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Thread: More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

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    God/dess Gynger's Avatar
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    Default More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Its hard for me to not to get discouraged when I work at a club that is very much into numbers when there are more girls on the floor than customers. We run specials and we've got like 12 girls working and 8 customers... And, because I have never really had to hustle in the past at clubs I've worked at, I think I am losing my hustle! I actually had one guy who I asked if he wanted dances, do the "once over look" on me and then tell me no...

    So when I mention to our GM how slow it is, he says, "Girl it must be you"... what does one say to something like that?

    This week has sucked majorally.. usually when I work nights I average $400-600, this week, I've been lucky to come home with 200 and my numbers are low... I need fresh ideas and new suggestions to get my dances, my usual hook lines aren't working...



    Discouraged and feeling unloved.... :'(


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    Member Kelly@AretysAngels's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    My club is often similar to what you are describing. I do a lot of talking so customers come back just to see me. When it is super dead - dont hide in the dressing room or on the phone. Sit with a clear view of the door so you are he first to say hello. Keep a happy face no mater how miserable the night is. They want to be cheered up so make sure you look happier then any other girl in there. Remember - they DO have the money- stick with them for a while. Youve got nohing else to do anyways! Also.. if you have a good friend- work as a team. Better that u boith make a little money then none at all! Good luck. I totally feel you girl!
    Working hard in Florida...
    xxx KELLY xxx

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    Featured Member polecat's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    I don't know how you ladies deal with the amount of rejection that comes along with your work. I'll watch a dancer ping-pong through the club, getting shot down a dozen times in a row... then see her find a corner, heave a sad sigh.. compose herself enough to put back on a smile and go out again, to be shot down more.. heartbreaking!

    You're hot Gynger! Don't forget that. Don't take that "once over" look to be an indication of disapproval with you. Instead, the cheap bastard had no intention to buy a dance and was just copping a free up-close look. I've been with sods that were after a particular dancer to become available, and do that pause/look-over then reject thing to someone approaching for the hustle. It's not you, it's the customer.

    Slow periods are where the payoff for regulars comes in play. All the other pain in the ass nuturing needed with regulars finally balance out for those dead club nights. When you do get a customer, try selling a revisit! As Kelly put so well, *talk* with your customer.. get to know him a little and be personable. If you can sell a few dances with him, before he leaves plant a seed for what night you work next week that are overly slow and try to get a committment for him to re-visit. If you give him fantastic time->value today, then mention it'll be slow a particular night next week where he can get similarly outstanding time->value, chances are pretty good he may return, and do so specifically for you.

    From a customer's standpoint, SC's are all about value and convenience. Most customer's equate value with dancer looks, attitude, time yielded, friendliness and mileage for $$ spent. If you strengthen any two or more of the above in slow periods, they become hustle selling points and make the choice of you over the others a no brainer. Convenience is usually out of your control and has more to do with the customer- such as his schedule, your schedule, how far he has to travel to visit, etc.etc. But altering convenience can be handled by offsetting with value. i.e. asking the customer to revisit next Wednesday when he has other plans is a "no".. offer to double his value (I'll give you 5 dances for the price of 3, or we can hang at the bar for 20 minutes and bring your yacht photos, etc.etc.) and suddenly he may start changing his plans. Some cash sure beats nursing a bottled water for hours on end.

    I know a lot of this may seem common-sensical, but I hope you can find value in some of it! Good luck and go get 'em!
    It doesn't matter if you're somebody in this world, it rather matters you mean the whole world to somebody.

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    Member jeepcane's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Quote Originally Posted by polecat link=board=9;threadid=7699;start=msg88224#msg88224 date=1080245596
    Slow periods are where the payoff for regulars comes in play.
    Amen to that. I am a regular at a SC in a fairly small town. Most of the dancers live out of town and commute. One thing they do with me is to call and leave a message on my cell to let me know that they are working that particular day. While it doesn't guarantee that I will stop by, it always gets me thinking in that direction.
    Another thing that always gets my attention is that most of the girls know that I will have a couple of drinks and chat with the bartender for a bit prior to getting dances. Most of the "regular" girls will stop by and chat for a minute and leave and wait till I come into the dance area. However, everyonce in a while a new dancer will find out my name and stop by and introduce herself, calling me by name. In business, remembering names, knowing names, is always good. For a girl to do that, means that she is just a little sharper than the average girl. She knows how to handle herself, and what she is doing both as woman, and as a promoter of herself. And at least for me, I just have to get to know her.
    Ignorance is bliss, and I just want to be happy.

