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Thread: fahrenheit 9/11

  1. #151
    Veteran Member Isis's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Big D link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129354#msg129 354 date=1088399283
    Quote Originally Posted by Isis link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129252#msg129 252 date=1088381434
    Quote Originally Posted by ace_barker link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129243#msg129 243 date=1088380857
    What a load of Bullshit.
    typical, its bullshit but u cant show any reasonable reason why- whatever u brainwashed jackass whatever

    Yea? And where is your proof? All I see on your posts is profanity. None of you Bush bashers have stated one legitimate reason for me to change my thinking about him. Liars and such does not tell me why, it only tells me that you really don't know why you just do! PROVE YOUR CAUSE IF YOU WANT TO SELL IT TO ME!
    Big d
    Uhm WHERE IS YOURS ??? Oh that's right u just like Ace u don't have any if so then post it- counter the things we have said or agreed with....... cant u or Ace counter with anything at all ? so far the answer is a resounding NO.

    Not one legit reason huh ? Like I said about Ace..... ur brainwashed if u cant even find one thing to question on Bush. You don't have to agree with us but to say there isnt one legit reason to question his policies is ABSURD.

    Quote Originally Posted by Big D link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129352#msg129 352 date=1088398922
    Kiss my republican, educated, non-abortion having

    Big D
    oh so now if we dont support Bush then we must have had an abortion Uhm I have never had one and I obviously dont support Bush so that blows ur theory now doesnt it

    Since u seem to think Bush is the end all why dont u just state why u worship him so- give us some reasons not to dislike him so much.... that is if there are any reasons

  2. #152
    Veteran Member Isis's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by doc-catfish link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129560#msg129 560 date=1088440121
    Quote Originally Posted by bjmcinti link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg127988#msg127 988 date=1088180151
    I do not consider that an act of treason, what I do consider an act of treason is making a documentary that is slanderous of the leader of our country.
    Big D
    Would this include potential numerous acts of "treason" commited between January 1993 and January 2001? I'm curious.
    what exactly are u re: to ?

  3. #153
    Banned Madcap's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Big D link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129538#msg129 538 date=1088437995
    Quote Originally Posted by Lexi link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129528#msg129 528 date=1088436621
    Quote Originally Posted by Big D link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129352#msg129 352 date=1088398922

    Pathetic is coming on to this site and making a comlete ass of yourself! Kiss my republican, educated, non-abortion having

    Big D

    70% of MEN are against abortion. 100% of these men will never get pregnant.
    Oh and of course you are a non-abortion having You are a man.




    I don't know, MC, Wildman, am I am man? I am sure that Wildman can definately confirm my sex - it was right in his face Friday night!
    Considering the Bike pic, i'd say you are most definately a woman.

  4. #154
    Banned Madcap's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Oh, and actual Treason is an offense pusishable by death, ask the Rosenbergs...

  5. #155
    Veteran Member Isis's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    I bet she'd like to put all the people like me to death just b/c we dont worship Bush and have no problem saying so

  6. #156
    Featured Member sander8son's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    well, having stopped reading this thread at about page 5 a couple days ago(and no, ofcorse i haven't read up to page 11 since then.)

    i just saw the movie. it wasn't as sensationalistic and extreme as id hoped it would be. but was still somewhat entertaining.

    its definately anti-republican, but i found it to be only slightly pro-democratic(party). which is good for me, since i obviously hate both parties. some good tv-nationesque parts to it(like where he tries to ellicit congressmen to enlist their children in the US armed forces).

    i wasn't voting for bush pre-viewing the moving, nor am i after. it hasn't changed my opinion on the presidency, the republican party, or the democratic party. i hope that others who see this, not only take away a distrust and hatred of the republican party, but also will stop to realize that the democrats contributed to the problems portrayed in the film(although, they're hardly chastised by moore) as well.

    it is clear, that regardless of who you like or dislike, our true enemy isn't george bush, nor is it the republican party. our true enemy is the government itself. moores conclusion at the end about keeping society continuing along, is a testiment to both parties bringing forth the destruction of the very people they brainwash into believing they serve. i dont think moore realizes this, but its true.

  7. #157
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    i think my mom shouldve had an abortion so i wouldnt have had to read this whole thread

  8. #158
    Featured Member sander8son's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by AinNY link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129677#msg129 677 date=1088452682
    i think my mom shouldve had an abortion so i wouldnt have had to read this whole thread
    tell ya what ain, toss jeter and arod on that list too and we'll call it a deal!

    so does that mean you dont recomend i read from page 5 or whatever on?

