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Thread: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

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    Default How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    hmmmm ... from


    (snip)The rate of dog ownership is rising ominously. How can a profusion of puppies be worrisome? A report from the Raymond James financial services firm concerning trends in the housing market explains: Increasing numbers of women “are adopting dogs for security and/or companionship,” partly because of “the great education divide.”

    Since 1979, the report says, the number of women going to college has accelerated relative to male enrollments. By 2012, there were 2.8 million more women than men in college, and by 2020 this “enrollment gap” is projected to grow to 4.4 million as women account for 74 percent of enrollment growth.

    In 2000, the adult populations of college-educated men and women were approximately equal. By 2013, there were 4.9 million more women age 25 or older with college degrees than men in that age group. This means a shortage of suitable male partners for a growing cohort of young women, who are postponing family formation. The report says that millions of female-led households are being established by women who, being focused on their careers, are delaying motherhood, partly because of a shortage of suitable partners. More about suitability anon.

    “Increased ‘competition’ for college-educated males” might mean that college-educated bachelors will feel less incentive to become domesticated, further depressing family formation. And for the growing class of undereducated young men, there are increasingly bleak “employment, income and dating prospects.” What is good news for dog breeders is bad news for the culture.

    Two years ago, Susan Patton, a Princeton graduate and mother of two sons who attended Princeton, detonated multiple explosions in the culture wars when, in a letter to the Daily Princetonian, she told “the young women of Princeton” what “you really need to know that nobody is telling you.” Which is that their future happiness will be “inextricably linked” to the men they marry, so they should “find a husband on campus” because “you will never again have this concentration of men who are worthy of you.” She explains:

    “Men regularly marry women who are younger, less intelligent, less educated. It’s amazing how forgiving men can be about a woman’s lack of erudition, if she is exceptionally pretty. Smart women can’t (shouldn’t) marry men who aren’t at least their intellectual equal. As Princeton women, we have almost priced ourselves out of the market. Simply put, there is a very limited population of men who are as smart or smarter than we are. . . . It will frustrate you to be with a man who just isn’t as smart as you.” (snip)


    ... I literally have no idea what to 'make' of this ...
    Last edited by Melonie; 03-22-2015 at 06:58 AM.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Hide the peanut butter! lol

    Naw, really....it's for the best. Marriage is meant to be a business contract to enrich the lives of both parties. Marriage is also not for everyone.

    In related news, this is probably why that Cinderella movie was such a big hit movie....people's wishes tend to be fleshed out on screens when they go without.

    edit to add- I can actually shed light on some of this when I have a chance to think about it. My boyfriend is 17 years older than me so we are both in some ways "living the dream."

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    What a random correlation to make. But a fair point.

    I think most educated or even just smart women don't like dating guys that don't stack up; guys will date stupid girls because they make it into a trophy wife situation; girls don't usually do that.

    If I didn't have my bf and his genius brain around, I'd be perfectly content with animals for companions... I have very few male friends who are on my level.
    I've found that boys who are not on my playing field, either intelligence-wise or maturity-wise, are easy to spot... when I was younger, I had a rule to weed them out: I would not associate with guys who were not at least 2 out of 3 for being in college, having a job, and not living with their parents. Sounded shallow to some people but fuck, anybody who couldn't meet that criteria was usually either an idiot or a 13 year old in an adult's body.
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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Honestly, I think the one thing women are doing wrong is wanting their education equal. I'm not saying marry a dumbass ( I hate dumb people) but maybe look at a guy without as much education. I have a MA and as long as he has a diploma (well and a few other important things like childless)from high school then it's fine. The reality is yes there is a shortage of degreed men but not men. Let's not forget that with that shortage means a degreed man MAY have note options. By may, if he isn't using his degree (common now), or is ugly, or has what many consider undesirable traits (he's short or obese), then I dont think it matters. Let's say he is everything, handsome, tall, educated with a good job he'll have many choices. However few people fall into that category.

