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Thread: I need help

  1. #1
    Member suzielightning's Avatar
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    Default I need help

    I'm sorry, I know most of this has been covered elswhere on the site, but I have some questions.

    I've only been dancing a week, and I'm not making money (for those of you who read my other posts, I decided not to switch clubs afterall). I'm getting some dances, mostly from guys curious about the new girl. I know the immediate response is "keep going", but I'm not even making back my house fee, and I don't know how long I can keep going. (house is $100, plus $5 tip to the bartender, and $36 when I can't get the guys to buy me drinks)

    So there's my background, here are my questions:

    Should I tell guys I'm new, or will I do better if I don't?

    I work dayshift, and most of the guys are regulars. Is there hope? (I can work the night shift, but it would be difficult for me.)

    What do I say? I know I have to talk for a while, and I do well with that, but when it comes time to ask for a dance, most of the lines I've read on here won't work in my club. "Can I dance for you now before it gets busy?" It doesn't get busy on my shift. "Let's go back to the VIP room, so we can have more privacy" Well, you're the only guy here, so this is as private as that. Arg!

    What can I say to keep a conversation going with someone who answers with one syllable? So far I have "have you been in here before? Are you from around here? what do you do? and what do you do for fun?" But sometimes we get through those in 15 seconds, and I know its too early to ask for a dance, but I will because I can't think of anything else to say.

    I think I do a decent stage show, though I need to work in a few more moves, but my lapdances are lacking. I try to watch the other girls, but they give me dirty looks when I'm too obvious watching them lapdance. any tips?

    I'm sorry there's so much here.Our club is pretty slow right now, and most of the income is generated by regulars. I haven't had much luck generating repeat dances, and I'm scared to death the "new girl" appeal will wear off and I won't have any regulars.

    I enjoy the work, but I need to make some money doing it. I'm going to be really sad if I go through my savings and have to quit because I can't afford house anymore.

    Thank you so much for listening.
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    God/dess velvet's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    first off where are you? 100 payout is ALOT . specially if you are new. is there any other options in your town? even if it is a club that you consider second tier you may be better off starting there. you need to get seasoned. if it is the only game in town by all means milk the new girl thing. 1) they like "new meat" 2) they will think that they can do more with you (even tho they cant) if you are new and inexperianced. play it up... let us know what the conditions are in your area. sometimes a girl not knowing any better will go to the club with a high profile that takes advantage of newbies.
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    Default Re: I need help

    Number one, your house fee is toooo high. I don't know if that is the going rate where you live. Days usually have more regulars than nights with the exception of Fridays.

    Your club is slow and you are working on a shift with not many customers to work on the floor. The few customers in the club are regulars and those types of guys usually come in to see "their" girl. it's hard to get those kinds of guy to try someone new.

    You would be better off working at night. There are some clubs with good happy hour shifts. It depends if your club has scheduling or not. I would recommend IF possible working 4-closing at your club that way you can key in on the after work crowd and the 9-closing crowd which will attract more guys who are more open to a new face.

    Keep your eyes open for other clubs too. if you don't mind posting where you work, someone on this board might be able to steer you towards a better opportunity.

    You can make a decent living dancing but many times that requires moving around until you can find a city and several clubs there which "fit" you. if you have children or are in a committed relationship I know that would not be possible. If you aren't you will find in a fairly short period of time if you work at it places to work where you will be in th black at the end of your shift instead of in the red.

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    I agree completely about "day shifts". Regulars contribute at least 50% of dancer earnings on the day shift because there are so few "walk-in" customers between 9 and 5. As a new girl you don't have regulars, and it will probably take several months to build up a base. By this logic you should earn nearly twice as much on the night shift, where regulars are a much lower contributing factor.

    Another issue on "day shift" is mileage. Given that there are fewer customers during the day, and less club security, and (no offense) many day shift dancers are older or are moms such that the "quality of goods" is usually not as high as during night shift, a standard technique for making money on day shift is offering high mileage. If other girls are doing it, if day shift customers expect it, and if you are not offering the same, you're likely to find guys buying one dance from you and moving on once they discover that you're not "delivering".

