    More frustrating are the snide remarks
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Klddg...N0th-TdlmaQ6oQ

    http://www.npr.org/blogs/codeswitch/...-out-white-men


    I'm donating to Hollaback who made this video.
    http://www.ihollaback.org/
    They also have to put up with the shit printed by reputed orgs such as NPR

    Last year - My dancer friend went to grocery store after her night shift. Two guys working that night inside the store (stockers) started staring at her and passing comments. Very uncomfortable, very annoying. She took the time to file a complaint, went the next day to speak some more to the GM. Both stockers were fired. I hope them assholes don't get another job. I'll too never let behavior like this go. I'll take the time to follow through with my complaint. This behavior has to end - and guys think they're being cool. It's never ok.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Ugh, my least favorite is when guys can't take a hint when you ignore them the first time and follow you, get in front of your face, and keep talking at you. Dude, if I ignore you the first time TAKE A HINT AND FUCK OFF!

    It's about time someone brings this into the public eye. It can get borderline scary and stalkerish. I had a guy keep talking at me out of a car window while I was walking and I ignored him of course, I turned into the parking lot of where I was going and he pulls in behind me, parks in front of me attempting to block my path and goes "Hey! Hey! What's up? What are you doing??"

    I gave him a nasty look and ran into the building. I don't get why people think this kind of behavior is okay and a girl is being a bitch if she doesn't respond to it or is bitchy about it.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside


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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    That's Fox News, known as the toilet of the news media. It consists of misogynist, racist, and tin foil hat wearing lunatics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Half Empty View Post

    One can also note that with a very few exceptions, it's lower-class citizens that both perpetrate, and encourage this behavior. Men raised in middle-class households are less likely to behve this way, regardless of race; women raised in middle class homes are less likely to encourage it. I believe this is why many women here have commented to the effect that they are actually harassed LESS when they go out fully made up and looking classy - while few guys might still take a shot, most of them inherently understand that this probably isn't a woman who feeds off of that kind of attention.
    I don't think it's a class problem because I've been harassed by men of all different classes. However, by low income I assume you mean the welfare class as compared to working people? I do think the group you are talking about tends to act like this especially when you look at the baby daddy/baby mama many have. Many aren't raised by a dad who can teach them right from wrong.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    On NPR, on point, pretty good conversation with a person from Hollaback. While she started out a bit edgy heading towards militant she made some very nuanced comments. One, to paraphrase that we all would like to live in a world where you can say 'hi' 'hello' 'you look good' to people on the street, the verbal harassment ruins the ability to do that.

    It is rare when someone impresses me with a 3 dimensional view of an issue that they are an advocate for.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    There is no excuse for that kind of behavior and I'll never understand it.

    Just one thing to point out though when I watched the video - I don't think that most of those harassment scenes took place in Midtown or Downtown. Girls walk around those areas all day long in much skimpier and tighter outfits and I don't believe I've ever witnessed that kind of behavior from the guys around them. Those shots looked to me like like they came from Harlem, especially since there is no Jimmy Jazz shoe store below 124th street in Manhattan. Those Harlem neighborhoods aren't known to be terribly civilized and, in all candor, it would not surprise me if they picked the rougher areas of "Manhattan" specifically because they expected a certain amount of harassment.

    None of that excuses the behavior of these men one iota, but I think that Manhattan got an awful bad rap with that video.
    You gotta be kidding me?? I was harassed and assaulted sexually in the Upper East side and once in the Soho!! I was followed like that video in the East Village as well. I actually never experienced assault or harassment while living in Harlem.
    Why would you think that because you never noticed harassment that it doesn't happen in Manhattan? It's an odd bias, magical thinking, given that Manhattan streets are incredibly clogged four-five deep with people moving in every direction. No one could observe all of that.
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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    Just one thing to point out though when I watched the video - I don't think that most of those harassment scenes took place in Midtown or Downtown. Girls walk around those areas all day long in much skimpier and tighter outfits and I don't believe I've ever witnessed that kind of behavior from the guys around them.....
    The guy who made the video stated that midtown was BY FAR the most harrassment-dense region!

    "Midtown was our biggest hotspot for street harassment."

    http://www.bustle.com/articles/46972...ions-of-racism
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay12 View Post
    ^What Sophia said.
    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    I wish there was an "auto-like" setting that I could just have applied to all of your posts Sophia....

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside


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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by Sophia_Starina View Post
    The guy who made the video stated that midtown was BY FAR the most harrassment-dense region!

    "Midtown was our biggest hotspot for street harassment."

    http://www.bustle.com/articles/46972...ions-of-racism
    Actually, I believe people figured out that the vast majority of the video (Using landmarks) takes place on one street in Harlem and one street in Manhattan. Not to undermined the subject matter but doesn't this group that made this video specialize in making viral videos (Basically an ad)?

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by lol1337a View Post
    And I feel you on being harassed by men from all walks of life. I'm the most scared, though, when I'm harassed by wealthy white men because statistically they tend to get away with whatever the hell the want to in court to the greatest degree.
    I agree with everything you've said on the topic. I think it's kind of ridiculous to call Harlem "uncivilized," and I've spent plenty of time in Harlem, midtown, downtown, and Brooklyn. I don't ever remember having an encounter in Harlem that made me seriously fearful, but I had several around Park Slope and Union Square.

    Of course, my personal experience may be skewed because the time I spent in Harlem I was almost always in the company of the guy I dated at the time, who lived there.

    Really though, the scariest experiences I had in New York were just about all on the subway. Which is doubly terrifying because in that situation, on a moving train, you have very few options for escape.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    Quote Originally Posted by fishielicious View Post
    Really though, the scariest experiences I had in New York were just about all on the subway. Which is doubly terrifying because in that situation, on a moving train, you have very few options for escape.
    God yes! I hate them so much that during busier hrs I will make time for a 10blk walk if I have to rather than take the train. It's not just a matter of not a lot of escape options, either -- it's the lack of room to maneuver. Fewer places spook me more than a crowded train, even as a mid-range/close fighter -- it's one of the easiest places I can think of to corner a person & cause them serious harm.

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    I hate how the one guy yells, " hey someone's acknowledging you for being beautiful!" In a rude way. Soooo I should be grateful that your doing this?? I wonder if guys really get a girls number from this. I mean I hate this but maybe this is working for them somehow?

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    Default Re: This is why I hate going outside

    "Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them.”
    This is by Margaret Atwood.

    This type of stuff scares most women, but it really hurts because I'm raising a little girl. I'm sexually harassed in front of her on the regular. It breaks my heart that within another few years it'll start happening to her, too.
    I'll never be a politician or win a noble prize. I think of my being as a single grain of sand in a mudslide; I still have faith that with our own individual efforts we can make the world a better place for the next generation.

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