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Thread: Is it possible? long

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    God/dess greenidlady1's Avatar
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    Default Is it possible? long

    Okay, I need some opinions of this situation. My best friend (Lolita) has within the last several months acquired a regular (David) that has been spending obscene amounts of money on her. I have heard of guys doing this before but always wondered if sex was involved in exchange for these gifts. She is married as I am and they are also pretty open. Anyhow, this guy comes in the club twice a week to see her and gets maybe 10 dances or so (350), however, she spends time talking so maybe he compensates her for that as well? Lolita is Russian and one of our friends, also Russian (Sasha) , was reported by one of the other girls at the club and the INS came to pick her up. Sasha spent time in jail and Lolita convinced David to help her. David hires a lawyer for Sasha and Sasha is deported within a couple of months, which is what they wanted. While Sasha was in jail in Atlanta, GA. David flys Lolita and her husband in his jet to see her. Atlanta is four hours from here. Also, Lolita's mother from Russia came for a visit this month and David put them up in a three bedroom condo over looking the ocean this past weekend. He also took them all out to dinner (including their two children) and payed for all the meals (3 nights). They are planning to also go on a cruise on David's private yacht next month to the Atlantis in the Bahamas. Do you think David enjoys helping her this much and this is how is getting his satisfaction or do think perhaps more is involved. I think it would be rude of me to ask her because she is such a close friend to me but I wonder about it. I am happy for her if she doesn't have to have sex for the favors and would like to acquire one of these types of men for myself if sex isn't involved.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Sure, it's possible. Given your description of David's financial means, it might even be likely.

    The general rule is this: The more significant the means, the less likely it's strictly about sex. The inverse is also true: The less significant the means, the more likely it is strictly about sex.

    The most obvious reason in the Lolita/David case is that it's not that much money to David. Trust me on this one -- so far he's probably spent less on Lolita, Sasha, the attorneys and all the travel/food/lodging you've described than he pays the IRS in about three days. So there is no impending pressure on David to make demands on her.

    Beyond that general rule, it can get fairly complicated. I know guys have the reputation of being universal horn dogs (true), but it's not always that simple. There are other compelling reasons why men of means like to be, or feel driven to be, around beautiful women. Often it's about image, or presentation or social interaction (keeping up with the Gates's). Other times there may be powerful psychological drives at work that could fill several novels. Sometimes rich guys are just lonely.

    Since Lolita is your close friend, you could probably find out in the course of a normal conversation, without asking her point-blank.

    One final thought. It may seem alluring to have this option for yourself if no sex is involved. But the greater danger for a married woman may be whether emotion and attachment are eventually involved.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    There are guys like that out there, who will offer to buy gifts, assist in emergencies, and be hospitable in other ways--without the slightest pressure for sex. That doesn't mean they'd object if the recipient of those favors decided to jump on them, but it isn't their primary motive.

    They do seem to be pretty rare, and usually it's part of some sort of master plan to seduce the woman over time. But as TOO says, the more wealthy the guy is, the less it means to him. I like to think that if I were very wealthy, I'd be this way with people who deserved it.

    Could be your friend has lucked out and found someone both generous and cool.

    Typically, though, nothing comes for free, even if the price paid is having to repel unwanted advances at some point down the line.
    You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star.
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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    It's totally possible that she's not having sex with him, but she's definitely in deep emotionally with him.



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    Veteran Member logan820's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    nothing is for free, that's my opinion, I'm not saying it has to be about sex, but he's getting something in return, and maybe it isn't a big deal to him, and he just enjoys her company....i don't buy it

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Yes it's possible. My roommate gets a whole lot more than that from a regular turned 'friend'. Like it's hard for me to believe, and I SEE it; I live with her so I KNOW she's not putting out for him. He's in PA and she's out here in AZ - when he comes to visit he sleeps on the couch! He's given her so much I can't even write it.

    So yes, while extremely rare, there are guys with ridiculous amounts of money who will spend it freely on a woman they like without ever getting laid. When they've got that kind of money, a few thousand here and there is no big deal.

