Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 92

Thread: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

  1. #1
    Veteran Member Hello~Kitty's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    345
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

    Default Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Recently Sean Hannity and FoxNews told it's viewers to blame liberals for high gas prices. http://mediamatters.org/items/200505060008

    Typical propganda (well actually lies) for both Hannity and FoxNews but they should have done some research first because liberals are not the single and sole cause of gas prices to be at their current high cost..... the real cause of high gas prices is a combination of many , many things including Bush declaring war and the effect that war has had thus far.
    Example of discrimination (Imho):

    the only prudent way to treat Islamics in the US and western europe today is along the same vein as Russians and Eastern Europeans were treated during the 'cold war' days - with some degree of suspicion warranted until proven otherwise !

    http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44590




  2. #2
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    In regard to the accuracy of mediamatters.org's own 'propaganda' that liberals aren't at the heart of high gas prices, you should have checked mediamatter' reference links ... specifically . Attempting to draw a conclusion that the action of a republican president temporarily banning offshore drilling in certain areas 15 years ago is somehow a more significant factor than a democratically controlled US congress passing their own congressional ban, or the democratically controlled state legislature of California passing a permanent state ban, or the democratically controlled California coastal community govt's refusing to pass necessary shoreline zoning laws to allow offshore drilling platforms to operate, is a huge distortion of the true situation. As proof I would offer up the Gulf of Mexico coastline, which was not party to the same presidential moratorium.

    You are correct that there are also many other components contributing to the high price of gasoline situation besides lack of new US offshore drilling, which are discussed here in a different thread. The most recent gasoline cost component of course has nothing at all to do with oil drilling or oil supplies i.e. the Maryland 'minimum floor price of gasoline' law (also passed by an overwhelmingly democratic state legislature), and was probably the reason that Hannity commented on the subject at this particular time.

    As to GWB sending troops to the middle east, it is arguable that had he not done so right now we would already be paying $5 per gallon for gasoline plus waiting in lines as inadequate supplies were rationed out, exactly as occurred under the Jimmy Carter administration when mideast oil deliveries were cut off at the source. However, unlike the official action of middle eastern governments which was responsible for the shortage in the Carter years, this time the cause would have been islamic terrorist bombers blowing up pipelines and oil tanker platforms.

  3. #3
    Member NuttinbutLegs's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Las Vegas
    Posts
    60
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Regardless of whose fault it is- oil is outdated and causes too much pollution and environmental destruction. We should NOT be drilling for oil anymore- I think. I KNOW there has got to be a way somewhere out there where we can build cars that run completely on electricity or that are completely battery operated. I know that this would cause some people to lose out on a great deal of money (especially the oil companies), but in the long run if we don't take care of this planet, we're all gonna be f***ed.

  4. #4
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    You're right that 100% electric cars could be built right now. One significant reason that they are not being built is the high cost of the batteries. Since the lead used in the battery plates is deemed to be toxic and heavily regulated from an environmental standpoint, the initial cost and replacement cost of such batteries is very expensive. Also, because of a lack of nuclear power development over the past 25 years, the cost of the electrical energy needed to charge batteries to drive 50 miles is at least twice as high as the cost of the energy needed to drive the same 50 miles coming from gasoline. Also due to lack of power grid development over the past 25 years any significant increase in electrical demand for a new application would put large areas at risk of blackout.

    It's basically a matter of you can't have your cake and eat it too. In other words, you can't bring nuclear power plant licensing to a dead stop, you can't bring power transmission line environmental approvals to a virtual dead stop, and you can't limit new electrical generation to only natural gas fired turbines for environmental reasons, and still expect to have a surplus of reasonably priced electric power to devote to a new application i.e. electric vehicles.

  5. #5
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    262
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by NuttinbutLegs
    Regardless of whose fault it is- oil is outdated and causes too much pollution and environmental destruction. We should NOT be drilling for oil anymore- I think. I KNOW there has got to be a way somewhere out there where we can build cars that run completely on electricity or that are completely battery operated. I know that this would cause some people to lose out on a great deal of money (especially the oil companies), but in the long run if we don't take care of this planet, we're all gonna be f***ed.

