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Thread: Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

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    Default Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    I know alot of threads have touched on this subject but I wanted to bring to everyones attention the injustic of there not being alot of black dancers in upscale clubs. Now I am not black but do have black girlfriends and I noticed alot of very beautiful black dancers recently get turned down at auditions at my club recently. I think black women are very beautiful. Infact I think most women of color are usually more beautful than white women (expecialy mullato women but that is just my prefference) If I were a man quite frankly I would be pissed at the lack of black women in my club and lack of women of color generally in upscale gentlemen's clubs. I know everyone says that upscale gentlemen don't like women of color that much but it really upsets me when the tell a sexy black dancer that we are full of dancers and then the next day hire a white dancer that was half as pretty and half as charming. Why is this going on in 2004?

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    lilac-
    I've seen the same thing in my relatively small-time club. I've seen quite a few black dancers get hired only to last a few weeks a month tops in my main club.

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    It is extremely unfair. I work in a couple of upscale clubs and there are many men who like dancers of different ethnicities. And shame on club management for not taking heed to that fact.
    Money is congealed energy, and releasing it releases life's possibilities. ~Joseph Campbell

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    I think it's a stupid move for any club not to have a variety of ethnicity. My favorite club was really good about that and I can't tell you how many times I heard customers say they wish more clubs would get on the ball with that!

    Many people are so beautifully mixed now-it makes for some of the most interestingly gorgeous women

    I have this theory that the answer to world peace actually lies in the mixing of races. Race supremest types just hate me

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    tampafldancer
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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    lilac, im just curious.. Are you spanish?

    anyway. i do agree that beautiful black women get turned away when half as pretty white girls and even hispanic etc get the job.

    I hear that its all about what the men coming into the club like, but sometimes i think a managers decision may be a little jaded.

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    tampafloridadancer I am a mix of half brazillian, quarter german and quarter french. It was funny growing up I always had white friends and I always wanted to be blond with blue eyes and and I would purposly stay out of the sun to not get any tanner. My mother would always tell me how lucky I am to have a mix of such ethnicity and one day would appreciate my dark looks. Now I think Mariah carrey, stacy dash, halle berry and other black women are sooooooo beautiful

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    Here in detroit african american woman are all over the strip and i agree lilac they are absolutley gorgeous (i agree on your statement about mullato girls as well) but as the clubs get nicer it is rare to find a woman of color or mass numbers of them and i have a lot of colored friends as well who are great buisness ladies beautiful classy and charming in comparison to some of the white women hired, i dont understand why its like fuck man youd think being able to be in a nice club and indulge in all the different races of beautiful women would be like heaven lol i know alot of black girls that dance fucking awesome and unique as well i dont know what we could do about the situation but i can definetley tell you i agree babe
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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    Yeah Destiny have you seen mixed girls with like dark skin and light eyes. Grrr they make me so jelouse! LOL just kidding! This is so messed up. I can not imagine being a black dancer in my city. There is one all black club in town but it is pretty much a brothel and black girls who can not get hired at clean clubs becuse the clean clubs have "too many" black dancers at one time end up there. In that sense I am really glad I am not black because I have seen many pretty black girls get turned away.

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    i do agree. I believe black/white mixed women can be the most beautiful!!

    i have a friend who is italian and black.. and wow!!
    but look at vin diesel, hes pretty nice looking too!

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    dark skin light eyes definite hottie lol im with you there lilac you know who i absolutley love stacy dash shes fucking hot is she mixed, even if not her eyes are so beautiful!
    So you buried all your lover's clothes and burned the letters lover wrote, but it doesn't make it any better. Does it make it any better?
    And the plaster dented from your fist in the hall where you had your first kiss reminds you that the memories will fade. -Dashboard Confessional

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    Quote Originally Posted by AnneKatherine link=board=27;threadid=9697;start=msg116029#msg116 029 date=1086025086
    It is extremely unfair. I work in a couple of upscale clubs and there are many men who like dancers of different ethnicities. And shame on club management for not taking heed to that fact.
    In order for management to take heed to that fact, or any other fact period it would require them to pull their heads out of their asses,coke pile, some whores twat etc and actually give a flying fuck about what goes on in the clubs as opposed to how much money they bank, dancers they bang or coke they snort on a weekly basis

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    I have to believe that the corporate clubs at least have researched and modeled the customer base and customer preferences of various cities. The fact that black dancers comprise a much higher share of dancers in Atlanta versus NYC, for example, has a lot more to do with the nature of the upscale customer base between the two cities than any racial prejudice on the part of corporate club management. I grant you that for an independent club, the all powerful owner may be to blame for enacting a policy of limiting black dancers. But when corporate chain clubs do different things at clubs owned by the chain in different cities, this can't be explained by clubowner prejudice alone.

