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Thread: The Dilemma with Extra's...

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    Default The Dilemma with Extra's...

    As many girls here know, many clubs in San Francisco have extras and are pretty open about it (Mitchell Brothers is the most famous, but there's a bunch of others).

    The lapdances are typically very high-mileage with the girls encouraging you to touch almost everywhere - they actually will guide your hand because they know out of town guys are not used to this.

    But the lapdance is just a salespitch for the private dance which at a minimum is a handjob and will run the whole gamut of perversity...

    The problem is it's very difficult to convince these dancers you only want a lapdance and if you do only get a lapdance from them they might even be unhappy with you.

    I imagine some guys get a private not realizing these dancers are serious about the extras they talk about since the costs of these privates aren't any more than privates in non-extra's clubs in other parts of the country.

    So how many guys would tell a dancer to stop when she starts titty-fucking your dick during the private when all they thought they were getting was a nude dance? Not many, I bet.

    Anyway, the dilemma with extras is that when they are available it is usually NOT the guys asking for them but the dancers trying to push them. And the guy going into a club and not partaking in the higher mileage/higher dollar activities is viewed in a negative fashion by many of these dancers.


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    Featured Member polecat's Avatar
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    [Edit- I already got my first email regarding my original reply, and after re-reading, it was a bit too overly explanatory, giving and convoluted. Inbox if you'd like the War and Peace version of the same that was posted earlier. The basic spirit has been retained in this shorter version.]

    The theory that a gentleman can't have a good time or receive stellar, respectful treatment at clubs that offer extras is false and disingenuous. Gentlemen in San Francisco, like anywhere else, receive the best and preferential treatment possible. As you mentioned Mitchell Brothers, I'll chime in specifically that the more wealthy, affluent, and famous gentlemen visit this club. It's the BEST club to take a female companion due to it's upper scale and cleanliness, one of the few clubs nation/SF wide I feel perfectly comfortably inviting out of the area CEO's/CFO's as well as married friends as the dancers are other worldly sweet and extremely classy.

    Pressure upsells from cheapie $20-$40 laps (or "test drives" as they are sometimes called) to metered/VIP shows in SF are in part due to meter visit quotas in addition to club fees. Upsells to VIP, Champage, private, "blue-room" or whathaveyou are the same everywhere... all across the USA.

    What is unique about Mitchell Brothers and other SF clubs that have extras that are basically enforcement-exempt have non-extras dancers working happily, side-by-side with extras dancers and everyone co-exists peacefully. Boundries become personal choice vs. earnings potential.

    It's a bit disturbing to see an excuse for accepting extras somehow blamed on the dancers of these clubs. I have yet to find a dancer at any SF club that wasnt ECSTATIC to forgo and bypass extras, provided the tip was worth their while, from which tip amounts in range with gentleman's club rates are more than happily embraced. It's again, very disingenuous to almost insinuate that your penis is just so desirable that the dancers can't control themselves around it.

    In 30+ visits to Mitchell Brothers and other SF clubs in the past few months, I've never been "coerced" into extras, never felt this expressed requirement to take it out of my pants, paid the same (or lower) rates as the gentleman's clubs in the surrounding area. Gentlemen truly get red-carpet preferential treatment and treated like a king.

    This coercion, "minimum of a handjob" and "gamut of perversity" isn't the reality. It's available and can be openly discussed and negotiated, but it's in no way the "sexual harassment" scenario like Mark is trying portray. lol.

    The portrayal here sounds more like a married guy that got busted for seeking out extras and now trying to displace the blame as being some sort of "victim" from these vile, temptresses that found him so irresistable to force themselves upon him.

    Negative treatment from dancers in SF clubs is to the same scale of negative treatment from any club nationwide. If you only have $20-$40 total to spend, by all means, don't waste the dancers time at lapdance clubs. This is a golden rule ANYWHERE in the USA. Don't even bother going to strip clubs at all. If you absolutely MUST find female dancer entertainment, find yourself a nice go-go club where there either aren't club fees or the few remaining that actually pay the dancers. These style clubs don't have the hustle cycle as no form of 1-on-1 upsales exist and you'll be welcomed and respected as these places expect only a few bucks per dance set for the women in the cages.