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    Veteran Member MotherDaisy's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    polecat I loved your post except for the 5 for 3 part. just in case you haven't read it else where on the site it majorly undercuts other dancers and messes up future earnings for all.

    I would be pissed if a GM said that to me. Maybe their cover charges and drink prices are where all the money is going and that is the reason he is not seeing any problems. I wouldn't sell any more drinks or promotional items if I was you. But that probably won't change anything.

    Maybe it is you. It could be your attitude or energy level. Maybe you are coming off badly to the men. Or maybe you rock so much you need to be dancing somewhere that can handle you!!!
    Those who bring sunshine into lives of others, cannot keep it from themselves.

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    God/dess GoldCoastGirl's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    What about...

    More dancers (from 15 to 25) than punters (those who are on the floor)... no dance specials... no drink commissions... sometimes the ratio is more like 3 dancers to every 1 customer or even 1:1 .... no money via the stage (stage tipping is allowed but not encouraged at all).... ???

    We are in the slow season where I am right now and this situation is happening on a Tues and Wed shift more than my Sat and Sun shifts.

    It is my attitude however it is really hard to keep positive when this same situation happens every week and I KNOW it won't get better until June.

    Suggestions, comments, etc ... please


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    Banned Katrine's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    The 3 for 5 is a promise, and should be a bait n switch routine, unless the guy is already a regular. In which case, in order to keep a regular, you need to comp out a few dances periodically so that he feels "special". Hence, I stay away from regulars....

    Pole and everyone...I am quite often that girl who makes the rounds, is thoroughly rejected, sigh, shakes it off, and goes back into the battle.....it gives us a feel what its like for the guys going out and trying to pick up a girl.....

    My tip: when onstage, aggressively work ONE customer, make super eye contact and smile, call him over, talk to him onstage, give him lots of extra time.

    Now, you must choose the prey with the highest potential, and you can strike out by choosing the wrong one....but hopefully, you have 3 stages, and the men are dispersed enough for you to choose multiple targets....


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    Featured Member polecat's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Quote Originally Posted by MotherDaisy link=board=9;threadid=7699;start=msg88426#msg88426 date=1080285247
    polecat I loved your post except for the 5 for 3 part. just in case you haven't read it else where on the site it majorly undercuts other dancers and messes up future earnings for all.
    Ooops! And EEEK- thanks for pointing that out! I realize now there are some circumstances and club models where this would be looked at as undercutting, and should be more specific. (centering on my own geographic/locale again.. DOH).

    Out here, dancers pretty much define their own prices.. and songs. So it's not uncommon to get dances from two dancers in the same club- one being 2-3 songs for $40, and another one song for $60. Dancer's VERY often throw in a free dance or two depending on things (additional upgrade/VIP sale for swaying customer, to the dancer noticing a group of guys observing with interest so as to sell the next dance heh)

    Incentives to specifically fight convenience to force a revisit where a revisit wasn't even on the roadmap are also looked to as different. It wasn't meant to be a new pricing precendent (i.e. if the guy decides to visit a 3rd time, the discount doesn't apply- he should start revisiting on his own after two enjoyable visits with the same dancer), it's meant to get that "next wednesday 9pm" appointment for that one time deal. Free passes, or offering a free drink.. anything to get someone in the door again!

    GoldCoastGirl-
    More dancers (from 15 to 25) than punters (those who are on the floor)... no dance specials... no drink commissions... sometimes the ratio is more like 3 dancers to every 1 customer or even 1:1 .... no money via the stage (stage tipping is allowed but not encouraged at all)...
    Ugh, I was just posting in DollarDen how much this model sucks, and it's bad from both sides, customers and dancers. A club where there are 30-40 dancers and just over a dozen customers- the customer is in for hustle overload, which can start as soon as 10 seconds as he walks in the door as he gets jumped by multiple dancers.. then every 30 seconds as he tries to order/drink his beer.

    If you take the points of value in the last post, offerring better value to the customer in your hustle (be it real or embellished) can put you on top of the other hustles. Slow times are where neato dance tricks learned come in handy because you can intrigue the customer. Five or six standard dance offerrings followed by a woman asking, "Ever seen a spider flip dance move?" makes a customer raise an eyebrow and he just HAS to go see what the hell a spider flip is.