  9. #159
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by sander8son link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129693#msg129 693 date=1088453656
    Quote Originally Posted by AinNY link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129677#msg129 677 date=1088452682
    i think my mom shouldve had an abortion so i wouldnt have had to read this whole thread
    tell ya what ain, toss jeter and arod on that list too and we'll call it a deal!

    so does that mean you dont recomend i read from page 5 or whatever on?
    Put us all out of our misery...

    Please dont read this thread. I think i am now dumberer for having read this thread (no offense to anyone here...its just a joke)

  10. #160
    God/dess onlythebest's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    After what I have read and see in the media how things are going,I am voting for Nader to be neutral.
    One of woman's cardinal rule: Body parts can be fake,everything else has to be real.

    一个女人的枢机规则:肢体可以伪造,一切必须真实.

    中国大CHINESE BIG BOOBS!!!中国大




  11. #161
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Madcap link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg128062#msg128 062 date=1088188084
    It's propaganda, but it'll be entertaining propaganda.
    Since I have neither the time nor the interest to read 12 pages of "I'm right"...no "I'm right" (or "I'm left"?) that I've seen before, let me say that IMO, this sums it up pretty well. Although, truth to tell, I think it was only fairly entertaining.

    As for me, I've always thought Bush was a lousy president, and that he stole the election, and I know I'll be voting against him in November.

    As for the film, I liked parts of it. Personally, I think "Lies, and the Lying Liars that Tell Them" (Al Franken) covers a lot of the same ground in a much better way, especially as Franken clearly documents where he's getting his info, with Lexis/Nexis and web references and the like.

    I think the film spent way too much time on the Bin Laden/Bush connection, as its generally accepted that Osama is the black sheep of the family, even if he did have some contact with some family members (the movie doesn't specify which). I think that's really fishing for something that isn't there. Now, as to Bush being concerned about Saudi interests in the USA, I don't know, because I'm not in GWB's head. However, to deny that the Saudis have helped the Bush's get rich would be a pretty big stretch.

    I think the depiction of Bagdhad as a happy place before the Americans showed up is crap. Yeah, I'm sure that there were lots of happy people there, however to ignore what was going on in other parts of the capital (and country) is about as biased as you can get. And, the truth is, civilians get hurt in war. Its unfortunate, and it happens. I think Moore's position is that we shouldn't have been there in the first place, so that makes the USA guilty of killing all these civilians. That's a tougher question, although I certainly feel that an Iraq without Saddam is better for the general populace in the long run, and that makes the civilian casualties regrettable, and for the greater good (although the families who had casualties might disagree with me).

    I think the best parts were showing Bush's inactivity after the 2nd plane hit the WTC (remember, he wasn't informed until after the 2nd plane hit) when he should have made a polite apology and gotten with strategic people immediately, his lack of care about terrorism before 9/11, and generally showing the lack of competence and character in his administration.

    I think putting a human side on the conflict was the most interesting part, as the news generally only gives the feel good stories or the insurgent attacks, so a fresh perspective was nice.

    Was it propoganda, mostly anti-Bush propoganda? No question about it. BTW, I say "mostly" anti-Bush, because the fact that no Senator would support the Congressional Black Caucus over the election results was appalling, IMO. Was it slanted...again, no question. However, as some commentator I heard on the radio remarked "Its nothing worse than the Rush Limbaugh's of the world do to the Democrats every day of the week."

    So, take the film for what it is, and enjoy it as a film. Don't take it as gospel, and find out the facts for yourself. Read the Franken book. And mostly, get out and vote in November.

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    God/dess NinaDaisy's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by onlythebest link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129719#msg129 719 date=1088455599
    After what I have read and see in the media how things are going,I am voting for Nader to be neutral.
    You said in a previous thread that you support Bush because he won't cut your husband's military benefits, but Nader is more anti-defense than 10 Kerry's put together!

    I don't get it...
    "She has written so well, and marvellously well, that I was completely ashamed of myself as a writer...But this girl, who is to my knowledge very unpleasant and we might even say a high-grade bitch, can write rings around all of us who consider ourselves as writers"

    Ernest Hemingway on writer, aviation pioneer and horse trainer Beryl Markham


  13. #163
    Veteran Member Isis's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    what makes u think Kerry will cut miltary pay ? Here are some of what I have found:

    John Kerry opposed the administration’s proposed cuts to the military. He has said will not abandon our troops or cut their pay, particularly at a time when so many members of our reservists are facing danger.

    Also Kerry supports repealing the trillion-dollar tax cuts to the wealthy. He has co-sponsored a bill in the Senate to use that money to fund the $87 billion request by President George W. Bush for completion of the war with Iraq.