    I haven't seen exact stats but have read sociologists are concerned with the top and the bottom because what is happening is the top educated women are often not having kids, or having them later which means less people. Meanwhile those at the bottom are having kids more and most are unwed. This isn't a good trend and will eventually cause a society collapse. Many times these unwed mothers become undesirable partners to many men, while many of these unwed dads are still considered desirable to women. I don't know why since I wouldn't touch them, but I suspect that the women choosing them want anyone and overlook these obvious questions.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Let's say he is everything, handsome, tall, educated with a good job he'll have many choices. However few people fall into that category.
    I wind up seeing lots of these guys, thanks to my 'vacation location' down here way south of the border. Indeed they have many choices ... and as a consequence usually choose to avoid marriage ( and especially avoid re-marriage ), in favor of a series of much shorter term 'relationships'.


    Also, while I didn't originally include it, the article's author also raises the following ...

    (snip)Patton’s brassy indifference to delicacy served the serious purpose of riveting attention on what social scientists call “assortative mating.” Plainly put, America has always aspired to be a meritocracy in which careers are open to talents and status is earned rather than inherited. But the more merit matters to upward mobility, the more inequality becomes entrenched in a stratified society.

    Those favored by genetics and by family acculturation of the acquired social capital (the habits and dispositions necessary for taking advantage of opportunities) tend to go to school and then to work together. And they marry one another, concentrating advantages in their children. (snip)


    while many of these unwed dads are still considered desirable to women. I don't know why since I wouldn't touch them, but I suspect that the women choosing them want anyone

    if he isn't using his degree (common now), or is ugly, or has what many consider undesirable traits (he's short or obese), then I dont think it matters
    The argument could be made that both of these 'extremes' share a common denominator ... a transition from women seeking 'life partners' to women merely seeking 'sex partners'.
    Last edited by Melonie; 03-22-2015 at 05:35 PM.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Honestly, if I was one of those guys I'd probably avoid marriage too. A super rich person is often preyed on. However people tend to marry in their social class.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    This study is incomplete as it says nothing about cats/kittens. An unmarried woman above a certain age is often referred to as a "cat rancher." As for marriage prospects for women: The female population (at least in the US) has outnumbered the male population for quite some time. As for the declining percentage of males attending college: I don't have any ready answers, though a thorough analysis of the societal changes that took place in the last several decades could take up a lot of bandwidth in another thread.
    I'm right 96% of the time. I don't sweat the other 5% .......................

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    It's crazy cat lady, but yep there's that stereotype. I do have a friend who collects cats but she is married. I do know the older a woman gets the less likely she will marry but it's not the numbers it was used to believe to be. In fact that study about a woman over a certain (age 30 or 40 I forget)was more likely to be killed by a terrorist was disproven and most of the women in that study did marry. They were all educated women but not sure if they married likewise educated men.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    a college education really means jack to me , in fact a guy mired down with oppressive student loans is less attractive than a guy who knows a trade and has life smarts.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    LOL @ cat rancher.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Cat Rancher is gonna be my new band name.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    There have been a couple times where I have been attracted to men w/o a college degree, and I would have gone out with them had they asked. In general though I have to admit this is something I am a bit snobbish about...and I don't mean to be. It's just something I want in a partner, like physical attractiveness.
    Last edited by lynn2009; 03-22-2015 at 08:38 PM. Reason: grammar
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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    I used to require a degree but now it doesn't matter. I won't date stupid morons whether they are so called educated or not. I can think of not so smart guys who got through college because they had a famous name (a former president comes to mind who used to brag about having poor grades) and smart ones who never finished college (Bill Gates).

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Cat Rancher, that was awesome. Will spend the next week waiting for an opportunity to use it like a dork.

    What a bizarre conclusion from that article. In my experience many women simply love animals. In my social circle alone I have multiple super serious horse women, a couple of vets and vet technicians, and a woman who fosters dogs. I have never met a woman who I became friends with that doesn't love horses and dogs.

    Believe it or not, one thing that is happening is some very bright men are dropping out of college or skipping it all together in favor of starting or joining a company of similar folks. The concept of college really exists to educate a work force. An entire culture of middle aged CTOs is rabid for the hip factor of finding and hiring the 18 year old wonder kid. Of course there are the uber slackers, but this trend towards developers being hired on skills and body of work is growing very quickly. It really is like hiring an artist based on their work and not the assumption they can paint because they went to college.

