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Thread: 400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

  1. #1
    tampafldancer
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    Default 400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    OK.. I'VE been dancing for 2 years and i have never had anyone short change me on dances!
    I don't ask for money upfront, but i'll tell you why i am now.

    About a hour in the vip room, about 22 dances, and 2 discounted dance that management was running

    and he trys to pay me 40 dollors when he was about to leave!! I was like, yeah"you did AT LEAST 20 dances, thats 400 dollors"

    his responce was.. "20 dollors for a damn dance, that a rip off, i think you need to get your bouncer over here so we can talk about it."

    Sure enough i grab the bouncer, and the bouncer grabs management, and he tells the guy in front of me "THERE IS NOTHING WE CAN DO, she should have gotten the money upfront, and he books out of the club right before saying "i need to take your number out of my cell now!!!!!""" DUMB ASS, i hope he found out the NUMBER WAS [email protected]@!!!!!!!!

    But anyway, he was throwing hundred's around from his pocket to his wallet, and management didn't even ask him to pay half??

    This seems really unfair considering this stupid smuck was tying to be hands on the whole time!
    what a creep, and i even went so far to make a compliment to this guy after he made one to me out of kindness! i WOULD HAVE TOLD HIM OFF if he didn't run like a greyhound out of the club!

    What i would do to go back in time!

    But you know what, later that night i had a regular customer MAKE UP for what earning i lost..


    Maybe i should just stick to my other club (i work at several) and that wasn't the classiest ever!



    PLEASE, PLEASE SOMEBODY tell me this has happened to you before.


  2. #2
    tampafldancer
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    I ALSO THINK his responce to my asking for the money was typical of a guy that HAS DONE IT BEFORE!! "I think you need to get your bouncer over here"

    how SORRY IS THAT!!!

  3. #3
    mermaidnz
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    OMG that SUCKS!!!

    can you take hime to small claims court??? i know it sounds drastic, but, damn $400!!! he owes you that legally, you provided the service, now bill him and make him pay.lol

    im glad your regular was there to help

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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    Tampafldancer,next time just make sure like every 5 dances or so you collect.I have been guilty of doing that to butthen you run the chanceof this happeneing.Especially when lots of time lapses like that and the guy gets more and more buzzed.Sorry about that.Did you tell him up front dances were 20.Also I try to ask after every song do you wan me to keep going, then say ok were at 5 now thats 100.

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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    Man my typing is bad today,wtf.

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    Member Synnove's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    That sucks some serious monkey balls. What a DICK! I'm so sorry that happened to you hon. I've had something similar happen to me before, but not quite under the same circumstances. Don't blame you for getting paid upfront.

    And yeah, it does sound like he's pulled that on someone before.

    I may have put the oron in moron, but I didn't put the upid in dumb.

  7. #7
    tampafldancer
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    i do that sometimes too michele, but i guess i was just acting a bit naive here. The guy was well dressed, down for business.. it just didn't make sense!!! The other girls were like "holy shit!!"

  8. #8
    tampafldancer
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    ok, but do all of your managers treat this kind of incident the same? LEGALLY, is that all he can do? hmm

  9. #9
    tampafldancer
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    mermaidz.. i could have paid for your other boob to be removed with that money LMFAO!!!! DAMN, WHAT I WOULD DO TO GO BACK IN TIME!!!

    OH AND SMALL CLAIMS COURT.. if i knew who the hell this guy was??? lol Also, if the club cant do anything legally, im guessing i can't either??? im not sure though. It is a bit too much for me to loose out on. If it was 100, or even 200 i would careless, but this guy TOTALLY USED this situation to his benefit!

  10. #10
    Featured Member sander8son's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    my opinion. since management/bouncers didn't even bother to attempt to detain him and settle it, they just forfeited any money you owe to them for a while. clearly they're not working for you. i say, stop tipping bouncers/management until they dont allow you back in the building anymore. i mean, im sure the bouncers realized that you were in the VIP room or whatever for a long time with this guy......

    you're right, sounds like hes done it before, if he calls the bouncers over. seems like at a minimum if they're not gonna make him pay they should atleast rough him up or fuck with his car. oh well.

    you said you've got another club you work at. so my vote is to definately stop tipping bouncer/paying house fees. fuck this club.

