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Thread: Was what I said racist?

  1. #51
    Banned Stringer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Don't sweat it, Lilith. If the girl you were speaking to accepted your apology, then that's all that matters. It is obvious from your posts that your heart is in the right place.

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Cristalla, I'd advise you to NOT use the word wetback in conversation. It is definitely used and received in a negative way.

    Also, when people call you a WOP they are not being nice...

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgette
    Cristalla, I'd advise you to NOT use the word wetback in conversation. It is definitely used and received in a negative way.

    Also, when people call you a WOP they are not being nice...
    Whats weird for me is, the only person I know that acutally uses the term Wetback, is Mexican.... go figure!

    I always laugh when I get called a Wop. Most folks dont realize that calling a woman a Wop is literally incorrect.
    Last edited by PaigeDWinter; 08-21-2005 at 08:28 PM.
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  4. #54
    Veteran Member Cristalla's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    yeah thanks bridgette,,, thats why i always ask first but sometimes learning a new language brings u back like when u were a child and u just repeated the words u heard,,,
    i totally want to avoid that mistake!

  5. #55
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    ouch... I don't think that you meant anything wrong by it, but you really should choose your selection of words more carefully..

  6. #56
    Featured Member MinahSky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    None of those words are good to say to anyone. I dont' are if the person saying it is of that nationality. It didn't start in a good place and isnt' meant to be nice...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Do unto others as you would have them do to you...it's less work to be nice than it is to be evil!

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  7. #57
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    I've heard alot of 2nd-3rd generation mexicans use the word wetbacks, and they don't mean it in a nice way either. I never quite understood that, since their parents/grandparents were wetbacks

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cristalla
    oh ,,, ok... sometimes i read all this american slang terms and i need to know if they are bad or not because i might use them in a conversation not knowing and get in trouble,,,
    i m italian and sometimes they called me WOP but it just makes me laugh ... i dont take offense maybe because is just a funny word and doesnt have a meaning in my country...lots has to do with being raised with the meaning of the word
    http://www.rsdb.org/?2

    ^ Racial slur database. If you are easily offended I wouldn't read it. its basically a spreadsheet looking database on almost every word I have heard plus a few I havent. And it includes the meanings behind the words, which is helpful in smiting the racist people.

    That should help you out Cristalla on some racial terms.

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by TJAndDani
    http://www.rsdb.org/?2

    ^ Racial slur database. If you are easily offended I wouldn't read it. its basically a spreadsheet looking database on almost every word I have heard plus a few I havent. And it includes the meanings behind the words, which is helpful in smiting the racist people.

    That should help you out Cristalla on some racial terms.
    Cant say for sure for the majority of the slurs listed, but their definition for WOP is mostly wrong. But then again, most folks dont know the real meaning.

    Several American dictionaries will tell you that wop is an acronym for "without papers" or "without passport," supposedly formerly stamped on the immigration documents of certain newcomers arrived from Italy. Una sciocchezza! Utter flapdoodle! Poppycock! Nonsense! In all the files of all the various names under which American departments of immigration have been known throughout United States history, there is no record whatsoever of the official issuance of such a stamp. No person has ever brought forward and presented as evidence a single immigration document stamped with such a phrase. Not once.

    Be suspicious whenever you are offered a word origin involving a short form or an acronym. The illiterate and the unread don't seem able to imagine language being passed through history, so acronymic pseudo-etymology is often the only path they are able to posit. These are the folks who think that the f word (whose roots are at least 3,000 years old!) is an acronym representing in English "for undue carnal knowledge." What, one wonders, would be "undue" about the carnal knowledge of, say, animals and married persons. I don't put animals and marrieds together on purpose, by the way.

    A plausible source of the word wop is the Spanish adjective guapo, pronounced approximately 'wopo' or 'hwopo,' depending on dialect. Its prime and sensuous meaning is 'beautiful' or 'handsome.' As a noun it came to mean 'dandy" or 'foppish male.' Then, says one theory I don't agree with (see why below), Spanish soldiers sent to Sicily took guapo meaning 'dandy' with them where the word entered Sicilian dialect as guappo. The word made its way north in Italy to become part of the dialect of Naples also. Italian guappo turned into a term of affection among Italian men who, when some of them immigrated to the United States in the late 19th century, carried the word to America as a term of male affection.

    Then, says this theory, non-Italian Americans heard Italian men referring to one another by this term, so the Americans mysteriously first reverted to the Spanish spelling but made the word wop an insult for Italians in general. The last shift is particularly unbelievable. But this is the origin currently in favour with several of the large dictionaries of English. The earliest usage in the Oxford English Dictionary dates to 1912 and is spelled wap. One American dictionary of slang says the first printed version they can find spells it Spanish-style as guap and guapo. The next OED usage citation is for the year 1914, with the familiar spelling of wop.

