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Thread: Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

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    Default Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Hello all! I work in Columbus, Ohio and have for the past 12 years. I left dancing in 2000 and have returned this year. This time had been a complete disappoinment. I work in a nude club that used to be a juice bar but is now byob. That was hard to get used to. I was forced to work dayshift until the last few weeks. Money at night has been better, but not what I am used to. I make between $100-$300 a night. What I have noticed is that the clientel is young, wannabe rappers. Most dancers here dance to rap or r&b. I do not. I have had customers literally complain to me that 'they don't listen to this shit' and loudly rap over my music. None of these custmers ever spend more than a dollar. We get a lot of groups of young kids with their female friends who as well do not spend and are only there to hear the rap music. I have considered working at a topless club which would be more upscale. However, those clubs have this same problem as well. I have posted on stripclublist.com to see if there are any clubs here in Columbus that are not ghetto. I have received a response that said that Columbus market is pretty much all ghetto. I don't speak ghetto, therefore trying to talk to these customers is like trying to speak a foreign language. Also, most customers want a 'lap' dance or some sort of touching which is illegal here. Dayton, Ohio is only 45 minutes away, and I am waiting for a response about the clubs there. Anyone here work in Dayton? Are all clubs like this now? Is it the new thing now just to go to strip clubs to listen to music and just tip?
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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    I can relate to alot of what you're saying and I'm 2000 miles away from you! I've definately noticed a decline in $ in my area; what used to be average is now good. Many girls (actually most) in my club play hard core gangsta rap and then here I come on stage with my boppy electroclash although I've never experienced somebody so rude as to rap over my music. I know what you mean about the young groups of friends too

    45 minutes away is not far at all I say it's worth a shot.


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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Assuming that you were 19 to 21 twelve years ago, you are now in your early 30's anywhere from 31 to 33.

    From my perspective there has been a massive culture change from the early 90's to the first decade of the twenty first century.
    Both in youth culture, corporate culture, and society in general.

    The same thing sort of happened to me at your age but the change in the last decade has been more pronounced I belive.
    When I have fully figured it out I can write an article and make some money or a book. Obviously I haven't figured it out yet, but the cultural change is very pronounced on early 30's somethingsd verus
    early 20 somethings now.

    You remember things and music and Youth culture as it "should be."
    Obviously a youth culture that worships "gansta" culture
    shouldn't be a broad societal norm but for some reason it has become widespread. It is also in the mexican immigrant community which is a bit odd and the asian imigrant community which is very odd.

    By your early 30's you know about car insurance, mortgage and rent payments, credit reports, working in large and small corporations
    and "responsibility." Your framework of reference of real world experiences is bigger and you no longer "fit" in the artificial youth culture model of whatever happens to be the present model.

    You probably need to be in a much higher end club with older business clients. They would appreicate you more and believe it or not you could probably relate to them better than an 18 year old byob club. With a hard drink license, a club would automatically screen out 18 to 21 year olds which would give you a two to three year client profile boost right there. A business oriented club
    in an office market (for example) would further up the profile to
    start of 25 and older.

    These are just trends I've noticed, and I have not been able to connect all the dots so to speak. Tends ot tie into my philosphy of picking clubs by location and quality of physical plant because they are hard physical and economic facts and not subjective like
    comments on "hot girls" or dancer looks. Those would be subjective secondary criteria.

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Very well said, niceguy.

    Catfly - perhaps you should go for the metrosexuals
    Columbus Ohio I heard was a major IT center (dunno about now).

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    catfly, I hear you about the possibility of not being able to find a single club in your home town where it's still worth spending 6-8 hours per night. The culture shift phenomenon, the poor economy (or poor customer spending habits) and the anti-dance club ordinances hit my own hometown a few years earlier than yours. As a result, in order to make dancing live worthwhile for this 30+ dancer, I find it necessary to travel extensively.

    I'd definitely give Dayton clubs a look at least. You really have nothing to lose except a few gallons of gas and a few lost $1 stage tips at Columbus clubs.

    Also, most customers want a 'lap' dance or some sort of touching which is illegal here
    This is something else which has grown out of a poor economy in conjunction with anti-dance club ordinances. These days, in the majority of clubs in the majority of cities, in order for a dancer to earn decent money it's virtually unavoidable that customers will expect her to 'bend' the law. Other dancers working in the same club will also readily 'bend' the law to give the customers what they want (which guarantees that you'll have trouble selling private dances if you don't do the same). This leads to a situation where dancers find themselves looking over their shoulder constantly, as they must routinely 'bend' the law in order to earn enough money to make dancing worthwhile, but at the same time they face the potential risk of a bust, bail, legal fees, a black mark on their criminal record etc.

    This looking over the shoulder phenomena causes more stress for me than any other aspect of dancing. Unfortunately, in order to avoid this phenomena, you will probably have to travel extensively to upscale clubs in big cities. You'll also have to convince these upscale clubs that they should hire a dancer who is 30+ years old with a head on her shoulders, versus a hot but naive 21 year old.

