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Thread: Counter-Inauguration

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by livenudegirlsunite
    I just read that DC is banning all signs and puppets for the J20 protests!
    Blame that on terrorism. This was an order by the Secret Service to the National Park Service. They don't want anything in the Inaugural parade that could conceal a weapon or be used as one.

    The ban apparently includes crosses too. Even Bush's fundy allies can't express themselves.
    http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/mld/l...n/10613755.htm

    I'll admit that it seems like a draconian measure, but the world has changed a bit since the last time we inaugurated a President. I doubt things would be any different if it were Kerry being sworn in.

    I wonder if they are going to pull the same crap nationwide.
    Considering that GWB can only be in one place, highly doubtful. This is about security, not censorship.
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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    didnt some middle eastern country just ban CARS in the city for thier presidential elections???

    Can you imagine DC without cars for 4 days?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

    It could be worse!!!

    Just write your message on your back,like the "professional"boxers are doing now,and remove your shirt when the camera is on ya.

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    besides,this isnt about the election that was lost,this is the celebration to the one who won.

    Let us celibrate in peace.

    We got a "right" dammit!!!!!!!!!!

  4. #29
    Featured Member Destiny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by Djoser
    OK, here you go, a more recent source for the point I was making, which is that GWB is beginning his term with the lowest approval rating of any re-elected President in 50 years.

    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...toryId=4283094

    You got me on the question of whether his opponents hate him more than Clinton's did. That is my opinion of what is likely to be the case. I will see if I can track down data that proves me right or wrong. In the meantime, I think it might support my contention to compare the approval ratings of Bush at re-election with Clinton at re-election. Clearly Bush has more opponents, which would imply that my contention is correct, but will not of course prove it.
    Okay, you're right about the poll numbers. One thing that is interesting about the NPR poll though. The approval rating for second term presidents has shown an almost steady decline from Eisenhower's 73% approval rating to Bush's 50% rating today. I'm not sure why that is. I suspect that people in our parent's and grandparent's generations were much more likely to, "rally around their leader" than we are today. If that's true, then we're not likely to see a second term president with approval ratings much higher than 50% for another generation or so.

    Was Clinton hated more by his opponents than Bush is today? Yes, Bush's disapproval rating is higher, but polls don't measure the depth of people's feelings. Plus, Clinton was re-elected during a time of greater economic prosperity, which you would think would lead to a higher approval and therefore lower disapproval rating. Who really knows. We're both really just going on our own feelings. I definitely think the depth of hatred towards Clinton was stronger than anything we're seeing today. I did find this recent poll that said, "Nearly two-thirds of those polled described Bush as likable, strong and intelligent. A majority said he is dependable and honest." So apparently even some that disapprove of him, think's he's a decent guy. Here's the complete article.

    Quote Originally Posted by Djoser
    An update on the potential for trouble at the Inauguration--much of the parade route has bleachers which have been erected for spectators, which require the purchase of tickets. Demonstrators are unlikely to buy tickets, lol...
    First, i think i read that the tickets are a security measure and understandable given all the terroism in the world. Secon, the protestors won't have to buy the tickets. "The National Park Service has agreed to give thousands of anti-war demonstrators a prime spot along President Bush's inaugural parade route that will allow them to protest during the procession. The anti-war group A.N.S.W.E.R. Coalition is planning to erect its own bleachers in the space, an open plaza on Pennsylvania Ave., just a few blocks from the Capitol building, said Brian Becker, national coordinator for the group."

    Like I said before, there is no country on earth that protects the rights of the minority to disagree more than ours does.

    Quote Originally Posted by Djoser
    However, I predict--at the least--some pretty significant numbers of people making their disapproval known in vocal fashion, in DC and elsewhere across the country, which will be impossible to ignore entirely. Though I suspect that the people partying with GWB will do their level best to do that.
    I'm sure you're right. However, I have two questions for ya':

    1. Are such activities
    appropriate? The Inauguration is not a political event, it's a government event, mandated by our constitution. True, the parade as such, is not specifically called for, but the traditions of the event are over 200 years old. I read about one group planning to moon the parade. As a mother do you think I want to sit my son down in front of the tv to watch this historical event only to have him see some hairy liberal drop his pants? In my opinion such behavior is disrespectful to me as an American. I read one protestor bragging about how at the last inaugural he had thown garbage at the president's motorcade. Where do you draw the line? What is acceptable to you what is not?

