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Thread: Extras

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Extras

    Here we go again with the same old stuff being brought up over and over again.

    Pamela what is the hourly rate for phone sex? Thorn and others need to send us their credit card numbers and for a hourly rate we will tell them that “Yes, baby, we all sleep around.”

    I am not sure what these guys are trying to prove. So what if they have been able to purchase sexual intercourse (lest this be confused) from some strippers.

    Sounds like they are bragging about buying sex.

    And the Rich Uncles who bails out rent / car payment strapped strippers with cash for some kind words and sexual intercourse.
    A stripper who cannot pay her rent maybe should be looking for another line of work or at the very least, a cheaper place to live.

    I am personally tired of hearing from guys who buy sexual intercourse or want to know if we are selling the same.

    LE Q



  2. #27
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    Thorn, if you had read some of my older posts, you'd have seen that I'm more aware than I'd actually like to be about "my end of the pool". I have posted in the past that the actual club feature fees and in club earnings now suck, and that many are merely using their feature bookings as a 'front' for their primary income source i.e. . I refuse to do this sort of stuff, and as a result I'm directly affected in a negative way because these girls are willing to settle for lower club feature fees since the majority of their cash is coming from extra-curricular activities while the feature booking is primarily a tax write-off to cover their trip to a different city. This lowers the going rate for my own and every other girl's feature fee, and without extra-curricular activities adding to the income side of my personal equation it's usually not even worth it for me to take most feature bookings anymore.

    You're also not telling me anything I don't already know about the supposedly super-upscale club dancers, and the availability of after hours fun and games. I'm not thrilled by this, but at least there is a major distinction that they don't do it inside the clubs.

    My personal opinion is that if a girl wants to do these sort of things it's strictly a personal decision on her part, and I could care less as long as it doesn't directly affect me or other dancers who choose not to do "extras". But when girls decide to do this and as a result drive down feature fees (including mine!), or when house dancers decide to do this right in the clubs putting a severe crimp on the potential earnings of other house dancers who are not offering "extras" PLUS putting other house dancers at risk of being busted right along with the 'extras' girls. IMHO this crosses the line. On this point I totally agree with Sugar and Leigh that 'extras' i.e. "bustable offenses" from a legal standpoint, absolutely do NOT belong inside strip clubs. However, the fact is that 'extras' are indeed available inside many many strip clubs, and this leads to fact #2 that dancers in these clubs are at risk of being busted, legitimate charges or bogus charges non-withstanding.

    The poor earnings potential without "extras" in many clubs today does indeed raise a very real question whether 'marginal dancers' (i.e. girls who don't fall into the "spectacular" category) who decide not to offer "extras" and who are unable to travel to escape an "extras" dominated local club market might indeed be better off financially taking a "straight job" rather than slugging it out all night at a club to barely make tipout and gas money, and at the same time exposing herself to the risk of being busted right along with every other dancer in the club regardless of whether she was actually providing "extras" or not.

    All I can say is that the 'glamour' and 'show business" aspects of exotic dancing which were prevalent when I first got involved with dancing have all but disappeared over the last 10-15 years. I count my blessings that I have made my 'retirement' money on the club circuit already, that I have an internet presence which provides me more income than today's clubs ever could WITHOUT having to deal with the issue of 'extras', and that I have a college degree and a Respiratory Therapist's license such that I can walk away from exotic dancing any time I decide that I'm finally fed up with it.

    The primary reason that I spend time posting on this board is to try and alert new dancers to the realities of today's exotic dancing business, and to possibly spare them some of the grief that myself and other dancers who post here have learned about the hard way.

    As much as the entire issue of "extras" in clubs bugs me (it personally cost me nearly 10 grand to appeal a bogus prostitution charge because other dancers in the club were offering "extras" and got all of us busted as a result!), and as much as many of us are sick of talking about it, unfortunately it is probably the #1 issue that Michael the dancer who made the original post and 80% of real world dancers face today. But as several of you have already pointed out, the girls that post on this board fall mainly in the "other" 20% of real world dancers, who see the issue of 'extras' primarily as a matter of moral principle or of professionalism, rather than as a matter of feeding kids and paying rent or not.