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    That's why I will only work in clubs that serve drinks and are over 21 admittance. I really feel for you . I'd say try to make the drive and look for a club that requries patrons to be 21. Sometimes though you will get those wanksta wannabees but I just ignore them unless I see other girls getting dances over at their tables.

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Quote Originally Posted by catfly link=board=27;threadid=9067;start=msg107399#msg107 399 date=1084197353
    Dayton, Ohio is only 45 minutes away, and I am waiting for a response about the clubs there. Anyone here work in Dayton? Are all clubs like this now?
    Im not a dancer but I am a Daytonian and thought Id throw in my 2 cents. With the exception of Diamonds in Centerville, Dayton clubs are topless, low to medium contact (depending on the club) and full bar. I havent counted them but Id guess there are around a dozen or so clubs. Several are pretty scary but youd do OK at The Living Room (my home club) or Pizazz. Both are very nice, clean and well managed for the most part.

    Money has been up and down in this area from what I understand. Many of the ladies depend on regulars for most of their income.

    FBR
    Once again I have embraced my addiction and have put off the moral dilemma to another day.

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    The younger crowd is more prevalent in almost all clubs nowadays, whether they are upscale or not.

    I would not blame the music for your earnings problems. I posted recently about clubs having many more young guys in groups than they used to and less older customers.

    There is a place for all types of music in clubs. I am black and 30+ and my music of choice is classic R&B and new R&B with some popular not so hard hip hop songs mixed in. I respect some dancers who play country, techno, and rock. Any person with half a brain on his shoulders who goes to a club understands that he will hear a variety of music in a club and not expect to hear what he listens to on custom made cds in his car all night in the club.

    But when you work in a byob club in a town where full bar clubs exist you will have a higher number of young guys in groups than the already high amount in the alcohol clubs.

    And if you work in a place where the dances offer no contact when guys previously were used to contact, that explains no money. Your target customers are not going to patronize the clubs anymore.

    Even if the club played all "white" music you still will have the party young crowd there.

    Club owners are a lot of the problem as they need to train their DJ's to run dance specials and 2/1's and push tips hard when the crowd isn't spending money on dances. Younger guys aren't going to spend $100 plus on dances while with a group of friends. They have lots of dating options older guys don't have.

    Even with the shittier strip club scene nationwide, as a general rule, with only a few exceptions the juice and byob bars attract the young crowd. And if you are an older dancer, you will be working with many more younger dancers and if the young guys do spring for a dance or 2 the 22 year old dancer will more than likely be who they will choose over you. I would say your focus should be only on the full bar clubs.

    I face the same problem. I don't do well with younger customers with a few exceptions.

    And Melonie is right, many higher end club managers think the college aged white dancer is what the guys crave when I repeatedly see gilrs in their late 30's and 40's outselling these girls as the target customers have more in common with a well kept 35-40 year old dancer than one their daughters age.

    Just last week the 45 year old former miss nude dancer I worked with had guys in to see her every night. Several young dancers were upset but hey, she cultivated her business and all of her customers were in their 40's and 50's. There was no need for those girls to be upset. They hadn't taken the time to market themselves and develop a clientele and she had.

    My two cents worth. Avoid the byob and juice bars and only work full bar clubs. If that means driving or traveling you will have less frustration in the end. At least in those clubs every customer won't be young.

    Now if you were working in a baller environment wherethe DJ was playing the songs Tip Drill, Booty Poppin' and Freek a Leek and the girls were shaking their booty on stage and the young ganstas were spanking the girls on the butt and throwing hundreds of dollars on the stage as they are in the videos of those songs, you would probably enjoy that crowd more as you are coming off stage with several hundred dollars LOL!

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Just to clarify: our customers have never been used to lap dances or contact. I was wondering if other non-contact clubs were having this problem as well. Also, I don't necessarily blame the music - I like some rap & I think a lot of r&b is sexy. I blame the environment & our culture. For instance, 9 of the 10 dancers working play rap & r&b. I play Depeche Mode, Tricky, Book of Love, and 80's rock. I stick out like a sore thumb. However, the older customers we get - which may be 2 or 3 for the whole night - prefer this music to the ganster rap.
    Luckily, I am 31, but I look 24 :-) .
    Also, do the $100 tipping on stage exist anywhere except in videos? I would love to work there!
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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Quote Originally Posted by catfly link=board=27;threadid=9067;start=msg107685#msg107 685 date=1084239566
    Also, do the $100 tipping on stage exist anywhere except in videos? I would love to work there!
    Happened to me on Friday (may 7th, 2004), but this is rare. I will go over $50 on a weekly basis, but the over $100 on stage is really quite rare, maybe only every 3 months or so. Mostly I average about $15-20 per two song stage set.

    Oh, I dance mostly in Oregon, but travel often to other locations around the northern US and Nevada.


    Promote yourself and earn more money! This is a business that is owned by strippers for strippers. Let's make that money!


