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Thread: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

  1. #51
    Veteran Member zoezoebelle's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Quote Originally Posted by lokikola View Post
    I hear about these days a lot as well. I am GLAD I did not start dancing right away. I spent four years in the military and entered dancing a lot more level-headed than the young girls I see.

    I will continue to dance as planned (until I finish school) and will only stop if I cannot maintain an average of over 500/night, which I don't see happening anytime soon. I'm not gonna sour myself with things that have been but weren't even for me to begin with.

    Seriously the older dancers who tell me this shit just leave me wondering wtf they did when they were making thousands a night for years for them to still be here at 40.
    Hahaha, that's a good point! The older strippers I know seem so level headed, but at the same time they haven't managed to save and invest so it does make you wonder. I'm glad I got into it at 22, after experiencing what it's like to struggle with real jobs and getting much of my personal shit sorted out first. Even if I only make 30-40k a year doing this, I'm young and single, so I'm still going to save and invest a sizeable chunk by the time I'm 30.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Quote Originally Posted by lokikola View Post
    I hear about these days a lot as well. I am GLAD I did not start dancing right away. I spent four years in the military and entered dancing a lot more level-headed than the young girls I see.

    I will continue to dance as planned (until I finish school) and will only stop if I cannot maintain an average of over 500/night, which I don't see happening anytime soon. I'm not gonna sour myself with things that have been but weren't even for me to begin with.

    Seriously the older dancers who tell me this shit just leave me wondering wtf they did when they were making thousands a night for years for them to still be here at 40.
    So true. To be honest, it has never occurred to me. I guess, they thought that money will be that great forever,hence didn't bother to save at all. Who knows.
    Anyway, it just motivates me a lot to work hard and save,save,save 'cause I don't even want to think what stripping will be like in 10/15/20 years

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Me too! I save as much as I possibly can and try my best to take extra shifts, stay focused at work, etc. I see girls all around me buying expensive cars, purses, going on vacations. And it's like, that lavish lifestyle is fancy and we can obviously afford it, but honestly I can't really enjoy a luxury knowing that I have to go back in the club the following night to make up for that money that was spent. I'd much rather save up what I can now and enjoy later on in life.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    @Melonie, just out of curiosity - how many days per week did you work back then? On average?

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    the older dancers who tell me this shit just leave me wondering wtf they did when they were making thousands a night for years for them to still be here at 40.
    I see girls all around me buying expensive cars, purses, going on vacations. And it's like, that lavish lifestyle is fancy and we can obviously afford it, but honestly I can't really enjoy a luxury knowing that I have to go back in the club the following night to make up for that money that was spent. I'd much rather save up what I can now and enjoy later on in life.
    I was 'fortunate' enough to come into the dancing industry in the late 90's after first having obtained a degree and worked in the health care profession. So I understood from my first night onstage how 'exceptional' the earnings potential from dancing was, and also understood the need to treat dancing as a 'serious, professional' career. That meant 'working' as much and as often as I could. This also meant saving and investing as much of my dancing earnings as I could. After ~12 years of 'serious, professional' dancing, I had enough savings and investments accumulated to provide the passive income necessary to cover 'normal' living expenses plus a few niceties for the rest of my life.

    Along the way, I saw other dancers ... some of whom had higher earnings potential than I did ... pi$$ their opportunities away. Many blew tens of thousands of dollars on maintaining an upscale lifestyle i.e. expensive apartment, expensive cars, designer clothes, expensive vacations etc. and as a result saved next to nothing. Some others blew tens of thousands of dollars on drugs. Still others blew tens of thousands of dollars supporting parasite boyfriends. But spending their earnings like water was really only half the 'story'.

    Just as much a factor for some other girls was developing an 'I don't feel like working' syndrome. For some girls this typically took the form of showing up at the club but exerting very little energy to pursue customers, thus failing to maximize their dancer earnings potential that night. For other girls this took the form of not showing up at the club at all if they had already earned enough money that month to cover their rent, car payment, party money, etc. Still other girls 'took themselves out of the game' via non-serious attempts at college, by acceding to a boyfriend's / husband's wishes to quit dancing, etc.