    Battery technology is the current holdup in development of electric cars. They are too heavy, bulky, and provide an inadequate supply of power to be practical at this point in time. When batteries catch up, the idea of an electric car will be a viable alternative to gasoline and diesel power.

    A better solution is the use of bio-diesel. It's a renewable source of fuel that doesn't require a major overhaul of our fuel distribution network, doesn't pollute like gasoline (virtually no HC's), and uses engine technology already established and familiar to consumers, manufacturers, and service departments. Diesel technology has developed to the point that performance can compare to that of a gasoline-powered car.

  6. #6
    Featured Member discretedancer's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    1,004
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    I am an investor/partner in a new BioDiesel production facility in PA - BD made from waste veggie oil (though hemp is an equallygood source in many ways....most states don't allow industrial hemp production). Great for diesel engines, reduces emissions and helps engines live longer. CONSTANT cost because the feedstocks and materials (basically) never change in price.

    also, as a side benefit....we get alot of glycerine (re: the stuff they make hand lotions from) . If anyone wants this, let me know!

  7. #7
    God/dess Mr Hyde's Avatar
    Joined
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Tampa
    Posts
    4,035
    Thanks
    278
    Thanked 586 Times in 346 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Liberals are the cause of everything bad in the simple-minded world of the extreme right these days.

  8. #8
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    262
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Hyde
    Liberals are the cause of everything bad in the simple-minded world of the extreme right these days.
    Liberals are as equally bad and simple-minded as the extreme right. Liberals really aren't liberal at all, they're authoritarian, just like the conservatives they hate.

    Having godlessness and PC bullshit forced on you is just as bad as having religion rammed down your throat. Both the extreme left and extreme right are trampling our freedom and stifling our progress.

  9. #9
    Veteran Member Hello~Kitty's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    345
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Hyde
    Liberals are the cause of everything bad in the simple-minded world of the extreme right these days.
    Oh isn't that the damn truth.... todays US conservatives for the most part anyway, accept no responciblity for anything at all and instead try to blame everything under the sun on liberals..... the truth of the matter is that both political parties and their supporters share blame on many of the things not working in this country but you won't hear that from the NeoCons and their supporters that is for sure !

    Quote Originally Posted by Hef
    Having godlessness and PC bullshit forced on you is just as bad as having religion rammed down your throat.
    Godlessness ? Sorry but that is incorrect, try seperation of church and state ie freedom of religion .


    As for being politicaly correct (which usualy refers to supporting equal/civil rights) I suppose that is a matter of opinion but as a woman I tend to want a more "PC" society. It is kinda of a self preservation thing. If I don't support equal/civil rights for minorities then why would anyone stand up for my civil rights ? I think women in general tend to understand the importance of "PC" policies. There are a few excetions to that ofcourse but as my frend pointed out in a differnt topic those women appear to harbor deep seated prejudces of their own which IMO alters things a great deal.

    A better solution is the use of bio-diesel. It's a renewable source of fuel that doesn't require a major overhaul of our fuel distribution network, doesn't pollute like gasoline (virtually no HC's), and uses engine technology already established and familiar to consumers, manufacturers, and service departments. Diesel technology has developed to the point that performance can compare to that of a gasoline-powered car.
    Bring it on... I am all for alternative fuel sources but until they become accepted and widely used I'd rather we be drilling here in our own country (in the least damaging way and place possible enviromental wise) rather than commiting mass murder (100,000+ thus far) to gain control over the oil in Iraq. Drilling in the US is the lesser of two evils but alternative fuel is the best overall answer.......ofcourse we wont be seeing much of that as long as we have an oil man and a defense contractor company man running the White House. Alternative fuels mean less personal profits for them and therefor alternative fuel is given only lipservice in a press confrence here and there.


    btw~ how can you tell when a NeoCon is lying ? It's whenever they are not asleep
    Example of discrimination (Imho):

    the only prudent way to treat Islamics in the US and western europe today is along the same vein as Russians and Eastern Europeans were treated during the 'cold war' days - with some degree of suspicion warranted until proven otherwise !

    http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44590




  10. #10
    God/dess
    Joined
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    2,352
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie
    You're right that 100% electric cars could be built right now. One significant reason that they are not being built is the high cost of the batteries. Since the lead used in the battery plates is deemed to be toxic and heavily regulated from an environmental standpoint, the initial cost and replacement cost of such batteries is very expensive. Also, because of a lack of nuclear power development over the past 25 years, the cost of the electrical energy needed to charge batteries to drive 50 miles is at least twice as high as the cost of the energy needed to drive the same 50 miles coming from gasoline. Also due to lack of power grid development over the past 25 years any significant increase in electrical demand for a new application would put large areas at risk of blackout.