    The point being made is a good one though, by itself minus the dog connection. There are a lot of very highly educated women with great careers "on the market". Shouldn't that be a sign of progress? Personally I meet two extremes here, women who are only considering men more accomplished than them and ones who don't care that much.

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    Smiley Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    The love of my life. True story : :

    Here's Mr. Perfect

    IMG_76851-1.jpg
    IMG_76861.jpg
    IMG_76901.jpg

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    70% of men aged 20-34 in the U.S. are unmarried. My fridge is stocked with beer, my humidor is full of cigars. I'm going to watch it all come crumbling down with a smile on my face.
    Quote Originally Posted by _Avery_ View Post
    omg, why is it so huge?!! lol lol

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyanka View Post
    The love of my life. True story : :

    Here's Mr. Perfect

    IMG_76851-1.jpg
    IMG_76861.jpg
    IMG_76901.jpg
    He's a doll. Right now I only have a cat but hope to have another dog eventually. My Dog died last year and I miss having one.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellydancer View Post
    He's a doll. Right now I only have a cat but hope to have another dog eventually. My Dog died last year and I miss having one.
    Thank you! He's my sister's dog but we all share him. He's the best thing to visit, esp after a week hell full of assholes.

    I'm sorry for your loss.
    Last edited by Vyanka; 03-22-2015 at 10:45 PM. Reason: typo

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    I'm dating a guy who went to college but didn't finish. He figured out that his degree wasn't particularly useful for someone who had just been promoted to chef at work. So he dropped out and started working harder at improving his skill set at work. For our town, he's very well paid and his skill set can get him a job anywhere. He's dating a cam girl with three-possibly-four degrees who has never used them (that's me!), so I can see his point. I'm not opposed to someone not having a degree, but I expect them to have a skill set such that they can work a decent job then don't hate, pay the bills, and exhibit some form of emotional maturity and basic intelligence. Common sense is a nice bonus, by the way.

    As an aside, I just purchased my second German Shepherd. I'm also a gun owner. I don't trust anyone to protect me besides me. And my dogs.


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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    I think that this article makes an interesting companion piece for this discussion:

    http://cnsnews.com/news/article/barb...re-not-married

    The article indicates that 70% of males aged 20-34 are not married. Now this would have been a little more meaningful to me if they started at age 24 or so and I'm guessing that the % would drop a lot. But the article does highlight the increasing percentages of guys in all age brackets who remain unmarried.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    ^^^ indeed your companion article also touches on my earlier point ...

    (snip)time was, girls set the cultural morays, the standards, the parameters for intimate activity. The girls were the ones that set those boundaries. And now it’s the guys who do,” Crouse told CNSNews.com.

    “And it’s doubly terrible because the colleges now are predominantly female. So you have some – up to 60 percent of the student bodies are female. And almost all of them are more than 50 percent female. And so the ratio [of] male/female is out of sync.

    “And that means the girls have to live by the guys’ demands. And that means less romance. They don’t date. The girls, I have talked to numerous young women, lament the fact that they don’t have the opportunity to dress up and go out for an event.”

    Young women who adhere to a moral code and refuse to participate in the “hook up” culture are now considered social misfits, Crouse pointed out. And they face even more daunting odds of finding a husband than their promiscuous sisters.

    “It’s really interesting, because Mark Regnerus and Jeremy Uecker wrote their book, “Premarital Sex in America,” what, three, four years ago. And even then, they were very concerned about the fact that young women today are not as likely to get married. And their prospects, if they are not sexually promiscuous, are really low because the guys, if they can sleep around, they’re not interested in going with the girls who don’t put out.(snip)

    This would appear to form a 'bad omen' for the future of exotic dancing .... well, for female dancers at least !!!

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ^^^ indeed your companion article also touches on my earlier point ...

    (snip)time was, girls set the cultural morays, the standards, the parameters for intimate activity. The girls were the ones that set those boundaries. And now it’s the guys who do,” Crouse told CNSNews.com.
    I do want to point out, familial pressure used to be what prompted a lot of women's choices about men back in the day (whether her family approved of her boyfriend, etc.) Women were also actively punished for having premarital sex that resulted in pregnancy (unwed mother's homes, forced adoptions, etc.)