    Getting creative doesn't hurt either! Money is money. A good example of getting creative- one dancer at a DEAD empty club I visited (about 30 dancers, 6 customers including myself), after being baggerred for dances ever 30 seconds, she just sat down and empathized with my plight of wanting to relax. She "invented" a hostess role, made her own pricing model, and sold it as her just being at my side to thwart off the constant barrage of "wannadancers", while also instigating stage tipping and dances with other women. I.e. pay for $20 + 5 ones every three songs, we both go stage side and she tips from her pile of ones, I tip as well, and if I want a dance with her or if I see anyone I want a dance with, she goes and gets 'em for me. I got a ton of singles from the cashier, we got a couple drinks and stage side we went. She made good cash, all the girls dancing on stage made $2-$4 off us (er me) per song... plus two cheerleaders front row in a dead club helps loads with motivation (she also was a howler woot), plus the other 5-6 customers against the back wall were inspired to come forward and stage tip, I had her fetch two dancers for dances during that time.. and got one dance with her before leaving.

    That dancer she converted that visit into a great time, tripled my spending... AND spread the wealth to the other dancers who weren't making jack all night. She had nothing but praise and compliments for every one of her co-workers all night too.

    There are DOZENS of ways to make money in a stripclub if you're resourceful, inventive and offer value over the other women. And looks/mileage don't have as much to do with it since the above example was from a woman that was most definately the least attractive woman in the club and had 0 contact offerings in an SF high-mileage environment. Her attitude sold herself, plus a customer can clearly sense a good thing as she was also including her sister-dancers. There is zero buyer's remorse tipping tipping a dancer that behaves like her.

    So basically- observe your customers. See what things visually appear to annoy them and find a way to "fix it" (for a small fee that is hehe)... see what things they enjoy, and offer it 10-fold better... create, learn, or embellish something unique and intrigueing the other girls aren't offerring and pique the customer's interest... and above all, be as earnest, enthusiastic and fun-loving as a customer can sense all these things.

    It is my attitude however it is really hard to keep positive when this same situation happens every week and I KNOW it won't get better until June.
    Reserve yourself to understand that some nights, there just isn't going to be ANY money. I know it goes against the credo of most Stripper School and Stripper 101, but sometimes the 6-7 customers that wander in on a slow night DON'T have any money. They have $0 in the ATM, and barely scraped up enough for cover charge and a few bucks left for a drink and a tip or two. You should look at every customer as having an endless supply of cash ripe for the taking, but don't take failure of your best hustle methods as always meaning YOUR failure and let it get you down. A lot of times they are just cheap bastards! heh. Other times, they are a "specialist" customer and you didn't stand a chance no matter what you do (i.e. they specifically wont spend a dime, unless you're asian, or black, or a blonde with big implants, they are looking for "extras", etc.etc.). You don't want these guys anyways. hehe.

    Music's a good motivator for shifting mood too. I know a couple dancers that keep a walk-man in the dressing room locker for quick motivation boosts as the other dancers and DJ have crummy music taste. LOL. They take a quick break to get energized by a favorite tune on headphones, drink a bottled water, then hit the floor with a vengeance again. Repeat as needed. There is a distinct difference a customer senses from a dance offer from someone that just rocked out to their favorite tune versus a downtrodden dancer that has just struck out for the past 2 hours straight... no matter how good you think that fake smile is. hehe.

    Sorry for the long diatribe! Extremely bored waiting for an email from work at the moment. Hope some(any) of this helps! :o :o
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Some of it has helped. I really wish that I could do the 'duck out into the dressing room and listen to my favourite tune or something motivational' that you mentioned.... we are only allowed out back for a few minutes UNLESS we are on break.

    My club prefers the dancers to be visible hence the reason why they 'get on our backs' if we are out the back for too long even on a slow shift.

    That would work for me so good however I just can't do it. I can't really do the hostess thing as we already have hostesses.

    Two things that I think will work for me and make me stand out over the other dancers are my ass (it is nice and firm but not too firm) plus how flexible I am... I am one of the very VERY few dancers at my club who can touch my feet behind my ears. It is a little 'trick' I reserve for half hour or longer lap dances.

    You are right about that there are some shifts where there is no money even tho' the whole thing we are all taught is to 'have faith that there is unlimited money making potential every shift we work'. Plus there are those who have a specialty.

    At my club it is optional for the dancer to do a fully nude or just topless stage show. I'm going to mention to the punters that even tho' I will do a nude stage show every time... that I will be more explicit with them if they tip me $10 or more. I might have to encourage stage tipping more on these types of shifts.