    The major fact against the Italian guappo is its pronunciation. Guappo is spoken as 'gwappo,' not 'wopo.' The g is hard, the u is a 'w' sound. In no Italian dialect, not Sicilian, not Neapolitan, not Brooklyn, is guappo pronounced 'wopo.'

    Think of the Italian word for 'men who make up the watch,' guardia. It is pronounced 'GWARDya." The famous airport in New York city is not 'Lawardia,' is it? No, it's LaGWARDia. But we are to suppose that every single American listening to these Italian immigrants use their word guappo heard them say 'wopo' and not 'GWAppo.' That's crap. It's not merely unlikely. Such a derivation is preposterous and the whole story reeks of folk etymology.

    The etymology that appeals to my knowledge of verbal transmission is the one propounded by most Spanish linguistic writers on the etymology of their own words and language. Their basic story is: it all happened in Spain.Guapo was first applied in Spain as an insult for Italian migrant grape workers in Iberian vineyards. Today Spain has more than one million "guest workers." Of course, the country has always HAD to welcome immigrant workers because of population scarcity and density fluctuations at various times in Spanish history. When the first large flood of Italian workers came to Spain at the end of the 19th century and in the early years of the 20th century, Spanish men, with their notoriously sensitive machismo, thought very little of Italian males. Spanish women disagreed—as records of intermarriage attest. Spanish men dismissed Italian men as "los guapos," 'the pretty boys.' They were too handsome. They were pretty boys who had to be watched when they were around virginal and pure Spanish women. British and American residents and visitors to Spain heard Italian men being called guapos. To remind, Spanish guapo is said 'wopo.' Italian is not.



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    Marasmus says, "Oh no, that wasn't gas, it was merely a rectal chuckle."

    Marek says, "A friend of mine got punched in the face by a dominatrix stripper about two weeks ago and I thought of you."

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    I would apologise to the girl (not any of the others) for how the comment may have come across, but make it clear to EVERYONE you are not apologising for the actual comment. Your comment was with good intentions - make sure they understand that.

    They were obviously looking for ANY reason to hate on you. You know you are not racist, and I'm sure they know too, they are just pulling this out as far as they can to alienate you and make you doubt yourself. Do not offer them an opportunity to get you down.
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    From a custy POV, someone needs to tell the DJs to turn up the lights a bit when fairly dark black women are on stage simply so I can SEE them, damnit! Maybe he should clear it with her first in case she's ashy and doesn't want the lighting right then, but it's a visual thing and I won't tip what I can't see!

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by pet_rock
    From a custy POV, someone needs to tell the DJs to turn up the lights a bit when fairly dark black women are on stage simply so I can SEE them, damnit! Maybe he should clear it with her first in case she's ashy and doesn't want the lighting right then, but it's a visual thing and I won't tip what I can't see!
    Its something i have never understood,but deal with every time I work.

    stunning females!!!
    Ones that you would have to search long and hard to find a visual imperfection,demanding low lights.

    Doesnt seem to matter what color they are,most want low lights.

    When I hear a custie complain about not being able to see them,all i can do is tell them to sit at the stage and tip,not in the back of the room saving money.

    Im not saying this applies to you,im saying its rare to find a club where you cant see the girl if your close to the stage,even in low light.

    The dj is caught between the lighting the club wants,and what the entertainer insist on 5 seconds before her set.

  13. #63
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cristalla
    i m italian and sometimes they called me WOP but it just makes me laugh ... i dont take offense maybe because is just a funny word and doesnt have a meaning in my country...lots has to do with being raised with the meaning of the word
    mean no offense,its just because you asked what "wet back"means.

    WOP...
    It stands for "WithOut Papers"
    Its an insult.

    Its a slang word that came from imagration into the USA,if memory serves me,i think it was born in New York.

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    i just read your post to my roommate, who is ethnic. she said it was good advice. :^)

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    Veteran Member Foxey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Hey I didn't say anything about "acting black" I said "PRETENDING to be black" I agree, I don't think it's possible to "act black" but yeah it is possible to pretend to be black. What is with a white girl who won't talk to anyone but black people and looks down on other white people? You can't tell me that she isn't having an identity crisis. And yeah I have worked with girls like that. I think that no matter what color you are you should embrace your heritage and be open minded towards everyone. And ya know what? American "Ghetto" is a new culture to me. I grew up in Vancouver BC. Ghetto is defined by the dictionary as "A section of a city occupied by a minority group who live there especially because of social, economic, or legal pressure" In Vancouver that discription would most accurately describe the downtown east side, or east hastings area. Guess what? People down there don't speak "ghetto" in fact they sound like everyone else in Vancouver. The most predominant minority there are Native Americans (or should I say Native Canadians, First Nations whatever) My point is that I have a hard time knowing "ghetto" when I hear it simpley because it's new to me. I think anyone in Vancouver can vouche for that. If the only people I've ever heard speaking "ghetto" are black people on MTV and so when I hear a white girl speak "ghetto" and I perceive it as her "pretending" to be black does that make me a bigot? No, it just makes me misinformed and hey I will accept that.
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Lilith,

    Hon, relax. You didn't do anything wrong. And even if the other person perceived what you said to be bad, you apologized and meant it sincerely. You shouldn't worry about it.

