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Thread: Hybrid Cars...

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    Veteran Member bella622's Avatar
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    Hybrid Cars...

    I am getting ready to buy a new car and I am wondering if anyone has a hybrid... I drive so much that the gas mileage seems like it might be worth paying a few extra dollars for that version of a car.

    Does anyone have one? Is there a significant difference in gas mileage for real?
    Hollywood is a place where they'll pay you a thousand dollars for a kiss and fifty cents for your soul... - Marilyn Monroe

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    Veteran Member bella622's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Oh yeah... I almost forgot. I heard that you get like a $2000 tax break if you buy one. Any truth to that? That would almost cover the difference in price between the hybrid and the regular car.
    Hollywood is a place where they'll pay you a thousand dollars for a kiss and fifty cents for your soul... - Marilyn Monroe

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    God/dess whirlerz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Well, I know a guy who's had a Honda hybrid for a couple years now. He likes it. He says he gets like 50mph highway. But, like everything, there's a downside. I heard you have to fix them more, & you don't always get what they promise gas-milage wise altho it's better than a regular car of course. If i was in the market, I'd sure consider one. Definiately try to do some research.


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    Veteran Member leebay88's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    If you do a lot of HW driving than you really won't be able to take advantage of the hybrid. Once you start driving on the HW at high speeds and long distances it switches over to gas power.

    If you do a lot of city driving or are using the breaks often then you will def see the benefits of the hybrid.

    A few years back there were a lot of service issues with hybrids. I've heard that it is a lot better these days. The Honda Accord Hybrid is suppose to be really good.

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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Quote Originally Posted by leebay88
    If you do a lot of HW driving than you really won't be able to take advantage of the hybrid. Once you start driving on the HW at high speeds and long distances it switches over to gas power.

    If you do a lot of city driving or are using the breaks often then you will def see the benefits of the hybrid.

    A few years back there were a lot of service issues with hybrids. I've heard that it is a lot better these days. The Honda Accord Hybrid is suppose to be really good.
    I agree the Honda Accord is the way to go they are having some problems with the Mini-Van ( forgot name ) shutting off for no reason .Stay clear of that - for stop and go as stated this is good but there are cars out there when driven on the hwy can get 30mpg so is it worth the extra money - probably not you wont get the return on it from the fuel costs . I am waiting for Melonie to chime in here she is a real big advocate of these lol ...

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    Featured Member screaminpeachez's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    http://www.fred.net/tds/prius2004.html

    The Prius does 60 mpg city, 50 mpg highway.

    That's awesome!
    "may your work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching, screw like your being filmed and drink like a true Irishman "--anonymous
    "GOD is LOVE, but get it in writing"- Gypsy Rose Lee

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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Im still skeptical.....although I would drive one...I dunno if I would buy one. I still think they need to work more bugs out. If I had to service it and wonder about the true MPG constantly then I dont think it would be worth it.
    Just as I would never buy a brand new car..alot of them are starting to have random problems where you have to take them back to the dealership/service shop.
    you live like an ivy vine
    you can only survive by clinging onto trees
    that's your flaw
    put down some roots so you can stand on your own
    -Kenpachi



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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Hybrid is the way to go if you do a lot of distance driving, and want a more advanced
    powertrain than the present 19th century engine combustion technolgy we are stuck with.
    There are no gueling facilities for hydrogen cell cars, and we probably need fusion power to
    produce enough liquid hydrogen (and cool it down to liquid form) to make this technology
    feasible. Thus hybrid is ready now.

    Gas prices will go down somewhat, but $1 a gal. is history. I think $2 is the new minimum.

    My view. Demand on this planet has changed forever. 1 billion people in India and 2 billion in China will all want cars. I can't blame them, but this is a huge new demand and it is fundamental long erm demand on gasoline, (and other resources).

    Thus I think $3 gas is possible, with rising prices for the next thirty years with periods of
    some declines.

    You should buy a hybrid if you beleive in the environment, and believe that prices are going to be high and go higher for the long term. If you buy one, you are sort of a pioneer
    in practical applied engineering as you are one of the first. There will be problems.

    Only buy a new hybrid and buy the 100,000 mile 10 year warranty from Honda.
    Toota has the same buy their maximum warranty.

    I'm not sure how the hybrid will do in snow climinate. I would expect OK in winter in Indianna, Illinois, Washington DC, Ohio,Kansas. Probably do very well in the south.
    My thoughts are that batteries have problems about 10 degrees F. The midwest is much warmer than the past so you are probably OK. Near Canada and the border I would wonder about winter preformance.

    I key legal and engineering change needs to be made on these cars. At the end of a day
    you need to be able to plug your hybrid in and recharge it overnight. For trips under 8 miles
    you might never need to use the gasoline engine.

    At the moment, doing this voids your repair warranty. My guess is this is an engineering and poliitcal/practical energy problem with so many people draining electricty overnight to recharge their cars. Toyota and Honda need to add this recharge feature and for many people milage goes up to about 90 miles per gallon.

    The point is if you buy one you don;t have to worry about rationing, and as a country
    we could really stretch our oil supplies and become somewhat independent from the guys wearing bedsheets. After all their cartel (OPEC) controls the price somewhat.

    Electric gas technology is the wave of the future for the next fifty years.

    You are paying a premium for it. If you can afford it do it. Everyone will talk with you about your car.

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    Featured Member discretedancer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Hybrids are good...Insight gets the best MPG, followed by Prius/Civic in basically a tie.

    Don't ignore the diesels...my Jetta wagon gets 48-50mpg all the time, Hwy and City...and I can run it off waste veggie oil from restaurants if I chooose to...free fuel (read up on this before trying it).