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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    This is common in many big cities. I'm working in Vegas now and this is common every day. I just left work at 11 and 15 more dancers were coming in when I left. I'm going back in at 5AM with hopefully less dancers and some older customers.

    I went to work at 1:30 and sold 2 guys. One luckily paid me $200 to sit with him and the fu**ing club wouldn't sell him any more funny money.I could have made another $400 or so off of him. My other customer bought 1 $20 dance. I get really discouraged here.

    Let me tell you, with more girls than customers guys feel intense pressure and here actually push girls away and are mean to them. Over half the girls don't even make their tipouts back. Granted their selling skills are poor but in reality no matter how much girls brag if a dancer CONSISTENTLY has to work under those conditions she will make little or no money with sporadic days in the black.

    Being friendly to the guys and changing the subject and talking to them about something other than buying a dance when then say not right now is your best chance of warming them up for a dance later. And no matter how standoffish the guys get be persistent in talking them into buying a dance.

    I oftentimes say" If you didn't want dances and to have fun you would have gone to a regular bar, right?" I then push them back in their chair and seductively say, I want to dance for you. "Let's do one dance right here at the table so you can see how good my dances are."

    Some guys will push you away somew will say they have no more money and some will buy.

    You just have to be persistent. It's hard when the guys are overwhelmed.

    Your GM was being defensive because he felt personally attacked when you told him his club was slow. In reality if there are 8 customers and 12 girls that club is in bad shape. if you can pull $200 out of a club in those conditions you are truly blessed. I hope things get better because all of you guys are fortunate to get tipout back in a club that slow.

  11. #11
    Featured Member Chili Palmer's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Okay, I realize this is coming from someone whom you probably despise, but let me ask a few things and point out some things for you. If any helps, well, there ya go.

    First, do you really believe pickup lines for guys work any better than the similar, inane lines guys use to try and pick you up? I've said this before: I don't come to strip club to get laps from Paula Poundstone or Rita Rudner; I'm looking for a woman who fits my fantasy profile(s). If you don't and you ask me for a dance, I AM gonna give you the "once over" and then--politely--say "no thank you."

    That said, one thing you can do to increase your lap dance acceptance ratio is to dress and accessorize the best way to accentuate your body type. You have a petite body; you're probably never gonna get a boob hound like me to get a lap no matter how sweet you talk. OTOH, one of my subfetishes (and I am hardly unique) is the "naughty schoolgirl" act. Wear a short pleated skirt, tied white blouse, knee highs and 6" heels one night (pigtails optional). See if your "yes" quotient goes up appreciably--my guess is it will. The outfit may seem trite, but there's a reason why it's considered a classic.

    There's a dancer at the club I frequent who is everything I don't look for, and never gets a lap from me, but when she wears the abovementioned outfit, I always get a couple of laps from her (and tell her not to be too hasty in removing the outfit, too). She's still low mileage low contact, but the fantasy supersedes the touching and we both are happy.

    Remember, you aren't there for you, you're there to make to make money. That means dressing in a manner that maximizes your profit opportunities and acting accordingly. There are very, very few middle aged men (your target demographic) who are into goth, multiple piercings or want to be nagged a la Tina's post in a club--doing this will guarantee you a self-fulfilling prophesy of doom and gloom.

    FWIW,

    CP


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    Banned Katrine's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    I don't know CP, Tina's method has been proven to be very successful for me. You're just one example, and a jaded one at that.........

    "Have you ever been to American wedding? Where is the vodka, where's marinated herring?" - GB
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  13. #13
    Featured Member Chili Palmer's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Jaded?!? Moi?

    Sorry, Katrine, I'm hardly jaded. I'm having as good, if not a better time in a SC than when I first started clubbing over 20 years ago.

    What I AM is in control of my faculties and my money when I'm in a club--no amount of stripper shit or annoying sales tactics can or will work on me--never has, never will.

    As for Tina's comments:
    Being friendly to the guys and changing the subject and talking to them about something other than buying a dance when then say not right now is your best chance of warming them up for a dance later. And no matter how standoffish the guys get be persistent in talking them into buying a dance.
    The first part of this I agree with wholeheartedly. Do be friendly, do be chatworthy, but don't be annoying. Coming back time and time and time again when it is more than apparent I have no interest in getting a dance is just going to piss both of us off.

