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  1. #201
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    Default Re: Covid news

    I’ve calmed down a bit since the new CDC guidance was released.

    I’m so angry at the CDC. My Canadian friends were right! This is just beta testing! The CDC caved and dropped mask mandates too early.

    That’s like telling a kid they can have ice cream for breakfast and stay up all night, and then telling them the next day they have to go to bed early and they can never have ice cream again. You can’t do that! They should have set a metric for vaccination % of population and waited until after fall/winter before dropping the mandate. They have no nuance in their guidelines either. I’ve lost all respect for the CDC.

    We’re already a marginalized group. I don’t know about you, but if I wear a mask at work I won’t get dances.

    If the virus doesn’t kill me, then the stress of the pandemic will. (yes, that’s hyperbole.)

    Here’s a really good interview with Dr. Campbell
    Last edited by moneybags; 07-30-2021 at 04:11 PM.
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    Arrow Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by trustfundkiller View Post
    I just saw that Disney is now requiring all employees to be vaccinated. Those are are unvaccinated will have 60 days to do so and those working from home will have to submit proof of vaccination before returning to the workplace. Good on them. Stop making it easy on these unvaxxed clowns. Make it so difficult to be a part of everyday society that they either get vaxxed or stay home.

    Hopefully more companies will follow suit.
    The Lalapaloiza music fest is requiring Covid cards and / or negative tests


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  5. #203
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by trustfundkiller View Post
    I just saw that Disney is now requiring all employees to be vaccinated. Those are are unvaccinated will have 60 days to do so and those working from home will have to submit proof of vaccination before returning to the workplace. Good on them. Stop making it easy on these unvaxxed clowns. Make it so difficult to be a part of everyday society that they either get vaxxed or stay home.

    Hopefully more companies will follow suit.
    I’m glad employers are mandating vaccines.

    People seem to be clueless to the fact that unless you work from home, see very few clients a week, then your job is a place where you’re at a great risk of contracting covid or something else.

    I never get sick. But when I worked in vanilla corporation I stayed getting sick because people cannot help themselves and will traipse their sick ass into work (to avoid the stigma of using sick days) then spread their pathogens without a care in the world.

    Anyways mandate vaccines for school aged kids and for employees who see more than 10 clients a week.
    Last edited by miss.a.p1600; 07-31-2021 at 08:51 AM.

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  7. #204
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    Default Re: Covid news

    I'm more of a moderate on this issue I suppose; the Mayo Clinic is doing an excellent job changing hearts and minds by addressing the root of people's fears with transparency and information, also, it is nice that politicians from BOTH parties have been telling people not to be afraid to get the vaccine.

    "Forcing" people takes law enforcement we haven't got and companies can be sued, while at the same time they need workers, so I'm not sure the draconian line will realistically work.

    I've talked to a number of very lefty Canadians and they are 100% sure Trudeau is out in this election he has called for September. I'm not so sure, but I know you could NOT do what he has done in Canada in the US and survive as a politician.

    I think in this case maybe less anger, more baby steps, is better. If you know a reluctant person, talk to them, tell them what you went through, tell them why you made the choice you made, it does work. I have two friends I believe I've convinced. Anyway they got vaccinated and that is what matters. People have some very real fears and you might be the one to help them realize their fears are hurting them.
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  9. #205
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    Default Re: Covid news

    From an interview with Dr. Irwin Redlener, a pediatrician and physician, a professor of pediatrics at the Albert Einstein College of Medicine, and the founding director of the National Center for Disaster Preparedness at Columbia University’s Earth Institute.

    As a vaccinated person, how concerned should I be given the new CDC guidance about getting COVID? And how concerned should I be about spreading COVID?

    The latest data is showing us something very important: That with the new Delta variant, the viral load, the amount of virus carried by an infected person is the same whether or not that person has been vaccinated. This is a different situation than we understood before, with previous variants and the original virus, because all three of the vaccinations available here—Moderna, Pfizer, and J&J—were able to suppress the amount of virus. Not eliminate it, necessarily, but certainly we were seeing big differences in the virus load being carried by vaccinated versus unvaccinated. That no longer seems to be the case. Even though the vaccines will, by and large, prevent very serious illness or death in a person who gets infected with the Delta variant, it turns out that the vaccines do not suppress the amount of virus in a person’s body.

    Which means that we can tell you as a vaccinated person, you’re very, very likely going to be protected from having to go on a ventilator or die. But what we can not say is that you’ll have less virus that you could then spread around. That makes you, as a vaccinated person, a potential threat to people who are still vulnerable. And we have a situation in the United States where we have 100 million people or so who have never had the disease, and who have never been vaccinated and who are vulnerable to getting infected by a vaccinated person who’s contracted the Delta variant.

    Why did the CDC put out this new guidance before putting out the data that informed it? And has this new data been fully and adequately vetted at this point?

    The White House and the CDC and the federal agencies that deal with the pandemic are still learning how to communicate about this highly dynamic, highly dangerous disease. I think people are surprised by this, but the fact of the matter is that this is not easy because the situation, the data, keeps changing—we keep learning more things. And the communication strategies have not been what they should be.

    The first thing we need to know about the communication strategies is that there should never be a policy, a guideline, put out by the CDC that does not have this caveat: Here’s what we know, today, but it’s almost inevitable that we’re going to learn more in the next week, two weeks, a month, that’s going to make us want to change the policies and the recommendations. Be prepared in this very dynamic reality of COVID-19 and especially the new variants that things are not going to stay static for very long. We’re telling you what we think now, not what we will be thinking.

    Number two, it was really a big mistake not to precede or accompany the new guidelines with this new data. It didn’t make sense. In May, the message was “if you’ve been vaccinated, you can go indoors or anywhere else you want and you don’t need a mask.” And it turns out that that’s not true. So what looked like kind of an arbitrary reversal of policy was actually a change in policy based on new data.

    Read more...
    Last edited by eagle2; 07-30-2021 at 10:34 PM.

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  11. #206
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    Default Re: Covid news

    ^^^This is true AND the fact of the matter is the CDC guidance was economically and politically motivated. Yes get vaccinated and wear a mask, but the CDC has lost its integrity. How does someone with a medical degree not add the caveat in the message unless they want to manipulate people into “keep calm and carrying on.” They should have said expect the guidance to change, but they didn’t because they wanted us to go back to work and to spend money.

    I’m just venting. I’m tired of being BS’d by the higher ups.
    Last edited by moneybags; 07-30-2021 at 10:40 PM.
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  13. #207
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    Default Re: Covid news

    This article seems pretty even handed: New delta variant studies show the pandemic is far from over
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  15. #208
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    Default Re: Covid news

    A) If you're fully vaccinated, and decide you'd still prefer to keep wearing the mask everywhere, that's fine.
    B) If you're fully vaccinated, and decide you're comfortable going maskless in places where they aren't required for the vaxxed, that's fine. I fall into category B, because that is MY preference.

    No one in group A or B is better than the other, and should not be turning their noses up at each other. Though I DO understand your concern of "But how do I know this person actually IS vaccinated?" I get that. I bought lanyards recently, just in case the time comes when we're required to show proof of vaccine status. That way, we can just have it around our necks. Lol.

    We did what the CDC/president/our governors told us to do by getting the vaccine, and we "masked up" when required and where required. If the mask mandate is reinstated in our states, then obviously ALL of us will have to go back to wearing them everywhere...so some of the folks in category A can stop freaking out when they see us category B people out somewhere.
    39 and feelin' fine!



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  17. #209
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    Default Re: Covid news

    I'm in category B for now.

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    Default Re: Covid news

    The virus doesn’t care about our politics. I refrain from judging or trying to control others. I do truly empathize with most people- most people are just trying to get through this COVID era the best they can. We all want to get back to normal. We just don’t agree how to do that.

    Plagues have been around forever. We just are spoiled by modern health care. Instead of focusing on what I can’t control, l’ll just be grateful I’m vaccinated and safe right now. I’ll focus on boosting my immune system naturally, meditate, and pray. Hopefully, I’ll stay healthy until they get a booster.

    The politics of the pandemic is just insane! We’re in this together-like it or not. We all share the same planet, so we need to get our shit together and learn how to play nice…LOL.
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  21. #211
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by Bahuba View Post
    I'm more of a moderate on this issue I suppose; the Mayo Clinic is doing an excellent job changing hearts and minds by addressing the root of people's fears with transparency and information, also, it is nice that politicians from BOTH parties have been telling people not to be afraid to get the vaccine.