    2. Are such activities effective? Democrat's high in recent history came with the election of Bill Clinton to his first term. If I'm not mistaken, at that point, democrats controlled the white house and congress. Since that time, democrats have lost both the house and the senate and the presidency two out of the last three times. If this trend continues, the democrats will be a minority part for the next generation or longer. So what do the democrats do? They keep whining and complaining about how stupid the people are that live in red states. I'm sure all those protestors will have a great time mooning the president and generally making asses of themselves. Then they will go back to Boston or California feeling so good about themselves. But do you really think that some tobacco farmer in Georgia, a small-business owner in Texas, or a soccer mom in Nebraska is going to watch all the goings on and say, "wow, I want to be just like those folks"? No, such activities will do nothing but reinforce the image of the democratic party as the haven of a bunch of kooks and left-wing radicals. In my opinion, that's not the way to get back into power again.
    Dancing is wonderful training for girls, it's the first way you learn to guess what a man is going to do before he does it. ~Christopher Morley, Kitty Foyle

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    One question, why are we spending so much money on the security when it could be used for something more worthwhile? I mean what's he going to say? " I accept to be president, AGAIN." ????
    There just doesn't seem to be a point to a second inauguaration.
    Just another waste of money in my opinion.
    Please don't lick me, it tickles..



  6. #31
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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by Destiny
    1. Are such activities [/b]appropriate? The Inauguration is not a political event, it's a government event, mandated by our constitution. True, the parade as such, is not specifically called for, but the traditions of the event are over 200 years old. I read about one group planning to moon the parade. As a mother do you think I want to sit my son down in front of the tv to watch this historical event only to have him see some hairy liberal drop his pants? In my opinion such behavior is disrespectful to me as an American. I read one protestor bragging about how at the last inaugural he had thown garbage at the president's motorcade. Where do you draw the line? What is acceptable to you what is not?
    I just thought I could throw in some answers here.

    I think that it is entirely appropriate to be able to voice your displeasure...your inacceptance to a president. HOWEVER, I do not agree with people doing so in an offensive way. It is one thing to disapprove of something the president says/does, etc. But, I find it completely inappropriate for someone to commit a lewd, disrespectful act in the name of protest.

    2. Are such activities effective? Democrat's high in recent history came with the election of Bill Clinton to his first term. If I'm not mistaken, at that point, democrats controlled the white house and congress. Since that time, democrats have lost both the house and the senate and the presidency two out of the last three times. If this trend continues, the democrats will be a minority part for the next generation or longer. So what do the democrats do? They keep whining and complaining about how stupid the people are that live in red states. I'm sure all those protestors will have a great time mooning the president and generally making asses of themselves. Then they will go back to Boston or California feeling so good about themselves. But do you really think that some tobacco farmer in Georgia, a small-business owner in Texas, or a soccer mom in Nebraska is going to watch all the goings on and say, "wow, I want to be just like those folks"? No, such activities will do nothing but reinforce the image of the democratic party as the haven of a bunch of kooks and left-wing radicals. In my opinion, that's not the way to get back into power again.
    People continue to look at this as a Republican/Democrat thing. It is not. There are a LOT of republicans who do not like or support Bush. There are a lot of Democrats that do. There are a lot of people who do not support Bush and are neither Republican nor Democrat. It's not a party thing...it's a personal thing. I am neither Repub nor Dem. I do not align myself with a 'certain' party...I go by who is supporting the issues I feel strongly about. There are a lot of people like me. I've never whined or complained about how stupid the people who live in the red states are...I have expressed, very vocally, my complete distrust, lack of confidence, complete annoyance at, and total anger for a man who will use outright lies to further his own agenda. A man who cares so little for our environment that he'll allow drilling in the last frontier that has been protected for so long...a man who will allow loggers to clear cut once protected forests. A man who has no hesitation to go into a country and pillage it...for his own personal gain. A man who is more interested in using as many "paid vacations" as he can as opposed to actually doing something in office. And, lastly, I completely detest the fact that this man cannot speak, at all, very coherently without notes...and even then it is a toss-up. To me, personally, I feel that we selected the village idiot to represent us...