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    Well I guess with all their research they figure white men (who frequent gentlemen's clubs the most) do not like different ethnicities. This research is perplexing to me because I would consider myself a "woman of color" I guess but I dance for 80% white men a night. I would consider myself a dancer that makes very consistant money. So what gives? ???

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    That's too bad to hear, although as I've gone I've noticed several newer black dancers that I've not seen before. Keep in mind I'm only there once a week.

    I'll have to get the scoop from my faves, two of which are "minorities."

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    I work in a small upscale gentlemen's club. However, my club is in the south. There are total of 5 black dancers, 1 asian, and 3 latinas. The last two minorites men seem to be a hell of alot more comfortable spending money on them, then me and the other 4 females that work here.

    Our stages age usually empty(even though i and another female do not dance to much hip-hop at all).
    It takes quite a while for customers to warm up to me, and it takes even longer for the girls who's skin tone is darker than mine.

    In fact, one gentleman who used to look the other way when I was on stage finally came up to the stage to tip me this past week. After I came off stage I went over and talked to him, I think he finally realized I was a great girl too.

    Oh well, I mean Im sure it is just as bad for the few cacausian females in all black club. Black men dismiss them before they even get a chance to say hello.

    I might not ever be the top earner at the club because of this, but I will be damned if it will stop me from trying.
    I cant make some guy get a lap dance from me or take me to the champange room, it his choice.

    However, I will admit I find myself developing a certain nervous tick, when a guy wont tip me at all, but will run up a tip the girl with the tan dancing to "salt shaker" botty poppin and all.

    Oh well, who knows tomorrow night maybe things will change. I can dream.

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    This research is perplexing to me because I would consider myself a "woman of color" I guess but I dance for 80% white men a night. I would consider myself a dancer that makes very consistant money. So what gives?
    I would have to take a wild guess that your experience is somehow related to the probability that 80% of your club's customers (or at least 80% of those customers spending major money on private dances) are white men.

    A club owner told me once that "as an employer, the government can order you to hire a certain percentage of blacks & hispanics. But nobody can order customers to do the same thing. It doesn't do any good to bring in more black dancers if my customers aren't going to buy as many private dances from them, and if my customers then wind up standing in line waiting to buy dances from the remaining white girls."

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    I really disagree about corporate club owners doing research when it comes to hiring women of color.

    Corporate clubs don't operate like major department store chains who look at demographics when deciding which store should carry MAC or ethnic brands or high end designers.

    I worked for several of these so called chains in the past and for example the owner of the Christie's chain, Steve Cooper is a bigot from Memphis. He would tell white dancers they were cheapening themselves by dancing for blacks.

    Another club owner would charge the black dancers at his club higher tip outs.

    And another would not allow a white dancer to approach black men.

    Another wanted 3 ids from black men at the door.

    And Lilac, Ricks has always been a whites only type of club. They hardly allowed black music to be played. Their Galleria club in Houston is doing so badly that the word on the street is that it will change names and become a "upscale black club". That alone tells you the Ricks people see blacks differently than whites.

    When middle aged white men own businesses many are plain bigots. Black men historically have been a threat to white men in power. Blacks have a different style than whites and many white men in power are uncomfortable with it.

    Most dancers as a whole don't know their ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to dealing with customers and club owners don't run their businesses anything like other businesses operate when it comes to customer service and employee training.

    These black and white girls need to be taught how to dress and communicate with customers.

    Very few customers nowadays wait in line for dances. They have to be persuaded to buy. And many big club owners are such dip shits they think that guys want all college aged white dancers.

    I ABSOLUTELY refuse to believe that business analysis and surveys are used in strip club hiring. I don't care if we are talking about Christies, Ricks, Scores, Deja Vu or other chains.

    There are redneck and prejudiced customers and I have had my share of them, but many club patrons like what they don't have and interracial relationships are more and more common now.