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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Just to clarify: our customers have never been used to lap dances or contact.
    Well, this is one of life's great ironies. In many cities, passing strict anti-dance club ordinances in fact results in making the clubs higher contact than they ever were. This stems from a simple two step principle - if dancers can't make decent money following the letter of the law, girls will "bend" that law. If girls are willing to "bend" the law, and if the ordinance makes the penalties for "bending" the law virtually the same as if the dancers threw the law out the window altogether, then girls really have nothing to lose and lots of potential income to gain by offering even more contact than they did before the ordinance was passed !

    Put another way, if a dancer risks a $500 fine for dancing closer than 6" to a customer during a table dance, and also risks the same $500 fine for giving a customer full contact lap dances, why wouldn't she go for the lap dances in hopes of earning $500+ a night instead of $200- ?

    Even more extreme, in the event of a bust, the girls giving lap dances can probably afford to retain a top notch connected local attorney, with some hope that when they go to court that the charge will be dismissed or reduced, plus their records expunged. On the other hand, the girls not doing lap dances and earning peanuts probably won't be able to afford a high powered attorney and will wind up using a public defender instead. These girls will probably wind up being found guilty and paying the entire amount of the fine as a result, with a misdemeanor charge remaining on their permanent record.


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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Catfly, I'd start driving over to Dayton and get hired into a club or two there ASAP. The only way you will get much business in your current club is if you start 'conforming' to what the punk want. But you likely won't be comfortable, which will show, and will hurt your money. I agree with the others that you'll do better in more upscale topless clubs.

    FBR posted good info about some Dayton clubs. I'd check them out if I were you.

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    In Columbus you may want to try The Dollhouse. I've heard that it's not doing as well as it used to, but the day shift there was especially nice - older, corporate customers. Kahoots also seemed okay. It's a restaurant with naked girls in it. You'll get more of your target customers, but probably have to work harder for their money. Both clubs are pastie and offer lapdances with minimal contact (must keep both feet on the floor at all times).

    Lena



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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Much of our target customer base is still scared at the economic crunch we've been under for the past several years and isn't confident enough to go out and spend in clubs as often as they'd truely like

    Add to that the political climate being more conservative since the famous WhiteHouse BJ our target customers are more nervous about club busts and don't go or go alot less often. Many clubs have been regulated to death and some customers just aren't going anymore. And finaly the clubs that are totaly legal are often the big showclubs and are just not affordable to most middleclass guys.


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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Thank you all for the posts. I may give Dollhouse another try (I worked there a few years ago for about 2 months). However, I would rather have the nightshift. The dayshift where I work now has the correct clientel; just not enough of them. I can't make a living on 5-10 customers a day - even if they are the businessmen. Sometimes they spend, and sometimes they don't. And, I am gonna venture out to Dayton as well. I still fill-in on dayshift at my club 2 days a week in order to work 3 nights. I worked today and did well. I made $160. Not bad for dayshift. However, yesterday I only made $20 (We had business, but only 2 dancers - customers stayed just to see us dance once and leave).
    Also, I noticed our money comes in spurts. One week will be good, the next bad, the next good, the next bad. It has been about every other week that is good here in Columbus. That must be due to everyone getting paid every 2 weeks. My husband gets paid this week, and so I will see if this week is good. I do think everyone is about on the same payroll rotation.
    Anyway, just a thought.
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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    We get quite a bit of the 18 y.o.'s with the thuggish attitude and no money! I'll be turning 28 this week, so I know where you are coming from! I have little patience for this! 10 years ago, it was older business like men, but now, its few and far between!


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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    As I've said before elsewhere, demographics are working against the SC business. The older businessman who visits SC's while out of town, and who used to be your bread and butter, is becoming scarce. Many of us guys have retired, voluntarily or otherwise. And those who are left no longer have the free evenings to go clubbing, what with changes in the way business is now done (eg. email). My advice: do everything (within reason) you can to cultivate and hang on to a handful of older regulars, their numbers are declining. You may have to work harder at marketing yourself, which may include staying in closer touch by phone, meeting for lunch, anything to make him feel special. I know many of you hate the thought of doing this but you may not have much choice if you want to continue earning a living in this business.
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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    Fondl is absolutly correct IMHO .

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    Default Re:Wrong clientel - is this everywhere?

    It makes sense that with companies watching expenses and key employees having out of town meetings via e-mail and conferencing thus traveling less that their numbers at clubs would be less.

    Most older guys are married and that also explains why they go to the clubs during the day when they have a light schedule. Earlier hours definately have more older customers.

    And Catfly I admire your honesty. No dancer can take for granted selling even one dance anymore and $160 for a dayshift or even a night one depending on the clientele and other variables is not always as bad as it seems.

    Many dancers act like $700-$1000 a night is a piece of cake and they make that all the time where in reality I want to work with the dancers who make that amount 5 days a week 50 weeks per year. Of course there are a few exceptions but the problems you are mentioning Catfly are real and affect more dancers than those willing to admit it.

    I have noticed that the weekend of the 1st and 15th or right after it is better than times in between.

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