    Anywho...off on a tangent. The point is simply...it doesn't matter if you agree with what people are doing. It is their right to protest that which they do not approve of. It is their right and their freedom. I do believe that all protesting can be done with respect and dignity...and it is not about a party not in agreement with what happened...it's about the nation's people who do not agree with what has happened. It's not just the democrats, but the green party, the undeclared...the people who are upset at the way this man has chosen to run the country...or at the lack of effort he has put forth in doing so.

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    VenusGoddess kind of said it all there.

    The one thing I might add is to repeat that the protests that did so much to end our involvement in another bad war--the one in Vietnam--were regarded as being staged by a bunch of kooks, too. But after a while, enough people listened, even the President, lol.

    Maybe we could by starting on this day somehow begin to get it through his thick skull that there are millions of people who not only disapprove of what he has done, but hate what he stands for (the danger of enforced morality being a primary, if selfish concern of many members here).

    And a great way of starting that process is to start on the day he is supposed to be celebrating--we are saying we don't think he has the right to celebrate with so much dissatisfaction among the citizenry. So much that they are willing to travel to Washington, walk out of class, risk confrontation with conservative supporters, and possibly even arrest, etc.

    As far as the appropriateness of a mass moon is concerned, if it could be kept from the eyes of sensitive children, I would love it...

    Not only does it appeal to the side of me that does appreciate a good joke (if in this case it is a somewhat juvenile form of humor), it would be a great way to give him back some of that contempt which he has shown for the citizens of this country he has lied to, and would impose his stifling religious beliefs and moral code on.

    The frat boy in him would understand perfectly.
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  8. #33
    Featured Member Destiny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by VenusGoddess
    I think that it is entirely appropriate to be able to voice your displeasure...your inacceptance to a president. HOWEVER, I do not agree with people doing so in an offensive way. It is one thing to disapprove of something the president says/does, etc. But, I find it completely inappropriate for someone to commit a lewd, disrespectful act in the name of protest.
    I couldn't agree more. I have no problem with people standing and holding signs and stuff like that. But reading the news, most of the protestors are not content to do that. Is this what society has come to? That we have to have a tape delay of the inauguration so we don't have another "wardrobe malfunction" like at the Super Bowl? That teachers cannot show this historical event in their classrooms for fear of what the kids might see? Like I say, there is a time and a place for everything. But for crying out loud, its a presidential inauguration, not some MTV music award show. Is it asking too much to expect people to act appropiately?

    Quote Originally Posted by VenusGoddess
    People continue to look at this as a Republican/Democrat thing. It is not. There are a LOT of republicans who do not like or support Bush. There are a lot of Democrats that do. There are a lot of people who do not support Bush and are neither Republican nor Democrat. It's not a party thing...it's a personal thing. I am neither Repub nor Dem. I do not align myself with a 'certain' party...I go by who is supporting the issues I feel strongly about. There are a lot of people like me. I've never whined or complained about how stupid the people who live in the red states are...I have expressed, very vocally, my complete distrust, lack of confidence, complete annoyance at, and total anger for a man who will use outright lies to further his own agenda. A man who cares so little for our environment that he'll allow drilling in the last frontier that has been protected for so long...a man who will allow loggers to clear cut once protected forests. A man who has no hesitation to go into a country and pillage it...for his own personal gain. A man who is more interested in using as many "paid vacations" as he can as opposed to actually doing something in office. And, lastly, I completely detest the fact that this man cannot speak, at all, very coherently without notes...and even then it is a toss-up. To me, personally, I feel that we selected the village idiot to represent us...

    Anywho...off on a tangent. The point is simply...it doesn't matter if you agree with what people are doing. It is their right to protest that which they do not approve of. It is their right and their freedom. I do believe that all protesting can be done with respect and dignity...and it is not about a party not in agreement with what happened...it's about the nation's people who do not agree with what has happened. It's not just the democrats, but the green party, the undeclared...the people who are upset at the way this man has chosen to run the country...or at the lack of effort he has put forth in doing so.
    Funny, you complain about all the horrible stuff GWB has done while in office, then complain that he doesn't spend enough time at the office.