    It's basically a matter of you can't have your cake and eat it too. In other words, you can't bring nuclear power plant licensing to a dead stop, you can't bring power transmission line environmental approvals to a virtual dead stop, and you can't limit new electrical generation to only natural gas fired turbines for environmental reasons, and still expect to have a surplus of reasonably priced electric power to devote to a new application i.e. electric vehicles.
    I am sure that most peolple would like to be more environment friendly but the automotive industry or rather the big three are not going to invest all ther profits in developement of a new oil / emmision free vehicle just yet they would loose there ass and surely go out of business this is going to come down to a federal mandate sorry to say, to see these changes - the cake tastes good for these corporations why change the flavor ? The byproduct (lead ) as said by Melonie would be worse for the environment then just keeping cars that run on fuel .I have a suspicion there is probably a draft or plan of a vehicle that is much more effecient and does not polute the envoronment but is locked up in a vault somewhere never to see the light of day until a mandate is put into affect .

  11. #11
    Featured Member Destiny's Avatar
    Joined
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    1,355
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    The biggest cause of high gasoline prices are environmental extremist.
    Dancing is wonderful training for girls, it's the first way you learn to guess what a man is going to do before he does it. ~Christopher Morley, Kitty Foyle

  12. #12
    Jay Zeno
    Guest

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Destiny
    The biggest cause of high gasoline prices are environmental extremist.
    Hm. Some people would call me an extremist, yet I accept the fact that pollution is going to happen, just as our digesting of food creates waste. But I would like a more efficient process of energy use that takes us away from dependence on nonrenewable and diminishing resources.

    If that makes me an extremist, so be it. I would disagree, but that's of no consequence. I used to be, doing the Earth Day march thing and all of that, until I realized that radical environmentalists lie to get their way every bit as much as hardened industrialists or heartless economists.

    But I'm wondering where in the chain of oil extraction, shipping, refining, marketing, distribution, and sales the "environmental extremism" adds more cost than anything else.

  13. #13
    Veteran Member Hello~Kitty's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    345
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Zeno
    I'm wondering where in the chain of oil extraction, shipping, refining, marketing, distribution, and sales the "environmental extremism" adds more cost than anything else.
    Well said ! I am fairly sure we will get some sort of false and non logical reasoning from someone in the hate all liberals crowd as an answer though

    as I mentioned before : todays US conservatives for the most part anyway, accept no responciblity for anything at all and instead try to blame everything under the sun on liberals..... the truth of the matter is that both political parties and their supporters share blame on many of the things not working in this country but you won't hear that from the NeoCons and their supporters that is for sure !

    And while I can't see the entire message from which Jay quoted in his above post due my ignore list settings, I can see from the part he quoted that my earlier comment is right on the money...no pun intended, LOL !
    Example of discrimination (Imho):

    the only prudent way to treat Islamics in the US and western europe today is along the same vein as Russians and Eastern Europeans were treated during the 'cold war' days - with some degree of suspicion warranted until proven otherwise !

    http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44590




  14. #14
    Featured Member Destiny's Avatar
    Joined
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    1,355
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Zeno
    But I'm wondering where in the chain of oil extraction, shipping, refining, marketing, distribution, and sales the "environmental extremism" adds more cost than anything else.
    Simple economics JZ, you keep the supply limited, you increase the costs.

