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Thread: Why do we not have a union?

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    Default Why do we not have a union?

    Hello

    I am fairly new to camming and to this site, but I know enough that it is a constant struggle amongst us to find an adequate site that will maximize our earnings. The kinds of cut that the site takes (especially when considering the amount of taxes that we are paying as individual contractors) is outrageous and getting worse.

    Why don't we have a union or form a union? There are obviously a multitude of very talented and smart women here that the sites consider an asset, and I think that coming together is the only way to fight the huge sway of these companies (rather than just trying to individually maneuver around them.

    Let me know if you have any insight

    Kira

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    Veteran Member HoolaTwister's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    A union? Lol. Look up what happened to the Lusty Lady.

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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    But it sounds like Lusty Lady took a hit from the recession, the problem here isn't that there isn't a market for camgirls, its that we're taken advantage of. For example, just unionizing to create greater restrictions on studios and stuff.

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    Veteran Member HoolaTwister's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    The Lusty Lady took a hit because they could not get their sh*t together. At all. They can blame the recession, they can blame the landlord but bottom line is, the union broke them. It sounds great in theory but I'm not sure it would be a good idea at all.

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    Featured Member DancesWithSloths's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    Many reasons, but here's one: because - at least in theory - we are freelancers, and so - at least in theory - cam sites are our business partners, rather than employers. (Now, personally, I have many misgivings about this, but that's a different can of worms.)

    Freelancer unions do exist - anyone remember the Hollywood writers' strike? - but the studios couldn't swap the striking writers with more eager ones from poor countries. And that is another reason we don't have a union.


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    Veteran Member nadia29's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    I'd join a union if someone else started it. I could see it working for North America girls and western European girls.
    Last edited by nadia29; 05-29-2015 at 09:50 AM.

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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by nadia29 View Post
    I'd join a union if someone else started it. I could see it work for North America girls and western European girls.
    Heeeey, I feel left out. I'm east european! Don't break my ex-communist heart.

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    Veteran Member nadia29's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by euro_princess View Post
    Heeeey, I feel left out. I'm east european! Don't break my ex-communist heart.
    The more the merrier=) Of course we want you to join.

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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    Unions generally come about as a reaction to managerial abuses. I'm trying to wrap my head around the mechanics of exactly how this would work.

    How do you tell models "you can't work on this site because their payouts are lower"?
    Do you enforce models setting a minimum price per minute?
    What effect would seniority have on the process?
    How much of a critical mass of models would you need in order to get a site to change its policies?
    How do you keep the union leadership from getting bought off, especially with everything being online?

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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    ^^^ Unions can only organize 'employees'. Thus any pre-requisite to Union representation would be conversion from independent contractor self-employed status to 'employee' status. And along with that change would come new costs for unemployment insurance, disability insurance, minimum wage hourly pay, other 'employee' benefits ( like health care and retirement ) if the person is allowed to work more than 28 hours per week, accounting / payroll processing costs, etc. Ultimately, these additional costs would have to come out of webcam host or camgirl earnings.

    Also, as an 'employer', any webcam host entering into an 'employer' role would also face new 'employer' responsibilities that are not financial in nature. For example, if a camgirl were to use her webcam to solicit 'real life' hookups with customers, the webcam host could potentially be charged with 'promoting prostitution'. Along similar lines, if a camgirl were to play copyrighted music during her webcam, the webcam host could be charged with 'copyright violation'. Also, since an 'employer' webcam host could potentially be subject to 'hostile workplace' lawsuits from employee camgirls, the webcam host might be forced to block new webcam customers until they can be 'vetted' ( via credit card company or whatever ). At the very least, this could force 'employer' webcam hosts to perform background checks before hiring 'employee' camgirls ... to try and weed out those with criminal records, those who have filed claims against past 'employers', etc.
    .

    Bottom line appears to be that webcam customers are spending X amount of money. Right now that money is divided between the webcam host, the camgirls, and the taxman. Converting to 'employee' status would also force that same X amount of customer money to now also be shared with state unemployment and disability insurance funds, payroll processing services, accountants and attorneys, etc. Also, if any webcam host were to convert to 'employer' status, the reduced payout to 'employee' camgirls would undoubtedly force many existing camgirls ( and their customers ) to quickly move to a different webcam host who still treates camgirls as independent contractors ... i.e. creating a snowball situation toward bankruptcy.

    Lastly, various 'employer' hiring laws would come into play ... which could potentially result in US based 'employer' webcam hosts only being allowed to hire US citizen / permanent resident camgirls, Eurozone based 'employer' webcam hosts only being allowed to hire Eurozone citizen / permanent resident camgirls, etc.
    Last edited by Melonie; 05-29-2015 at 11:03 AM.

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    Default Re: Why do we not have a union?

    I've wondered it myself. At least I think it would be good to make a rule that Independent Contractors make at least 50% of their gross income. There's a very thin line between Independent Contractor and Employee and a lot of these sites demand only things an employer should demand. yet still get away with.




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