    But please, don't try to use dancer repulsion to patron cheapness at fee/tipout clubs as some sort of excuse to justify getting extras. If you bring a pocket-book with the kind of spending money to drop like you would at K2U, Hustler's, Gold Club, Centerfolds, etc.etc.. you'll be appreciated and welcomed. If you're a $20 guy, you wont get a warm welcome at any strip club.
    It doesn't matter if you're somebody in this world, it rather matters you mean the whole world to somebody.

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    Pamela
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    I have heard my share of Mitchell Brothers as well, but thats another story, anyway.....Send that guy over to me that has only $40, i will be more than happy to give him a ld or 2. Those $40's add up! If i never did a dance for $40 man i would not have made as much money as i did inside the club!

    Pamela

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    Quote Originally Posted by Pamela link=board=8;threadid=5657;start=msg61386#msg61386 date=1073513232
    I have heard my share of Mitchell Brothers as well, but thats another story, anyway.....Send that guy over to me that has only $40, i will be more than happy to give him a ld or 2. Those $40's add up! If i never did a dance for $40 man i would not have made as much money as i did inside the club!

    Pamela
    Thank you for restoring my faith.

    Here's the issue that I think he was getting at. When extras become the norm and barter is embraced, it becomes an unpleasant experience for the average strip club guy.

    Think about it for a second -- one of the HUGE reasons that men go to the strip clubs is for a little female attention without all the games that come with the 'real' world. There is something very refreshing about seeing a girl and knowing that if you call her over and give her $20, she will give you a lapdance. I don't mean that in a misogynistic way. Truth be told, men don't *really* pay for the nakedness. Sure; that's a part of it. However, the bigger part is the lack of the games.

    It's like the old line "men don't pay prostitutes for sex; they pay for them to go away." (NOT SAYING THAT STRIPPERS ARE PROSTITUTES ONLY MAKING A POINT). The point is only that men are paying to not think about things like "Will she be mad at me if I don't buy X more? Is she trying to sell me X? Does she think that I'm a cheapskate? Etc.” Jesus -- men get enough mental torture from dating women. There is a reason that we pay an hourly rate that would equate to over a half million dollars (assuming a 40 hour work week, etc.)

    One of the reasons that SF clubs don't seem appealing to me (and I/we LOVE LV clubs) is that I have heard soooo many stories of barter. I don't want to deal. I don't want to think about it. I don't care about extras (the only extras that I would want (things like breast and ass touching) aren't really extras in LV). I don't care about the VIP rooms. I/We just want to go a club, drop a couple hundred dollars (usually about $60 per dancer), and leave. Once someone tells me that I shouldn't waste a dancer's time if I'm not going to get milked it's no longer fun.

    -A's husband (writing from her account)

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    I dont have a delimma with extras. I get them outside the club..not inside. Problem solved.

    Hello to A's husband. Amber is very sweet. You are a lucky man.

    FBR
    Once again I have embraced my addiction and have put off the moral dilemma to another day.

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    Quote Originally Posted by FBR link=board=8;threadid=5657;start=msg61437#msg61437 date=1073528064
    I dont have a delimma with extras. I get them outside the club..not inside. Problem solved.

    Hello to A's husband. Amber is very sweet. You are a lucky man.

    FBR
    I'm not disputing that I'm one lucky guy. With that said, you're probably thinking of a different Amber. Now if you had said "potstirrer, spitfire, etc.".....

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    No Im not thinking of another Amber. I accidentally PM'd your Amber thinking it was Amber76. She responded with a very nice PM. I was just making the point that she is nice.

    FBR
    Once again I have embraced my addiction and have put off the moral dilemma to another day.

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    And she may be a potstirrer, spitfire etc LOL I dont know her. LOL But I still say your are a luck man enjoy!

    FBR
    Once again I have embraced my addiction and have put off the moral dilemma to another day.

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    Please read through this thread for an example of this apparent "SF only" issue:
    http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/ind...;threadid=3913

    I believe I answered the same way- which is, there are different scale clubs in big cities for every financial situation.

