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Thread: having my name on the deed?

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    Default having my name on the deed?

    My boyfriend and I haven't been dating for super long but things have moved pretty quickly between us. I just moved into his flat with him (though we've basically been living together since early October) and we've had preliminary discussions about getting married/having kids and whatnot, in which he's made it pretty clear that that's what he wants (although that's something I'm not interested in until a few years down the line when I've completed graduate school.)

    As of right now he covers all of the bills-- groceries, rent, utilities, toiletries. I pay for my personal items like my phone, cigarettes, getting my hair done, whatnot.

    But we're going to start apartment hunting at the beginning of the year and I want to contribute to the down payment. He is about $5,000 short and I told him I would give him the money. I don't really like the idea of moving into a bought flat with him and not having my name on the deed. If we were married then obviously I would have some claim to it, but that's not something I'm interested in right now. I just feel like if I'm going to invest years of my life into making this a home, I want to feel a sense of security.

    However, I guess I'm not sure what the best way to bring the matter up is. We haven't had any specific conversations about this, just conversations about what we're looking for (he was basically going to buy himself a one bedroom bachelor pad in an area filled with bars and now we're looking at two bedrooms close to schools). I think I feel guilty about bringing it up when he'a paying for everything and putting down 10x as much as me in regards to down payment and basically just nodding his head as I say "and I want that and that and that and NOT that" (he wanted a modern flat in North London, I wanted a period flat in South London.. we're looking for the latter). He's talked about how we can move into a house in 4 years once I have a history of paying my taxes since we'll have two salaries to bring to the table, but I feel like right now I'm not really contributing.

    If my name were to be on the deed how would it work? I don't know anything about buying property.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    I think you have every right to ask for your name to be included on the apartment or house - to ensure he can't just kick you out or move another b*tch in if things go south. Like if he invited you to live there, you guys are in a long-term serious relationship, and he is getting benefits like you're cooking, cleaning, emotional support, and giving him p*ssy then I'd think you can ask to have your name on the lease/deed for some insurance. Otherwise I'd ever so gently push for engagement leading to marriage to get those wifey privileges. You definitely want to have some assets in your name as well.

    If none of the above work then have money stacked aside to get a place on your own - just in case.

    Maybe someone with some real estate expertise can chime in to the thread...
    “Cook for him like a housewife, fuck him good like a nympho….pay the rent and the car note, he invests in me like crypto”

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^^^^ miss.a beat me to it.

    When I was w/ my first bf, back in uni, we had been together for abt a yr b4 moving in together. Shit was going great until he got into drugs, started fooling around, etc. He threatened to have me kicked out when I would complain abt his drug use, or refuse to partake w/ him, or try to kick out his dealers & any1 that he would just spring on me w/o so much as a 'Hey, just a head's up, Al's coming over for a beer in 30' Altho I was a bit afraid of him physically, bc he was a lot bigger than me & could very easily literally pick me up & throw me out, legally he had no ability to do so bc both of us were on the lease. What I didn't realise at the time was that he would have actually been the one in the bigger bind bc of his illegal activities.

    As miss.a said, you are not the only one receiving benefits from the two of you shacking up together. You have every right to be on that lease along w/ him. If you're feeling guilty abt being 'demanding' or 'pushy' -- maybe I misunderstood when you were describing how he is pretty much caving on whatever you ask for as far as location, etc but maybe offer a little more effort to compromise w/ him.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    You need to consult a real estate attorney in your area. Here, being on the deed and the mortgage are two different issues. I guess I am unclear also if you are buying or leasing. I assume you are buying. the laws vary so much from state to state. You should not feel guilty for wanted to be valued and counted in your relationship. If you are afraid to have this conversation with him then something is missing in this relationship. Adults have this conversation before getting into an arrangement not after. Five thousand dollars is a lot of money. If you are not going to have an interest in the property then what are you doing to protect your 5k?? If my memory is correct - you havent been with this guy very long - less than a year??? It takes most people a couple of years to let their real selves come out - just something to think about before making a financial commitment with someone, and have you seen his credit report?

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Thanks ladies, I agree with both of you. It doesn't bother me much with the place we're in now because it's just a short term rental that he had before meeting me, but this is different. It's a place that we're buying together with the plan of making it into a family home. Even besides the issue of financial security, I want to feel like this is our home that we own together, not a place he's doing the courtesy of letting me stay at.

    I think I just go back and forth from, I cook/clean/do laundry/fold clothes/put out 5x a week/emotionally support him 24/7 in his extemely stressful and demanding job and with all other issues in his life so therefore I contribute to, he has all the money and pays all the bills, I don't contribute and have no right to ask.