    My own definition of "extras" i.e. a "bustable offense" is also changing for the worse. Here's the latest from the great state of California - . You don't have to be offering HJ's BJ's or the whole enchalada to bring down a wall to wall prostitution club bust anymore, either!

  3. #28
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    I am telling you i am not an "extra" girl. And in our club it refers to illegal activity. Simple when i get right to the point.
    You seem to have your doubts. And is it out of the norm for some dancers to just do the job they were hired to do, with no "hanky panky" ???
    I have made my point, enough said.
    Damn spelling again....but i am cleaning in between postings... KISSES TO YOU LEIGH
    Pamela, you don't seem to be understanding what I am saying.

    The issue isn't that MANY dancers aren't doing it totally straight. No extras. If you have read my posts I state that I make the average to be 1:10 [one in ten] doing some form of extreme extra. That means nine aren't.

    You are one of the nine.

    What I *am* getting at is this:

    Many dancers like to simply turn a blind eye and deny that one in ten. They deny that any extras are taking place in the clubs where they work. I am here to tell you that if you work in a strip-club, any strip-club, there is a very good chance that someone there is giving extras.

    Now, the reason it is important to know that is that it changes the enviorment and the look and feel of the playing field and that is something you have to deal with as a dancer who doesn't give extras.

    You don't like it because it raises a bar that places extra demands on you, but you can't hate it because the thought that someone might be providing extras brings in the guys with the big wallets looking to find that someone. [I am sorry, but it is the "bad girls" that drive the market place... its simply how the business end of this is working currently... its not right, or wrong, it just is].

    I am suggesting that acknowledging this and accepting the situation for what it is gives you a level of power, and control, you don't get to have if you bury your head in the sand on the matter.

    That's all.


    Those that don't take shouldn't be taken.

    To those special folk who realize all we are doing is throwing ideas about and who know the difference between opinion and Id, I appreciate reading your thoughts [and respect them whether I agreed with you or not].

    To less open minded folk who feel the need to silence those in opposition to their view of the world I suggest to you that you just might be your own worst enemies.

    Karma to the people!

  4. #29
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    You have come thru again for us Pamela, and I again tell you I adore you for standing up - there ARE those of us who DO NOT engage in the prostitution side of our industry...

    If Thorn and others like him decide we are liars, because of all the endless contact with the aforementioned hookers in our industry THIS IS EXACTLY why those of us who are clean dancers are royally PISSED about!
    Leigh, you really need to reread my posts.

    I am NOT saying anything different then most of what you just said in this post of yours quoted above. And I am not calling ANY of you liars. I do believe that some of you deceive yourselves yourselves as to the nature of what your industry is turning into.

    Most of you, any time the issue is brought up, simply say , "well I don't do any of that". Well, probably YOU don't. However that doesn't address the issue about what is going on and how the business is changing.

    Frankly, the only dancer present that seems to be candid about the issue is Melonie. I have read her post on the topic and she can see where this business is heading. [Wait, there was one other and I should give her credit, but I forgot her board name... sorry.]

    All I am saying is that it is my opinion, based on solid first hand observation, that at least 1:10 dancers is engaging in acts of prostitution [extras] and that is in the high end, "gentleman's clubs". That, and the notion that it isn't getting less pervasive, but more so.

    You are right about one thing. After Pryce [whose board this is actually] it is your board. The dancers. And I am simply suggesting that this is something you folks ought to talk about candidly.

    The nature of your business is changing. Drastically. It is changing very fast. If you don't acknowledge it, learn about it, and thus learn how to impact it in some way, you are going to find that instead of controling it, it will control you.

    That is simply the way life works.

    Anyway... I hope my point has been made clearer.
    Those that don't take shouldn't be taken.

    To those special folk who realize all we are doing is throwing ideas about and who know the difference between opinion and Id, I appreciate reading your thoughts [and respect them whether I agreed with you or not].

    To less open minded folk who feel the need to silence those in opposition to their view of the world I suggest to you that you just might be your own worst enemies.

    Karma to the people!