    Objections to drilling in ANWR, mostly from environmentalists, have stymied efforts to open up the refuge ever since a 1980 change in federal law allowed for oil and gas exploration there. At the time, Alaskans were under the impression that production would start soon. Sen. Ted Stevens (R-AK), who recently toured the remote North Alaska site, said that for “24 years I’ve argued to get Congress to keep its word to us.â€

    Now some would argue that opening up the ANWR to oil drilling is not worth the environmental risks, That's fine. The same could be said for drilling off the coast of California or Florida. But lets make no mistake that such decisions do increase the cost of fuel.
    Dancing is wonderful training for girls, it's the first way you learn to guess what a man is going to do before he does it. ~Christopher Morley, Kitty Foyle

  15. #15
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    262
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Hello~Kitty
    Oh isn't that the damn truth.... todays US conservatives for the most part anyway, accept no responciblity for anything at all and instead try to blame everything under the sun on liberals..... the truth of the matter is that both political parties and their supporters share blame on many of the things not working in this country but you won't hear that from the NeoCons and their supporters that is for sure !
    CONGRESS as a whole accepts no responsibility. They bullshit and bandaid and do whatever will help them get another term in office, or get them a cushy job once they're out. They're politicians, it's what they do.


    Godlessness ? Sorry but that is incorrect, try seperation of church and state ie freedom of religion .
    The concept of seperation of church and state came about because early American colonists wished to escape the religious persecution they felt in England, where they were legally bound to the Church of England and the Queen was a religious figurehead as well as monarch.

    Our founding fathers looked to Heaven for moral guidance in leading our country, and we shouldn't allow some left-wing minority to bar the rest of us from doing the same. America was founded on Judeo-Christian morality.

    As for being politicaly correct (which usualy refers to supporting equal/civil rights) I suppose that is a matter of opinion but as a woman I tend to want a more "PC" society. It is kinda of a self preservation thing. If I don't support equal/civil rights for minorities then why would anyone stand up for my civil rights ? I think women in general tend to understand the importance of "PC" policies. There are a few excetions to that ofcourse but as my frend pointed out in a differnt topic those women appear to harbor deep seated prejudces of their own which IMO alters things a great deal.
    There is a difference in supporting equal rights for everyone versus pushing a ridiculous social engineering agenda. Equal rights are good, having to tiptoe around other peoples' "sensitivities" for fear of offending them (and paying legal consequences) is very bad.

    Examples:

    Los Angeles County decided to do away with the terms "Master" and "Slave" when referring to computer hard drives. Why? Because it might offend black people. WTF? Is that a fucking joke?

    Affirmative Action. Why should racial quotas have any bearing on hiring/firing employees? Shouldn't candidates be judged based on past performance, education, aptitude, etc? Why should anyone get preferential treatment due to skin tone? That's fucked up. It means jobs aren't being awarded to the most qualified people all the time.

    I take issue with the term "undocumented immigrant". They are, by definition, CRiMINALS. They purposely evade our Border Patrol and knowingly and deliberately violate our immigration policies, procedures, and laws for ther own benefit. But it's "unfair" or "discriminatory" or "racist" to express negativity to those poor people. Bullshit. They're illegal aliens.

    Get my drift?

    Bring it on... I am all for alternative fuel sources but until they become accepted and widely used I'd rather we be drilling here in our own country (in the least damaging way and place possible enviromental wise) rather than commiting mass murder (100,000+ thus far) to gain control over the oil in Iraq. Drilling in the US is the lesser of two evils but alternative fuel is the best overall answer.......ofcourse we wont be seeing much of that as long as we have an oil man and a defense contractor company man running the White House. Alternative fuels mean less personal profits for them and therefor alternative fuel is given only lipservice in a press confrence here and there.

    While I don't agree with everything you said here, I can at least agree on the end you propose. I'd much rather drill on American soil than rely on foreign oil, but ultimately I'd like to see a viable alternative for fuel like biodiesel become our mainstay.

    I think your mass murder comment is ridiculous and I highly doubt you can substantiate your assertion that we have committed the mass murder of over 100,000 people to gain control of Iraqi oil. Please provide some evidence or at least admit you're wrong.

    btw~ how can you tell when a NeoCon is lying ? It's whenever they are not asleep

    I can say the same thing about Feinstein, Schumer, Kennedy, Boxer, etc....