    Whether these girls earned the money and blew it, or passed up opportunities to earn it, the end result was the same.

    Combing through my strip club memories, I would guess that perhaps only 1 out of every 10 dancers I worked with over the years treated their dancing as a 'serious, professional' career as I did. One 'old friend' danced for about 6 years, strictly following a 'game plan' which called for setting aside sufficient money to put herself through college and also set herself up in practice as a Veterinarian after graduation. Another 'old friend' followed the same 'game plan' as I did, pursuing maximum effort, maximum earnings potential, and maximum savings for enough years to enable them to retire from dancing without the financial need to work at anything else for the rest of their life. Unfortunately, such success stories are the exception rather than the rule.


    just out of curiosity - how many days per week did you work back then? On average?
    I worked out the overall costs and after-effects, and boiled my best option down ... I wound up dancing 5 nights a week ... but for just three weeks out of every four. Without taking that fourth week off to take care of 'normal life' matters, as well as 'recharging my own batteries', I found that the additional money earned by pushing myself to work 5 nights every single week was being offset by even higher expenditures ( restaurant food, paying someone to perform my home and car repairs, 'retail therapy', etc. ). I also found that my average energy level wound up being lower, thus yielding somewhat lower average nightly earnings, if I danced 5 nights a week every week. I also tried working 4 nights a week every week, and this improved my energy level, but didn't really allow me to take care of those 'normal life' things ( versus paying someone else to do them ), and certainly didn't allow me to 'recharge my batteries' from an emotional standpoint in the same way that spending an entire week out of my dancing 'persona' did.
    Last edited by Melonie; 04-24-2015 at 03:52 AM.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Hindsight.........when I was making $5000 a week working 3-5 shifts I was buying expensive clothes and shoes, makeup (foundation I used back then was $35 for a small bottle), I thought nothing of throwing away my bedspread and curtains and buying all new colors. It was just money and I'd make more the next night. I was able to buy a house at 23 and rental properties at 27. But Lost them in a divorce. (long story). I was traveling to Las Vegas every 3 months and gambling for a week straight, and shopping in the boutiques. Now, or rather since 2010 when I came back I spend way more wisely. I buy almost every damn thing I can at dollar tree (paper towels, cough drops, tissues, paper plates, wet wipes, etc). I do own a house, it will be paid off by feb 2016. But the money nowadays makes me spend wiser, but it's so hard to save. Last year I was in a dive bar lucky too be leaving with $135 after house and dj fees on a weeknight. I don't know many people who used those dancing days to scrimp and save. There were girls I knew started dancing in 1997 and I saw them in 2002 and they still didn't have a car. WTF. Drugs and other habits I guess.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Quote Originally Posted by TiffTiff View Post
    Hindsight.........when I was making $5000 a week working 3-5 shifts I was buying expensive clothes and shoes, makeup (foundation I used back then was $35 for a small bottle), I thought nothing of throwing away my bedspread and curtains and buying all new colors. It was just money and I'd make more the next night. I was able to buy a house at 23 and rental properties at 27. But Lost them in a divorce. (long story). I was traveling to Las Vegas every 3 months and gambling for a week straight, and shopping in the boutiques. Now, or rather since 2010 when I came back I spend way more wisely. I buy almost every damn thing I can at dollar tree (paper towels, cough drops, tissues, paper plates, wet wipes, etc). I do own a house, it will be paid off by feb 2016. But the money nowadays makes me spend wiser, but it's so hard to save. Last year I was in a dive bar lucky too be leaving with $135 after house and dj fees on a weeknight. I don't know many people who used those dancing days to scrimp and save. There were girls I knew started dancing in 1997 and I saw them in 2002 and they still didn't have a car. WTF. Drugs and other habits I guess.
    I just wanted to say I really appreciate your honestly. I am not the best with my money tbh. I think I have begun to spend too much on cosmetic procedures but anyway… I don't use drugs or have a boyfriend who takes my money or spend it recklessly. I am a single mom living in Miami and that alone is expensive so I'm not saving as much as the average stripper in Miami could but I'm not doing bad either.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Quote Originally Posted by TiffTiff View Post