    Pamela-
    Send that guy over to me that has only $40, i will be more than happy to give him a ld or 2.
    Although there are a GREAT number of girls at upper-scale clubs (Mitchell Brothers included) with this same attitude, there are also a few that feel otherwise. The point being, people that come into a club that has club fees and simply nurse a drink or don't tip aren't going to receive VIP/red-carpet treatment.

    I should have been more clear- a guy with $40 will have a great time, but if he's still there two hours later, he's not as welcome as other patrons by a few dancers. In Mitchell Brother's case, there are up to 4 stage-style live shows going on, so it's become a fairly favorite place for "I'm going to pay cover charge and that's it" style of customers.. whereas if they are tipping shows properly, they'll blow through that $40 in short order. The club even has an enclosed "cinema" which is a canvas-screen movie-theatre with seats for the freeloaders to go hang out in.

    A's Husband-
    One of the reasons that SF clubs don't seem appealing to me (and I/we LOVE LV clubs) is that I have heard soooo many stories of barter. I don't want to deal. I don't want to think about it. I don't care about extras (the only extras that I would want (things like breast and ass touching) aren't really extras in LV). I don't care about the VIP rooms. I/We just want to go a club, drop a couple hundred dollars (usually about $60 per dancer), and leave. Once someone tells me that I shouldn't waste a dancer's time if I'm not going to get milked it's no longer fun.
    Thank you for clearly stating the "myth" and illustrating the incorrect nature of SF clubs and Mitchell Brothers. You and I have the EXACT same mindset for what a visit to a stripclub should involve.

    There is no "barter" unless the PATRON has some sort of specific expectation and a price. "Barter" doesn't happen unless JoeBlow walks in with "I've got $150 and I want a blow-job" on his expectation list. Otherwise, it's the standard stripclub experience- ladies approaching with conversation, leading to "wanna dance?" and either you politely decline or away the two of you go to the couches. By 2-3 songs worth of lapdances, the dancers will inquire if you'd like to go to a VIP, or "somewhere more private where I can lose this g-string" kind of pitch. They appreciate the business and they don't snap at a VIP/private decline provided you have tipped for those 2-3 songs. You can repeat this as often as you like and have a wonderful time.

    I've seen MORE pressure exerted at AZ, NV, WA and FL clubs than you see at Mitchell Brothers... and that's the point. The "bartering" doesnt begin until a patron who has gotten a dance or two (or worse yet, right on the initial "hello") starts talking of a specific service for a specific price, and even at that- things that would get you a slap in the face anywhere else in the country will be given respect. The response will be either "Sorry, I don't do that... but would you like me to send someone over that will?" or "I need more than what you've offerred for that kind of special attention" and the bartering begins.
    It doesn't matter if you're somebody in this world, it rather matters you mean the whole world to somebody.

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    I suppose that I've just had some unlucky friends then. They've has dancers in SF tell them that a lapdance is 20,30,40 (all at the same club)

    -A's Husband

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    Pamela
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    That all sounds fine Polecat, but if i shunned every customer because he ran out of his $40 when he is coming in to see me every night or so, i lose a regular. My job was not to bleed a man dry, but to want him to come back, and when his 2 ld's are over because he ran out of money, that is fine. He bought a few dances, and had a drink or two. Thats what clubs are about.

    Say my $40 man came in everynight, spent the money on me and bought a couple drinks, and your once every other month guy comes in and goes to VIP. Maybe some extra pennies from the VIP guy, i will take my $40 ld guy who puts no pressure on me, because no means no, and i can kindly let him down easy. VIP's more is expected, no doubt.

    This is how you make regulars, not all guys have big $$$ to spend in clubs today, or don't want to spend a paycheck there anymore. Simple fun is for the "not so weathly" guys too! Gotta love them.

    Also many guys who hit VIP, also hit many dancers, see whats "new".

    I have been a dancer too long, and know how the game works. If a guy pays for a dance or two, and buys a couple drinks, runs out of money he's always welcome where i worked, and not considered a freeloader.