  16. #16
    Jay Zeno
    Guest

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Destiny
    Simple economics JZ, you keep the supply limited, you increase the costs.
    Agreed as a principle. Is the supply so limited right now that "extreme environmentalism" is holding it back? I haven't seen it.

    And I agree that environmental mitigation increases cost. Everything that is done during the production process increases costs. But you said "extreme environmentalism" was the highest cost factor. I'm wondering how those specifics factor in.

    Objections to drilling in ANWR, mostly from environmentalists, have stymied efforts to open up the refuge ever since a 1980 change in federal law allowed for oil and gas exploration there. At the time, Alaskans were under the impression that production would start soon. Sen. Ted Stevens (R-AK), who recently toured the remote North Alaska site, said that for “24 years I’ve argued to get Congress to keep its word to us.â€

    If this is the point, I have not seen where ANWR being locked up has been the highest factor in increasing costs from the ever-present flow from other sources. As far as I can tell in my ignorance of things in the petroleum market, decisions by the oil-producing countries have a greater bearing on cost, which is in line with that supply-and-demand principle, too.

    Now some would argue that opening up the ANWR to oil drilling is not worth the environmental risks, That's fine. The same could be said for drilling off the coast of California or Florida. But lets make no mistake that such decisions do increase the cost of fuel.
    Well, while production is meeting consumption, I would ponder whether the withholding of other resources actively increases costs but rather keeps costs from maintaining or declining due to lack of competition. But, shrug, the net effect is the same, depending on how the oil producers would treat this new production. Did the Alaska Pipeline reduce or hold the line on costs? I'm just curious - I have no idea. Anyway, yes, I'm one of those reluctant to open up the Refuge, too, because I haven't yet seen compelling evidence that it's truly needed as of now. But I still don't see where refraining from opening the Refuge is the highest factor in cost at the pump.

  17. #17
    Veteran Member Hello~Kitty's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    345
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Hef
    I think your mass murder comment is ridiculous and I highly doubt you can substantiate your assertion that we have committed the mass murder of over 100,000 people to gain control of Iraqi oil. Please provide some evidence or at least admit you're wrong.
    There is alot of evidence out there that points to the purpose of the war being control over the oil.... do a little googling and you'll find it (I'm not in the mood to stop my current research of another topic right now to point some out, sorry... but I am sure you are more than capable of looking it up yourself) therefor I will not say that I am wrong but I will admit it is a personal opinion of mine, which is shared by many as well as opposed by many.

    I agree with your comments on Church/State but I will also point out that our current reigning party has been pushing their view of religion (fundy Christian) as the only acceptable religious view and have been intergecting it into governemnt at every turn lately. Examples: Congress and Bush brothers on the Terri Schiavo situation, attempting to ban gay marriage , kicking out Democrats from Churches , calling all liberals a threat to people of faith (as if their view of faith is the only view) trying to force abstinace only sex ed etc.

    The current reigning political party leadership is attempting to have state sanctioned and required religion. That is a violation of church and state and opposes the priciples of the founding fathers who came here to escape government interference in religion.

    What I objected to originaly was the use of the term "Godless" as that is incorrect. Democrats and liberals are not by and large "Godless" but rather support the concept of freedom of religious beliefs without government interference.
    Example of discrimination (Imho):

    the only prudent way to treat Islamics in the US and western europe today is along the same vein as Russians and Eastern Europeans were treated during the 'cold war' days - with some degree of suspicion warranted until proven otherwise !

    http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44590




  18. #18
    Veteran Member Hello~Kitty's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    345
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Zeno
    I would ponder whether the withholding of other resources actively increases costs but rather keeps costs from maintaining or declining due to lack of competition.
    Excellant point ! And that is exactly what we have now... one side of political spectrum is now and has been opposing any other resourse except oil for some time. This has been dramticaly increased during this time period of having an oilman in office.

    Realisticly do we expect anything less though... alternative fuels would cut into his personal profits as well as the major contributors to his campaign and agenda. So why would he bother doing anything less than taking actions that help raise the cost of oil ? There is no incentive for him to do anything else but do everything in his power to hike up prices.