    Also, since there was no private dance room back in the day, if a guy liked you he would tip you a $20 on stage. If he wanted your absolute attention he would make it rain 5's, 10's, 20's. There was no other way to tip us or give us money. There was no negotiating anything. Back then you also made extra money based on your costuming. Short shorts and bikini top was lazy......sequins, feathers, and bedazzling your own outfits got you way more tips. It was low pressure back then. No hustling, no nothing. We ALL did our hair and makeup and were meticulous abut our shoes and outfits. Truly a whole different world. And like a stupid young dumbass, I DIDN'T APPRECIATE IT until later in life when I had to start hustling and competing.
    I understand..The showering big bills on the runway was the norm w no vips necessary or n some cases available..just stage dancing...no hustling necessary..

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    My worst vices are tattoos and my reptiles. My boyfriend remarked acidly that my former cocaine habit was cheaper than my reptiles and tattoos.
    Joking aside, I'm not a big spender on the proverbial stripper status symbols like my friends. The only things I splurge on occasionally for myself are shoes and bras that fit me properly.
    "Fake tits are like Kevlar. They don't guarantee your chances of survival but they sure as hell improve it."
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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    "Those days" are sadly not coming back. When my mom was dancing in the late 80s and early-mid 90s they had to do air dances on top of boxes in front of the customers - no touching. No contact. She was making $800+ per night, plus getting paid $17/hr! The girls had to keep their hair and nails and makeup done. Ugh now I see girls with chipped DIY manicures and shit. No. Once, long after my mom got her degree and quit dancing, she got into a bad car accident and had to have surgery (her neck was broken). While she was waiting for her lawsuit she wasn't allowed to work (per doctor's and lawyer's orders) but she was completely broke, so she decided to strip for some extra cash. However, she didn't know how much the industry had changed. This was about 2008 and she went to Penthouse in Detroit (one of the dirtiest clubs in Detroit). She quit after a week or two and was horrified that she was only leaving with a couple hundred a night because she wouldn't prostitute herself. She wasn't used to that bullshit.

    It's funny because the main club that she used to work at back in the good days was my main club for about 2 years. The other day I was talking about how small the dressing room is there and she's like "really? When I worked there we all thought the dressing room was huge!" I was very puzzled then I put two and two together and asked her if they had any private lap dance rooms back then, she said no, so I immediately knew what happened to that 'large' dressing room. It had to downsize in order to make room for the vip booths. So now girls can give extras and the dressing room is a nice-sized walk-in closet. (so glad I don't work there anymore).

    The club I work at now has virtually no extras because there is no completely private place to give dances.

    The only way I can see clubs going back to "those days" would be clubs in smaller boom towns where guys have money, but the club would also have to be low-contact and have high standards for the girls. That would be probably the closest we'll get to "those days," unfortunately.
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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    I honestly see cities like Seattle and Denver showing the future of dancing- corporate chains controlling clubs, only allowing certain kinds of girls to work, and the house taking a giant chunk of the girl's money via funny money cash ins and making it so stage tipping is poor.

    It sucks. I feel lucky I got to experience the freedom of travelling to dance- small rural clubs NEED dancers to come to them so they aren't as controlling as corporate chains.

    BTW small rural clubs DO drop the ball sometimes via poor management, lying to girls, and not ejecting problem customers/dancers. Travel dancing isn't all gypsy adventures and exciting new horizons, it's high overhead and hearing the same BS over and over.

    TL ; DR Stripping really is a job now...

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    I honestly see cities like Seattle and Denver showing the future of dancing- corporate chains controlling clubs, only allowing certain kinds of girls to work, and the house taking a giant chunk of the girl's money via funny money cash ins and making it so stage tipping is poor.
    In terms of future possibilities, with the probable exception of privately owned clubs where ( peeling back the sugar coating ) 'dances' aren't the primary service which the club / dancers are actually providing to customers, I agree with your assessment that 'corporate' chain clubs are likely to become increasingly dominant. The 'corporate' chain clubs are really the only ones with the 'deep pockets' necessary to ride out the ups and downs of industry profitability in one particular local economy, not to mention being better able to absorb the increasing costs of regulatory compliance, tax compliance, etc. via 'economy of scale'.