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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    Did he say he had been in before?Did anyone recognize him?There are guys that do this for a living I think. I had one guy tell me one time.I thought you were dancing for me because you like me.Yeah sure.Just make sure from nowon you get your money every like 10 dances at the most.Oh and thats one of the reasons I quit working in florida, the guys can treat you like shit and they do nothing.In chicago big vinny would hve thrown him out on his ass, after he got my money.

  12. #12
    tampafldancer
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    yea... that will last for maybe 10 minutes before they kick me out!!! LOL the funny thing is managment got the money from my regular that night!!! they were like "would you like to pay her house tonight"

    i guess i didn't think twice about it because he does it often.

    i would do it... but it wasnt the bouncers fault really, JUST MANAGEMENT.. sHOULD I BRING IT UP next time i go in to management again??? I don't know!

  13. #13
    tampafldancer
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    hell yea michele/.. This would never happen up north where i worked before!

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    God/dess doc-catfish's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    Quote Originally Posted by tampafldancer link=board=27;threadid=8833;start=msg104080#msg104 080 date=1083459564
    About a hour in the vip room, about 22 dances, and 2 discounted dance that management was running

    and he trys to pay me 40 dollors when he was about to leave!! I was like, yeah"you did AT LEAST 20 dances, thats 400 dollors"

    his responce was.. "20 dollors for a damn dance, that a rip off, i think you need to get your bouncer over here so we can talk about it."
    Elle, was this a "pay by the dance" VIP or did the guy purchase a block of time? I'm assuming the former by what you posted, in which case I say follow Michele's suggestion and have the customer pay up periodically. This also helps deter those unpleasant "how many dances did we do?" disputes. Your count can get a bit fuzzy after twenty, but almost no one loses count after five.

    If it was the latter then collecting up front if generally the standard, because whether it's a three minute dance, or a one hour VIP, the customer is purchasing ONE UNIT of service which he/she will be obligated to pay for.

    I don't ask for money upfront, but i'll tell you why i am now.
    Before you punish all your customers for the actions of one, consider the reasons why you never asked for the money up front in the first place.

    Even in clubs with a prepay policy, I've seen more than a few dancers who will go against that policy and let the customer pay off the tab at the end, (or at least periodically) at their own risk, because they feel that they will lose more in sales by following the rules.

    As far as, can your club management do anything to get your money back, probably not considering that there is no documentation proving the transaction took place, or that the services rendered are technically illegal in a lot of localities. Yes, I'm in agreement with you and others here that he's pulled this stunt before.

    Just chalk this up as a lesson learned, and in the future follow whatever payment policy works best for you.
    Former SCJ now in rehab.

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    Featured Member The_Oceans's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    I agree with michele and doc-catfish. Especially if it's VIP (let's say 3 dances/$100), I would suggest collecting every three dances (or whatever the "unit of service", as referred to by doc-catfish).

    I also think this particular club is run by a group of single-celled amoebas. Didn't they realize than their lack of effort on your behalf means money lost for the club? (Because I would assume that if they are taking a % of your take, that means the club doesn't get their cut of the money not collected from your deadbeat.)
    "Women, not girls, rule my world" - Prince

    "No parking on the dance floor" - Midnight Star

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    As far as, can your club management do anything to get your money back, probably not considering that there is no documentation proving the transaction took place, or that the services rendered are technically illegal in a lot of localities. Yes, I'm in agreement with you and others here that he's pulled this stunt before.
    From a legal standpoint, this is exactly correct. The only proof you could offer in a court of law that this customer actually accepted services from you but did not pay you is your own word against his. If you or the club attempt to drag this customer into small claims court, he could just as well claim that he paid you in full or that YOU did not deliver. Such is the risk of an undocumented financial transaction in exchange for an unobserved private dance.

    Worse, bringing this matter before any court could raise questions as to whether private dances are truly 100% legal in your area. If they aren't, then you'll lose the judgement anyway since a person can't be held to an illegal transaction. Either way, it would give the court and local law enforcement reason to start being interested in the goings-on at your club.