    And yes, I am trying to be a bit more compromising on the flat, but it's difficult because he can be very "whatever you want sweetie" with me and it drives me NUTS sometimes because I love him and want him to be happy and have no desire to walk all over him. I think the area is more important to me and the style of the flat is more important to him, so hopefully we can work with that.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^^^^^how can you expect him to value your contribution when you dont???

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikki_Fox View Post
    You need to consult a real estate attorney in your area. Here, being on the deed and the mortgage are two different issues. I guess I am unclear also if you are buying or leasing. I assume you are buying. the laws vary so much from state to state. You should not feel guilty for wanted to be valued and counted in your relationship. If you are afraid to have this conversation with him then something is missing in this relationship. Adults have this conversation before getting into an arrangement not after. Five thousand dollars is a lot of money. If you are not going to have an interest in the property then what are you doing to protect your 5k?? If my memory is correct - you havent been with this guy very long - less than a year??? It takes most people a couple of years to let their real selves come out - just something to think about before making a financial commitment with someone, and have you seen his credit report?
    We're in London so I'm sure it's different here as well. We're leasing right now and looking to buy in the spring, so we're going to begin looking in January.

    I think it's more my issue than one with our relationship, I've planned to bring it up with him but just haven't been sure how. I'm more used to financially equal relationships than this unequal one we have, and he does so much for me without ever complaining or acting like I owe him or expects anything in return, it sometimes makes me feel guilty. And even though $5,000 is a lot when I compare it to the $50,000 he's putting in it feels like pennies to me.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    you need an attorney - even if you get a smaller percentage then so be it - if that is what you are contributing - it is better to handle this stuff going in


    and 5k is not pennies sweetie you worked hard for that 5k - protect it like a momma bear

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Does this mean you'll be able to get your kitty back?

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Quote Originally Posted by audrey_k View Post
    I think I just go back and forth from, I cook/clean/do laundry/fold clothes/put out 5x a week/emotionally support him 24/7 in his extemely stressful and demanding job and with all other issues in his life so therefore I contribute to, he has all the money and pays all the bills, I don't contribute and have no right to ask.
    Yeah you do...I think you have a right.... because if you were to calculate all the above into to money (like in theory pay people to do this) How much would that cost??? it would be at least a few thousand or more per month.

    Just because you don't contribute as much to a bill money wise, this is still a contribution of your time and energy that you do without financial compensation that would cost him money if you weren't there to do it. So having your name on the deed is the least he can do for your contribution.

    Plus having your name included would ensure equality and provide you with an asset thus increasing your net worth. Just because the guy has more money doesn't mean he has to have all the control.

    Who knows, you may suggest this to him and he agrees. But if you never say anything then your answer will always be no.

    Quote Originally Posted by audrey_k View Post
    sometimes makes me feel guilty. And even though $5,000 is a lot when I compare it to the $50,000 he's putting in it feels like pennies to me.
    I'd think in percentages if I were you. Like if he's contributing 10% of his income which comes out to 50k and you contribute 10% of your income which comes out to 5k then you're good - nothing to feel guilty about. Plus even in 2014, men still out earn women - even in the same field. Blame it on women's rights lol!
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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^yes! I'm very happy, an old friend of mine that I didn't even know was in London saw a post of mine on Facebook about it. She's going to take him for up to 6 months (we should be moved by then) and then I can take him back. It already sucks to be away from him but at least it's just temporary, he's in a good home, and I can visit him.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Instead of asking a strangers on the internet a legal question regarding property in London, it would be a better idea to consult a lawyer (solicitor ?) in your jurisdiction.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^my post isn't really about legalities of mortage, if that was the issue then yes I would go see a property lawyer (or better yet, just call my property lawyer client and get free advice).

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Another thing to consider is that the two of you agreed to reduce your income so drastically that you can't pay more than $5000 on a deposit now and who knows what on the mortgage later. He shouldn't hold your lack of earning power against you in terms of property ownership because he was complicit in that decision too.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^true. The jobs I'm looking at right now I'll be lucky to make $1,000 a week-- I'm fine with that since it's a job I want to do, but he knows how drastically cut my income will be, and he is a very large reason for it.

    Like I said we haven't talked about it so I haven't gotten a negative reaction and he's taking the money from me so I feel like he must assume I expect some ownership? I'm just nervous to bring it up because of my own issues mentioned above. But I feel better after getting some advice from you ladies! And even writing it down here, now I feel like I have a better way to explain to him exactly why I feel so strongly about it. I am nervous to get a negative reaction but I feel like if he really doesn't want me on there then that's a sign he isn't as serious about me as I thought.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Agreed completely. You're making sacrifices for the relationship so if he doesn't make this one it's a red flag.