    If the damned club owners would get their heads out of their asses and have classes like Dancer Wealths required for every dancer, then girls of all races would sell fairly evenly and less problems would happen in the clubs.

    You have to train girls in proper etiquette and dressing. Some black and hispanic dancers are a little rough around the edges but training will fix that as long as they are basically attractive.

    And owners need to market their clubs across the color lines. Money has no color and people of all races like high end products.

    And in many cities the clubs with a variety of dancers have just as good a clientele and money making potential as the stuffy club with a "whites only" attitude. The stuffy clubs that only play white music, who make the token black dancer play white music are a turn off to decent white men and ethnic ones too. NO ONE will tell me this is not true.

    And if club owners are so fucking smart, as they see more and more young guys and girls are coming in the clubs and less older guys, why do they continue to operate a Neiman Marcus format with Kohl's and Penneys customers? Club owners have shit for brains for the most part and could care less about the customers or the dancers.

    Any fool would know that pushing the tip rail and $1 dances would work better with the young crowd. That is one reason I make more money in the small booking clubs. The stage is the draw and almost all the young guys will tip on stage whereas in the big clubs where the stage is not pushed since they are not into spending $100+ on dances we make no money at all.

    If a club trains it's dancers and promotes all the dancers to the customers, the customers will be trained to buy from everyone.

    That is one reason why this business is sucking so badly now. Guys like variety. If they didn't they wouldn't go to clubs seeking companionship and dances,and paronize massage parlors, escorts and studios, paying for sex with women other than their wives.

    If variety is marketed properly,this business wouldn't be declining as badly as it is. ???

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    I noticed that on the west coast, but not here. I work in a very upscale gent's club and we have quite a few beautiful black dancers.

    I also notice that they get most of their dances from white customers.

    Being that this is an industry of fantasy, a lot of white, middle - upper class customers love the black dancers because being with a black woman is a fantasy to them - one which they could not live out outside of the safety of a club.
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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    Tina thanks for poppin' in.......

    Why do we keep having this same debate on this board. Melonie I'm beginning to feel that you have some personal stake in this! I mean your posts on other subjects do not at all lead me to believe that you TRULY believe in the professionalism of club management, yet time and time again you fall back on that lame excuse that mngmt's "demographic research" and customer preference is what keeps women of color out of some upscale clubs. BS!!!!

    Newbies let me tell ya -- the hatin' will come from White dancers and White management......Whatever you do don't dare make more money than the White dancers--you'll be fired for something ridiculous.....................

    As long as racism and bigotry have existed, racists and bigots have tried to come up with a ton of excused to ratioanlize and excuse their behaviour. It usually goes along the lines of "It's their own fault because they behave xxxxxxxxxxx" or "We only do it this way because xxxxxxxxx" or "If we did not do this than we would lose money"

    WOC -- don't let the system get you down! This industry is no more enlightened than any other Western industry and the same bull$hit applies. As long as we keep fighting, our sisters and daughters stand a better chance of not having to deal with the nonsense.

    Oh and BTW for all of you out there Atlanta is no different most "White" clubs have an unspoken "4 women of color on the floor rule" too. The standard " WOC can't dance to RB/hi-hop but White girls can" rule also applies....... Of course thats hush-hush though

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    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    I am Chinese and have been dancing for ten years in ONLY upscale clubs,and had the luck of having EXTREMELY nice housemoms show me the right ways to go about this business and have so far made QUITE a bit of money as a result.I agree with Melanie as far as blacks and Hispanics being rough around the edges.A lot of them dance to hard core rap and dance accordingly to that type of music.The reality is, the upscale clubs don't want that type of customer(younger and not so worldy) coming into their clubs.It is NOT a race issue at all.It is a class issue.All persons are attractive when they are put together well.
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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    OOPS!I got Tina and Melanie mixed up.I meant to say I agree with Tina.SORRY LADIES!
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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    onlythebest although i agree with you to a point and i do understand what you mean i know many many african american and hispanic girls who are very classy ladies who could dance accordingly and amazingly to any type of music you play for them and amazingly i might add, i also know many black famales that yes listen to hard core hip hop but prefer not to dance to it because of the costumer base i think it is judgemental to say most because i know many who are nothing like what you described just my 2 cents
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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    Just a viewpoint.

