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Thread: NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

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    Senior Member jenna2479's Avatar
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    Default NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    New Paltz, NY, about 1 hr. 15 min north of the city. The mayor here will begin performing gay marriages today at noon. What a circus this area is going to turn into. Good for him, though! If Bush wants to protect the sanctity of marriage, why doesn't he require regular couples to wait a year before being granted a license. That might help to bring down the divorce rate. How about making it a crime to cheat on a spouse with a mandatory jail sentence. That might make people think twice before getting married unless they are sure they are ready. If two gay people or a white man and black woman or a thin person and a fat person or a brunette and a red head want to get married and they love each other, WHO CARES? You don't have to live with them.

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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    I think they should ban all marriages, anyone who gets married has to be a little off in the head.
    "I don't know about you, but I'm going to get my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames" Jim Morrison

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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    I am glad that the Mayor of New Paltz,NY has the nerve to stand up for whats right !
    My new love...is me !

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  4. #4
    Pamela
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    Sure but when you go into another state to live your not legally married are you ? And yes, i agree if one has a cheating spouse, that person should be fined and jail time as well.

    Pamela

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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    You know there was a time when certain races would go to other states and counties to get married. When they returned home of course their marriages were not considered legal by their local government. But did that mean the couple no longer considered themselves to be man and wife ??
    My new love...is me !

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    Pamela
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    Good question. Is this legal marriage going to hold true in all states, countries. Otherwise i don't really see a point.

    Pamela

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    Veteran Member bibacle's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    I'm not a lawyer (don't even play one on TV) but I believe that matrimonial rules have always been the province of the states not the federal government (it doesn't involve interstate commerce).

    Each of the 50 states defines who can enter into a "marriage" and the attending legal consequences of entering into that relationship. Currently, all 50 states limit marriage to heterosexual couples. Some states allow same-sex couples to enter into relationships that carry with them varying legal consequences. California and Hawaii, for example, have "domestic partnership" and "reciprocal beneficiary" laws, respectively. Right now, only Vermont allows same-sex couples to enter into "civil unions." To a certain extent, the difference between domestic partnerships and civil unions is a matter of semantics—in theory, California and Vermont could provide same-sex couples the same legal rights under different names.
    HOWEVER:
    Federal law treats "civil unions" and "marriages" differently. So for purposes of federal Social Security and tax law, for example, the U.S. government treats couples who enter into "civil unions" differently than couples who enter into "marriages." (Married couples can file joint federal income tax returns, for example, while same-sex couples who have entered into a civil union cannot.)

    Does that make sense to you guys?
    "Those who dance, are considered crazy by those who can't hear the music."--George Carlin

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    It just hit radio news (just before noon) that the NY State Dep't of Health, which is the authority behind all NY marriage licenses, interprets the state constitution as defining legal marriage as the union of one man and one woman. Thus the NY Dep't of Health went on record that gay marriage licenses are not legal and that any NY public official issuing such illegal gay marriage licenses will be subject to immediate prosecution. I guess that, unlike Gov. Schwarzenegger, NY's governor Pataki knew the right person to call to stifle the gay marriage issue in NY in a matter of minutes.

    Sure but when you go into another state to live your not legally married are you ?
    This is the fine print issue that has 49 state governments and 49 million employers up in arms. #1 Marriage is a Legal Contract - #2 the "full faith and credit" clause of the US constitution says that a contract made in one state is legal and binding in all other states. This means that, technically, if a gay couple were to be legally married in, say, Massachusetts, and were then to move to NY (or if a NY based gay couple were to travel to MA to get married), even though NY does not allow gay marriage the state of NY and all companies operating in the state of NY would have to recognize the legality of the MA gay marriage contract. This in turn would require companies to provide benefits to the spouses of gay employees. This in further turn would lead to discrimination lawsuits against NY companies by NY gay partners. Basically, if one state opens the floodgates to legalized gay marriage, it will proliferate across the USA as fast as the gay couples married in that one state can drive to other states.

