NYC Could Lose More Than Half Its Strip Clubs

[Eric Stoner]

From the New York Post : Strip club owners in NYC may have to close or relocate. A recent court ruling has invalidated the 60/40 Rule. That rule permitted strip clubs to stay open in otherwise restricted ( usually residential or commercial ) areas if 60 % of the club was used for "non-adult " entertainment such as a restaurant. The City had not been enforcing the zoning code. Until now.

Sapphire has taken over the lease of Flashdancers in Times Square. Other clubs may be forced to move to "industrial " areas or close.
Industry insiders say NYC could be left with only 4 to 8 strip clubs open after everything shakes out.

[slowpoke]

That should be good for the survivors.

[Spicecake]

Horrible for all the girls at clubs that are closing and with such little competition hosts and managers will expect even more tips while treating the girls worse knowing they don’t have many options.

[Nyla19]

Yup!!!! Bad news for a bunch of NYC clubs.

[arielbriel]

What do you mean by “saved”? Are you mocking us?

[rickdugan]

^No Ariel, I was referring to the belief held by Nanny State types that dancers are victims, which they use to justify their actions against club. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

[whirlerz]

What's a Nanny state?

When clubs close here, they pop up somewhere else.. that's here tho.
But yeah, problematic cause custies are used to those locations

[ZeroSugarMonster]

I think that with less clubs, the customers will be less dispersed and more concentrated. If there are less clubs, the downside is the competition will be even steeper for hiring dancers, unless the clubs lax their standards about the 3 shift a week, 8 hr minimum bs which is pretty stsndard in all their clubs. Dancers may be forced to travel out too. For that I have no pity bc having lived in la, travel dance is something you simply do and/or commute 1-2 hrs each way sometimes. Nyc as is is oversaturated with clubs. And yes, they rip off their workers by taking huge cuts out of the vip. Yes, hosts and management will take advantage of the situation but don't they already? I mean, how much worse can it get until they get sued into extinction via class action lawsuits. Anyhow, for dancers already doing well, I think it could get better.

[Ifyouseekamy]

Prayers for those girls. That’s rough. They already were having issues with competition from bottle girls. All that’s gonna do is make prostitution worse...girls gotta pay rent one way or another.

[CFMNH44]

Nanny state - Those who ban something because they don't like it - Banning plastic bags, big slurpies, back page ads, strip clubs. There is a major shift happening, it may not be good for those that can't adjust. Retail in general is shrinking, brick and mortar stores are closing, it makes sense that strip clubs, the 'retail stores' of the sex industry are hurting from all sorts of pressure. Normally, at least in the vanilla world, the shift is to online, but... The Amazon of sex work, Backpage and others were closed by FOSTA / SESTA nannies. One unpredicted fallout is the demise of The Village Voice - the best of the 'Alternate Newspapers'. (Original home of the 'Pheonix Classified Ads' - where sex workers lined up to buy small print adverts for their services back in the old days...) When the newspaper was forced to sell off Backpage they lost their main revenue source. Sad that an independent news source is now gone. We can see this happening, how do we adjust?

[SnuffleUffleGrass]

Just wanted to add that gentrification is causing this in other major metro cities as well.

[whirlerz]

Thanks for the definition, CFMN
I noticed the other won't, but crawl outta word work to antagonize tho

Totally agree w/Snuffle!

[random stripper]

Hoping for the best for the NYC ladies. Politics really are something else.

[slowpoke]

What's a Nanny state?

those locations

When government violates your rights under the pretense of "helping" you.

[hoosiers]

They are also both beholden to major commercial and real estate developers. So there MIGHT be a connection.

dingdingdingdingdingding

[whirlerz]

When government violates your rights under the pretense of "helping" you.

Pokey-wokey!

[Optimist]

Note: the posts with political commentary/finger pointing have been removed. Please stay on subject without political grandstanding or vilifying.

[arielbriel]

Prayers for those girls. That’s rough. They already were having issues with competition from bottle girls. All that’s gonna do is make prostitution worse...girls gotta pay rent one way or another.

That’s mainly in queens and this mainly affects the manhattan strip clubs.

[eagle2]

I would think that clubs that are doing well will relocate rather than shut down.

[arielbriel]

They already are opening up new spaces however customers just like the original more a lot of the times or those xlubs are smaller or not as good.

[rickdugan]

I would think that clubs that are doing well will relocate rather than shut down.

Unfortunately it's not that simple.

First you have to find a desirable location that meets the zoning requirements and NYC has crafted them in a way designed to severely limit available options.

Then, if you are lucky enough to find a suitable building in one of the few areas that you can still run a club, you still need to get city approval for a new liquor license. One of the last clubs that tried to get a liquor license in NYC was the Show Palace in Long Island City, which was forced to operate without a liquor license for over a decade due to resistance by the local Community Board. Each section of each borough has its own designated Community Board which, while purportedly an advisory entity, holds a lot of sway with the city.

Net-net most of the clubs club that are forced to close are likely to stay closed.

[Bloom2018]

Hopefully clubs won't be taking high cuts and raising their house fees. If you're a good dancer you'll be making more money because of the higher concentration of customers, and club owners know that.

[Eric Stoner]

I would think that clubs that are doing well will relocate rather than shut down.

Exactly. Sapphire which took over the original Scores location ( which was never that great ; not easy to get to thanks to Queensboro Bridge traffic and lack of parking ) is now assuming the lease and location of Flashdancers. Despite being near Times Square ( opposite the Ed Sullivan Theatre ) they are supposedly safe. At least for now.

However in the zoning laws there is also a density requirement i.e. a strip club has to be a certain distance from another adult business be it another club , a video store etc.

[Eric Stoner]

Unfortunately it's not that simple.

First you have to find a desirable location that meets the zoning requirements and NYC has crafted them in a way designed to severely limit available options.

Then, if you are lucky enough to find a suitable building in one of the few areas that you can still run a club, you still need to get city approval for a new liquor license. One of the last clubs that tried to get a liquor license in NYC was the Show Palace in Long Island City, which was forced to operate without a liquor license for over a decade due to resistance by the local Community Board. Each section of each borough has its own designated Community Board which, while purportedly an advisory entity, holds a lot of sway with the city.

Net-net most of the clubs club that are forced to close are likely to stay closed.

You are correct in that options will be limited. As we have both laid out. As you also point out, Community Boards have some input - they can oppose granting a liquor license but not determine whether or not to grant one. That is up to the New York State Liquor Authority. Fortunately , NYC repealed its cabaret law so a license is not longer required afaik.

What we MIGHT see more of are private , "members only" clubs a la Rosewood Theatre.

[Vyanka]

Those underground clubs need to shut down. Some guy told me it felt like a raid waiting to happen.

Anyway, I think closing a few clubs is a good thing. NYC doesn't need that many.