    "Forcing" people takes law enforcement we haven't got and companies can be sued, while at the same time they need workers, so I'm not sure the draconian line will realistically work.

    I've talked to a number of very lefty Canadians and they are 100% sure Trudeau is out in this election he has called for September. I'm not so sure, but I know you could NOT do what he has done in Canada in the US and survive as a politician.

    I think in this case maybe less anger, more baby steps, is better. If you know a reluctant person, talk to them, tell them what you went through, tell them why you made the choice you made, it does work. I have two friends I believe I've convinced. Anyway they got vaccinated and that is what matters. People have some very real fears and you might be the one to help them realize their fears are hurting them.
    How is “forcing” employees any different from forcing kids n college students to take vaccines to prevent outbreaks?

    It’s not forcing them per say. They can find an employer who doesn’t require it or work for themselves. Just like school kids would have their parents homeschool if they weren’t satisfied with vaccines being required to attend.

    Some of these ratchet Employers will probably have their replacements lined up before the unvaccinated employee can pack his belongings.

    I think the fear is real.

    I know firsthand. The adverse reactions.

    I do think that as long as a person has insurance (life, health, and disability) and maybe even some money for lawyers then the fear should be subsided in the rare event something goes wrong from the vaccine.

  22. #212
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by Bahuba View Post

    I saw a dude snatch this girls mask off n said ďwhat are you wearing that for? The pandemic is over!Ē

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  24. #213
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by Bahuba View Post
    I'm more of a moderate on this issue I suppose; the Mayo Clinic is doing an excellent job changing hearts and minds by addressing the root of people's fears with transparency and information, also, it is nice that politicians from BOTH parties have been telling people not to be afraid to get the vaccine.

    "Forcing" people takes law enforcement we haven't got and companies can be sued, while at the same time they need workers, so I'm not sure the draconian line will realistically work.

    I've talked to a number of very lefty Canadians and they are 100% sure Trudeau is out in this election he has called for September. I'm not so sure, but I know you could NOT do what he has done in Canada in the US and survive as a politician.

    I think in this case maybe less anger, more baby steps, is better. If you know a reluctant person, talk to them, tell them what you went through, tell them why you made the choice you made, it does work. I have two friends I believe I've convinced. Anyway they got vaccinated and that is what matters. People have some very real fears and you might be the one to help them realize their fears are hurting them.
    Companies can't be sued by employees for mandating vaccines. When hospital employees sued their (former) employer for firing them because they refused to get vaccinated, their case was dismissed.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/13/h...e-lawsuit.html

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  26. #214
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by eagle2 View Post
    Companies can't be sued by employees for mandating vaccines. When hospital employees sued their (former) employer for firing them because they refused to get vaccinated, their case was dismissed.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/13/h...e-lawsuit.html
    I'm not sure one precedent with one set of circumstances will be the end of the legal debate in these matters. Also, having been involved in civil suits, they ain't fun on either side. I had a senior judge say to me "judges are wrong about 25% of the time".
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  28. #215
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by miss.a.p1600 View Post
    I saw a dude snatch this girls mask off n said “what are you wearing that for? The pandemic is over!”
    Sorry I don’t mean to be a thread hog, but I’m processing the new CDC guidance. Especially living in a conservative state where the guidance won’t be well received.

    We just need to respect people’s boundaries. At this point Americans need Dr. Phil more than Dr. Fauci.

    My spiritual guru says we’re going through a mass awakening, and unfortunately pain is usually how humanity evolves is through pain.

    Working in a high risk environment for diseases it’s very concerning! I’m sure I’ll be okay, but it’s still a valid concern. I’m just trying to search inside myself for solutions instead of letting fear control me. It’s not easy! I know the risk is real, but it’s a very low risk if one is vaccinated. So I think one has to do a risk-benefit analysis and decide what the best course of action is instead of over reacting.