    Look, I've been trained by some of the best sales professionals in my industry in both Tom Hopkins and SPIN selling tactics. I understand what you're trying to do and respect the effort, truly I do. But I DO NOT COME TO A STRIP CLUB TO BE HASSLED, PERIOD.

    I coined the phrase "mosquito girl" for dancers who keep buzzing around my table asking and asking and asking me for dances. It always ends the same way: when the girl is unable to close me after multiple efforts, she finally asks me the dreaded "Why not?" question. And THAT is not a question you ever want a customer to HONESTLY answer, because you will end up crying in the dressing room and you STILL won't get me to buy a dance.

    I've read most of the posts on this site, and whenever a dancer asks for suggestions for getting better results, it's always the same old BS: sell hard, harder, HARDER. Not one post have I seen where any of the women on this site recommend what should be the first thing anyone in a visual-based profession should do: get a lesson in color matchups. Find out what clothes work best for you, what makeup accentuates your best features and covers up your weakest. Do you look better with short hair or long? Do the shoes match the rest of the outfit? Nails french cut?

    Look, just because I make no apologies for being a mileage hound doesn't mean I don't know what the fuck I am talking about here. There's a reason why I can afford to buy as many laps as I do, as often as I do. Instead of shutting down, or only taking advice from competitors or the husbands/boyfriends/support personnel, why not listen to someone who actually has the money and willingly spends it on the right women? Wow, what a concept.

    CP

  14. #14
    God/dess Gynger's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Quote Originally Posted by Chili Palmer link=board=9;threadid=7699;start=msg95524#msg95524 date=1081743897
    Okay, I realize this is coming from someone whom you probably despise, but let me ask a few things and point out some things for you. If any helps, well, there ya go.

    First, do you really believe pickup lines for guys work any better than the similar, inane lines guys use to try and pick you up? I've said this before: I don't come to strip club to get laps from Paula Poundstone or Rita Rudner; I'm looking for a woman who fits my fantasy profile(s). If you don't and you ask me for a dance, I AM gonna give you the "once over" and then--politely--say "no thank you."

    That said, one thing you can do to increase your lap dance acceptance ratio is to dress and accessorize the best way to accentuate your body type. You have a petite body; you're probably never gonna get a boob hound like me to get a lap no matter how sweet you talk. OTOH, one of my subfetishes (and I am hardly unique) is the "naughty schoolgirl" act. Wear a short pleated skirt, tied white blouse, knee highs and 6" heels one night (pigtails optional). See if your "yes" quotient goes up appreciably--my guess is it will. The outfit may seem trite, but there's a reason why it's considered a classic.

    There's a dancer at the club I frequent who is everything I don't look for, and never gets a lap from me, but when she wears the abovementioned outfit, I always get a couple of laps from her (and tell her not to be too hasty in removing the outfit, too). She's still low mileage low contact, but the fantasy supersedes the touching and we both are happy.

    Remember, you aren't there for you, you're there to make to make money. That means dressing in a manner that maximizes your profit opportunities and acting accordingly. There are very, very few middle aged men (your target demographic) who are into goth, multiple piercings or want to be nagged a la Tina's post in a club--doing this will guarantee you a self-fulfilling prophesy of doom and gloom.

    FWIW,

    CP

    CP;

    Surprise to you: Nope, I don't despise you, even though some of your comments about me on a previous thread were just your opinions, but nothing more, so I can not despise someone for making an opinion of someone (me) even though he only knows me from a forum...

    so with that statement aside, I do agree with you in terms of what you stated about clothes, makeup etc.

    But, I'm not petite- I'm 5'7, 38-26-38 and a natural redhead. I work myself into the ground on some nights and it shows by my money, but in my club, the numbers are more important and its hard to get those 40 + dances when there are 15 girls working and not enough customers to go around. Weather I think, is playing a big factor in my area right now. The weather has been beautiful, which means, less time to frequent clubs. I posted this thread for new ideas, not that my old ones weren't doing the trick, but what I could do to say something different when there are so many other girls working.

    In terms of outfits, I agree with the old standard school girl outfit, but it is worn to death in my club and I refuse to wear it when others are. Instead, I opt out for my lingerie, my lace thigh highs and that usually does the trick for me. Don't get me wrong, I will wear the school girl outfit, and it works well for me when I'm the only one who is donning on the outfit, but it just seems so cliche that sometimes (and I am admitting this against my better judgement) I absolutely am ashamed to be one of those girls "oh look, another dancer in a school girl outfit".