    Guys are not stupid, and will soon learn about this "wallet drain hustle". And kindly go where they can spend alittle money for a dance or two.

    Pamela

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    With my illustrations of dancers cercing men to get extras I was specifically referring to The Market Street Cinema. In this club, you WILL be approached by dancers who will try to convince you to get an extras session. They routinely will come up to you and grab your dick with their hand - it's almost like a handshake at this place.

    And no they don't wan't your penis but they do want the money that the owner of the penis will pay them if they play with that penis. Mitchell Brothers is much more upscale and much lower key about the extras thing - but prostitution occurs in there too. It's just classier than MSC...

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    Quote Originally Posted by mark069 link=board=8;threadid=5657;start=msg61699#msg61699 date=1073622639
    With my illustrations of dancers cercing men to get extras I was specifically referring to The Market Street Cinema. In this club, you WILL be approached by dancers who will try to convince you to get an extras session. They routinely will come up to you and grab your dick with their hand - it's almost like a handshake at this place.
    LOL Mark..

    Okay, okay... I have to agree with you on MSC.. which is one of like 19 clubs in SF. Frankly, the other strip-clubs in SF are *NOTHING* like MSC, which is a total cesspool.

    My original reply prior to editing included the following (rather humorously with the handshake reference LOL):
    --------------------
    If you want to work your case Mark, pick specifically MSC (Market Street Cinema). It's the only real SF club that matches your model- where the dancers still haven't learned that an initial handshake is supposed to be to the customer's hand. There are no stage shows to speak of and lapdances really dont exist. After taking five steps from paying cover, you have 3 fairly average looking women throwing full-service prices at you while dragging you by the arm. THAT club has been going downhill fast, just recently had a management change, and hopefully will either scale up or otherwise change.
    ----------------------
    It doesn't matter if you're somebody in this world, it rather matters you mean the whole world to somebody.

  14. #14
    Pamela
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    It happens in every club. You just don't see it, believe me. Dancing is not what it used to be, and alot of times management encourages this type of behaviour for more money.

    Even if managemant does not encourage this behaviour, it still is in the clubs. These "dancers" may not last long, or they are excellent money makers, so management turns a cheek.

    Take your pick. And in Cali? Oh yes it's there. I have read too much from customers who visit the clubs. And a couple dancers who tried working the clubs out there.

    I only have heard of Mitchell Brothers, but hear the club is not squeaky clean.

    I was one to defend my club for years, but we still had the "extras".

    Pamela

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    I agree with Pamela. It's there, you just don't see it. I just recently confirmed two rumors about an old co-worker that I would never have believed. I staunchly defended her for months; I had been in VIP (private room with open couches, everyone in the room can see everyone else) with her hundreds of times and I never, not even once, saw an inkling of anything overly risque and I told people so every time they mentioned some rumor about what she might do in VIP. Much to my shock, two of those rumors are totally correct. I have to give her kudos for discretion though, as I would never have known if a regular customer of hers hadn't told me. I've been on the couch right NEXT to her and never saw it going on.

    Can't say that I honestly have a problem with it though. If I, who spend more time with her in VIP than most customers, never saw it then neither did my customers. She did her thing without it affecting my money.

    You might think that this was just because my old club was one of the rougher clubs. Nope, it goes on even at my upscale gown club. There's this customer we all know, whom I'll call Jeff. Jeff brings in plainclothes bodyguards with him and one night his bodyguard kept giving me the "mmmm, redhead" look so i naturally went on over. That's when I found out that he wasn't a customer, but he told me about this Jeff fellow things i would never have guessed. Jeff apparantly uses various strip clubs, including mine, as a game with escorting type services as his reward. He sees a girl that strikes his fancy and starts slowly feeling her out throughout the night to see if she'll go for it. If she says the right things then he makes her a (high) offer. The bodyguard implied that the offer has been accepted quite often. Then he looked at the girl Jeff was currently tipping on stage and said "Oh, looks like he's found his girl for the night."