  5. #30
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    Thorn, if you had read some of my older posts, you'd have seen that I'm more aware than I'd actually like to be about "my end of the pool". I have posted in the past that the actual club feature fees and in club earnings now suck, and that many are merely using their feature bookings as a 'front' for their primary income source i.e. http://www.bodymiracle.com . I refuse to do this sort of stuff, and as a result I'm directly affected in a negative way because these girls are willing to settle for lower club feature fees since the majority of their cash is coming from extra-curricular activities while the feature booking is primarily a tax write-off to cover their trip to a different city. This lowers the going rate for my own and every other girl's feature fee, and without extra-curricular activities adding to the income side of my personal equation it's usually not even worth it for me to take most feature bookings anymore.
    You are correct, I didn't give you proper credit for having open eyes, ears, and mind. I have corrected that.

    I don't wish to comment of it a either a bad thing or a good thing. Just that it should be acknowledged as A THING WHICH IS DECIDELY TAKING PLACE.

    You see, while I am decidely male and will, on occassion, "date" an extraordinarly dancer who has tickled my fancy and provides a level of service unlike nine out of the other ten dancers at any give club, it doesn't mean I don't recognize the rights of the worker to have some say in the nature of their work enviorment.

    I think dancers either are just taking it, when they don't have to, or are benefiting from it. Benifiting from it, while not providing extras yourself, isn't a problem BTW. Its part of the enviorment. Know it, use it; work it for maximum profit making ability. The key to it is in the understanding of exactly what is going on within the clubs you are working at.

    Hell, one way to see it is to know the dancers who provide extras, know that a certain segment of the cliental are trying to sniff them out, find that guy and work him up [getting a healthy slice of change in the process] then point him to the dancer in question to finish what you started. I am NOT saying dancers should do this.. it is one way to work the situation to your advantage by having the requisite knowledge to which I refer.

    For the good, or the bad, of it; strip-clubs are going to split in the near future and head down two roads. High end "Hostess" type places [and there will STILL be women in these who use it as a front to provide extras on the side] and clubs that are simply "hootchie" places.

    The middle ground, as we have both pointed out, is receding quickly.

    To maximize what time there is left of stripping as we know it today, I simply suggest that the dancers ought to know the nature of their business better.

    Is that so bad?
    Those that don't take shouldn't be taken.

    To those special folk who realize all we are doing is throwing ideas about and who know the difference between opinion and Id, I appreciate reading your thoughts [and respect them whether I agreed with you or not].

    To less open minded folk who feel the need to silence those in opposition to their view of the world I suggest to you that you just might be your own worst enemies.

    Karma to the people!

  6. #31
    Pamela
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    Default Re: Extras

    After i wrote my messages to Thorn, i took them down. Is easier to ignore. You Thorn....Not my club. Give it up.
    Pamela

  7. #32
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    Thorn and others need to send us their credit card numbers and for a hourly rate we will tell them that “Yes, baby, we all sleep around.”

    I am not sure what these guys are trying to prove. So what if they have been able to purchase sexual intercourse (lest this be confused) from some strippers.
    Q, I have no purient issues involved in this dialog. And I don't part with my credit card digets. I am strictly cash and carry. [sorry, couldn't resist]

    I am NOT< NOT > NOT [does any one here know what ONE IN TEN MEANS???] saying all of you sleep around. I am suggesting that about 10% of you sell sexual acts for money [albeit a subjective observation as opposed to scientific fact].

    I am not trying to prove anything. I *AM* suggesting that you can't control an enviorment you don't understand and I gather [more and more from my readings here] that many dancers don't understand the enviorment they work in.

    [sigh]
    Those that don't take shouldn't be taken.

    To those special folk who realize all we are doing is throwing ideas about and who know the difference between opinion and Id, I appreciate reading your thoughts [and respect them whether I agreed with you or not].

    To less open minded folk who feel the need to silence those in opposition to their view of the world I suggest to you that you just might be your own worst enemies.

    Karma to the people!

  8. #33
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    After i wrote my messages to Thorn, i took them down. Is easier to ignore.
    Pamela
    BINGO.

    My point EXACTLY.