    Higher prices = higher profits for him and his friends. Longterm effects mean nothing to him obviously or there would a number of differnt actions taken in the past 5 years, not limited to oil either. Though oil obviously his main interest.

    NeoCon agenda is to gain control of as much of the worlds natuaral resources and then sell it back to the world at the highest possible price. Purpose ... world domination, power/ego trip and padding their personal bank accounts. The welfare of the American people or even the worlds people means absolutly nothing to a NeoCon, ime.

    Democrats can take some things too far , Republicans can too.... but NeoCons are the worst of all political powers because they are the most greedy and least caring of anyone or anything ever put on the planet.

    IMO~ NeoCon ='s pure evil through and through.
    Example of discrimination (Imho):

    the only prudent way to treat Islamics in the US and western europe today is along the same vein as Russians and Eastern Europeans were treated during the 'cold war' days - with some degree of suspicion warranted until proven otherwise !

    http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44590




  19. #19
    Featured Member GnBeret's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    796
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    With the exception of older homes in the Northern U.S. that still use heating oil to fire their furnaces and some rural areas still reliant on propane for same, we have pretty replaced crude oil and/or its derivative products as the energy source for all non-mobile/non-transport related uses with natural gas - a much more energy-efficient, as well as cost efficient fuel source that remains in abundant supply, even in North America. However, for numerous reasons, natural gas, even in the form of LNG, simply cannot be substituted for gasoline, diesel, and JP-4 such that it could also replace oil as the energy source for mobile/transport related uses.

    Instead, the most promising and, at the current time, most likely replacement for gasoline driven vehicles is fuel-cell technology, which burns hydrogen and emits water vapor as exhaust. Assuming the "best-guesstimates" of those involved in the development of the technology are correct, we're looking at something like 20-25 years before the combination of efficiencies and cost competitiveness necessary for the vehicles to survgive in the marketplace is achieved.

    Doesn't really matter, 'cause when you stop to consider the vast infrastructure which exists to deliver gasoline to you at damned near every intersection that has a stoplight and every freeway offramp, it becomes readily apparent that it's going to take quite some time to virtually completely duplicate that system for the delivery of hydrogen - we're talking refineries, pipelines, railroad cars, tank trucks, underground storage tanks, and pumps, little of which will convert from present system, and most of which will have to be built from scratch.

    And, now, for the kicker... ja ja ja: Who, exactly is it that you think has the finances, capabilities and motivation to commit to such a massive and capital intensive undertaking? Aja, you got it: ExxonMobil, et al. he moral of the story being... if you think they're worried about the world shifting away from crude and, hence, are somehow holding things up in that regard, you're wrong - they're not. Look at it this way: there's a reason they all changed their names from "XYZ Oil Corp." to "XYZ Energy & Minerals Corp.," etc. about 15-20 years ago... they plan on being your energy supplier, regardless of what form that energy might take, throughout the remainder of this century and well into the next.
    "That's your answer Old Man? I guess you're a Hard Case too...."
    - Luke
    "Some men, you just can't reach...."
    - Boss, re Luke

    If there's one thing in my life these years have taught me,
    it's that you can always see it coming, but you can never stop it.
    -Cowboy Junkies

  20. #20
    God/dess Mr Hyde's Avatar
    Joined
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Tampa
    Posts
    4,035
    Thanks
    278
    Thanked 586 Times in 346 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    "Liberals are as equally bad and simple-minded as the extreme right. Liberals really aren't liberal at all, they're authoritarian, just like the conservatives they hate.

    Having godlessness and PC bullshit forced on you is just as bad as having religion rammed down your throat. Both the extreme left and extreme right are trampling our freedom and stifling our progress."

    Not liberals...I'll give you the extreme left though. Saying all liberals is as bad as saying all conservatives. I'll say this though...the GOP has allowed itself to be consumed by the extreme, Bush-can-do-no-wrong right.

  21. #21
    Featured Member discretedancer's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    1,004
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by GnBeret
    However, for numerous reasons, natural gas, even in the form of LNG, simply cannot be substituted for gasoline, diesel, and JP-4 such that it could also replace oil as the energy source for mobile/transport related uses.
    Tell that to UPS, FEDEXand the other companies already running CNG fleet vehicles.