    Travel dancing isn't all gypsy adventures and exciting new horizons, it's high overhead and hearing the same BS over and over.
    Amen to that !!! I wound up learning 'the hard way' that travel dancing at the 'wrong' clubs can result in less net money than staying 'home' and working at a local club.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    I might sound like the devil's advocate here, but in a few ways the corporate model is safer for dancers- they have the control/money to eliminate safety issues at the club. However as an IC the idea of sacrificing a huge chunk of my earnings is hard. As a travel dancer that huge chunk went into my overhead of getting me from place to place.

    I actually want to point a finger at several rural clubs that could have easily made a lot more money if they had just gotten off of their asses and been proactive about courting dancers, controlling in-house issues, and firing problem employees (since strip clubs seem to attract so many non-dancer flunkies who crave the stimulation of a strip club job.) Some of these clubs deserve to fail. A huge problem was treating the dancers poorly when in reality for that brief window of time in a dancer's life when she is young and vigorous enough to go from club to club....she can go wherever she wants to go.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Just a random thought on the topic of 'those days', I find it funny the differences in perspective. I'm only 23, so I didn't actually witness the 'golden age', but I'm still aware of its existence and how the kind of money we have now is like, ⅓ of back then. From that, I can appreciate that it's piss poor vs then. There's all these little 18 year olds that work the nude side at my club, they've been doing it for a little while so they're not still in that "Oh my God $80 in 5 hours!" phase... but they still think $150 is a good night. Granted, they blow it all, but they have noooo idea. Ignorance is bliss, I suppose.

    On the other end of things, I try to keep in perspective that even if it's only an "okay" day, I still average about the same hourly as my doctor father-in-law. We can still use dancing as a nice little springboard to financial goals, but smaller ones like paying for your degree or a down payment on a house. I think it'd be very difficult to pull a Melonie and retire by 40, entirely based off of dancing income, the way it is now.... I'd have to work close to 40 hours/week to do that, and a lot of us physically or mentally can't work that much.

    Just my 2 cents though, I'm sure someone will disagree and that's okay
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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    I think it all depends on the dancer...I have worked with some rock star earners. My fave was a minor porn star, I didn't realize why guys were so excited about her stage shows & why she was making a grand a night. lol This was like 10 years ago.

    In short dancers are going to have to be like the Japanese geisha- a perfect 10 in every department. Hot, fit, smart, polite, entertaining.

    This is also going to sound like a mean statement but I think the hard times are going to flush out a lot of women who do not need to be stripping- take that however you may. (I noticed more mean comments from guys regarding less attractive girls at the end of my years dancing- a lot of guys think there needs to be a standard for stage dancers.)

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    In short dancers are going to have to be like the Japanese geisha- a perfect 10 in every department. Hot, fit, smart, polite, entertaining.
    I would agree with your projection, where future 'upscale' strip clubs are concerned. However, that segment only covers perhaps 20% of clubs and dancers. Where future suburban / neighborhood clubs i.e. the other 80% are concerned, the perfect 10 attributes won't matter as much as the degree of 'personal services' which the dancers are willing to provide to customers at a 'reasonable' price.


    I think the hard times are going to flush out a lot of women who do not need to be stripping- take that however you may.
    Agreed that the strip club 'market' is likely to be increasingly difficult for dancers who don't 'measure up' to the hiring standards of the 'upscale' clubs, and who also aren't willing to provide the degree of 'extras' which will be expected at suburban / neighborhood clubs. And if, net of house fees, the earnings potential of a future dancer falls to levels which start to approach a minimum wage 'straight' job, there's really no point to continue dancing.
    Last edited by Melonie; 04-28-2015 at 01:42 PM.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Quote Originally Posted by SnuffleUffleGrass View Post
    In short dancers are going to have to be like the Japanese geisha- a perfect 10 in every department. Hot, fit, smart, polite, entertaining.
    This is exactly what I strive to be! Nearly every time I've banked it's been due to the hard work I put into researching obscure topics related to men's interests (especially snobby rich men's interests). There have been plenty of customers whom I wouldn't have gotten nearly as much money from had I not been able to talk to them about, just as some random topics, the global war on terror, haute cuisine, 19th century literature, German cars, American military history, etc. Ironically, some of what I talk about to customers, I learned at my university. Imagine needing a college education to be a successful dancer!