    It's just an inescapable fact these days that in areas of the country which have been hit hard by the economy, and where competition between dancers is intense, that some girls are not going to be able to make a decent living dancing anymore particularly if they don't offer high mileage. It's way too early for you to draw this conclusion, but you need to realistically assess what's really going on with the dancing business in your area and make some changes so that you're working under the most favorable circumstances. This definitely means trying the night shift at your present club. This also means researching every other club in your area to find out if any of them are better suited to your attributes and mileage level.

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    God/dess Bridgette's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    Agreed. I think $100 house fee is waaaayyy too high for a day shift, especially if the club is that slow. Day shift in any club is more of a regulars scene, and generally much higher mileage than at night. Night customers are much more open to new girls, and even seek them out very often. Plus, night customers are more focused on girls' looks rather than 'abilities', and with more customers, there's more opportunity to hustle if they're not buying more than one dance from you. You should try the night shift if you can, and don't rule out other clubs. There may be another club in your area where business is better. Sometimes we have to try several clubs before we find one that fits our style.

    Also, you say your lapdances are lacking. I know you're too new to have much of a groove down, but that will come with time. (Night customers also tend to be more tolerant of newbies' lack of skills if they like the girl.) Maybe you could practice a little at home with a friend or in the mirror. It never hurts to just practice moving around when you're not feeling pressured to perform.

    Your conversation skills will also come. I get the feeling from your post that you may be a bit stiff in your conversation from the pressure of needing to make that fat house fee with such few customers. Try to relax - not get drunk - and let the guys talk a little. You don't have to always be talking. Smiles, winks, friendly gestures like a squeeze on the knee work wonders without words. Again, night customers tend to be more tolerant when you're obviously new and inexperienced.

    What area are you in? What club? I'm sure someone here can give you more specific advice if you let us know where you are.

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  6. #6
    Pamela
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    Default Re: I need help

    Theres hope, if the other girls are doing it, why can't you! (hell yea) If no one was making a buck, that would be different. But you say you see others giving laps and working. Don't make it so obvious you are watching another girl. (I don't dance days, so i would think it is slower, everyones working.) If nights won't work for you, then stick out your days. You ARE paying out too much. Speak about that, perhaps. But you are new, and you have to climb the ladder. And being the new menu choice has it's benefits! Stick with it a little longer, if you still are not happy and no improvement, move on if you like. But you have to hustle!!! Screw the other girls. They are nothing more than competetion. Thats why you get dirty looks, jealousy! Maybe just improve a bit on your hustling skills, walk around the room like you are the only one there! Go get the guys!!!! Start sweet talking, flirt, look happy, and SMILE ...alot.
    If they are doing it, so can you. It's not like it's a club with no one there.
    Tough starting out, you will get there. Pamela

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    Default Re: I need help

    From Suzie's other post, she's in Seattle - and I think the fat house fee is normal there - yuck.

    Suzie, I would tell you to move! I know that's not an option, what can you do? As far as chatting with the customers, think about what you would talk about with a cute guy in a bar - ask questions, be interested, etc. Don't think of it as a conversation that has to make you money - the guys will pick up on this and you will feel stressed. Instead, try to flirt and make him feel comfortable. Draw on your acting skills.

    Lapdances you pretty much have to practice - you're right about watching the other girls, I guess maybe try to do it surreptitiously. My one piece of advice for new dancers is to move slowly - nerves can make you move really quickly instead of sexily. Think about how the guy you're dancing for really wants a good look at you, so you should move slowly enough so that he gets a chance to look at every inch of your lovely self.

    To ask for a dance, you can just say, "I think I'm ready to take off my clothes right now," or something to that effect. I think there's some other posts on get a dance lines on the board somewhere.

    And you should go to nights if the days are that slow - go where the money is. I am switching to a day shift right now because of school schedules, but if I can't make the money, I'm going to switch right back.

    I wish you got to start dancing in a city that was more fun and profitable! Hopefully you'll get to work somewhere more fun soon.

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    Member suzielightning's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    Thanks you guys. The encouragement really helps. Colette is right, I'm in Seattle, groan! I'll be moving to Portland in a few years, which will be great, but for now this is my only option.