    I know what works for me, that isn't the problem, the problem is numbers. The problem is coming up with something different when the club is full of girls and not enough customers and being able to make a sale and be different in terms of what I say than everyone else.


    Lately, my regulars have been a god send, the club has been dead and hopefully, it will pick up after everyone has gotten over spring fever.


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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    How about wearing a sheer gown slit up the side or a nice long robe? In the dancer seminar we were taught to leave the school girl outfits and bikini's alone.

    In my last days in Memphis, the club I worked at was a lot like what you describe. 15 dancers and 10-15 customers at one time. And every customer is not going to spend money on anyone. So it is impossible for you to make a profit EVERY night no matter how good you are, BUT, the nights you do find one or two guys who are able and willing to play, great selling skills have to allow you to get maximum dances from these guys to compensate for the nights when you make no money.

    Chili Palmer, I don't NAG anyone. I have a very friendly soft ladylike approach with the guys, and the guys who buy from me like that. When I mildly push them back in their chair we have chatted for awhile and the guys still are hesitant to buy a dance. The better customers I have found if you have spent time chatting with them will at least give you something for your time or buy one dance. But in some clubs they don't feel that sense of obligation.

    In certain clubs the guys seem to be more receptive to us than others.

  16. #16
    Featured Member Chili Palmer's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Chili Palmer, I don't NAG anyone. I have a very friendly soft ladylike approach with the guys, and the guys who buy from me like that. When I mildly push them back in their chair we have chatted for awhile and the guys still are hesitant to buy a dance. The better customers I have found if you have spent time chatting with them will at least give you something for your time or buy one dance. But in some clubs they don't feel that sense of obligation.
    Sorry, musta been when you said:

    I oftentimes say" If you didn't want dances and to have fun you would have gone to a regular bar, right?" I then push them back in their chair and seductively say, I want to dance for you. "Let's do one dance right here at the table so you can see how good my dances are."
    and then:

    You just have to be persistent. It's hard when the guys are overwhelmed.
    that had me confused with nagging. My bad.

    That said, let me ask you this: On the "blue" site, there is currently a 3 page thread started by Bridgette with the title "If you don't want a dance, just say no". Now, this is a righteous point brought up by Bridgette and one with which I agree wholeheartedly (and practice religiously when I am in a strip club).

    However, even after I do exactly what all the dancers on this site tell me they want me to do in turning down a dance, according to you it's not nagging to then ask me again and again. So, Tina, my question to you (and any other dancer who practices Tina's method) is, If "no thank you" isn't enough to get you to leave my table, just what are the magic words? How many different forms of the word "no" must I say before you will leave? And isn't it more than than a little hypocritical to on the one hand expect me to follow your rules (i.e., no breast touching) when I am getting a lap instantly and without question but you won't extend me the same courtesy in going away after I turn you down?

    You can't have it both ways. Well, actually you can, but at least admit the truth of it.

    CP

    (with apologies to Gynger for hijacking this thread)

  17. #17
    Banned Katrine's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    So it is impossible for you to make a profit EVERY night no matter how good you are
    I don't know what the problem is ladies, but in 6 years of dancing, I have not once NOT MADE a profit. I've left with a EBT of $100 on a few occasions, but that is the worst.

    ...and I stopped wearing my schoolgirl outfit when I turned 23 or 24, it was time to move on....shit does NOT work for everyone.....

    On a final note Chili, I do agree that the top stripper selling point is her "look" and that is should be one of priority investments for increasing earnings. BUT, when you work in a club with 50 girls, and 35 of them look like perfect Barbie dolls (and not necessarily blonde, big boobs, etc), dancer #51 must find a way to distinguish herself outside of the way she looks.....

    Many a man has been pleasantly swayed by choosing to go "against type" and spend time with a dancer that does not fit his mold....maybe you need to use your imagination more..variety...spice of life..all that cool stufff....

    Chili, you are a sales person, as am I, but not all customers and dancers are inherantly aware of human psychology....but that thing that will never sway you to spend more in clubs is EXTREMELY effective for the 5 lonely hearts surrounding you.....

    Sometimes I don&#039;t feel like selling, and I&#039;ll come up to you and you will get 2-4 dances from me quickly, assuming you like real breasts. Trust me, I can smell your SCJ type a mile away. After the dances, you will let me go, and I will move on feeling I&#039;ve earned my keep. Other days, I will ignore you completely to sit 1 hour with Mr. Lonely next to you, giving you that "fuckoe&#039;d" feeling because I am going to score $600 off him in <2 hours....