    He might need it spelled out to him though, which I know from experience (tangent alert). My ex once asked me to pay half his mortgage as my rent and chip in for repairs. It wasn't unaffordable for me, I just would have never chosen to pay that amount of rent or own a home at that point in my life and he knew it. When I moved in we agreed that I would pay my max comfortable rent and he would deal with the icky home ownership issues on his own, like he'd been doing for years. He was shocked and angry when I said I wouldn't pay up until I explained that if he was going to have such a change of heart about our initial agreement I would have to have my name on the mortgage -- after all I would be paying exactly what he was and should have the same rights (his ex put down the deposit). After we talked about it we agreed it would be too big of a step at that point in our relationship and went back to the former agreement.

    Different situation entirely, but maybe relevant to your relationship because for a while the conversation was really ugly and we'd both felt like the other was trying to exploit us. If I hadn't taken the time to very calmly explain where I was coming from and be patient with his reactions, it could have been a deal breaker. So just be calm and explain!

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Like everyone else has said you should absolutely have your name on the deed. Picture the worst case scenario (he has a change of heart) and take all the steps to protect yourself from it. If things go sour, he does not get to simply keep a flat that he would not have right now without your contribution.
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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Well, since everyone agrees, I am going to be devil's advocate.

    What if you change your mind?

    I mean, it happens. You haven't known him that awful long, maybe you get sick of his narrow ass and want to move on.

    It is easier[cheaper] to get out of a marriage than a real estate transaction.

    Personally I do agree with most of the above in that the advantages outweigh the disadvantages, but it is a consideration.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^yeah I've thought about that as well. I mean, I'm not vindictive-- if things did go sour between us I wouldn't take him to court arguing for half the house or anything, I would just want what I put into the flat and interest so that I would have money to start my life over. But we just officially moved in together so I want to see how things go. We've basically been living together for 6 weeks now, my stuff hasn't been here but we've spent every night together, and things have been perfect, but obviously it's a different thing when I don't have my own flat to go to. Our plan is to start looking end of January so I was thinking of bringing this conversation up in a month when the trial period is over.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Quote Originally Posted by lol1337a View Post
    Agreed completely. You're making sacrifices for the relationship so if he doesn't make this one it's a red flag.

    He might need it spelled out to him though, which I know from experience (tangent alert). My ex once asked me to pay half his mortgage as my rent and chip in for repairs. It wasn't unaffordable for me, I just would have never chosen to pay that amount of rent or own a home at that point in my life and he knew it. When I moved in we agreed that I would pay my max comfortable rent and he would deal with the icky home ownership issues on his own, like he'd been doing for years. He was shocked and angry when I said I wouldn't pay up until I explained that if he was going to have such a change of heart about our initial agreement I would have to have my name on the mortgage -- after all I would be paying exactly what he was and should have the same rights (his ex put down the deposit). After we talked about it we agreed it would be too big of a step at that point in our relationship and went back to the former agreement.

    Different situation entirely, but maybe relevant to your relationship because for a while the conversation was really ugly and we'd both felt like the other was trying to exploit us. If I hadn't taken the time to very calmly explain where I was coming from and be patient with his reactions, it could have been a deal breaker. So just be calm and explain!
    Yeah I agree, I think it will definitely be something I will have to explain clearly & calmly which is why I've been trying to think it out so much. I'm thinking I will just begin the conversation by asking him some questions about where he is to try and feel his temperature on the issue. I may not be giving him enough credit and he absolutely wants me on the deed or it hasn't crossed his mind yet but it won't take much explaining, but if there is a negative reaction I feel like that might be a better way to begin that coming across super aggressive with "so you know this flat we're gonna buy? yeah, my name better be on the deed."

    I love my boyfriend but men... really struggle with communication!

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^^^ I'm going to take an entirely different 'tack' on this topic, beginning with ...

    In the grand scheme of things, given both of your present income levels, the $5k you'd be kicking in toward the purchase of this condo is 'chump change'. As you say, he's kicking in $50k on the purchase ... in addition to shouldering virtually all of the other 'expenses'. Thus in objective terms, your $5k is more of a 'financial convenience' for your BF than a property investment on your part ( assuming that your BF could easily come up with an additional $5k via selling an investment, a short term loan etc. ).

    Also, in the grand scheme of things, if your relationship 'blossoms', your contribution to the condo purchase will be legally secured via marriage with or without your name being included on the deed. On the flip side, if your relationship 'fizzles', having your name included on the deed could lead to potentially painful 'complications', both personal and legal.