    As for the Refuge known as ANWR...if it were so cost-effective an option, why have more oil companies OPTED OUT of the program in the last 10 years, blaming their lack of interest on the cost-ineffectiveness and limited supply?

    The biggest thing BD has going for it (sorry you gasoline folks) is that every town, every farm can have a BD production unit on-site, cheaply and effectively turning locally-produced waste oil to energy for home heating (very big in my area) and vehicle propulsion, just as Dr. Diesel himself intended.

  22. #22
    Featured Member GnBeret's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    796
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by discretedancer
    Tell that to UPS, FEDEXand the other companies already running CNG fleet vehicles.
    Aja... but in addition to it being feasible for them to set up their own tanks, pumps, etc., they're also driving trucks with much heavier-duty frames and using rubber-bladder steel tanks mounted inside the frame members - much more difficult to do with a Ford Focus and, given the relative difference in the size of the frame members, not near as protected from being crushed. Although gasoline can "explode," it mostly burns - CNG explodes, period.
    "That's your answer Old Man? I guess you're a Hard Case too...."
    - Luke
    "Some men, you just can't reach...."
    - Boss, re Luke

    If there's one thing in my life these years have taught me,
    it's that you can always see it coming, but you can never stop it.
    -Cowboy Junkies

  23. #23
    Featured Member discretedancer's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    1,004
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    OK, but Honda had a CNG civic, and many (Hartford CT for one) cities have CNG cabs, and gas companies are REQUIRED to provide places to fill up in each market...

    and any car can be converted to CNG

    not saying it's an immediate, 100% replacement to GAS...but it also demonstrates that gasoline isn't the only fuel solution for today.

  24. #24
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Back to basics of supply and demand again regarding natural gas/LNG/CNG. The fact is that there are a finite number of gas wells in North America, which are barely able to keep up with current demand. Fact is that environmentalist lobbying has pretty much forced all new energy consumption for electricity generation to use natgas as the fuel. LNG imports are able to cover some of the shortfall between domestic production and domestic consumption, however there are only six US ports with installed LNG terminals and environmentalist lobbying is stopping construction of additional LNG terminals to allow an increase in imports.

    Another fact is that Alaska's existing oil fields as well as the ANWR have vast natural gas reserves, but that these reserves are essentially useless since there are no facilities to liquify and transport it by ship (no new LNG terminal environmental approvals) and no pipeline currently exists for gas delivery between alaska and the continental US (nor is one likely due to difficulty of environmental approvals).

    Clearly, an environmental lobby which in one breath says that the power generation industry has no practical choice other than to use natural gas fuel for all additional generation (and also promotes LNG/CNG as a subsitute for oil in vehicles), and with the next breath says that the available American market supply of natgas/LNG/CNG cannot be increased, is definitely playing both sides of the supply and demand equation with the inevitable result of much higher natgas/LNG/CNG prices.

  25. #25
    Featured Member discretedancer's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    1,004
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Hannity says to blame only liberals for high gas prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie
    , an environmental lobby which in one breath says that the power generation industry has no practical choice other than to use natural gas fuel for all additional generation (and also promotes LNG/CNG as a subsitute for oil in vehicles), and with the next breath says that the available American market supply of natgas/LNG/CNG cannot be increased,
    I haven'theard a reputable sustainable or environmental organization promoting NG in any form as an alternative fuel .... though some have promoted the fact that NG has less pollution involved when burned than petroleum. Those 2 are NOT the same

    Therefore, your entire statement is false...

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Gas Prices...
    By Butrcup98 in forum Dollar Den
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 12-02-2008, 10:32 AM
  2. High Gas Prices= More Extras?
    By laplover69 in forum Stripping (was Stripping General)
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: 05-04-2008, 07:00 PM
  3. Lets get gas prices down!!
    By Roulette in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 94
    Last Post: 05-15-2007, 05:50 PM
  4. gas prices going up again...
    By Emily in forum Dollar Den
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-07-2006, 11:43 AM
  5. And the gas prices keep going up why?
    By VenusGoddess in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 10-28-2005, 09:33 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •