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Thread: It's Going to be a LONG Cold Winter

  1. #126
    Sep 2006
    Thanked 9,175 Times in 4,137 Posts

    Default Re: It's Going to be a LONG Cold Winter

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    And what about the high sticker price for a Tesla and the cost of a home charger ? And the time element for recharging ? Even a high speed charger can take over an hour compared to a few minutes at a gas pump.

    Since we do NOT and will not have enough solar, wind or nuclear generated electricity to use in all those chargers now or in the near future there is little to no environmental benefit from switching to electric cars. Worse yet, where are the batteries made ? In China. Who dominates the markets for cobalt and rare earth minerals needed for those batteries and other essential uses ? China. So from both a practical and geo-political standpoint the electric car creates as many problems as it solves. And for what ? To please a bunch of Chicken Littles and Nervous Nellies who have been claiming that Doomsday is around the corner for the last 50 years.
    That's right. Back in the late '60's and early '70's we were told that the Earth was going into another Ice Age AND that we would run out of oil and gas within 10 to 15 years. and that air pollution from our cars would make the air in our cities unbreathable. Did any of those things happen ? No. Why ? Because we innovated and adapted and developed new sources of fossil fuels and developed things like catalytic converters and cleaner gasolines to REDUCE air pollution. The U.S. output of greenhouse gases keeps going down every year. For the umpteenth time: The U.S. and Europe are NOT the problem. It is the 3rd World : primarily China, India , Indonesia , Pakistan , Brazil , Nigeria , Ethiopia and South Africa.
    They are NOT going to accept lower living standards just to please Western environmentalists. And they have ALL made that very clear.

    As for rising ocean levels the doomsayers seem to assume that people are just going to stand around with water over their ankles, then knees , waists , shoulders and then go "Glub Glub Glub " as it rises above their heads. The reality is that people will innovate , adapt and adjust as they have been doing since our ancestors lived in caves and trees . People will move further inland and/or develop flood control technology and methods as the Dutch have. Many Asian countries have been dealing with Typhoons and Monsoons for centuries. The death rate from floods goes down every year.

    If rising ocean levels were a genuine threat then Why hasn't What's His Name sold his place in Rehoboth Beach ? Or Obama his place on Martha's Vineyard ? Or hundreds of wealthy and super rich Greenies who have oceanfront homes up and down both coasts and in the Gulf ? Many of whom have knocked down old houses to put up new and bigger houses. And they did that just so they could get flooded out ?
    Tesla vehicles cost more because they're far superior to gas powered vehicles. That is why people are willing to wait months after ordering one, to pay $50,000 for a Tesla, instead of going to a local dealership and driving off the lot the same day, with a piece of shit (compared to a Tesla) gas-powered car.

    As I've said before, your views of electric vehicles are based on where they were 10 years ago, rather than today. Tesla's batteries are currently produced in Nevada and their latest, most advanced batteries, the 4680s, will be produced in Texas. Tesla's latest batteries do not use cobalt. Tesla vehicles have more of their parts made in the US, than probably any other auto manufacturer. You don't think Ford and GM vehicles have any of their parts made in China?

    A home charger would pay for itself in less than a year. You don't even need one to recharge a Tesla. You can plug in to a regular outlet. It just takes longer to recharge. And the inconvenience of driving to a gas station to refuel your car, and pay 4 to 5 times as much as you would spend recharging a Tesla? You can conveniently recharge a Tesla at your home, overnight, without any inconvenience. You're not going to be driving your vehicle when you're sleeping, at least I hope not.

    The amount of energy coming from wind and solar in the US, is rapidly increasing from one year to the next. As more and more people buy electric vehicles, more and more energy will come from solar and wind.

    So from a practical standpoint, electric vehicles solve many problems without creating new ones. and the reason for the opposition to electric vehicles? To please a bunch of Chicken Littles and Nervous Nellies who are terrified of new technologies.