    Like I said before , the CDC is no longer a credible source. The nurse’s union told them not to drop the guidelines prematurely.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn...nce/index.html
    Last edited by moneybags; 07-31-2021 at 01:28 PM.
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  30. #216
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    Hmmmm. Are there people out there incapable of thinking for themselves ; reading for themselves and following the LATEST science in making important decisions such as whether or not to get vaccinated ? I'm sure there are. If Sean Hannity advocated drinking their own urine I'm sure some would try it. So what ?
    You posted this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    The latest numbers from NYC show that whites are 70% fully vaccinated. Among African Americans it is less than 40 % so it can't be blamed on "you know who " or Fox News.
    Which links it like a proof by contradiction, as if you're trying to state this: "people claim that 'you know who' supporters and Fox News watchers don't get vaccinated, but African Americans tend not to either; therefore it can't possibly be attributed to 'you know who' nor Fox News."

    But that was never the point; the latter doesn't disprove the former. Again, two members of two groups can reach the same conclusion using different reasoning influenced by different sources. So your statement of "it can't be blamed on 'you know who' or Fox News" is at the very least not applicable to both cohorts. Keep in mind you've already admitted this acknowledging that Fox News is attributed to at least some people not getting vaccinated:

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    If Sean Hannity advocated drinking their own urine I'm sure some would try it.
    "[Y]ou donít know how science works. At all" - kamiliam

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  32. #217
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Florida has highest one day covid case totals since start of pandemic. They are now the epicenter.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...t-ron-desantis

    These are the same people who were out protesting mask mandates n shutdowns now look at them.
    Last edited by miss.a.p1600; 08-01-2021 at 10:29 AM.

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  34. #218
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    Default Re: Covid news

    All these jokers had to do was stay at home or wear a mask

    Now look what they’ve caused.

    Last year, they were traipsing around maskless, shoulder to shoulder protesting mask mandates

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...dates-us-covid

    Well heaux, you won’t be mandated to wear masks anymore but you will be mandated to get vaccine to keep your job.

    Watch these jokers protest vaccine mandates (with no mask n no vaccine)

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  36. #219
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by miss.a.p1600 View Post
    Florida has highest one day covid case totals since start of pandemic. They are now the epicenter.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...t-ron-desantis

    These are the same people who were out protesting mask mandates n shutdowns now look at them.
    I saw these figures from a day or two ago:



    Florida makes up approximately 6% of the population in the US. Approximately 40% of new US cases are in Florida and 45% of new deaths, but their sociopath governor's biggest concern is making sure bars, restaurants, and other businesses aren't allowed to deny service to people who refuse to get vaccinated or wear masks.

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  38. #220
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by miss.a.p1600 View Post
    You seem particularly obsessed with Black people and their vaccination status.

    I was just curious what you’ve done to be a leader for your people (the black community) as far as outreach efforts n whatnot.

    It appears nothing.

    So you’ve answered by not answering.

    Thanks.
    Please do not use the back door and try to make this a racial thing. I posted the vaccination rates by ethnicity for one (1) reason : To try and put the lie to the notion that Fox and a certain former public official are pushing an anti-vaccination campaign. Blacks voted overwhelmingly for Biden ( 92 % ) and yet they seem to trust the government the least and have not been getting vaccinated. Fox viewers are mostly whites over 65 and yet they have gotten vaccinated the most. I am not trying to pick on Black people or blame them for anything. Given the intellectual whiplash caused by Fauci on mask usage alone it is not surprising that anyone is distrustful about what the government says about Covid , about vaccines , about wearing a mask etc.
    Last edited by Eric Stoner; 08-02-2021 at 08:05 AM.
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  39. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by eagle2 View Post
    I was referring to your statement, "The unvaccinated are actually concentrated in Blue Cities in Blue States."
    My statement was correct. If you can pause for a moment and think you might agree that unvaccinated people in areas with greater population density would have a disparate impact than people in rural areas who have not been vaccinated.
    A
    The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena... who, at the best, knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those timid souls who know neither.
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  40. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpacrkk View Post
    You posted this:



    Which links it like a proof by contradiction, as if you're trying to state this: "people claim that 'you know who' supporters and Fox News watchers don't get vaccinated, but African Americans tend not to either; therefore it can't possibly be attributed to 'you know who' nor Fox News."

