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Thread: Pass on the extras????

  1. #1
    Senior Member ambilyn's Avatar
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    Default Pass on the extras????

    Last night I had a customer who asked what $200 could get him. I told him it could get dances, and he kept pushing for more.... He asked if I could even do a hand job and I said no... The thing is, is that I have heard that other girls in the place do extras, but I wont, so do I pass him on and tell another girl or what? Plus I have just heard things I don't really know for sure and I don't want to offend anyone.... I just really need some advice on this subject..
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    Ambilyn

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    God/dess
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    HI Ambilyn...

    Just tell him you don't do "xtras" and that's it, nothing else.

    I wouldn't even bother passing him on to other girls they may not appreicate that if they found out you were passing those gus along to them.... Besides how are you gonna benefit from that.

    Just do your job hun and let those guys find there own girls who don't mind offering more than a dance.

    Seraya.


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    Featured Member MeganS's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    I'll tell the guy, well honey, it'll get you some really sexy LD's that you'll just go nuts over! Be vague! Fuck those extras! If he ends up getting dances and then proceeds to complain that it wasn't "what he expected" screw him! You never offered that in the first place. Some guys just don't respect us enough! (hmm, am I being a crotchety bitch today or what?)

    As far as passing the guy along? Not a good idea. Just say, "hey, I don't know what these other girls are into, you'll have to ask them yourself" I decided to no longer get upset or frustrated when guys ask me if I'm (basically) a hooker. Don't sweat the small stuff!
    "A dress makes no sense unless it inspires men to want to take it off you."
    Francoise Sagan

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    God/dess cinammonkisses's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    I agree. You are at work to do one thing and one thing only...DANCE! Your not there to jack anybody off, nor suck anybody off. If he really wants his "extra" services taken care of, trust me he'll find her.







    Some Douchebag: "[Pimp C] 12:43 am: its true we got to stick together the black people on SW CK you is teh condoleeza of SW"


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    Member Jexebel's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    I'm in with the rest of the ladies. Either he can get you to dance, or he can hit the waterfront. I wouldn't put too much worry into this kind of guy. Icks.

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    God/dess Bella21's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    Yup, the only problem with that is, I've found they think they can try to slobber all over your boobs if they expect something. Yuck.
    If you think school is hard, try being stupid.

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    Senior Member nikki's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    I agree with everyone else also. Tell them to fuck off. Be careful about sayin you don't know if other girls do or not, just ask. I've heard if you even suggest that others may or may not do anything, you can get busted for soliciting. ??? That's what i've heard in the area I live in. Just tell them you aren't a hooker and no one does it at your club. then walk a way. Keep your class sweetie!!!! Don't degrade yourself, its bad enough that we have to do the little we do to our bodies in this business anyways.
    Ride it Hard and Fast,
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  8. #8
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    Quote Originally Posted by nikki link=board=1;threadid=5212;start=msg55081#msg55081 date=1071406541
    I agree with everyone else also. Tell them to fuck off. Be careful about sayin you don't know if other girls do or not, just ask. I've heard if you even suggest that others may or may not do anything, you can get busted for soliciting. ??? That's what i've heard in the area I live in. Just tell them you aren't a hooker and no one does it at your club. then walk a way. Keep your class sweetie!!!! Don't degrade yourself, its bad enough that we have to do the little we do to our bodies in this business anyways.
    Ambilyn, you need to do a little recon at your club to find out the truth of the situation ...

    - possibility #1 "extras" are NOT offered regularly in your club and this guy was just a guy who was fishing. In this case it was an isolated incident which you can safely forget.

    - possibility #2 "extras" ARE offered regularly in your club and this guy was expecting to get the same "mileage" from you that he was able to get from other dancers. In this case you have a dilemma on your hands as to whether or not it's worth it to you to continue to work in this environment if you're not willing to compete "stroke for stroke" with other dancers in your club. Also, even if you aren't actually doing extras yourself, being present in the club while other girls are puts you at an equal risk of being busted (but without the extra income).

    - possibility #3 the guy was an undercover cop. The way he phrased his question boiled down to determining exactly what potentially illegal acts you might be willing to do in exchange for a stated amount of money. This is just the sort of criteria/evidence that courts want to hear to make a prostitution bust stick. Remember that you don't actually have to DO anything illegal to be busted for soliciting/prostitution - all you have do do is SAY that you're willing to do sex act X in exchange for Y$.

    If this guy was an undercover cop then you might want to recon what basis of probable cause he might have had (i.e. other dancers actually delivering "extras"), and you might want to think about taking the next couple of weeks off. It's unfortunately highly likely that if a club bust is in the works, that once the bust occurs that every dancer present in the club will be busted. Also, had you said anything that would lead this guy to believe that other dancers are in fact offering "extras", your remarks would constitute probable cause for a future club bust as well.