    Everyone brings something to the table...

    "Have you ever been to American wedding? Where is the vodka, where's marinated herring?" - GB
    "And do the cats give a shit? No, they do not. Why? Because they're cats."-from The Onion

    Quote Originally Posted by Mia M
    If a cupcake was tossed at me... well, I'd only be upset if it missed my mouth

  18. #18
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Katrine:

    I am with you as well. I have never left with NOT making a profit. My lowest day was $32 (and that was a day shift), and $150 (that was a night shift)...

    I don&#039; t understand these ladies who say that they can&#039;t make a profit... we have them at my club too, and there is money to be found, you just have to know how to find it.


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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    I can sense when a customer is totally resistant to me and after I get him off the subject of buying a dance and then lightly chat with him again as a last resort I then use the sit back and relax approach and try to sell him on one dance.

    If that doesn&#039;t work then I say thanks and leave.

    We know we can&#039;t sell everyone but a few guys will buy if friendly persistence is used and that is what selling is about.

    When guys tell me to come back later, though, I will.

    If you came into my club you wouldn&#039;t be that preturbed with my approach because I am not annoying and I don&#039;t follow you to your chair as soon as you walk in the door.

    But, Chili, you obviously are very defensive with every dancer you meet because you have been hustled so much in clubs. I can sympathize with you on that but every club environment is not pressured.In some clubs hardly any girls will approach customers and that irritates guys too.

    Just try to have an open mind just as we do with you.

  20. #20
    Featured Member Chili Palmer's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Tina:

    I&#039;ll take you at your word. But I am hardly defensive when I go into a club, quite the opposite. What I am is AWARE. I am far from your average SC neophyte (the one the ladies here seem to prey upon with unabated glee) who knows not what awaits him, nor what possibilities exist. I know why I am there, and I know why you are there. If our paths intersect in the form of a lapdance, then we&#039;ll both be happy. If not, c&#039;est la vie.

    I&#039;ve never had a problem saying no to anyone. I was raised in the music industry--my mother was quite a bigwig for one music label and since I was in grade school I have been inundated by people coming on to me for free records, tickets, backstage passes, etc. Just as I carefully picked my friends when I was younger, I now do the same when I am older, especially as I now have to pay $20 for 2 1/2 minutes with my SC "friends".


  21. #21
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    There are a lots of variables involved in a dancer not making her tip out back or clearing not much over it.

    As Polecat said, some nights the club is slow and the clientele just isn&#039;t the spendy type. They could be young guys and don&#039;t have it.

    Many dancers seem ashamed to say they don&#039;t make money every time they work but what is there to be ashamed about?

    This post is about more dancers than customers and in that kind of environment how could EVERYONE be in the black?

    When I work bookings in the Upper Midwest where I work with a controlled amount of girls and get club pay I never leave a club with nothing. And the clubs I have chosen to work even if the weather is bad I still can make $70-$100 plus get paid $66.

    BUT, that is in a club with LESS GIRLS than customers and with more stage time. Even on an off night guys in those clubs are TRAINED to tip on stage and you go on stage more often so you are always making some money. Plus in some clubs we can do $1 dances when we want. Plus in some clubs tip out is only $10 to the DJ and $5-$10 to the doorperson.

    In a bigger city club where you have twice as many girls as customers, with a total payout of $60-$80, one stage set a night and in a club where no one tips on stage and with the majority of customers being young guys in groups, a handful of older guys and the rest bar regulars who never spend any money just sit at the bar and drink, just selling 4 $20 dances to get payout back can be a monumental task.

    I have worked with some top saleswomen who leave early because they can&#039;t sell anyone under those conditions.

    So yes I will say that I always make a profit in Billings MT, Fargo ND, Watertown SD, and the clubs I book in those areas, but not always in Houston, or Vegas clubs where you don&#039;t stand out as much and either you do well or do poorly with no middle ground. That is why I chose to work in those areas. In an environment with a controlled amount of girls in a 6 day booking no dancer who is friendly and a good worker will bottom out. Granted some weeks are better than others but none so bad that you can&#039;t pay the bills and still have spending money left over.

    Gynger, do you work in a juice bar or alcohol one? The amount of customers seems low for a full bar club. With 12 dancers, 25-30 guys at one time and maybe 60-70 guys through the door in a night would be the MINIMUM I would say are needed for everyone to have a chance at making money factoring in that every customer doesn&#039;t buy dances and many are young nowadays.