    In my club, it's either the above or extras/heavy grinding and a high customer volume. There's great money in both, but ... I know how I prefer to make it.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Quote Originally Posted by kaninchen View Post
    This is exactly what I strive to be! Nearly every time I've banked it's been due to the hard work I put into researching obscure topics related to men's interests (especially snobby rich men's interests). There have been plenty of customers whom I wouldn't have gotten nearly as much money from had I not been able to talk to them about, just as some random topics, the global war on terror, haute cuisine, 19th century literature, German cars, American military history, etc. Ironically, some of what I talk about to customers, I learned at my university. Imagine needing a college education to be a successful dancer!

    In my club, it's either the above or extras/heavy grinding and a high customer volume. There's great money in both, but ... I know how I prefer to make it.
    Same here!! I love entertaining the more intelligent customers with intellectual banter and witty retorts, or speaking in broken French and talking about film history (today). I've had some very detailed conversations about computer programming and art. It is the only way I make so much money without giving handjobs in the back! I'm trying to memorise more jokes and find little fun things to do, like back rubs, to spark their interest. And I try to be hot, fit and polite! A month ago I still thought I'd do this job for 6 months to a year and then find other ways of supporting myself, but I'm starting to think it might be better to just focus on being a good sex worker for a few years. Take advantage of it while I have the chance!

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    In a way, this is true for every single industry out there: the glory days are over. People used to get rich quickly in many industries, and now it's only the upper 20% who are enjoying such success. So, either you're part of the 80% who are making 20% of the money, or you're part of the 20% who are making 80% of the money.

    Those of us who are part of the 80% will tell you that the glory days aren't over - they're simply harder to come by...but they're still out there. And those of us who are part of the lower 20% will complain until the cows come home that the glory days are absolutely over, never to return.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    It's bizarre that strip clubs used to pay dancers. I wonder how house fees and tipouts came to be standard.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    Quote Originally Posted by lokikola View Post
    I just wanted to say I really appreciate your honestly. I am not the best with my money tbh. I think I have begun to spend too much on cosmetic procedures but anyway… I don't use drugs or have a boyfriend who takes my money or spend it recklessly. I am a single mom living in Miami and that alone is expensive so I'm not saving as much as the average stripper in Miami could but I'm not doing bad either.
    I was also living in a 2 income household. Now I am raising 2 kids without child support and I have a daughter living at her grandma's so she can go to college. There's times where I had such a bad week or month that I almost went to a local food pantry for extra help. I can't afford what babysitters want nowadays ( 17 year olds want $12 an hour to sit in my house while my kids sleep and I dance). The area I live in is not great for strip clubs. They are all dive bars with pool tables pretty much.

    I quit my real job in March making $13 an hour, working 38 hours a week bringing home around $400 a week. Now I can dance 3 shifts a week and make that with a total of 15 hours a week (worst case scenario, average closer to $700). But I'm older and I have no tolerance anymore so I burn out very quickly and get discouraged very easily.

    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$What I encourage everyone to do is get an online savings account that you have no access to. I opened up an ING account a few years ago. I can send $15 to the account or $500, whenever I want. There's no fees, you don't get a debit card. I have it set up to come out of my checking account. It takes me 10 minutes to look at my checking, see that I have more money than I need for my budget and send it to the savings. Now it's gone, out of sight, out of mind and I won't spend it. I accumulated $5000 in a little over a year just doing that randomly. But you can also set it up to automatically take a set amount on certain dates, say the 15th of each month you want $100 moved over. Just look up online savings account. Capitol one is what I have now. It used to be ING Direct.