    I feel like we have pockets of America that still push for their kids to use old-fashioned judgement for choosing partners. I have relatives who are very religious and live accordingly. There are even people who form their entire lives around religious dogma (like Mormons or the Quiverfull movement).

    Marriage itself is an unappealing contract. In many states it subjects both parties to liability for the actions of one partner. (Including drug trafficking charges, bet some of you didn't know that!)

    People can have functional common law unions that leave more money in their pockets and leave the law out of their bedrooms.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    One of the side effects of the sexual revolution is that it devalued sex. Hey, I'm not complaining, lol. But I sometimes wonder if women truly understand how much power they lost over men once sex became such a casual thing. After all, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?

    But IMHO men's hesitancy to commit nowadays goes far beyond just sex. I think a lot of guys are struggling with role confusion. They no longer know what they are supposed to be. Trying to be like their fathers and grandfathers is not an option because the women of today do not want to be like their mothers and grandmothers. Now this is all certainly understandable, but it has made relationship dynamics much more confusing for men in the modern age.

    Now, instead of simply being kind and loving providers and protectors, they are expected to be: (1) good providers, except when it interferes with home life; (2) sensitive and emotionally open, except when they need to be tough; (3) equal partners in decision-making, except when they are expected to take charge; (4) sweet and non-aggressive, except when they need to be protective; (5) modern in their thinking about how to treat women, except when they are expected to be romantic or chivalrous; and/or (6) equal parents, which many of these guys are learning as they go because their role models from previous generations did not serve in the same role.

    And if a guy does not manage to meet all of these standards and she doesn't feel emotionally fulfilled in some way, it is all too easy for her to divorce him and take half of everything, along with child support payments and maybe even alimony.

    Small wonder that so many guys are looking at marriage with a jaded eye nowadays.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Well I can maintain that some guys still want to get married b/c 1) bragging rights 2) if they really want to start a family, sooner is better, and 3) marriage has some perks, like combining incomes or enabling one party to stay at home & maintain a household.

    But if you look at how the law treats marriage, it won't help everyone. In my case marriage would cause me financial hardship. So I'm not married and don't care.

    The other hard truth is many men literally cannot afford marriage. Not to a woman in his own age group (if it's a young man you are talking about...) The normal expectation is the husband supports the wife if she has lesser income or none at all. That's supporting a whole human being. Big risk. A big enough risk that "free unlimited sexual favors" doesn't come close to being a trade off.

    The way child support laws and family court laws are.....men also have a lesser chance of a fair shake there. So they don't want to expose themselves to liablity.

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    Default Re: How Can a Profusion of Puppies Be Worrisome ?

    Ending my first marriage (many years ago), with no children and a short lifespan, cost me multiple court visits, hefty attorney fees and $60k in alimony payments over a set period of time. We were a very bad fit and we got married too young. She got the money even though she was still young, had 2 Masters degrees and I paid all the living expenses throughout her graduate schooling. Our pre-marriage cohabitation and my income both factored into the alimony award.

    Now it was worth every damned nickel to be out of a very bad situation, but it goes to show you the difficulty in ending a marriage, even with no kids. By comparison, ending things with my next live-in girlfriend, who lived with me for 2 years years, cost me some difficult conversations, splitting of our furniture and a check for $4,000, which I gave her to help her get setup elsewhere.

    I'd likely have never married again if I did not: (1) very much want a family; and (2) meet the woman who I thought would be a great wife and mother. Despite constant dating, it took me 5 years from the end of my first marriage to meet the woman who I wanted to be the next Mrs. Dugan and I was starting to lose hope. I had no intention of getting married and having kids just to have it all go to shit.

    Now that I'm in my 40s with 3 kids, I would most likely never marry again if my wife ever left me (I will never leave the mother of my children). I just can't see the upside in doing it again.
    Last edited by rickdugan; 03-23-2015 at 10:43 AM. Reason: spelling

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