    The US IS by far the biggest problem when it comes to carbon emissions. On a per-capita basis, the US emits twice as much CO2 as China does.

    Wealthy people who express concern about global warming and buy houses near the beach, does not disprove global warming. I would much rather the US be proactive in fighting global warming, as well as reducing pollution, than just ignore the problem now, and then spend billions on infrastructure to protect our coasts from rising ocean levels. I prefer to breath clean air. I don't understand why anyone wouldn't.

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  3. #127
    God/dess Eric Stoner's Avatar
    Oct 2006
    Thanked 1,161 Times in 707 Posts

    Default Re: It's Going to be a LONG Cold Winter

    Any further response on some of your points is probably going to end up being a circular argument that generates more heat than light and ultimately leads nowhere.

    Europe has found out what happens when they overly rely on solar and wind. They end up burning coal to meet CURRENT energy needs. How many times do I have to post that I am all in favor of wind and solar. And nuclear. The REAL question is what do we do in the interim ?

    According to the numbers I have seen the Chinese and Indians are much bigger burners of coal and pollute a LOT more than the U.S. They and the rest of the 3rd World generate much more greenhouse gases than does the U.S.. Perhaps not on a per capita basis but certainly in the aggregate. And I am not sure about that. Both have populations of well over a billion people. The ingredients for Tesla batteries come , in part , from China. Spodumene concentrate from Australia is converted in CHINA to lithium hydroxide which is then shipped to Tesla's battery factory in Nevada. The replacement batteries for Teslas are all made in China. Solar panels are made primarily in China.

    No , I do not drive while asleep although I have seen several people on the road who seemed to be doing so lol.

    Concern for global warming is fine. Panic is not necessary and leads us down paths that are best not taken. Rather than trying to piss up a rope and worry so much about carbon emissions I , along with many others , think our money would be much better spent on innovation and adaptation to climate realities as compared to pie in the sky schemes that either will never happen or not be as cost effective.
    Wishing well.
    Last edited by Eric Stoner; 12-02-2021 at 12:55 PM.
    The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena... who, at the best, knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those timid souls who know neither.
    Teddy Roosevelt

  4. #128
    Veteran Member
    Jun 2011
    Thanked 289 Times in 132 Posts

    Default Re: It's Going to be a LONG Cold Winter

    Eagle you say the US emits twice the CO2 as China, but let us look at this. When you see pictures of US Cities Daily are they all covered in smog like LA, which has the toughest emmission laws on record?

    No they are not. You want to know what country they show daily with the worst air pollution in the World? India. Go back to when they showed images after their lockdowns and the people saying that they hadnt been able to see that far in decades. You want to know why, they like China use old style combustion engines which are the high pollution engines.

    Tesla is assembled in the US but guess where the lithium for those wonderful batteries come from? and who does the Mining?

    Jiangxi Ganfeng is the largest lithium metal producer in the world, while its lithium compound capacity ranks third worldwide and first in China. The firm holds lithium resources across Australia, Argentina, and Mexico and has over 4,844 employees.

    Cant have an electric car without the lithium battery.

    You want to know what disproves global warming as not being cyclical? Weather records show that we have a warming cycle every 150-200 years and then we have a cold cycle.

    Right now we are at the peak of the warming cycle, getting ready to begin the slow cooling. Want to know why noone knows about the last warming cycle other than old records and not dramatic snow pack changes and glaciers falling into the ocean and climate scientists not knowing history of their own science? No access, no internet, no satellite images, no media creating idiots and pawns out of children to cry and whine on camera.

    Now of course i know your answer will be im not a doctor or a scientist. But how about before you fall into your normal responses, you go and do actual research not using the NY Times or other Leftist sources. Try the Library of Congress or other independent research entities who have history in global weather.

  5. #129
    Veteran Member
    Jun 2011
    Thanked 289 Times in 132 Posts

    Default Re: It's Going to be a LONG Cold Winter

    found something that sums up the all electric debate


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