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  37. #72
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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    It's bizarre that strip clubs used to pay dancers. I wonder how house fees and tipouts came to be standard
    This was a side-effect of the cultural change which has occurred over the past ~30-40 years. Two generations ago, a girl who was willing to appear nude in front of an audience ... be it a live club audience, magazine readers, movie viewers ... was very likely to be 'ostracised' by family, friends, and polite society in general. As such, comparatively few girls were willing to do this. The result was that a severe 'supply' shortage existed where attractive 'strippers' were concerned. And, as with all 'supply and demand' equations, the shortage of attractive 'strippers' provided financial leverage which those 'strippers' could use to their advantage in terms of hourly pay, expected tips etc. Keep in mind that, ~30+ years ago, the major strip club customer offerings were legally confined to stage performances and 'ladies' drinks' ( basically, a form of non-private CR ).

    However, between the ongoing 'liberalization' of polite society in general, and the rise of adult internet and cable TV content through the 90's, the 'supply and demand' equation began to change significantly. 'Stripping', as well as other forms of adult modeling, became more socially acceptable with fewer negative consequences - thus more girls willingly added themselves to the 'supply'. Clubowners gradually took notice that they were beginning to have more requests from new dancers than they had available 'jobs' for. And the 'supply' of willing dancers increased even further as more 'liberal' interpretation of national laws allowed clubs to add lap dances and ( fully private ) VIP / CR to the customer offerings ... which provided a major source of additional earnings for both the clubs and the dancers. Clubowners made use of the 'new' availability of lap dance / VIP / CR earnings to eliminate hourly pay for dancers during the 90's.

    From there, between the 'dot-bomb' of 2000 and the economic recession following 9/11/2001, the 'supply' of willing dancers again began to increase greatly as a result of the gradual disappearance of mainstream unskilled jobs. At the same time, the supply of available customer dollars began to decline significantly, while societal views of sex continued to become more 'liberal' as adult content became even more mainstream. The increased competition among dancers, combined with fewer club customer dollars available, began to add significant amounts of 'extras' to customer offerings. And with the greatly increased numbers of willing dancers, plus yet another new source of additional ( 'extras' ) earnings being added, clubowners then took the chance that instituting 'house fees' would result in an adequate number of dancers to still allow the club to operate being willing to pay them ... while 'house fees' would also provide an incentive for ( would-be and existing ) dancers whose earnings potential was marginal to seek work elsewhere.

    On a dancing history 'side note', I will add that the lucrative nature of dancing in the 90's led to an increase in the number of strip clubs ... many locating in suburban / neighborhood areas. Increased dancer competition thus the rise of 'extras' post 2001, in combination with more strip clubs, arguably led to a 'backlash' on the part of local residents. This gave birth to such things as local anti-strip club ordinances limiting contact / 'exposure' levels, zoning laws trying to force closure / relocation of strip clubs, dancer's licensing laws trying to prevent convicted prostitutes / drug users / thieves from being able to work as dancers, etc.
    Last edited by Melonie; 04-29-2015 at 05:33 AM.

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    Senior Member TiffTiff's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    yeah, I also remember when we had to wear pasties at least 3 inches in diameter, then it was just to cover the nipple (whatever size u needed), then I left for 3 years and came back to NO pasties and house fees! When I started dancing, not only was I paid but there was a jukebox and we got endless quarters to play our songs. No DJ fee either. Then a few years and better clubs later there was a dj but it was only $3 to pay him b/c the club paid him. It just went downhill from there with all the fees and pay the dj, tip the bouncers, tip the bartenders even if you aren't drinking. Who the hell does the club actually pay anymore? It's all profit except the utilities! They take part of our dance money, a lot of our champagne money, our house fee, we pay the dj...wtf.

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    Who the hell does the club actually pay anymore? It's all profit except the utilities!
    The local property tax assessor, their mortgage banker and/or their investors / stockholders, their attorneys and accountants, etc. Welcome to 'corporate' America.

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    Default Re: Are 'those days' ever going to come back?

    I do know of one club who still pays their dancers hourly and they get to keep their tips, but it's only $6 per hr. cash....no over time. And there is a schedule. It is sort of like the 'old days', but working conditions are worse.

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