    At the moment, there have been NO legal gay marriages by virtue of the fact that no state government has sanctioned gay marriages. The MA Supreme Court has issued an order to the MA legislature to rewrite state marriage laws in order to make gay marriages legal, but at this point in time this has not yet happened. The gay marriage licenses being issued and the ceremonies being performed in a handful of cities are taking place without the official sanction of state governments, thus they are illegal.

    At the moment, the legality of gay marriage issue has been brought before the California Supreme Court by the attorney general at Gov. Schwarzenegger's request. But until they make a ruling, and until the California legislature amends state marriage laws to specifically legalize gay marriage, the San Francisco gay "marriages are illegal.

  9. #9
    Pamela
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    Thanks. Well all seems to be at a "halt." And perhaps to stay that way.

    Pamela

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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=6949;start=msg78576#msg78576 date=1077911366
    I guess that, unlike Gov. Schwarzenegger, NY's governor Pataki knew the right person to call to stifle the gay marriage issue in NY in a matter of minutes.
    So true Melonie !!
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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    I wanted to add this recent news article for everyone to see......

    Mayor of N.Y. Town Marries Gay Couples

    2 hours ago

    By MICHAEL HILL, Associated Press Writer


    Village of New Paltz Mayor Jason West, left, prepares to marry Maj. ...More...
    NEW PALTZ, N.Y. - Twenty-one gay couples exchanged wedding vows on the steps of village hall Friday in a spirited ceremony that opened another front on the growing national debate over gay marriage.

    As the ceremonies by 26-year-old Mayor Jason West were ending, the state Health Department asked the attorney general to seek an injunction "to prevent further illegal conduct by the mayor," a department spokesman said.

    A call to Attorney General Eliot Spitzer's office was not immediately returned.

    West, elected on the Green Party ticket last year in this village 75 miles north of New York City, joined Gavin Newsom of San Francisco as the country's only mayors to marry same-sex couples.

    "What we're witnessing in America today is the flowering of the largest civil rights movement the country's had in a generation," West said.

    Billiam van Roestenberg, 38, and Jeffrey McGowan, 39, of nearby Plattekill, were the first to wed. Wearing suits, they held hands and carried flowers as the crowd cheered.

    "I feel happy and joyful and peaceful," van Roestenberg said. "A little bit of peace has finally come in. I feel proud to be an American."

    "Now I'm normal and equal like every one else," he said.

    The midday ceremonies ended a little more than an hour after they started.

    More than 100 people, mostly supporters of gay marriage, turned out on the green across from village hall, outnumbering family and friends of the couples there to marry. A few scattered protesters carried signs opposing gay marriage.

    Jay Blotcher of High Falls, N.Y., said that while West could only give him a certificate and not a marriage license, it was still important to go through the ceremony.

    "We have to show people who we are," he said. "We've been badmouthed by religious zealots. We've been deprived by President Bush, and we have to show people that we're your friends, neighbors and family."

    Blotcher, who with his partner has already gotten a civil union in Vermont and a domestic partnership in New York City, said Friday marked another important step.

    "This country was founded on a revolution," he said. "And this is a revolution, but it's a revolution of love."

    One protester stood outside the hall with a sign that read, in part, "It's Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve."

    "It's against nature," Angelo Da'Quaro said. "It's against religion, it's against all of that."

    The ceremonies came a day after the state Health Department said New York's domestic relations law does not allow marriage licenses for same-sex couples. It said a clerk issuing such a license or anyone solemnizing such a marriage would be violating state law.

    Department spokesman William Van Slyke said the department was requesting the injunction and also wants the attorney general's office to find the same-sex marriages in New Paltz "null and void."

    West and some legal experts said they read the law differently.

    "For a marriage to be legal in this state all that's required is for it to be properly solemnized by someone with authority to do so," West told the CNN cable network early Friday. "I'm fully able to do that."

    Vincent Bonventre, a professor at Albany Law School, said nothing in New York law explicitly prohibits same-sex weddings, but that the framers "clearly were contemplating opposite-sex marriages."

    Discussion of gay marriage heated up this month after the top Massachusetts court ruled that anything less than full-fledged marriage for gays there would be unconstitutional. Since then, San Francisco officials have performed more than 3,400 same-sex marriages and have challenged their state law barring such unions. Earlier this week, President Bush endorsed a movement to amend the Constitution to ban the practice.

    A bill in the New York Legislature would ban same-sex marriages. Similar bills have died without action in the past. At least 34 states have enacted so-called defense of marriage laws.

    As word of the New Paltz ceremonies spread Thursday, the number of couples seeking to marry quickly tripled to 12, and the mayor set up a waiting list on the village's web site. By noon Friday, West said more than 100 people had signed up on the Web site, and he had received "innumerable" phone calls and e-mails from others who want to marry.

    Plattsburgh Mayor Daniel Stewart _ New York state's first and only openly gay mayor _ said he will not perform same-sex marriages.

    "I believe in changing the law, but I don't believe in breaking the law in order to change it," said Stewart, a Republican.

    ___

    On the Net:

    http://www.villageofnewpaltz.org

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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    Quote Originally Posted by Farrah_Holiday link=board=1;threadid=6949;start=msg78603#msg78603 date=1077917874

    Jay Blotcher of High Falls, N.Y., said that while West could only give him a certificate and not a marriage license, it was still important to go through the ceremony.
    I am curious as to why these ceremonies are being called "marriages" when a marriage license is not even being issued.
    At least SF issued marriage licenses, now the validity of them is another question.
    My new love...is me !

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    God/dess lestat1's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    While I support giving full "marriage" rights to gays in the form of civil unions, I'm not sure breaking the law is the best way to go about doing it. In this case it's non-violent, so I don't have a real beef with it, but I generally favor chnging unwanted laws instead of breaking them.

    I don't want the government deciding what a marriage is or isn't. It's a religious concept that unfortunately had legal rights attached to it instead of having all couples apply for "civil union" benefits in addition to their religious ceremony of marriage. The two should be seperate. It's up to the members of each faith to decide for themselves what their beliefs are.

    Maybe someday The Supreme Court will change it's mind. I think they're wrong (wouldn't be the first time they were). We shouldn't have laws or regulations based on a particular religion's beliefs (i.e. gay marriage, polygamy, abortion, stem-cell research, etc.)

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    Veteran Member NVJosh's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    The Nevada State Constitution was amended to say that legal marriage can only exist between a man and a woman. The intent of the Self-Righteous Society, er Christian Coalition was for Nevada not to have to recognize gay marriages from other states. However, the broader effect, which most Nevada voters ignored because of the heavy airwave bombardment by the We Know What's Best for You Warrirors, er Christian Coalition is that things such as hospital visitation rights are now denied to all non-married people in Nevada, gay or straight.

    They called it the "Protection of Marriage" act. It should have been the "Protection of Close-Mindedness" act. Or perhaps the "Protection of our Good Old 19th Century Values" act.

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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    I am curious as to why these ceremonies are being called "marriages" when a marriage license is not even being issued.
    Obviously for publicity reasons. Holding a ceremony of sorts allowed the mayor of New Paltz to save face with the gay community and the news media, and to get the free publicity he was seeking, while not issuing them marriage licenses kept the mayor of New Paltz from spending the weekend in jail !

    IMHO this entire situation of the gay community being "used" as a source of free publicity for liberal politicians is approaching the point of disgust. I mean at least when San Francisco's mayor originally started issuing marriage licenses to gay couples there was some (I repeat some) possibility that the actual issue of gay marriages factored into the mayor's actions to a higher degree than obtaining free publicity or posturing for future political benefit. But in New Paltz, the mayor can't even claim that gay marriage was an actual issue at all since he did not issue one single marriage license. IMHO the mayor of New Paltz is guilty of blatantly yanking the heartstrings of the gay community knowing full well that his "ceremonies" were accomplishing nothing at all except garnering the mayor free publicity.