    I can't help but laugh when I read quotes about how stupid George Bush supposedly is. GWB is a graduate of Yale and has an MBA from Harvard. Do you really think that the "village idiot" was able to obtain degrees from two of the most prestigious universities in our country? Having grown up in Texas, I should explain something. In Texas, there are a lot of "Good Old Boys". Good Old Boys are powerful men that put on an "aw shucks" front. But it's just an act. These types want you to underestimate them, to think they are fools. When i was working for my Dad, I'd meet men that you would have thought just fell off the pick-up truck from Podunk, Texas. They'd leave and I would remark about what a hick they were and my dad would tell me that they were multi-millionaires thanks to all the shopping centers and office buildings they owned. Think about it, every opponent George Bush has ever faced, from the lady he beat out for govenor to Saddam Hussien has underestimated him. He wants it that way.

    Anyway, i guess the kooks will have their bit of "fun" in Washington. Funny, I never would have thought that mooning someone would be the most effective way to get through their "thick skull" and get them to change their mind on important issues, but what do I know.
    Dancing is wonderful training for girls, it's the first way you learn to guess what a man is going to do before he does it. ~Christopher Morley, Kitty Foyle

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    can't help but laugh when I read quotes about how stupid George Bush supposedly is. GWB is a graduate of Yale and has an MBA from Harvard. Do you really think that the "village idiot" was able to obtain degrees from two of the most prestigious universities in our country?
    I don't think GWB earned his degrees, I think they were bought for himby his father. Not an uncommon thing really, lots of wealthy and well connected families have been doing that for their not so bright children for ages and ages.

    I think Cheney is the one running the show most of the time anyway.


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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by Destiny
    I can't help but laugh when I read quotes about how stupid George Bush supposedly is. GWB is a graduate of Yale and has an MBA from Harvard. Do you really think that the "village idiot" was able to obtain degrees from two of the most prestigious universities in our country?
    Bought and paid for. Do you really think that Yale or Harvard are going to turn down huge contributions in order to make the son of the donor comply with rigorous academic standards? I seriously considered whether his being stupid was a big front, so as to be appealing to the common man. But listen to the guy speak...

    He can't.

    I went to a school which, though rated somewhat below Yale and Harvard, nonetheless has been ranked within the top 15 in the country or higher, for most of the last century, and has more Nobel Laureates associated with it than any University in the world. No one like Bush could have survived there--unless of course, his dad was shelling out major bucks to the Alumni Fund.

    Quote Originally Posted by Destiny
    Anyway, i guess the kooks will have their bit of "fun" in Washington. Funny, I never would have thought that mooning someone would be the most effective way to get through their "thick skull" and get them to change their mind on important issues, but what do I know.
    Now where's your sense of humor, lol...

    I don't seriously think mooning will get through to GWB, except that maybe the frat boy in him will be pissed off at the insult--which he deserves, but that's beside the point. Nor do I want a bunch of kids to see it, either. I can see the humor in it, though, even if it is juvenile. Much as part of me would like to see it happen, I doubt it will. There are much more effective forms of protest, and I think they will be utilized.
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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by Djoser
    BThere are much more effective forms of protest, and I think they will be utilized.
    Like I had stated earlier, the absolute most effective form of protest should have been utilized about 2 1/2 months ago. I did my part, and the results showed that 49% of the people in this country (possibly more once you consider those who didn't vote) thought someone other than our current President was more capable of leading this country.

    I think over the past couple of years, GWB has seen plenty of anti-war placards and people screaming at him in disgust. What is it about this protest that is so special that is going to get his attention?

    I'm not questioning the right to protest, it just seems to me that those who so vehemently oppose Bush could turn their angst towards something more constructive, like say a plan to relocate to borderline states (i.e. Ohio, Florida, etc.) to make sure that they don't go Republican in 2008.

    Besides, if people actually run naked in the streets, I assure you that FOX News will be all over it, and will take no shame in putting their usual "this is the best that the liberals can come up with?" spin on the whole debacle. Why make it that easy for them?
    Former SCJ now in rehab.