    For those who haven't read my club posts, I'm working at the Sand's plaza. My other options in town are the Lusty Lady, Rick's (high high mileage), and a bunch of deja vu places.

    We have the six-feet from the stage rule, and the no alcohol rule. Also, we have to keep our clothes on when we're off stage.

    Ok, here's a question for you all:
    I was chatting with a guy who said he'd been coming into the club for about ten years. (!) I asked him if I could dance for him, and he agreed, but as I started, he asked how much I charge. This is on the main floor, not the VIP room. Can I assume the other girls are setting their own prices? Should I try? THere's only one girls I really trust enough to ask that and know she'll give me a straight answer, and I won't offend her or piss her off. What do you guys think?
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    God/dess Bridgette's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    That guy was most likely a haggler. He's been going to the club for a long time and fancies himself having alot of importance there, so he likes to try to haggle girls down on the price of a dance. He also knows many girls will charge less than the standard rate in daytime when it's slow, so he's probably used to getting lower-priced dances.

    He could also just be cautious - maybe he's had some girls try to overcharge him for dances, and he's being careful not to have the same thing happen again. If it's as slow as it sounds, some girls will resort to tactics like that to keep their profits up. I always stick to the set dance price at the club I'm in, and let the guys know that they can also tip if they like. That way they get reminded that tips are appreciated, they don't feel like I'm trying to hustle them (I'm not), and they also get the hint that I don't do discounts.

    I've never been to Seattle, but I've heard about Ricks - REALLY high mileage. It's apparently also very busy, but you'll have to put up with alot of crap there for the $$. Lusty Lady is now unionized, and the girls get paid by the hour, so unless you want to deal with that kind of limitation and bureaucracy, I wouldn't bother.

    I still recommend you try nights, maybe see if you can work an early night shift, or leave early at a set time if you have other commitments. Many clubs will work with you on shifts to some extent if they know you are in school or have another job.

    You might want to one of the Deja Vu clubs a try also. They may have more profit potential for you as a newbie. I've never worked for one of them, and I've heard they have some annoying policies, but if the business is better, it may be in your interest to deal with ithem.

    Good lick!

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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    Default Re: I need help

    I've read more than a few posts on here about how to sell guys on dances and there seems to be some good advice. For me, it's all about the personality, don't come up and ask "do you want a dance?". Spend a couple of minutes on me and convince me that you might actually care what I have to say, or that you feel for the fact that I had a bad day, etc, etc. It seems a lot of the time a girl will come and ask a few canned questions and completely ignore the answer.

    A smile and eye contact is a big thing for me too (get's me every time).

    Side note. I never realized that the dancers were responsible for selling a certain number of drinks. Is this something that is common? That is some serious BS if you ask me. Some places charge $10 dollars or more for those dancer drinks! I have never bought one because I would rather give the dancers my money than the club.

  11. #11
    Pamela
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    Default Re: I need help

    Yes T-Town, a man can have as many drinks as he wants. And me as a dancer can ask if he would like another. In the club i work drinking and women seem to go together. Our drinks from the bottle are $5. And fountain are $8. (the more expensive club.) But yes we can push for drinks. At least in the clubs i have worked. I don't wan't (number 1) the guy having to squeeze his way through others to only wait for a drink. The waitress may not make her rounds in time (any one of them.) And i don't want to run the risk of another dancer seeing him alone waiting for a drink. And i have been known to buy a regular a drink. Pamela~

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    Default Re: I need help

    Pamela,

    Are you working somewhere where they serve real drinks or just pop? Here in Washington it is non-alcoholic drinks only. In some clubs the pop refills are $5 for about what ends up being 4 ounces of fountain pop in a tall skinny glass of ice. Needless to say, there is not usually a big crowd at the bar jockeying for position to get their hands on another drink. What I was referring to was the pressure from the dancers to buy them a drink. Dancer drinks are sometimes $10 or more. It is a regular occurrence here and I knew that they were under pressure from management to sell them, but I had no idea that they were actually fining the dancers for not doing so. While I have no problem buying a drink for a dancer and spending a few minutes talking to her while she finishes it, I was under the impression that the dancer would rather have me spend that money on dances.

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    Member Bella's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    I think you made a good choice not switching clubs!

