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Thread: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    "What if Bush has been right about Iraq all along?

    February 1, 2005

    BY MARK BROWN SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST
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    Maybe you're like me and have opposed the Iraq war since before the shooting started -- not to the point of joining any peace protests, but at least letting people know where you stood.

    You didn't change your mind when our troops swept quickly into Baghdad or when you saw the rabble that celebrated the toppling of the Saddam Hussein statue, figuring that little had been accomplished and that the tough job still lay ahead.

    Despite your misgivings, you didn't demand the troops be brought home immediately afterward, believing the United States must at least try to finish what it started to avoid even greater bloodshed. And while you cheered Saddam's capture, you couldn't help but thinking I-told-you-so in the months that followed as the violence continued to spread and the death toll mounted.

    By now, you might have even voted against George Bush -- a second time -- to register your disapproval.

    But after watching Sunday's election in Iraq and seeing the first clear sign that freedom really may mean something to the Iraqi people, you have to be asking yourself: What if it turns out Bush was right, and we were wrong?

    It's hard to swallow, isn't it? (snip)"

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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    I have always believed Bush was right in wanting the people of Iraq to have a true sense of "freedom". I just hope his convictions will lead him to feel the same for the people of Sudan.
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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    I just hope his convictions will lead him to feel the same for the people of Sudan.
    Unfortunately, the Sudanese case has lots of strikes against it i.e. UN already has the 'official' position of defender/peace broker, very tenuous links (if any) from Sudanese 'players' to any US homeland security threat or threat to US troops, the vast majority of african-american voters opposing republican military (and other) policies in the last election ...

    If GWB is willing to spend more political capital by expanding US military options abroad, Sudan stands well down the list which begins with Syria and Iran.

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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Oh, yes..How could I have ever forgotten about Iran ?
    My new love...is me !

    Even the greatest authority does not, ultimately, know you as you know yourself.
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    The end never justifies the means. If a dog behaves because he is afraid his master will beat the crap out of yet again it does not make the abuse by the master justifed.

    I hold great hope that the people of Iraq will make the best of this situation and I pray that the find the strength to overcome all the violence that their own leaders as well as the current leader of the US has poured down upon them over the years. I am quite curious to see how things work out. If they do I will be so very happy for them- however what that bastard Bush has done and how he went about it will never be excused
    under any circumstances. At least not to ethical people.

  6. #6
    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Yep - the liberals and the democratic party are going to be seen through out the middle east as the ones who prolonged their misery under tyrants from above and embargo's from below.

    America Frees Afghanistan --> Elections
    America Frees Iraq --> Elections
    America Frees ? --> Elections

    Once that air of self-determination gets blowing through Iraq (and hopefully the rest of that region), those people will remember who were AGAINST them getting the chance of voting, AGAINST them getting their countries in order again, and AGAINST them from being tortured and arbitarily killed by madmen and terrorists...

    ... and no matter what the anti-war crowd says... for those newly freed millions of people... all they will remember is THEY WERE AGAINST CHANGE FOR US AND CHANGE WAS GOOD.

    Sniff sniff - do I smell more republican seats in the house and senate coming up?

    It's a shame, because I am not really pro-republican.

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    God/dess Farrah_Holiday's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Quote Originally Posted by Deogol
    Sniff sniff - do I smell more republican seats in the house and senate coming up?
    Lets hope not. Its important to keep a good "balance" between the parties.
    We don't want a country with one point of view.
    My new love...is me !

    Even the greatest authority does not, ultimately, know you as you know yourself.
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    Senior Member Mark W.'s Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Quote Originally Posted by Farrah_Holiday
    Lets hope not. Its important to keep a good "balance" between the parties.
    We don't want a country with one point of view.
    While I agree it is important to have a balance between points of view I do not feel that is the desire of the majority of the rightwing nor about 1/2 of the leftwing.

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    God/dess Casual Observer's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    ^ Of course not. A balance of points isn't why you run political campaigns, create platforms and propose and enact legislation--you do these things to further enhance and entrench your political power base when the opportunity arises to further perpetuate your agenda.

    It's not about power sharing folks, it's about power politicking.
    Idealism is fine, but as it approaches reality, the costs become prohibitive.

    William F. Buckley, Jr.

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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie
    What if Bush has been right about Iraq all along?
    Right about WMD's? Isn't that why we went into Iraq? They were an imminent threat right? That's what we were told wasn't it? Was Bush right about WMD's? Did I miss something? When did we find them? How much of a threat did those WMD's pose to us anyways?

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    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Uh, no... we went into Iraq for more reasons than just WMD.

    From the law that authorized intervention...