    I'd also point out that the customers who spent the most on me in the club expected the least in the way of contact. They were the kind who had much more than your average "money" guy, knew they could buy anything they wanted sexually, and appreciated the pleasant company much more than the cheap thrills. These guys are few and far between but they're out there. The ones who have REAL money to spend are waaaaay less demanding than the run of the mill "gotta get my money's worth" type of customer.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Other Owner
    Sure, it's possible. Given your description of David's financial means, it might even be likely.

    The general rule is this: The more significant the means, the less likely it's strictly about sex. The inverse is also true: The less significant the means, the more likely it is strictly about sex.
    Exactamundo. Unfortunately the real money guys are so rare, most strippers never see them and therefore never understand this.

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    You know, you guys are right. Now that I think of it the guys that spend the most don't expect much for it. I had a customer come in last year and spend 1300 bucks and all he wanted to do was sit on the sofa, cuddle and chat literally. I have never made more than that amount off one customer alone though. And the biggest gift I received from one of my regulars was one of those shiatsu fold-up massage chairs.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Quote Originally Posted by The Other Owner
    Other times there may be powerful psychological drives at work that could fill several novels.
    TOO is right on the money, so let's explore a bit in this direction. Consider two dancers:

    Cute, petite, blonde, bright, funny, extraordinary athlete. Kind of like having a guy friend disguised as a clean hottie. This is a way cool friendship that will never be about sex.

    Cute, petite, blonde, bright, funny, submissive freak. Kind of like having your teen wet dream girl whenever you want. This will never be about anything but intense sex.

    Same look, different outcomes. Because the psychological drives are that powerful.

    Sometimes Chris Rock's Friend Zone is the perfect place to be.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Unfortunately the real money guys are so rare, most strippers never see them and therefore never understand this.
    Indeed, these sort of guys were few and far between to start with. Lately, LE bullshit and a general 'sleazing up' of the club scene in most areas has made these sort of guys even fewer and farther ! But yes, dancers need to realize that there are actually a few guys out there to whom spending $10,000 a day in 'pocket money' means absolutely nothing.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Quote Originally Posted by The Other Owner
    The general rule is this: The more significant the means, the less likely it's strictly about sex. The inverse is also true: The less significant the means, the more likely it is strictly about sex.
    Oh really? Having more money makes someone a gentlemen, and if you are poor, you are more likely to be a low-life simply seeking sex.

    Sure, whatever.

    In reality there are guys rich and poor like this, although obviously the gifts and help would be bigger when the guy has more money, I dont see in what way having more money means anything other than having more money. Money doesn't make people more noble, lol.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    If he's got a private jet and yacht what he's spent on her is probably about the same as an average guy buying a champagne room.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    No, having vast sums of money won't make you a gentleman, that's for sure!

    But it does mean spending a few grand here or there is like a 'normal' person buying someone a drink...
    You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star.
    Friedrich Nietzsche

    Free your mind, and your ass will follow.
    George Clinton

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Quote Originally Posted by dlabtot
    Oh really? Having more money makes someone a gentlemen, and if you are poor, you are more likely to be a low-life simply seeking sex.

    In reality there are guys rich and poor like this, although obviously the gifts and help would be bigger when the guy has more money, I dont see in what way having more money means anything other than having more money. Money doesn't make people more noble, lol.
    You're right. Money does not make people more noble. Sadly, often the reverse is true. What it does do is give them more choices. This is a crucial difference.

    You'll notice a pattern in this thread. The men who spend more both in the club and OTC tend to ask for less. It's because their financial means give them many more choices outside the club. They are not looking to squeeze every last penny of mileage out of the money they spend on a dancer in the club. And they are not looking for a direct return on what they spend OTC, either.

    Perhaps a less charitable -- or more realistic -- way of looking at it is that the five- or six-figure cash a guy of means drops on club and dancer support activities is a substantially smaller part of his net worth than the $300 the hard-working blue-collar or college guy spends on the weekend. This makes clubbing a lot more expensive activity for the poorer guy. You could argue that this is why more is expected in return. And the "gifts" he could offer do not extend to private jets, INS attorneys or long weekends at the condo. Since his assistance can't rise to the life-changing level, perhaps the nobility of his gestures are simply not appreciated.
    Last edited by All Good Things; 02-27-2006 at 12:44 AM.