    Given the Hollywood Stereotype about dancers, if you ARE busted you'll very probably find yourself in a situation of being considered guilty until proven innocent, with the only evidence on your behalf being your own word against the word of a cop (in the absence of 100% coverage club security camera tapes showing that you had no close contact whatsoever with anybody in the club at any time). You also may be facing a misdemeanor sex charge which could cost several grand to beat. Most importantly, having a misdemeanor sex charge on your permanent record could be the kiss of death for your future employment prospects in a "straight job" of any significant responsibility and pay level as potential employers simply throw your job application in the waste basket without having to tell you why.

    I don't like the smell of this guy ... did he also happen to have short hair and shiny boots, or any other characteristics which would corroborate the fact that he was an undercover cop ? Did he leave the club after talking with you or did he hit on other dancers who had similar conversations and who perhaps provided the probable cause he was fishing for which you did not ?

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    Veteran Member francesca's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    I agree with Melonie with possibility #3. Asking, "what can I get for $200" sounds like an undercover cop line. One big question and/or warning for everyone out there:

    When guys ask you questions like this, have they already attempted to fondle you, touch your boobs, etc.? If you are ever suspicious if a guy is an undercover cop, see if they will touch you in a sexual way--a way that is forbidden by whatever law exists in your area. Undercovers are NOT allowed to actually enact anything beyond what the local law states in order to entrap you.

    YES, they can "ask" you all the questions in the world and offer you endless amounts of money to try to get you to accept verbal offers for what the law calls prostitution but they are NOT allowed to cross the line when it comes to their own actual physical behavior. Otherwise what they do is not submissible in court and they can get terminated in severe cases.

    This info comes from a very good friend of mine who was an undercover vice cop here in Vegas for 20+ years. He's schooled me in great detail. He used to be one of the guys who sat in Vegas strip clubs asking these sort of things from dancers (hence how he gained his respect of dancers and started working against the system he worked for).

    He is the one who informed me of how to detect if someone is a cop or not. A dancer asking, "are you a cop?" to detect if someone is a cop IS A TOTAL MYTH. They are under no obligation to tell you just by asking. My friend was an undercover North Las Vegas "Bad Boy" (the guys in the yellow jackets with hoods over their faces to remain anonymous) and eventually was recruited to work for the DEA. He ended up taking an "early retirement" and now he works to dodge the laws he used to work under so I trust him completely.

    If someone asks for extras and you tell them they can touch your boobs and they won't do it, THEY ARE A COP. Get your $$$ and ditch them ASAP and inform everyone in the club.

    Hope this is helpful.

    francesca

    * FIND YOUR POWER ANIMAL

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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    melonie & franesca that didn't even enter my mind..... but it makes so much sense... Maybe he wasn't but MAYBE he was and if so its a good job ambilyn said no and passed didn't pass him on to other girls.

    Ambilyn maybe you should think about staying away for a lil bit.... when i think about it now it does sound strange for the guy to ask you what he can get for $200.... just something to think about especially if you do have girls in the club who offer "extras"

    Seraya.



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    Featured Member polecat's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    Quote Originally Posted by francesca link=board=1;threadid=5212;start=msg55100#msg55100 date=1071413190
    YES, they can "ask" you all the questions in the world and offer you endless amounts of money to try to get you to accept verbal offers for what the law calls prostitution but they are NOT allowed to cross the line when it comes to their own actual physical behavior.
    It's true that undercover cops can't cross this line, but informants can.

    Some vice-squads bring on "confidential informants"- which fall outside the rules of normal police investigations, yet their testimony becomes key. Many escorts and prostitutes have been busted by informants that have actually paid/received sex acts multiple times before the actual bust.
    It doesn't matter if you're somebody in this world, it rather matters you mean the whole world to somebody.

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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    Whoa.... but i suppose that's just 1 of the many perks that come along with the job!


  13. #13
    Pamela
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    PLease don't pass him on to one who will. Let him find the ones who will himself. Blow him off. I HATE when these people come to the clubs wanting hj's bj's friggin phone numbers, all that crap. Meet at a reguler club, gee.....They are more likely to get everything all night for $200.

    Pamela

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    When guys ask you questions like this, have they already attempted to fondle you, touch your boobs, etc.? If you are ever suspicious if a guy is an undercover cop, see if they will touch you in a sexual way--a way that is forbidden by whatever law exists in your area. Undercovers are NOT allowed to actually enact anything beyond what the local law states in order to entrap you.
    Actually, this law varies from state to state. In Texas for example an undercover officer can actually have complete contact with the girl including actual sex, and THEN zip up his pants, bust her for prostitution, and take his money back ! I suspect that such state laws wouldn't survive a federal appeal, but I sure don't have $100,000 to finance one and neither do most dancers !

    In places like NY and NJ where such actions could legally be considered entrapment, the cops instead rely on the "word of a cop versus the word of a dancer" scenario to deny any wrongdoing - and without a video tape of the exchange it's virtually impossible for a dancer to convince a judge or jury that she's telling the truth if the arresting officer has a different story to tell (even though he is lying about entrapping you to cover his own ass). The preconceived Hollywood Sterotype in the minds of judges and juries that dancers are nothing but thieving, lying, drug addicted whores places every dancer who must appear in court at an extreme disadvantage.