    Look at the 3 best selling mens mags over the last 20-30 years.
    Playboy
    penthouse
    hustler
    Not alot of woc featured in these pages.
    Im not saying its right or wrong.Im saying its social conditioning and upbringing covering a few generations.

    This has got to be one of the few remaining industries that racists still control and blatently flaunt it without even the slightest worry about getting in trouble.
    I think this will all change in the next few decades with the MTV generation.As they move into positions of power in this industry,they will make changes to closer resemble social demographics.

    Just as a question,not ment to start a shit storm.

    Does anyone know of a "black"upscale club that has survived for more then a few years,and where the money is good???
    I swear i tried to think of one,even in atlanta,detroit,DC,or NY and couldnt remember any?
    I know the reasons why,but it would sound terribly racist of me if i said why.

    Can you tell me if there are any,and why you think there is not??

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    A black "upscale" club will not attract for the most part the same type of clientele as the white clubs.

    Many black guys grew up with nothing and when they get a little money just spend to show off.

    Plus most will attract the baller crowd of young hustlers.

    Many black guys who were not exposed to an integrated society growing up look at women as conquests and use their jive skills to lure them into bed and surely will not spend money on them, let alone buy dances from them.

    Plus the adage, "white women are to be used", because whites used us for years causes many black inner city guys to look for white women they can take advantage of.

    As one brother told me just the other week when I spoke to him in the club, "I'm here for the same reason you are".

    There are lots of educated black men out there. But educated black men do not like to hang around "common" blacks and will tend to go to a club which is nice, but which also has a racially mixed dancer and customer base where they can hear some good R&B mixed in with rock and alternative sounds.

    The so called "upscale" black club will be a booty shaking place. Fancy building as most big clubs are in Houston, but with a hip hop flavor.

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    Default Re:Black dancers in Upscale gentlemen's clubs

    Quote Originally Posted by onlythebest link=board=27;threadid=9697;start=msg116722#msg116 722 date=1086167160
    I agree with Melanie as far as blacks and Hispanics being rough around the edges.
    That's a b.s. comment. Most young girls in general are rough around the edges as far as this business is concerned. If you were really looking at this as a class issue then your comment would have read something along the lines of " Lower class black, white, latino and asian women tend to be a bit rough around the edges" But you didn't you singled out that trait as being a feature of a particular race ---see dictionary.com definition of racism.

    RACISM 1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.



    Quote Originally Posted by onlythebest link=board=27;threadid=9697;start=msg116722#msg116 722 date=1086167160
    A lot of them dance to hard core rap and dance accordingly to that type of music.The reality is, the upscale clubs don't want that type of customer(younger and not so worldy) coming into their clubs.It is NOT a race issue at all.It is a class issue.All persons are attractive when they are put together well.
    If it were really a class issue in your mind then the statement wouldn't have been made--- Let's see a dancer of any race in an upscale club will 9x out of 10 dance according to the prevailing customer tastes.....Even if the dancer herself isn't into that particular type of music or style, club culture and rules will probably dictate her choices. For a dancer of any race to make it in a high tier club she would need to have not only an outstanding body and face, but also good carriage and bearing, and some modicum of intelligence---Are you saying that WOC don't possess these traits (well the Asian's apparently have no problem )
    For a ny girl it comes down to how well she knows it or how well she can fake it.

    In white clubs the main girls that you see dancing to r/b and rap are white! If upscale clubs don't want a younger customer coming in, but feel that the music played will encourage it, then why does little blond Kimmie get to dance to it, but not black Jenny? That argument is pointless because as many WOC can tell you - it's only the WOC that aren't allowed to dance to r/b- rap.

    I always think it's funny when I work with trailer trash at a supposed "upscale " white club, and the women find that they are having a difficult time making $$. These women don't fit in because they don't possess the social skills to make it in the environment... and all of the peroxide and silicone in the world won't make up for an inferior upbringing.

    Bottom line sisters-- you know what class you fit into and what type of men you attract... If you know that an upscale environment is suitable to your work personae, but you can't seem to get in - it isn't because you aren't pretty enough, or polished enough. A racist will always find a reason to support his or her viewpoint and the blame will always be laid at your feet......Kick that b.s. to the curb and keep movin'.
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