    That said, night shift would be your best option. That sucks that it would be hard.

    $100 a night is normal here, the cheapest house fee at the slowest club is about $70.

    AT your club, I have been told that the night shift can be pretty lucrative.

    I guess I don't have any real advice...but just wishing you luck, and all the best!

    Bella

  14. #14
    Pamela
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    Default Re: I need help

    Hi T-Town,
    I work 3 different clubs at various times and hours. The club i was speaking of we sell alcohol, if you don't want a drink, have a sprite, since they sell mixed as well, not just beer.. i have at time felt like i was putting some pressure on a few guys, but i have slowed down. More time and drinks a guy spends with me the more dances i get to perform for him. The other club is alcohol served too, and i either am going to have to quit or start doing laps with them. Which i HATE lapdances. But we will see. Off topic...sorry.
    Anyway i am in Florida. But that is my point, i also put this under hustling i believe. The more drinks a guy buys (usually.) he seems more apt to buy more dances as well. He becomes uninhibited. And that is a pretty good sell. i only ask, and he always has the option to say no thank you. And i get that too. And no, we do not get fined if we don't sell drinks to customers. This is my way of getting more stage dances, and regulars. I don't drain them, because i want them to come back. I just want them to losen up some for me, and feel real comfortable. Also i don't drink alcohol, so i make it a point to get the drinks, mine looks like a drink, but it's only sprite in a frosted glass, or red plastic cup. Pamela

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    Featured Member Devastating Divyne's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    I worked in Nashville and we had 2 sell that ladies drinks crap.. Customer drinks were like $2 and our drinks were like$8. Payout was only$25, but u had 2 sell like ten drinks, djs had to get $15 and so on and so on. If u did not sell the drinks u had 2 pay for them. So actually payout was $135 and they took money out of evry dance. Ladies drinks suck. Oh, and in case u can't tell I hate Nashville and their whole money per dance, on schedule certain days freaking system. If u make $600 in a night u have actually paid the club $200 givin 10 bucks outta evry 30 dance and u leave with $400. Oh, and u still have to take care of that $135 payout.
    "Come what may although I often say realities come from dreams, but approach all lies with open eyes because NOthing in this world is EVER ALL it seems."

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    Default Re: I need help

    Again I don't want to come across as pessimistic, but Seattle is pretty close to the top of the list of cities that have been hit very hard by the economic downturn - Boeing moving out, hundreds of dot bombs, getting caught in the draft of California's natural gas and electricity cost increases etc. It's just an inescapable economic fact that lots fewer customers are now bringing lots fewer dollars into clubs. And if other hard hit cities are any example, the "clean" clubs suffer the most since they catered to upscale businessmen and their clients who are now scarce. On the other hand, the very high mileage clubs suffer the least since some guys will always be able to come up with the money for "up close and personal" attention.

    If the club you are working at is getting away with charging a $100 stage fee, it can only be because SOME of the girls in that club are earning decent bucks (because of long time regulars or by whatever means ?). The other possibility is that many of the girls in that club, like you, are winding up with very poor earnings BUT there are enough dancers looking for jobs in Seattle that when one of you quits the clubowner knows he can hire another new girl and collect a $100 stage fee from her for a few weeks until she also figures out that the club is hopeless. The fact that you're not earning money in this Seattle club may in fact have nothing to do with you, your dancing skills, your approach etc. It may have everything to do with the fact that there's very little money to be earned in Seattle clubs and that the experienced dancers are depending on their regular customers for the majority of income they are still earning. Under these conditions, a new girl who is without regular customers and who can't afford to stick around earning peanuts long enough to cultivate her own regular customers is screwed.

    If you seriously need dancing income, and you're "stuck in Seattle", I'd definitely give some heavy brainstorming to whether or not you're up for higher mileage at the Deja Vu's or at Ricks. The economy is going to get worse before it gets better. If you can handle the mileage, go for it now before established dancers in other clubs see their earnings dry up to the point where they're also heading to Deja Vu or Ricks to make ends meet a few months from now. If you're not up for it, you might be better off establishing yourself in a "straight job". Again, you haven't been at your club long enough yet to really find out the possibilities. I'd say give it a couple of weeks and find out the earnings potential on the night shift. But if the potential turns out not to be there, you're better off facing the reality of the situation quickly rather than continuing to take your clothes off for less take home money than you could be earning at the local shopping mall!