    But that was never the point; the latter doesn't disprove the former. Again, two members of two groups can reach the same conclusion using different reasoning influenced by different sources. So your statement of "it can't be blamed on 'you know who' or Fox News" is at the very least not applicable to both cohorts. Keep in mind you've already admitted this acknowledging that Fox News is attributed to at least some people not getting vaccinated:
    Hmmmm. Interesting point. I will say this and then hopefully leave it alone: I think people should get vaccinated. Anyone getting their medical advice from Fox or CNN or MSNBC or any other news outlet without researching further is deliberately being partially educated.

    Eagle's link quoting Dr. Redlener was excellent because it zeros in on the crux of the problem : The science on Covid is continually changing. Decisions and guidance from the CDC and various governments are often based on outdated data. What has not changed , so far , is that if you are vaccinated you have a .003 chance of getting sick enough from Covid to have to be hospitalized. That means that 3 out of every 100,000 vaccinated people will get seriously ill.
    If you are fully vaccinated you have a .0007% chance of dying WITH Covid. That's 7 out of 1 million vaccinated people. What is not yet clear is how many of those 7 people had a co-morbidity ? How many were obese , or were getting chemotherapy or were elderly etc. etc. ?

    How helpful would it be ; how much would CDC credibility be enhanced if Fauci came out and said something to the effect that:" I know what I said then is different from what I said later which is different than what I am saying now. My recommendations changed as the data changed. " Instead we have a guy who is so full of himself that he can NEVER acknowledge error and who seems to live for the media attention he has been getting for almost two years.

    We have politicians on both sides whose sole focus seems to be their poll ratings instead of public health. And then we have the media that focuses on doom and gloom to boost ratings and readership instead of focusing on cold hard facts.

    Given all of the above (and more) it is not surprising that too many people are unsure of what to believe
    and what to do as far as getting vaccinated goes.
    Last edited by Eric Stoner; 08-02-2021 at 08:25 AM.
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    Teddy Roosevelt

  41. #223
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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by rickdugan View Post
    There you go making those silly comments yet again. Since when does one need to be either to read widely available statistics published by the CDC and draw reasonable conclusions? Do you need a toilet paper engineer to tell you how to wipe your own ass?

    And while we're saying please, please stop posting on-off articles like the situations are commonplace or widespread. At best it's disingenuous and at worst it's a sign of severe challenges in critical thinking ability. If you have something supporting a differing widespread conclusion, such as CDC data, then have at it. But a dozen extra kids hospitalized in an Arkansas hospital or a few extra beds full in a tiny ICU in a rural MO county are not exactly indicative of widespread problems.
    I think EVERYONE should stop personalizing. It detracts from an important discussion and is not necessary on any level.

    I agree with you that the data is out there and people ought to make their own informed decisions. Based on the DATA any reason not to get vaccinated has lost whatever factual support it may have had.
    A
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    Teddy Roosevelt

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    Default Re: Covid news

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    My statement was correct. If you can pause for a moment and think you might agree that unvaccinated people in areas with greater population density would have a disparate impact than people in rural areas who have not been vaccinated.
    Then why are we seeing outbreaks in red rural areas like southwest Missouri, but not in New York City?

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    Default Re: Covid news

    You missed my point. Yes, we are seeing outbreaks where too many people have not been vaccinated. I never said otherwise. I am a proponent of people getting vaccinated. Rick is the fence sitter , not me lol.

    NYC and California ( just to name two ) have also seen upticks in "cases ". As we have discussed ( past the point of the dead horse being buried ) cases means people testing positive for Covid i.e. they have active virus. Some of those people have been vaccinated. I personally know three people in that category. The key stats are hospitalizations and deaths tempered by the presence or lack of co-morbidities. Rural areas often have a lot of elderly people with preexisting conditions like obesity.

    Which do you think would have a greater impact on public health ? A Covid positive person living in a county with a population density of 100 per square mile or someone living in Brooklyn , Manhattan , San Francisco , Boston or Chicago ? Which is more likely to infect other people all other factors being equal ? That is all I was trying to say despite the efforts of a few folks on here ( NOT including you ) to try and twist my words or ascribe to me nonexistent intent.
    Last edited by Eric Stoner; 08-02-2021 at 11:33 AM.
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