    Are there any clubs in town that are busy. You are in Boise, right? Any topless clubs there that have 150-200 guys through the doors daily?

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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    sometimes you gotta just turn up the volume of your sex appeal........just be sexy ...put your arm around them and sit on there lap if allowed and flirt,,, chit chat then tell him your dances are better than sex..............lol......it gets there attention and they get a dance.....of course they dont get it but do him a really good dance.

  23. #23
    Senior Member Crystal585's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Find another girl at the club that is in contrast to you, like dark black hair or something like that and work as a team, a lot of guys will go for this even if its slow, after a whole bunch of girls go up and ask him the whole "wanna dance" routine if two start chatting with him and making him think the whole 2 girl fantasy will be more interesting than half the time he&#039;ll go for it. It works much better with men in their late thirties to forties though than the college guys

  24. #24
    Featured Member polecat's Avatar
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine link=board=9;threadid=7699;start=msg96078#msg96078 date=1081823375
    I don&#039;t know what the problem is ladies, but in 6 years of dancing, I have not once NOT MADE a profit. I&#039;ve left with a EBT of $100 on a few occasions, but that is the worst.
    It also depends on a particular club&#039;s payout model.

    Flat-rate clubs with the rate based upon an average business/customer flow become problematic when business really dies down. On the flipside, when business is on the upswing, it&#039;s preferred since the club cut is much lower than it would be with the typical 30-50% per-dance hits.

    A good example is a local club with maybe two dozen dancers on shift. Doing the math- the door traffic coming in needs to generate about $8,000 collectively in dances in order for everyone on shift to "break even" (as in no profit, just pay out). There are most definately going to be nights when that much collective wallets walking through the front doors just doesn&#039;t have that amount to spend. Of course, in this model, when a convention is in town and a collective $30,000-$35,000 pours into the club, the club still only takes that same $8,000 since it&#039;s fixed, the rest is directly dancer profit. The extra traffic incentive for club being an increase in cover and drink/snack sales.

    Smaller flat + commission models are generally much easier to break even or retain SOME profit, but on the heavier nights, the club winds up taking that percentage of the whole, which means bigger and bigger cuts based on traffic on TOP of the door/drink sales increase.
    It doesn't matter if you're somebody in this world, it rather matters you mean the whole world to somebody.

  25. #25
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    Default Re:More girls than customers, rejection and discouragement

    A ggod example of what you said Polecat is in many Las Vegas clubs. Where I worked on night shift the housefee is $65. Plus $5 each to 2 housemoms and you&#039;re out $75. So you need to sell 4 dances to break even.

    With 2 girls for every customer and many of the customers young pimple faced guys in groups the dancer customer ratio is the kiss of death for any dancer to work CONSECUTIVE nights and make a profit.

    When business is good and the clientele is mostly older guys, selling those 4 dances and many more is easy. A high flat house fee and an unregulated amount of dancers is heaven for clubowners as long as dancers still flock in the club hoping tonight is their night.

    At some point when dancers get discouraged with going in the hole 1/2 the time they work and the club owners start having a hard time getting girls, they will have to restructure their housefees.

    In Houston for example an unlimited amount of girls work the clubs but only a bimbo dancer who shows up for work at 10PM would pay a $60 house fee. There housefees run from $5 to around $40 at 8 at night and a girl can work from open to close at the club for the same money and just tip 2 DJ&#039;s $5.

    So in Houston a smart girl working with lots of dancers will come in at club opening time and pay $5 to work and $10 total to 2 dJ&#039;s if she chose to work long hours and 1 dance sold would keep her in the black. The clubs aren&#039;t able to charge as high a house fee there due to heavy competition, so a dancer going in the hole is not as common as Vegas.

    The best situation for todays times was in a club I worked in Indy. No flat house fee, just $3 per dance sold and 10% to the DJ, minimum house fee $12. Of course the big clubs would have no incentive to let unlimited amounts of girls work under this scenario since too many girls in the club would cut down on the amount of dances the guys bought.

    The Indianapolis example is good for the girls but not for the club when dance sales are low.

    At some point when about 1/3 of the dancers out there say fuck it and grow tired of the intense competition and rollercoaster earnings and hang up their shoes, the right balance can happen in the clubs.

    When will lots of girls throw in the towel? I don&#039;t know.

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