    I know that many girls here feel that a $100 stage fee is way too high (so do I), and that dealing with high mileage isn't something they need to do (neither do I - willingly), but in all fairness these girls do not have to live and work in Seattle, or Houston, or many other cities which have been hard hit by the bad economy. If you can't "vote with your feet" to find better opportunities elsewhere (as I do), you're stuck dealing with the reality of the Seattle club scene. If this boils down to high mileage high income versus low mileage low income you need to make your own decision. At least Seattle has not yet fallen to high mileage low income versus low mileage no income like Houston.

    PS in regard to drink quotas I have worked at several clubs (mostly in the Midwest) that have this stupid drink quota system. It typically works like this - the dancer is responsible for buying 3 or 4 or 5 drinks during a shift, and she can either get customers to buy them for her for say $7 (resulting in a $2 kickback to the dancer per drink bought) or she winds up paying $5 for them herself. In alcohol clubs the customers are adamant that the dancer is actually drinking alcohol in the drink he bought her (although they don't know the difference between a 1/2 shot and a double!). I damn near ruined my kidneys during a 6 week stint in Indiana and Michigan a few years ago because every night I was forced to down 5 or more mixed drinks with customers or have lots of trouble selling dances/limos/lounge to guys who were drinking (virtually all of them!) and who expected his favorite dancer to be drinking with him.

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    Member suzielightning's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    You're right Melonie, thanks. Perhaps you are pessimistic, but I think you're also very accurate. The girls who are still banking at my club have regulars - and spend a lot of time getting money out of them.

    I get to work a couple night shifts this week, so hopefully that will up my earnings a bit. If not, I may pack it up until I relocate to Portland, which I hear is a better place to work.

    The drink situation at my club, for the record, is each dancer has to get 6 drinks a night. $9 each. If you don't make all six, you have to pay them back, $6 per drink. If you make more than six, you get $3 off each additional one. Personally, I feel like most guys will only buy one thing from me, so I'm much more inclined to push them for a dance, and pay for my own drinks. But with the $100 house, it really adds up.

    Thanks for your help. It's nice to know I'm not alone in this.

    I'd like to ask, if I may, how did it go in the beginning for all of you? Part of me feels like I've prepared so long, I should be good at it right off. Did you worry in the beginning? What did you do to get past it?

    Thanks!
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    Default Re: I need help

    It certainly took me a while to make real money - when I first started I was perfectly happy to make $100 a shift and it took me about 9 months before I was consistently doubling that and better. Obviously your earning goes up as your experience does, just like with any other job. I can say that I have done better each year as far as improving my average nightly earnings.

    Now, I was kind of a slow learner and I've seen plenty of new girls raking it in after a month of learning - but everyone's learning curve is different. You just have to give yourself time - hard to do with the pressure of a $100 house fee, I know.

    Some of the things I would have not done - sat too long with customers, worn silly outfits, been too honest. That's ok, now I know better! Wish I'd had the benefit of SW then, though.

    Here's the upshot to your situation: if you can learn how to make money in Seattle, think how great you'll do in any other city! You will be unstoppable.

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    Member Bella's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    I think that Melonie makes some good points.

    There are girls making money here....even in some slow clubs. I worked at a club that was not very busy....I waitressed not danced...and most girls were still leaving with cash. It's just hard.

    See how the night shift goes Suzie. If you are feeling a bit more comfortable with the hustleing, and think you can brave the mileage....perhaps try Ricks. It is a crazy place, but it is hard NOT to make money there. As I said, my friend works there...is extremely clean (she freaks out on teh girls doing nasty shit), and makes $500 average, and only works 4 to 5 hrs a night. Granted, she has regulars...but she has always made cash.

    BUT, you will have to put up with a LOT.

    Let us know how you are doing!