    Those bouncers needed to take that guy and shove him in the trash can. I swear, I would've reached in his pocket and grabbed the money myself. I can't believe they didn't force him to pay the money he owed.
    A club doing this only compounds the undocumented transaction problem. Forcibly collecting money from a customer based on only the word of a dancer would legally make the club an accessory to a crime if the customer claimed that the dancer had already been paid or had not actually delivered, and then the dancer tried to rip him off by claiming she was not paid thus trying to collect the money twice. I'm certainly not claiming that Tampa did this (in fact I'm sure she's the victim here), but in a court of law there is no hard evidence to prove that she didn't try to rip this customer off. Given the prejudices of cops and judges in regard to strippers and strip clubs, it's entirely possible that they could believe the customer's story. This could in turn subject the dancer to bogus charges of petty theft, and subject the club and bouncers to bogus charges of assault and petty theft if they had accosted the customer and forcibly taken $400 from him. Welcome to impartial justice for strippers, where the victim risks being charged with a crime unless she can prove her innocence with hard evidence !


    I also think this particular club is run by a group of single-celled amoebas. Didn't they realize than their lack of effort on your behalf means money lost for the club?
    The reverse could just as well be true. If less than the whole story got around among club customers, i.e. that management was helping girls rip off customers, it would be bad for the club as well as the dancers. I assume that management was actually being "smart" about this from their own perspective, since they avoided creating an incident which would be overheard by other customers. True that Tampa was screwed out of $400, but from a cold hard business standpoint on the part of the clubowner, the club would have risked losing much more money if an adverse reaction occurred regarding other customers.

    Chalk this one up to experience, and think of it this way. Letting customers run up 10 or 20 dances without "breaking the mood" has enabled you to earn lots of money in the past, and without any similar occurrences. If you had "played it safe" and forcibly "broken the mood" every few dances to make sure that you collected the customer's money, how much income would you have lost over the weeks or months or years that you have been dancing compared to losing $400 this one time ? This guy was a pro and an asshole, but that's no reason to start thinking that every customer is looking to rip you off.

    As with every situation involving strip clubs and the law, you need to let go of the idea of justice for all and face pragmatic reality that, in the absence of hard evidence, cops and courts will always take the word of a "fine upstanding citizen" over the word of a dancer. You also need to look at the situation pragmatically from a financial standpoint, and measure what you have gained against what you have lost.

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    Featured Member sander8son's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    hmmmmmmmmm, what about in the future, if some guy shortchanges you like that just grab him by the balls and squeeze really hard. again, he can't really press for assault, how could he prove it? even if it didn't make him cough up some money, i think itd be worth it to nearly pop one of his nuts. he may learn the error of his ways and not try to screw over the next girl.

  18. #18
    Member Fantasia's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    Here is a question of the top of my rambling mind.

    I do not know who it is for you all where you work, but in SD we are labeld independent contractors as we do not recieve an income other than tips. If you are cheated out of money by a customer, why couldn't you (if you had all the info you needed and you are not worried about possible law breaking in the bar, etc. etc.) you take him to court?

    And why should the bar be involved? You do not work for them?

    Just idle questions I asked myself as I was reading this thread. And if they seem silly, they probably are, it was a crappy night at work and I have yet to sleep.
    It's a mouse thing. You wouldn't understand.

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    God/dess VenusGoddess's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    Wow...when I go into VIP with someone...they pay by the hour, not the dance. So, when we're talking about going up there...I make sure they have the cash, and they pay before we get up there. The only time I don't do that, is if they have a credit card and give it up and sign the slip before I do anything.

    But, yeah...if you do by the dance, then you need to collect after every couple of dances. I had one guy get 3 dances in a row and then hand me a $20 and say that he "was all out of money". Grrr...but, never lost that much before. Sorry to hear that!

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    Veteran Member Rayleen's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    I think it's a thrill seeking thing, not unlike shoplifting when you get down to it.

    There definatly are a fair number of customers who do that ON PURPOSE. And most clubs will tell you to get your money upfront and that they can not help you if you get stiffed. Customers know this and so some try to steal dances.