    Hybrids do have 1 drawback...the batteries die eventually and are expensive (there are alot of them).

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    Featured Member screaminpeachez's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    "may your work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching, screw like your being filmed and drink like a true Irishman "--anonymous
    "GOD is LOVE, but get it in writing"- Gypsy Rose Lee

    http://www.myspace.com/screaminpeachez

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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    The diesels are a good alternative. However they are still combustion carbon fuel as the
    technology. I recall that diesel fuel used to sell for 20% less per gal than gasoline,
    which is a good selling point. Many people in the mid 70's bought diesels, and for awhile
    diesel fuel was 40% more than gasoline. Also you have to know which company sells
    diesel fuel as it is hard to get. (Not quite as hard to get as liquid hydrogen to refuel
    however.) NNew diesel technolgy does not pollute, but present diesel technology does pollute. Not sure the new technology is quite ready for application in the real world of
    cosnumer drivers.

    If electric technology can be made better it is new technology, and cheaper to refuel.
    One estimate I heard is that recharging your car at home is like 20 cents a gallon to run
    locally on electric power.

    The reason I push hybrid is that the technology is here, cheaper on fuel (with the recharge feature), and very very low on emissions.

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Ahhh, one of my favorite subjects. First, there are the original group of hybrids like the Civic which have a tiny gas engine, mediocre performance, and are eminently practical. Next there is a second group of hybrids which have a large gas engine and basically use the hybrid electric motor as an environmentally friendly supercharger to reduce acceleration times and boost peak horsepower. If you check the specs, you'll find that the Accord only gets 3mpg better gas mileage than the standard Accord, but has a way better 0 to 60 time. And yes for the duration of 2005 it is in fact true that you can claim a hybrid vehicle tax credit on your federal and state income tax, which is worth a reasonable amount of money.

    Now for the bad news nobody wants to talk about regarding hybrids. First, the hybrid system depends on a large bank of batteries which are estimated to have about a five year life before they won't hold a charge anymore. Replacing the battery bank involves about a $3-4,000 investment. If you amortize the battery replacement cost over a 5 year period versus a 3mpg gasoline savings over the same period, you're probably in the red.

    Second, many states have had the lightbulb come on in regard to an increasing number of hybrids causing a drop in state road tax revenue - which is presently assessed on a per gallon of gasoline basis like 50 cents + per gallon in NY and CA. The states are already talking about alternate ways to collect their road tax i.e. being charged so much per mile driven at annual vehicle inspection time, gas pumps which communicate with the vehicle's odometer and adjust the per gallon price of gas to include tax based on miles driven since the last fillup rather than gallons purchased etc. Thus it's entirely possible that in the near future hybrid vehicle owners will wind up being charged their 'fair share' of road tax based on miles driven, which at the very least will offset a significant portion of the gasoline cost savings.

    Personally speaking, from an overall lowest cost of maintenance and operation standpoint, give me a small high-tech diesel over gas or hybrid any day. I have to agree with Discrete that Volkswagen is probably the best small high-tech diesel which is legal for sale in the USA - it gets mileage equal to hybrids with better overall power and performance - it will have much lower maintenance costs over a 5 year period (actual over a 10 year period) - and the purchase price is more reasonable even when the hybrid tax credit is factored in, because hybrids all command a premium price.

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    Featured Member discretedancer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie
    First, there are the original group of hybrids like the Civic which have a tiny gas engine, mediocre performance, and are eminently practical...accord...3mpg performance
    Melonie's typical source: Make-it-up.com


    try
    http://hybridcars.about.com/od/carclubs/

    or

    http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-10912_7...eationDate+asc

    If you amortize the battery replacement cost over a 5 year period versus a 3mpg gasoline savings over the same period, you're probably in the red.
    but if you take a double-the-mileage car like Prius or Civic that is comparable in performance to its 4cyl bretheren, then the numbers get better. Maybe not enoug for you, but better

    Second, many states have had the lightbulb come on in regard to an increasing number of hybrids causing a drop in state road tax revenue - which at the very least will offset a significant portion of the gasoline cost savings.
    "significant" means you MIGHT (IF the hybrid only raises your MPG 3 which is 10%) pay another nickel per gallon, which still saves ALOT of money..if you double your mileage, you save $1.50 on every $2 gallon of gas not burned.

    Personally speaking, from an overall lowest cost of maintenance and operation standpoint, give me a small high-tech diesel over gas or hybrid any day. I have to agree with Discrete that Volkswagen is probably the best small high-tech diesel which is legal for sale in the USA - it gets mileage equal to hybrids with better overall power and performance - it will have much lower maintenance costs over a 5 year period (actual over a 10 year period) - and the purchase price is more reasonable even when the hybrid tax credit is factored in, because hybrids all command a premium price.
    Finally, we agree on something!

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    assuming that you'll be amenable to accepting Green Car Congress's test results as a bit more authoritative than 'make-it-up.com', you might want to compare the mileage of the Honda Accord Hybrid versus the standard Honda Accord 4 cylinder which I referred to above and which you attempted to blow off. Their test results came out 4 mpg difference instead of the 3 mpg I had seen in a similar test from a more 'partisan' source .... excuuuuuuuuuse me !



    PS look at the Accord diesel (which unfortunately isn't legal for sale in all US states yet), which gets 10 mpg better fuel economy than the Accord HYBRID !

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    Default Re: Hybrid Cars...

    Buy the 100,000 mile 10 year warranty and it covers the battery replacement, at least according to my Honda sales guy. I presume Toyotas is a similar coverage.

    Diesel is a good alternate. Remember not every gas station sells Diesel fuel.

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