    Bella

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    Default Re: I need help

    I think I might be able to deal with Rick's, you know? I worry that you can't be clean there and make money, but if your friend can. . . I had a guy unzip his pants and bring the tip of his thing out in the VIP room yesterday. I didn't notice right away, and when I did, I decided not to freak out unless he tried to touch me with it or put it in full view. I was on stage next, so I was able to make an exit without embarrasing either of us. I was really angry with him, I can't explain exactly why, but I gave perhaps my best stage show yet, beause I had all this angry energy, and it overshadowed my shyness. That felt really good.

    I can deal with stuff going on around me, I think. As long as I'm not pressured to partake.

    What about the Deja vu up on Lake city? I heard that they're not as slow as the Downtown one, and cleaner than Rick's. Bella, where do you work? Just curious. Send me a message if you don't want to post it.

    Thanks for your help.
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    Member Bella's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    Hey Suzie,
    You seem to have a really good head on your shoulders...you can probably deal with a lot.

    Ive actually heard good things about the Vu in Lake City....much better than downtown.

    I am not working now...due to having my little girl, and college....and beinga single mom....I've been taking some time to get into shape. I h ave worked at the Vu downtown, Sands years ago (short time), and waitressed in a few clubs along the way.

    I have been curious as to your experience with sands..as I was considering it...but mayb enot! lol

    My friend is making money. She has regulars, but it is SO busy there, that it is hard not to. The stage fee is still high...$150.....but it gets so busy it is standing room.

    You just have to hustle hard because there are tons of girls and it is cuttroat. I'm not sure of your look, but I think you can do it. Just know that a lot may be expected, and that the place...as in couches, floor, etc..are VERY dirty....meaning...don't touch anything if you have to.....and the managers do look the other way.

    BUT, if you need the money, and the other place isn't working.....you can try it, see how you do and whether or not you can handle the contact. The lap dances will be high contact, friction.

    Have you worked night sh ift yet at Sands?

    Bella

  22. #22
    Member suzielightning's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    I just got home from my night shift. I made money. Not gobs of money, but a great shift for me! It was really slow for several hours, and then we just started partying. I feel great. I had a good time, and I've got money ing my pocket. So this is what it feels like!

    I was right on tonight. I felt good. I had a cute new outfit, and practiced some new stage stuff before the guys got there, so my stage show was good all night, and it made for great advertising.

    The manager decided to put me on all night shifts, which is cool by me. The best part, she put me on the days when girls bail on her, because she needs her "good girls", and she appreciates my patience. I try to be an upbeat person, so I'm easy to deal with. I was really flattered.

    So my mind is going a mile a minute, and I need to go to bed. Thanks you all so much for your support. I love you guys!!
    Damn you
    Damn the broccoli
    And damn the Wright Brothers!
    -Stewie

    Any book is a children's book if the kid can read.
    -Mitch Hedberg

  23. #23
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    Default Re: I need help

    Yay, Suzie! I'm so glad to hear that you had a good shift. It certainly beats the hell out of a slow one. Sounds like you relaxed.

    about the guy flashing you: don't be afraid to tell him that you won't put up with that nonsense. You don't need to make a scene to get your point across, just very seriously look at him and say, "Zip it. Now. Or I'm going to yell, 'That looks like a penis, only smaller.'"

  24. #24
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: I need help

    Suzie, I'm so glad to hear that the night shift is offering better opportunities. But being the pessimist that I am, I feel I should perhaps alert you before you find out about a possible manager's scam which may be headed in your direction. There is usually a good reason that many night shift girls "bail" on certain nights of the week - i.e. these nights are SLOW! It's true that the night shift manager gets in trouble on these nights if they happen to turn out to be busy and there aren't enough girls in the club for the amount of actual customers (which also means that the girls that are there can bank!). But it's also true that some managers will take advantage of naive girls and force them to work only on the nights where earnings suck, while not letting them dance on nights when it's sure to be busy such that the more experienced girls who "bailed" on the slow nights can come in and bank effortlessly without the competition. If it were me, I'd remind your manager that while as a newcomer you don't mind helping out on slow nights but that in fairness you should also get a crack at one busy night at least since you also have bills to pay!

  25. #25
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    Default Re: I need help

    I had a guy unzip his pants and bring the tip of his thing out in the VIP room yesterday.

    Two words come to mind when I read this.

    LOSER and PIG!!

    Please do not put up with crap like that. Expose these people for what they are.

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