    And yes police informants are totally exempt from entrapment laws since they're not officers but merely scumbags working both ends against the middle. Fortunately, in places like NY and NJ, discovered informants seem to have a curious tendency of "mysteriously disappearing" from the area !

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    Senior Member tranquil_waters's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    My money has decreesed so much in the last few months due to the number of girls giving extras. I couldn't imagine being busted for such things. Around here your real name goes in the paper saying you were prostituting. NO EXTRAS FROM ME NOT NOW NOT EVER
    Tranquil Waters

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re:Pass on the extras????

    Quote Originally Posted by tranquil_waters link=board=1;threadid=5212;start=msg55222#msg55222 date=1071427337
    My money has decreesed so much in the last few months due to the number of girls giving extras. I couldn't imagine being busted for such things. Around here your real name goes in the paper saying you were prostituting. NO EXTRAS FROM ME NOT NOW NOT EVER
    Tranquil, you seem to be missing the point here.

    You cannot safely assume that if you are present in a club where other girls are giving extras that you will not be busted and charged right along with those other girls !!! Just because you know that you yourself are not breaking any prostitution laws in regard to contact levels with customers does NOT mean that you won't be arrested along with every other dancer in the club.

    It also does NOT mean that one of the cops won't testify that you were giving extras right along with some of the other girls, resulting in you're being charged with prostitution after your arrest. It does NOT mean that when you finally get your day in court to tell your side of the story to the judge and jury that they'll actually believe your story that "honestly I wasn't doing anything wrong!" when a well respected local cop is willing to testify to the contrary! It does NOT mean that you won't wind up with the same prostitution conviction black mark on your permanent record and with your same real name and address published in the local paper as girls who were actually giving extras.

    Actually the only thing that it DOES mean is that some other dancers are earning big money giving extras which they can use to hire a good lawyer and possibly beat the charges when they are eventually busted, while you're earning peanuts not giving extras and probably won't be able to afford a good lawyer when you are (bogusly) charged with the same offense, meaning that YOU are actually much more likely to be convicted than the dancers actually giving extras are !

    Unless your club has 100% video surveillance, such that VCR security tapes from the club can be used as positive proof in court of exactly what you were or were not doing at the club despite what a cop may have testified, the odds are strongly in favor of you being busted and convicted right along with the other dancers in your club who are actually giving extras.

    If this happens (and it's happened to me in the past), about the ONLY option you have is to pay your $500 bail, to "take your lumps" during the first court case (meaning you'll be found guilty, with your real name and address published in the local paper) - then to cough up several thousand dollars to a good criminal attorney to appeal your case to a higher court. Sometimes the appeal will overturn the local court conviction. Sometimes the appeal will result in a plea bargain to a lesser charge, but you'll still have to plead guilty to something and pay a hefty fine. Then once your original conviction is overturned or bargained down, if you pay the attorney even more money, he can probably manage to get a judge to sign an order to have your record expunged (otherwise the charge itself will still appear on your record even though the conviction was overturned or bargained down). All in all, it cost me about $5,000 in legal fees + lost nights of work while appearing in court to get 100% clear of a bogus club bust, and like you I wasn't actually doing anything illegal in the first place. Welcome to the US legal system, where dancers are considered guilty until proven innocent !

    I wrote an article about this, which can still be found at .

    The only major changes since this article was written is that most courts have now raised the bail amount from $250 to $500 in hopes of catching dancers without enough earnings from the previous night to make bail. This means that if you can't cough up the $500 bail and your clubowner won't/can't make bail for you, that you'll get a tour of the city/county jail until your case is heard.

    The other change is that as club/dancer busts have increased in number and complexity due to overzealous politicians and new local dance club ordinances, criminal lawyers have raised their legal fees and courts have raised their fines from $1000 to probably $2000 or more in most areas today. This means that if you can't afford your own criminal attorney, and if the clubowner won't/can't provide legal representation for you, that a public defender will probably manage to get you several days in city/county jail along with a smaller fine, or a very hefty fine without jail time.

    Also beware of relying on the club's attorney - while this may get you released and may get your case resolved without actually costing you any money, it will very likely leave you with a permanent black mark on your record which no amount of money for attorneys fees can get erased in the future. This black mark may also make it virtually impossible for you to ever be hired for a responsible and well paying "straight job", as it will immediately turn up during any pre-hiring investigation by a prospective employer.

    If you know for a fact that extras are being offered in your club by a number of dancers on a regular basis, you have a dilemma to face. Either join in the activities so that you will also be able to earn big money so you can afford a good attorney when you are busted, or get the hell out of that club so that you won't be facing the risk of being bogusly busted based on the extras the other girls are offering drawing the attention of the local cops ! Staying where you are is the worst of both worlds, and if the police attention the dancers offering extras is likely to draw results in you being charged right along with them without being able to afford a really good attorney, you'll actually wind up with higher fines and more black marks on your permanent record than they will !

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