    Bush took money from places like education to support the war despite his pledge of leave no child behind .

    Middle-class taxes are a large part of Kerry’s economic plan. He pledges to cut middle class families’ current tax levels in order to make things college more affordable.

    I see no reason to think Kerry will lower the paycheck of the miltary.




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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129489#msg129 489 date=1088429798
    LOL, where have you been the last 4 years, that's exactly what has already happened under Bush, have you seen the size of the deficit Bush has run up, have you seen the rise in unemployment, the outsourcing of jobs, the stagnating wages, all of which lead to a poor stock market and less "discretionary" spending money.
    If you'll check the stock market ticker you'll see that the downturn happened in the summer/fall of 1999, and George W. wasn't inaugurated until January 2001.
    I don't want to get into a big debate over the economy with you as we both know the President doesn't have a great deal of control over it, but still, ultimately someone needs to take responsibility for steering the ship in the right direction. Clinton resided over the greatest period of peace time economic growth in history, he obviously must have been doing something right, and not to nitpick but maybe you should be checking that stock ticker a bit closer, the market actually peaked in early 2000, not 1999, Bush was in office at that time.

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Also Kerry supports repealing the trillion-dollar tax cuts to the wealthy. He has co-sponsored a bill in the Senate to use that money to fund the $87 billion request by President George W. Bush for completion of the war with Iraq.
    Actually, John Kerry does not propose increasing taxes on the wealthy (i.e. himself). What John Kerry DOES propose is to increase taxes on people who are working their butts off and as a result have reasonably high earned incomes, but who are not wealthy because they do not yet own companies, large amounts of property, stocks or bonds.

    I urge you to revisit and actually read what it is saying.

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Clinton resided over the greatest period of peace time economic growth in history, he obviously must have been doing something right, and not to nitpick but maybe you should be checking that stock ticker a bit closer, the market actually peaked in early 2000, not 1999, Bush was in office at that time.
    Not to be nitpicky either, but Bush was inaugurated in January 2001, just as the winner of the 2004 election will be inaugurated in January 2005. I grant you that the NYSE, NASDAQ, and AMEX markets peaked at slightly different times ... however they all peaked while Clinton was in office. It was the news media which seemed to make it a point to withhold reports of disturbing stock market declines until after Bush was in office in 2001, thus fostering the (deliberate) false impression that Bush was directly responsible even though the declines had actually begun months earlier.

    At any rate, the unprecedented period of peacetime economic growth which occurred through the mid-90's had very little to do with Clinton, and a whole lot to do with the "defense dividend" Clinton was able to cash in because of the success of Ronald Reagan in toppling the Soviet Union and the success of George H. Bush in keeping a (temporary) lid on the middle east. This allowed Clinton to reduce military budgets by hundreds of billions of dollars, and a portion of that money saved was indirectly used for business investments and applied to the stock market. Effectively, the "defense dividend" was equivalent to a tax cut !

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129807#msg129 807 date=1088463662

    Actually, John Kerry does not propose increasing taxes on the wealthy (i.e. himself).
    Kerry wouldnt increase taxes on the wealthy but instead supports repealing the trillion-dollar tax cuts to the wealthy..... which says tome that the wealthy's taxes would go back to what they were before Bush gave them tax breaks so it wouldnt technically be an increase.

    It also seems to me the only people who benifet from Bush's policies are the rich and the religous fanatics. Bush's website it full of religon based programs. How does that comply to seperation of church and state. Isn't it the exact opposite?

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Kerry wouldnt increase taxes on the wealthy but instead supports repealing the trillion-dollar tax cuts to the wealthy..... which says tome that the wealthy's taxes would go back to what they were before Bush gave them tax breaks so it wouldnt technically be an increase
    You're still missing the point here. As the wealthiest person in the senate, John Kerry's taxes were not significantly affected by George Bush's tax cuts, and will also not be significantly affected if those tax cuts are repealed. John Kerry had about $137,000 in taxable income last year (which was subject to Bush's tax cut), but probably had $5,000,000 in tax free dividends, capital gains, and real estate appreciation on which he paid zilch in the way of taxes ! If Bush's tax cut is repealed, John Kerry will still pay zilch in taxes on next year's $5,000,000 in tax free dividends, capital gains, and real estate appreciation.

    On the other hand, MY taxes went down by about $4,000 last April as a result of the tax cut and, if repealed, my taxes will go UP by the same $4,000 next April. That's a tax increase in my book no matter how you spin it.

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    Veteran Member Isis's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Ur right I dont get it.... what does his personal income have to do with this ?

    Bush's policies only make the rich richer at the expense of the rest of the people.