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    the outlawing of signs is nothing more than trying force those who oppose into silence.

    As I see it- that is the true intent. Additional security is an added bonus and a neat little excuse.

    I have to wonder if those here complaining about the people who plan or support the protest-- if you would still be objecting if Kerry was the one being sworn into office ?

    I know I'd still object to the whole no signs degree by the King, I mean Pesident

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigerlilly
    the outlawing of signs is nothing more than trying force those who oppose into silence.

    As I see it- that is the true intent. Additional security is an added bonus and a neat little excuse.
    According to this article, signs are okay as long as they are not affixed to anything.
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/washing...t_x.htm?csp=36

    I have to wonder if those here complaining about the people who plan or support the protest-- if you would still be objecting if Kerry was the one being sworn into office ?
    That wouldn't change a thing. I don't object to the protest. I've just never really viewed holding signs and shouting slogans as an effective means of accomplishing anything other than making the protesters look rather silly to anyone who witness said spectacle. Union pickets, anti-war protests, anti-abortion protests, Reverend Phelps and his bunch of idiots, it doesn't matter.

    Its like the people who start these things think that if you hold up enough signs and scream enough, the world will change.
    Former SCJ now in rehab.

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by doc-catfish
    I've just never really viewed holding signs and shouting slogans as an effective means of accomplishing anything other than making the protesters look rather silly to anyone who witness said spectacle. Its like the people who start these things think that if you hold up enough signs and scream enough, the world will change.
    You mean like the Boston Tea Party, the Ukraine protests, the civil rights marches that Martin Luther King led and the protests for women’s right to vote? Yes, those were all totally ineffective. Demanding equality and justice for all is such a silly and trivial thing to do.

    Most people prefer to believe their leaders are just and fair even in the face of evidence to the contrary, because once a citizen acknowledges that the government under which they live is lying and corrupt, the citizen has to choose what he or she will do about it. - M Rivero

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Or how about Ghandi- his protests sure changed some things !

    ps... Live Nude your quote about propoganda in your siggy line is FABULOUS!!!!!

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    Quote Originally Posted by Djoser
    Bought and paid for. Do you really think that Yale or Harvard are going to turn down huge contributions in order to make the son of the donor comply with rigorous academic standards? I seriously considered whether his being stupid was a big front, so as to be appealing to the common man. But listen to the guy speak...

    He can't.
    You crack me up Dj. On the one hand, you think GWB is responsible for just about every ill in the world today. On the other hand you seem to think that he is an utter buffoon. Well how is it that a complete moron has been able to accomplish all the evil you want to give him credit for? I mean come on, it takes some brains to be an effective evil president doesn't it? If he's as dumb as you say he is, how has he been able to accomplish all the bad stuff you say he has done. And what does it say about Yale graduate John Kerry that he was beaten by an idiot? Besides, if he's as dumb as you say, you have no worries, I doubt he'll be able to find his way to the oval office the day after inauguration.

    I remember reading a funny quote one time. George Bush was asked to give the commencement address at a college. During his speach he said, "...and to you C students, I have one thing to say....You too may one day be president"
    Dancing is wonderful training for girls, it's the first way you learn to guess what a man is going to do before he does it. ~Christopher Morley, Kitty Foyle

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    Default Re: Counter-Inauguration

    The answer is quite simple--the President is largely a front man, an actor for the real powers that be.

    This was especially true with Reagan, but has also been true with Bush.

    Bush I find more frightening than Reagan, for two reasons--he is still alive, and he appears to be more fond of starting wars, something any President, as Commander-in-Chief, can do--imbecile or not.

    The military/industrial complex has found another compliant tool, except this one is f*cking things up far worse than the past ones have.

    But, hey, this is politics--and I am tired of arguing with you. It matters very little what you or I think, and Bush certainly won't listen to advice or criticism from a dancer or a DJ.

    Your quote is excellent, BTW. Have you seen any of Twyla Tharp's shows? I'm not sure if you are into her stuff, but I saw one in Austin that was very powerful.
    Last edited by Djoser; 01-20-2005 at 06:16 AM.
    You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star.
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