    The majority of you do exactly that... turn a blind eye and ignore.

    Thank you for making my case so elegantly.


    Those that don't take shouldn't be taken.

    To those special folk who realize all we are doing is throwing ideas about and who know the difference between opinion and Id, I appreciate reading your thoughts [and respect them whether I agreed with you or not].

    To less open minded folk who feel the need to silence those in opposition to their view of the world I suggest to you that you just might be your own worst enemies.

    Karma to the people!

  9. #34
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    All I am saying is that, eventually, ignoring it is going to come back and bite you on the fanny.

    It would be a shame if that happened, when you have the power to effect it to a large degree.
    Those that don't take shouldn't be taken.

    To those special folk who realize all we are doing is throwing ideas about and who know the difference between opinion and Id, I appreciate reading your thoughts [and respect them whether I agreed with you or not].

    To less open minded folk who feel the need to silence those in opposition to their view of the world I suggest to you that you just might be your own worst enemies.

    Karma to the people!

  10. #35
    Senior Member Thorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    Melonie, would you talk to them please.

    It seems that the fact that I have a "XY" chromosome set is effecting some of the "XX" chromosonal hearing around here.

    Some of their number would imply that because a male tries to raise a topic involving sex that the only thing that must be happening is he is looking for mastabatory material.

    And they say they don't like it when "dancer clichies" get dumped on them. Do they understand how it comes off as total hypocrisy when they turn around and drop "customer cliches" on men?

    Look, Ladies, I am an amature sociologist and philosopher. I'm not in a strip-club right now and neither are any of you. I leave the fantasy at the threshold of the door when I walk out of the place.

    My interest in this is purely practical. I can't ignore what I see and I have been observing this phenomenon unfold, off and on, for about 25 years.

    I see this from the perspective of someone with disposible income that meets the threshold of what is required to grease the wheels. I see the chemistry involved. I take note of the nature of the business and who is doing what, to whom, and where... what I want to figure out is WHY. You see, it is the learning of the "why of it" that is so interesting and what has me chatting with you here.

    From my end I wonder at the nature of it all. How money effects people. How sex effects people. And how money and sex together can drive an entire industry. How a business where 90% of those employed in it would appear to want it to go one way, but a 10% minority appears to be driving the business model in the opposite direction. Surely this could only happen if either the market demands it, or the other 90% have their heads in the ground [or, quite likily, some combination of both].

    Either way, it makes for a very curious study in human dynamics. Frankly, I think it is much more interesting then the actual sex that goes on.

    I hope that clears it up a little. [jeeze]
    Those that don't take shouldn't be taken.

    To those special folk who realize all we are doing is throwing ideas about and who know the difference between opinion and Id, I appreciate reading your thoughts [and respect them whether I agreed with you or not].

    To less open minded folk who feel the need to silence those in opposition to their view of the world I suggest to you that you just might be your own worst enemies.

    Karma to the people!

  11. #36
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    Default Re: Extras

    Thorn, I know we are all entitled to our opinions on here, but you have to keep in mind, this topic has been beaten to death, your posts are entirely too long (I get bored reading them after the first paragraph), and the most important aspect, if you can tell, most of these dancers could care less what you are saying, so why keep arguing and beating a dead horse? And I have a question for you, why do you even care about this topic so much as it is not affecting your life, or is it??

  12. #37
    Featured Member LEIGH_LANDON's Avatar
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    Default Re: Extras

    WELL NOW, MONEY YOU GOT IT RIGHT ON THE MONEY!

    We all couldnt have said it better ourselves. Wait - we have, over and over and over and over!
    HAHHAHAHA!

    Thanks, Money.
    LIVE LONG & PROSPER!
    Leigh Landon

    Never explain yourself to anyone, because the person who likes you doesn't need it and the person that dislikes you won't believe it.

  13. #38
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    Default Re: Extras

    Uh, Thorn, I hardly think you're getting anywhere by posting SOOO many times on this issue. It really looks like you're just trying to start some sh*t on this board and stir up unneeded trouble. You can sit all day and argue to death every single point someone brings up, but it's never going to accomplish anything. Give it a rest please.

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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