    I'm black myself, and I totally understand what you're saying. Wearing black (unless is has sparkles or is bordered in white) does make a darker skinned girl less noticeable. It's not a mean thing to say, it's the truth! Dark skinned girls should wear bright colors to emphasize the beautiful contrast. I know I do!!

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    Featured Member MinahSky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    It seems as if you're trying to educate yourself, Foxey, which is a good thing. Just remember that the world is a big place and MTV doesn't capture all of it...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Do unto others as you would have them do to you...it's less work to be nice than it is to be evil!

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    Senior Member SW Siren's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    I think the better way to have made the suggestion of costume color would have been to say how lovely she would have looked in brighter colors.

    it's always better to focus on the positive of a situation, especially when it is constructive criticism

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGreenMnM
    WOP...
    It stands for "WithOut Papers"
    Its an insult.

    Its a slang word that came from imagration into the USA,if memory serves me,i think it was born in New York.

    Nuh uh. Check the post I made a page or so back, hun.
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Foxey
    Hey I didn't say anything about "acting black" I said "PRETENDING to be black" .
    Then what the hell do you think actors do?! Acting = Pretend...Sigh..I'm just gonna not speak on this. For you to have been born in my generation..geez girl, you really need to get a clue.







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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Yeah, forget about it. I'm extremely dark-skinned too, and I rarely ever wear any color that isn't white. I even joke about wearing black and might say something like, "Hey, can you see me in this?" I mean, heck, I can barely see a pale-skinned person in black in club lighting! White (and often red and pink) are the two best colors for ANY dancer to wear--I have yet to see a dancer who does not look good in white at the clubs.

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    Veteran Member Foxey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by cinammonkisses
    Then what the hell do you think actors do?! Acting = Pretend...Sigh..I'm just gonna not speak on this. For you to have been born in my generation..geez girl, you really need to get a clue.
    Hey did you even read my last post? Maybe you need to get a clue that not everyone comes from the same place you do and not everyone has had the same life experiences. Have you ever even heard of Vancouver? Do you even know where it is? I'll give you a hint it's not a suberb of Toronto...
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    Featured Member Amethyst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by lilithmorrigan
    I feel so horrible, I think I said something that totally came out racist.

    This one black girl was complaining how she made no money so I asked her if I could make a suggestion.

    I told her that since her skin is dark and she wears black clothes and it's a nightclub, she tends to kinda fade in the background.

    All of a sudden everyone was mad at me. I spent the whole night apologizing to everybody and I feel so guilty that I've been throwing up. ;-;

    I didn't mean for it to sound mean or anything. ;-;

    Was it bad?
    Great advice (provided she's a dark-skinned Black dancer as not all Black people are the same color). Your choice of words leave much to be desired though. Maybe just: "I bet you'd look awesome in black or light blue - you'd really stand out!" instead of immediately commenting on her skin color. Are you racist? Nah. I've heard much worse. I also wouldn't worry about the other dancers either. Some girls just love drama, and they'll be mad at someone else in about a week.


  24. #74
    Veteran Member Cristalla's Avatar
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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    yes i knew it meant without papers - i didnt know the whole new wopo theory Paige decribed though -- but still i didnt feel insulted ,,, at that time i was actually without papers except my tourist visa but still i didnt care,,, if i get called slut or bitch then i care and those are insults ... but sometimes i hear black girls calling each other 'nigga' and they seem not to take it as an insult...they laugh and look playful... so i get confused ,,,

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    Default Re: Was what I said racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Malibu
    I would apologise to the girl (not any of the others) for how the comment may have come across, but make it clear to EVERYONE you are not apologising for the actual comment. Your comment was with good intentions - make sure they understand that.
    I agree w/ this. It atleast covers your bases by making sure that the originial dancer wasn't upset by the commnet, which she obviously wasn't.
    I've been told by many dark skinned dancers that they have to wear bright colors or they fade in the dark lighting, It's definitely true in one club I have worked at, even the REALLY tanned caucasian dancers have to wear neon or you can't really see their faces. I think I lent a dark-skinned new girl a red outfit one time because all she had was black dresses and she wasn't making any money.

    I'm glad you cared enough to make sure she was fine, but it just sounds like another case of grls starting up the drama train.
    It does suck to be called racist, I concider it the worst insult in the world because it's very hard to convince someone you are not, especially when they weren't even there (I'm referring to the dancers that come after the fact.)
    I guess this time you have to let it go and be glad that the on you were talking to knows that you were just trying to help.
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