    I learned that lesson pretty quickly when I first started dancing. I never got taken for more than a few dances but it was enough for me to start asking for my money upfront. However,when I first started doing that I gave in to a some of the guys who seemed offended at the request only to have most of them come up short anyway. I began to see a pattern~Guys who complain or refuse to pay upfront are most likely the ones who will try to shortchange.

    I also prefered the by the hour version of VIP rather than by the dance and I think alot of customers do too. Sometimes I'd even offer a mini vip in the mainroom if I could tell the customer wasn't up to spending over 100. For example, I'd offer like 15 min for 50 if vip was 200 an hour. I had lots of customers go for those

    A note on doing deals like that~ be mindful to keep your specials in line with club pricing like I did above or you'll tick some people off right quick














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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    If you are cheated out of money by a customer, why couldn't you (if you had all the info you needed and you are not worried about possible law breaking in the bar, etc. etc.) you take him to court?
    Yes, if the dancer was an independent contractor, then it would have to be she who initiated a small claims court action. However, all of the same legal points apply. She can't positively prove through documentation that the guy agreed to pay a certain amount, she can't positively prove that she actually provided services which the customer refused to pay for. It basically boils down to a case of the word of a stripper against the word of a respected businessman, with the court/police being inclined to give the respected businessman the benefit of the doubt.

    There's also the open issue that if the private dance involved technically illegal levels of contact that the court would be bound by law to refuse to force the customer to pay even if the court found that he had 'stolen' her services (since those services could have been technically illegal). Also, by bringing the case to court, the dancer must provide her own personal information, which opens Pandora's box in regard to the court/police/IRS investigating her or the club she works at. And if the guy is a real asshole, he could testify that the dancer was providing 'extras' - which would result in the guy not having to pay anything due to the supposed illegal services provided, but could also result in the dancer herself facing a prostitution charge and having to pay another $1000+ in bail and legal fees rather than walking out of court with the money she is owed !

    All in all, starting a court action would involve much more negative risk from the Pandora's Box factor than any positive chances of actually receiving the money she is owed.

  22. #22
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    so sorry to hear tampafldancer, yeah I know what a bummer that can be. Check out the thread below for more ripped off by the customer stories...



    Interestingly enough, I read a little tidbit in the local paper about a month or 2 ago, you know those little police beat logs? Anyhow, 2 girls in my area called the police on a customer who ripped them off. The charge (and I do think this guy was actually ticketed! but I'm not too sure I wish I could find the article!) was defrauding an inkeeper. Even more funny this was the same damn club at which I started this thread!!!


  23. #23
    God/dess Bridgette's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    Yeah I'd say that guy makes a habit of that. He flashes hundreds to make you feel comfortable with doing lots of dances without getting paid right away, then tells you to get the bouncer when you ask for the money he owes.

    Managers don't back dancers in situations like this because it is not in their interest to do so. It's not that they CAN'T do anything, it's that they DON'T WANT to, because then they might, god forbid, run the risk of getting a 'bad rep' with customers for actually enforcing payment of prices that ARE SET BY THE CLUB. This is why I liked the way Divas was run - the customers had to pay for every VIP session up front, period. Oversensitive whiny customers can get stuffed for all I'm concerned - they buy they pay, wtf are they so damn sensitive about paying for a service up front for? Payment is payment, no matter what time you pay it!

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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    God/dess Bridgette's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    So what? That is totally irrelevant to this topic. It's about a girl who picked a guy's pocket - has nothing to do with whether or not he paid up front. She would have picked his pocket regardless. The topic HERE has nothing to do with that.

    I stand firmly by my statement. Why should ANYone be expected to perform a service without getting paid first?

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

  25. #25
    Member pinkie's Avatar
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    Default Re:400 dollors and "GET YOUR MONEY UP FRONT"

    sevearl times i've been ripped off a customer asks for dances and i ask if they got money for me to keep dancing yes they say and then they dont have it...........hmph!!! i tell the bouncer and he said the same thing....should of got the money up front........so now i do, most of the time.

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