    At first I didn't believe him. My club is loaded with cameras and microphones and the owner won't tolerate a girl making money in his club without giving out a house cut of the profits. But sure enough, just as the bodyguard predicted, when I left work that night I passed Jeff's limo parked on a side road waiting for a dancer to join him. I didn't stay to see if someone actually joined them, but it seems reasonable to assume that Jeff made the offer and had made such offers before, probably with some modicum of success.

    It seriously creeped me out when Jeff tipped me well on stage a week later.
    He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you. ~ Friedrich Nietzsche

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    Pamela. You hit the nail on the head. So many guys have been taken to the cleaners in clubs over the past decade or overspent, that it's definately slowed down clubs all over the country and made many guys defensive every time a dancer approaches the table.

    If more clubs including higher end ones had more of a party atmosphere and made the guys feel more like people than $100 bills, the dancers and the club owners would be seeing more steady money than is being seen today.

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    Last summer i was in a club talking to this girl. We kind of hit it off in that wool-pulley, this-isn't-exactly-real, strip club way. She eventually asked if i wanted a private dance and, having sort of monopolized her time for a while i agreed so she'd get her cash. They have these, sort of, booth-things where this is done, or at least they had them the LAST time i had been there.

    Apparently, between that time and the last time, things had changed.

    NOW those booths are totally different. Where once they were semi private little deals with a chair, NOW they were totally private. No chair. There's this thing sticking out of the wall that sort of looks like a funky saddle made from carpet. Anyway this chick lays me down on this thing, by this time i am totally lost. Never before had any dance i had ever gotten involve me on my back.

    So, i'm on my back and this chick starts. Now, she's supposed to have bottoms on in this place. Bottoms go. Right off the bat i have a thong tossed onto me. Now, i'm not complaining at the moment this is pretty cool.

    It all went down hill from there.

    She starts in with my hands, putting them on her breasts and even actually taking my finger to her, er, em, erm. Well, you know. Now, i'm down there thinking "what in the name of god is going on here?"

    I soon got my answer.

    I think i was around a week away from hitting thirty, and I had never been propositioned in any way like that. Ever. Not in a strip club, not anywhere. The closest i can remember was some lady grabbing her crotch in my direction once while on a forray to get some booze way back when.

    "Would you be interested in a Naked Massage?" She whispers to me. "I can give you my Cell Phone number."

    And i can imagine how that 'massage' session might go, too. I may be naive in the ways of prostitution, but i'm not a total moron.

    She doesn't wait for and answer out of me, not that i could have given her one anyway, i was so fucking shocked.

    She stands up and steps closer, putting her Vagina very very close to my face. I know what's going on but for some reason my mind is totally blank. I could NOT believe she was serious. I looked up at her and she was looking down at me and her entire manner was more and more "get on with it" by the second. I remember thinking she can't fucking be serious!!!

    By the way: My tongue stayed put. I don't think i could have moved it if my life depended on it.

    I had originally planned to get a few songs from her, but i was so flustered i practically RAN outta that booth.

    I said goodbye to my friend and left the club. I avoid that girl like she's a goddamned porcupine now.

    Same thing happened to me about two weeks later at another club, though that one was a LOT more blatent. Right in the middle of the LD she pops off with "Want more? I can arrange it. 300$" (Exact words, see how burned into my memory these awful experiences are?)

    So when the originator of this thread asks "What do you do when a girl starts titty-fucking your dick" I ask "What do you do when a girl sticks her pussy in your face and actually looks at you like she expects you to start gobbling away?"

    And that's one of my favorite things to do on the planet!!!!

    Here's what you do, or what I&#039 do anyway. Look at her like she's totally gone compleatly barking mad and exit stage left at your earliest convenience.

    Look, maybe i'm just whacko. Maybe i'm old fashion or some damned thing, but i just cannot have totally impersonal sex. I just can't do it. I suppose it's biologically possible, but it's not something i'd enjoy or be proud of later. So extras are out for me, and the girl offering them can just be mad about it. Sucks that she's upset at me, but what can ya do?

    That said, coming home to an empty bed with 500$ in my pocket after turning down that second girl was a terribly terribly bitter pill...




    Edit: Some formatting and spelling errors.