    Whereas Iraq persists in violating resolution of the United Nations Security Council by continuing to engage in brutal repression of its civilian population thereby threatening international peace and security in the region, by refusing to release, repatriate, or account for non-Iraqi citizens wrongfully detained by Iraq, including an American serviceman, and by failing to return property wrongfully seized by Iraq from Kuwait;

    Whereas the current Iraqi regime has demonstrated its capability and willingness to use weapons of mass destruction against other nations and its own people;

    Whereas the current Iraqi regime has demonstrated its continuing hostility toward, and willingness to attack, the United States, including by attempting in 1993 to assassinate former President Bush and by firing on many thousands of occasions on United States and Coalition Armed Forces engaged in enforcing the resolutions of the United Nations Security Council;

    Whereas members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

    Whereas Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations, including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of United States citizens;

    Whereas United Nations Security Council Resolution 678 (1990) authorizes the use of all necessary means to enforce United Nations Security Council Resolution 660 (1990) and subsequent relevant resolutions and to compel Iraq to cease certain activities that threaten international peace and security, including the development of weapons of mass destruction and refusal or obstruction of United Nations weapons inspections in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 687 (1991), repression of its civilian population in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 688 (1991), and threatening its neighbors or United Nations operations in Iraq in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 949 (1994);

    Whereas in the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution (Public Law 102-1), Congress has authorized the President `to use United States Armed Forces pursuant to United Nations Security Council Resolution 678 (1990) in order to achieve implementation of Security Council Resolution 660, 661, 662, 664, 665, 666, 667, 669, 670, 674, and 677';

    Whereas in December 1991, Congress expressed its sense that it `supports the use of all necessary means to achieve the goals of United Nations Security Council Resolution 687 as being consistent with the Authorization of Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution (Public Law 102-1),' that Iraq's repression of its civilian population violates United Nations Security Council Resolution 688 and `constitutes a continuing threat to the peace, security, and stability of the Persian Gulf region,' and that Congress, `supports the use of all necessary means to achieve the goals of United Nations Security Council Resolution 688';

    Whereas the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 (Public Law 105-33 expressed the sense of Congress that it should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove from power the current Iraqi regime and promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime;

    Whereas on September 12, 2002, President Bush committed the United States to `work with the United Nations Security Council to meet our common challenge' posed by Iraq and to `work for the necessary resolutions,' while also making clear that `the Security Council resolutions will be enforced, and the just demands of peace and security will be met, or action will be unavoidable';



    But lets focus on WMDs because that is where the extreme left prefers to keep the focus instead of the security council resolutions and the well known corruption of Germany, France, and Russia who were bought off by the regime with ten dollar barrels of oil.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Mark W.'s Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    They changed the story so many times I lost track of why we went into Iraq

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    God/dess Casual Observer's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    ^ Indeed, that's the problem. Remember when the war was first being discussed? They didn't have a clear message or selling point until WMD, which they didn't even need in order to legally invade Iraq.

    Had they stuck to enforcing (especially) 687 violations among others, there would have been no evidentiary proof required after the invasion and no egg on the face of the administration with regard to the WMD fiasco.

    Totally avoidable.
    Idealism is fine, but as it approaches reality, the costs become prohibitive.

    William F. Buckley, Jr.

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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Using the phrase "selling point" in the context of war just makes me want to barf.

    The UN sanction violations were mostly ether. The sanctions were put in place by Bush I to begin with. They did nothing except for starve innocent Iraqi's while Saddam and his pals still had their 257 palaces with solid gold toilets. CO, you need to take over Karl Rove's job. Just promise me you won't ever do that nasty-ass thing with your comb that Paul Wolfowitz apparently does with his.

    And don't even get me started on the "liberal" media crap. Pretty much the entire mainstream media is running scared and capitulating to the Right-wing power brokers after the Dan Rather disaster.

    I firmly believe that he was set up by the network, or somebody, because he was the only major journalist to openly question what really happened on 9/11 and the Bush administration's possible role in it.
    "She has written so well, and marvellously well, that I was completely ashamed of myself as a writer...But this girl, who is to my knowledge very unpleasant and we might even say a high-grade bitch, can write rings around all of us who consider ourselves as writers"

    Ernest Hemingway on writer, aviation pioneer and horse trainer Beryl Markham


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    God/dess Bella21's Avatar
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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    Ya, of course they want freedom... I disagree with taking it upon ourselves to do something with their government. Sure, this has been said over and over... but I will never understand who died and made Bush jr. the ruler of the world. I was thinking about this yesterday... I haven't felt really safe since 9/11. Sure, I may never feel safe again now that i know that shit can happen... but it seems that we've been dying is mass numbers ever since. :/
    If you think school is hard, try being stupid.

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    Default Re: I never thought that I'd see anything like this from liberal media

    People are so naive to think that any government goes to any war without some sort of gain for somebody in the highest echlons of power. That doesn't mean politicians, neccessarily. Indistry has more power in politics than most people will ever care to admit.

    The fact is that there are TONS of other murderous regimes that the US has supported (Iraq being one of them in the earlier days of Saddam) wholeheartedly and openly. It's not a question of whether the regime kills its people- because the US gvm't don't fundamentally care about that. It's only used as a cover to GO INTO war... If any humanitarian benefits are gained from a war, it was a side benefit and never the primary reason to go to war.

    I love my political science teacher, a great independent guy. What was his quote? The only war that is for the people, by the people are called revolutions or peasant uprisings.

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