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    Veteran Member NVJosh's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    I dunno, maybe he's hoping to help start a nationwide trend of people who are willing to take a step to further the rights of an oppressed minority. It takes people on that edge to help cause change. Not knowing him or being inside his head, I can only guess at his motivations.

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    Featured Member ami's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    Quote Originally Posted by cardinal link=board=1;threadid=6949;start=msg78542#msg78542 date=1077904416
    I think they should ban all marriages, anyone who gets married has to be a little off in the head.
    yeah, probably...

    "marrige is the most licentious of human institions" -Bernard Shaw, playwrite.

    as for me: happily married 6 months today.

    [hr]

    Even if it is not leagl elsewhere just some places doing it will promt others. gotta chip away a peice at a time.

    certain countries do not honor other countries marrige licences. then if you get married in one, and move to another you have to go do a whole bunch more forms to get your marrige approved there, then they backdate the day to when you were actually married.

    "Protection of our Good Old 19th Century Values" act.
    I like that Josh, maybe you should petition to get the name changed.

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    Featured Member NikkiD's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    YAY!!


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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    N.Y. Town's Mayor Charged in Gay Weddings

    The village's mayor was charged Tuesday with 19 criminal counts for performing weddings for gay couples, an act of defiance that thrust the small community into the center of the national debate over same-sex marriage.
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    The village's mayor was charged Tuesday with 19 criminal counts for performing weddings for gay couples
    ... and the mayor of New Paltz NY was charged even though no marriage licenses were actually given to any of the gay couples he performed a 'ceremony' for. NY wasn't afraid to 'break the ice' in opposing illegal activities for fear of being attacked as anti-gay. Give this a day or two for the extremist liberal opposition to have their say in the news media, and I'll bet that the mayor of San Francisco and of other cities where gay marriages were performed will also find themselves being charged.

    Liberals/democrats are beginning to understand the tremendous mom & pop conservative backlash which is building against them as a result of the gay marriage and other liberal issues. I doubt that any liberal/democrat politician who expects a future in politics will pick up the national torch for the gay marriage cause at this point by publicly and strenuously opposing NY's actions in the national media.

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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    A marriage license from one state is valid just as a driver's license from one state is valid in another, or a divorce is.

    The usage of a driver's license is subject to the state the person is in. If you have a license from NM at 15 1/2, you may not be able to drive a car at night in other states. But you are licensed. This is comparable to being licensed and not being able to drive 80 miles per hour in a school zone. There is not out-of-state prejudice involved in the regulation.

    A nursing (beautician etc.) license from one state still lets you say you are a nurse, but you cannot practice that profession for a fee in another state except with a local license.

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    Featured Member NikkiD's Avatar
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    Default Re:NY performs gay marriages on Fri.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cookie Monster link=board=1;threadid=6949;start=msg78575#msg78575 date=1077911167
    I'm not a lawyer (don't even play one on TV) but I believe that matrimonial rules have always been the province of the states not the federal government (it doesn't involve interstate commerce).

    Each of the 50 states defines who can enter into a "marriage" and the attending legal consequences of entering into that relationship. Currently, all 50 states limit marriage to heterosexual couples. Some states allow same-sex couples to enter into relationships that carry with them varying legal consequences. California and Hawaii, for example, have "domestic partnership" and "reciprocal beneficiary" laws, respectively. Right now, only Vermont allows same-sex couples to enter into "civil unions." To a certain extent, the difference between domestic partnerships and civil unions is a matter of semantics—in theory, California and Vermont could provide same-sex couples the same legal rights under different names.
    HOWEVER:
    Federal law treats "civil unions" and "marriages" differently. So for purposes of federal Social Security and tax law, for example, the U.S. government treats couples who enter into "civil unions" differently than couples who enter into "marriages." (Married couples can file joint federal income tax returns, for example, while same-sex couples who have entered into a civil union cannot.)

    Does that make sense to you guys?
    I belive that you are right! YAY to the mayor for standing up!


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