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    OK, with all the ignorance on this board about who is paying taxes and who is not, use some data to support your assertions:

    Try these charts on for size.

    The bottom line is, you can't get a tax break when you haven't been paying taxes to begin with, and rich people, much as the class warriors in this country hate to admit it, pay most of the taxes in this country--always have, and so long as we have regressive tax policies based on class warfare, always will.

    Shouldn't this be a separate thread? It's way off-topic now...

    Two cents.
    Idealism is fine, but as it approaches reality, the costs become prohibitive.

    William F. Buckley, Jr.

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    It is a stupid movie, in fact it is not even a movie in fact, I would not even call it a documentary. It is a Political Propaganda message. The Message that M. Moore wants to tell is that he advocates an increase number of troops in Iraq but then turns around wanting to withdrawl the troops. The Movie has no basis of truth, it is filled with lies and provides no real conclusive facts to back up the claims. If you see this Movie it shows that you are unamerican and that you think Saddam should still be in power. If you want to watch it go ahead but it is a lie. If it was my choice we would have nuked a huge portion of the Jihad areas like Sadr City and Fallujah.

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129807#msg129 807 date=1088463662
    Also Kerry supports repealing the trillion-dollar tax cuts to the wealthy. He has co-sponsored a bill in the Senate to use that money to fund the $87 billion request by President George W. Bush for completion of the war with Iraq.
    Actually, John Kerry does not propose increasing taxes on the wealthy (i.e. himself). What John Kerry DOES propose is to increase taxes on people who are working their butts off and as a result have reasonably high earned incomes, but who are not wealthy because they do not yet own companies, large amounts of property, stocks or bonds.

    I urge you to revisit and actually read what it is saying.
    Wow, your like the third person who has referred to that web site in my social circle...

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    Veteran Member Isis's Avatar
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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Casual Observer link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129833#msg129 833 date=1088467224

    The bottom line is, you can't get a tax break when you haven't been paying taxes to begin with,
    Uhm who r u trying to say doesnt pay their taxes ? And how could u know anyway I pay my taxes and dont appreciate having the rich get breaks at the expense of the middle and lowerclass quality of life. Why should I suffer higher healthcare or struggle to send my kid to college just so the wealthiest people in this country can get have a little more

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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Casual Observer link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129833#msg129 833 date=1088467224
    OK, with all the ignorance on this board about who is paying taxes and who is not, use some data to support your assertions:

    Try these charts on for size.

    The bottom line is, you can't get a tax break when you haven't been paying taxes to begin with, and rich people, much as the class warriors in this country hate to admit it, pay most of the taxes in this country--always have, and so long as we have regressive tax policies based on class warfare, always will.
    An interesting book came out last year called "Perfectly Legal" by David Cay Johnson (a Pulitzer Prize winner BTW) which exposes how little taxes the super wealthy really do actually pay, you should pick it up and give it a look sometime.

    http://www.perfectlylegalthebook.com/

    A couple of excerpts from that site:

    *Roberto Goizueta, CEO of Coca-Cola, built a billion-dollar fortune without paying a dime in taxes on it.

    *Tom and Cindy Toth, a corporate trainer and stay-at-home mom, live on $90,000 a year. But the alternative minimum tax will take back much of the tax cuts Congress voted them in 2001 and 2003. By 2010, 35.6 million households will pay this “stealth tax.”

    *Ingersoll-Rand pays $26,000 a year to maintain a Bermuda post office box as its legal headquarters. That little trick lets them escape $40 million in corporate taxes each year.

    *The IRS unjustly came after Maritza Reyes, a cleaning woman in East Los Angeles who earns $7,000 per year, but ignored the fact that billionaire art dealer Alec Wildenstein and his wife Jocelyn never filed a tax return in three decades


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    Default Re:fahrenheit 9/11

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129818#msg129 818 date=1088464371
    I grant you that the NYSE, NASDAQ, and AMEX markets peaked at slightly different times ... however they all peaked while Clinton was in office.
    Did you check your stock ticker on that one? Try this site:
    www.bigcharts.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=10447;start=msg129818#msg129 818 date=1088464371
    At any rate, the unprecedented period of peacetime economic growth which occurred through the mid-90's had very little to do with Clinton, and a whole lot to do with the "defense dividend" Clinton was able to cash in because of the success of Ronald Reagan in toppling the Soviet Union and the success of George H. Bush in keeping a (temporary) lid on the middle east. This allowed Clinton to reduce military budgets by hundreds of billions of dollars, and a portion of that money saved was indirectly used for business investments and applied to the stock market. Effectively, the "defense dividend" was equivalent to a tax cut !
    Reagan uh? Okay .

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