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    Veteran Member vanilla_dog's Avatar
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    You know what you tell her? That she's better than that, that she doesn't have to do that for you, that she can do whatever she is comfortable with and you will be happy with her. It may be the first time she has ever heard that from a customer.

    The best customers are the ones who tell the girl to do whatever she wants in a LD...have a seat or dance, stay dressed or get naked. Given that choice I will happily sit down - dressed - and chat! Otherwise I'm just going to assume he wants me to get naked and dance.

    Insert extra in place of LD and I think probably the same still holds. Unless you tell her otherwise she will probably assume that's all you want out of her.
    You get what you put up with

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    Featured Member Chili Palmer's Avatar
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    Reading this post, I'm still trying to come to grips with what the male posters are stating: that they don't want a beautiful young dancer to take her clothes off, and then play with his gameboy or let him play with her boobs, etc.

    Quite honestly, I find this laughable, if not downright ludicrous. I love mileage, and what you consider extras I consider as a standard lap, but here's the deal: In all my years of doing this, I have never, ever asked a dancer to do anything. My limits are hers: if she does not allow touching, then I don't touch (I also don't get any more laps from her, but that's the choice we both make). I start off slowly, expecting to get multple laps from any dancer I select, and how long we continue is up to her and her comfort zone.

    Apparently, this makes me unique on this site, which, on a site dedicated to women taking their clothes off and dancing on customer's laps, seems kind of preposterous.

    And as for the customer who comes to a strip club with just $40 in pocket, I say, "What an a$$hole." After the $20 cover and $6 drink, you've now got enough left to tip 5 dancers at the stage and get one whole lapdance. The one thing I think most of us can agree upon is that no dancer on this site wants to take her clothes off for free. If you truly "respect" the dancers, then show up clean, shaved, not wearing denim, and with enough money (and willingness to part with it) to make it worth the ladies' while for showing up that night.

    Chili (G-d gave us five senses, and I like to use ALL of them in a SC) Palmer

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    I don't think anyone said "Don't want." I sure didn't.

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    Featured Member Chili Palmer's Avatar
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    I had originally planned to get a few songs from her, but i was so flustered i practically RAN outta that booth.
    Pretty much sounds like "don't want" to me.

    CP

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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    What I don't want is to take anyone home for a 200$ "massage." I don't like even the IDEA of buying sex, this includes licking away at some unknown girl's clit. I'm not built that way (well, maybe biologically, but not psychologically). If that's what's considered an extra, then yeah, she can keep it. I can get stuff like that from women who actually *want* to give it to me rather than just get it over with for a few bucks.

    Hey, you do your thing and I'll do mine. Have at it.

  23. #23
    Featured Member polecat's Avatar
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    Default Re:The Dilemma with Extra's...

    they don't want a beautiful young dancer to take her clothes off, and then play with his gameboy or let him play with her boobs, etc.
    Glad to see you got the point.

    I have nothing against extras, but my nights out in the city and my personality are incompatible with them.

    For me, a visit to a stripclub is the first stop of many for a night of entertainment. I'll maybe stop in for 20-25 minutes to kill some time, say hello to a few dancer friends, maybe get a friendly lap or two, and seed tip/cheer their stage shows. I'll have around 5-6 live music, dance club, and bars on the agenda and not interested in the risk of getting my pants/boxers soiled and I've got a big ego problem with paying for sex.

    I also prefer to have a more high-brow relationship with the local dancers since this makes them a more comfortable and valid outlet to take female guests. Just call me funny, but I'm not going to feel very comfortable taking a lady to some other lady that regularly "plays with my gameboy" for $.

    What IS ludicrous is to suggest a guy can't simply have this kind of experience in an extras-heavy club. Yes, one(1) brothel known as Market Street Cinema, this may be the case... but it's wrong to attach this model to stripclubs with girls that do extras. There is no coercive or forced nature anywhere else... just one of trying to get guys to spend. I can easily see someone that just isnt forking tips to start getting extras pressure, but aside from MSC- a guy doesnt have to bring weapons or prybars to keep a woman off his equipment as was suggested.
    It doesn't matter if you're somebody in this world, it rather matters you mean the whole world to somebody.

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