    Additionally, insisting on having your name on the deed could be construed as a relationship commitment on your part, or a 'demand' for a relationship commitment on his part. In other words, raising this issue with your BF could raise long term 'relationship' questions which neither of you are really prepared to commit to at this point. This could in turn serve as a catalyst to bring you closer together ( albeit for reasons which would now include a 'business partnership' as well as a personal one), but could also serve as a 'wedge' to push you apart.

    Personally speaking, given my 'read' of your own uncertainties at this time, I'd hand him the $5k with no strings attached, avoid the potential relationship commitment questions at this point in time, and see how things naturally evolve from there. In the best case, your relationship 'blossoms' without pressures of shared property ownership being an 'artificial' factor affecting any decisions made. In the worst case, you spent $5k in exchange for a few months worth of quasi rent payments, and you can both go your separate ways without a whole bunch of painful 'complications'.
    Last edited by Melonie; 11-18-2014 at 04:33 AM.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    I am curious Melonie as what you mean by complications.

    I guess I'm thinking that with her name on the deed she can't be evicted on a whim of this guy. Maybe if she doesn't have her name on there she can still get something in writing that says 'in case this doesn't work out I can still get x amount of money/months to find a new place'

    so if the 5k is not that big a deal to him in terms of property ownership then why invest it there? Why not save that 5k as like contingency plan like if things go sour she has 5k to put down on her own place.

    And I think the marriage thing is sound but wouldn't she still need to get this in a prenup to ensure she had rights to this piece of real estate?
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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    Honestly, I don't see much downside in having your name name on the deed. It doesn't prevent you from walking away if things go south - your economic interest is still intact. The obvious upside, however, is that it provides you with economic leverage should he want out after taking your money.

    If you start to waver, just think about what you would need to do to earn that $5k back vs. what he needs to do for it. Now yes, it may be a small % of everything that he puts in for the flat, but it is far easier for him to earn that money than it is for you to do so. Indeed, my biggest question is why he cannot scrape another $5k together himself between now and the end of January and instead must get it from you. Honestly, it probably would have been best, this early in things, if your money was not put in play at all, but that ship has obviously sailed. IMHO the best thing that you can do now is to protect yourself from losing money that you worked very hard to earn.

    In terms of approaching the issue with him, I would recommend that you just be direct. He needs to understand how much of a leap of faith it will be for you to hand over $5k of hard earned (and not easily replaceable) money, as well as to give up your current flat, in order to move into a place more suitable for the future. If he is truly as committed to the relationship as you are, then he can show it by taking his own leap of faith and treating you as an equal partner in this. Remember, you will be giving him a lot more than just $5k - you will be giving him your undivided love and loyalty, giving up your current career at his behest, etc. He needs to understand what this fully means for you and to properly value what you are doing for him.

    In any event, good luck!
    Last edited by rickdugan; 11-18-2014 at 11:48 AM. Reason: grammar

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    am curious Melonie as what you mean by complications.

    I guess I'm thinking that with her name on the deed she can't be evicted on a whim of this guy.

    True enough about potential forced eviction, but under those circumstances would anybody really want to stay ? I was actually thinking more along the lines of some things I went through with my own ex ...

    - being 'guilt tripped' - 'if we sell now we'll lose money because the real estate market is down ... why don't you stay with me for a couple more months ...'

    - already having moved away, but being forced to come back again to sign legal papers allowing the sale of our former home

    - being tracked down for unpaid homeowner's association fees / property taxes which my ex deliberately didn't pay because he wanted to be a maximum pain in my a$$

    It was bad enough putting up with that s#!t with a 50% interest in the house. OP is talking just 10% ( unless she decides to marry ) ! Having one's name included on a deed not only comprises a 'business partnership' but also saddles the ( very junior ) partner with potential future financial responsibilities relative to the property. For only $5k, that's a lot of 'exposure'
    Last edited by Melonie; 11-18-2014 at 11:05 AM.

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    Default Re: having my name on the deed?

    ^I agree there are definite disadvantages-- the last one being the worst-- just not sure if they outweigh the advantages.

    @rick--- we were having a discussion about moving in and I asked him if he had the full downpayment and he said he was five short, so I said I would give it to him. If I don't give it to him it won't break the transaction as he can easily save that up himself. But you're right, 5gs is a lot more to me right now than it is to him-- I lost about 3g in the move so it would be a huge chunk of my savings at this point. On the flip side, he is paying for expenses to the point that unless I just want to throw money away on meaningless, I can easily save up quite a bit before we move. However, as I'm no longer working in the sex industry, partly due to him, it's not as easily made. I don't know, I feel like there are a lot of sides to this issue. And thanks for the advice on how to bring the subject up, always nice to have advice on how to communicate with a man from a man...

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