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    Newbie notdocfill's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    They are like pets. He feeds them and watches them play and frolic.. You don't fuck your pets.


    I'm sure he has a real relationship somewhere else. The pets may not even have a clue.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Quote Originally Posted by The Other Owner
    You're right. Money does not make people more noble. Sadly, often the reverse is true. What it does do is give them more choices. This is a crucial difference.

    You'll notice a pattern in this thread. The men who spend more both in the club and OTC tend to ask for less. It's because their financial means give them many more choices outside the club. They are not looking to squeeze every last penny of mileage out of the money they spend on a dancer in the club. And they are not looking for a direct return on what they spend OTC, either.
    You're just repeating the same bs.

    Yes, the guys who spend more tend to ask for less... but 'more' is relative. It could be a guy spending a thousand dollars a month or ten thousand a month or whatever... but its not about having money and the possession of money which you seem fixated on, I would posit that the guys who show respect tend to spend more, whatever their means.

    All you've done is repeat that guys with money are some kind of special people who arent scumbags because they have 'more choices'. You even used the pronoun 'they' about the motivations and expectations of guys 'with means' -- again showing that you think having money puts someone in a special class about which you can make such generalizations.

    LOL

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Absolutely it's for real. He is a comassionate and idealistic type. The guy just wants her to understand he wants her to be part of his life as a friend, he wants to help her out. He will no doubt at some point want to meet her friends possibly with a veiw to establishing a relationship with one of them but he is not a manipulative type, am I wrong in saying he is not someone who is attractive but has means? He is someone who does not get a chance with women but it is their loss because he would dote on a woman who had his heart, I would introduce him to someone who would apreciate his caring nature and return his loving nature, customers like this are a true wonder, an antidote to the synical types that frequent strip clubs. I love them, life is not fair to them, probably the only type of person I'd go out of my way for at and outside of work, they deserve the best.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    I had a regular a few years ago that saw me every single day that I worked... bought my entire shift at work ( 1500 ) for a few months.

    I made a shit load of cash off of him, he bought me outfits from our costume lady etc etc.

    Even though I wasn't doing anything with him, he did end up falling for me and came into the club with a ring asking to marry me. Probably the hardest thing I had to do was tell him no, since in that time he became such a good friend of mine.

    in the end, I told him I couldnt see him in the club anymore and he flipped out.. went broke and had some sort of breakdown.

    I think a lot of times the girls aren't doing anything to make that incredible money, but I'd say a lot of times the men do have other agendas. Although there are exceptions of guys that just like the thrill of spending... the rush

    and even possibly the control factor in knowing that you depend on them etc.

    The only time I think of girls doing a bit more for customers, is when they constantly get thousand dollar tips from misc customers every other night.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Last time I was a "regular" of a dancer the entire club thought we were fucking. We weren't. I just really thought she was one of those special people you meet from time to time and the fact that I met her in the club didn't matter. She was married too and I would have done all the stuff you mention this guy did if I had the means. I think its where you meet that effects the perceptions in peoples minds.

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Quote Originally Posted by dlabtot
    All you've done is repeat that guys with money are some kind of special people who arent scumbags because they have 'more choices'.
    This thread started with a story about a guy who appeared to be kind, generous and helpful. By my estimation, generous in the five-figure range.

    The question was whether this behaviour could be expected without direct sexual favors in return. I think we've established that this is possible. In fact, it's entirely consistent with our collective observations that "guys who spend more tend to ask for less" and "guys who show respect tend to spend more." These are generalizations we agree on, apparently.

    The choices available to men of means allow for the "generosity" scenario. Without that spending power, none of it happens at all. It's the ultimate manifestation of "guys who show respect tend to spend more."

    I trust you recognize that I never suggested that all rich guys are noble or in a special class strictly by virtue of their means (hence the point of my phrase, "sadly, often the reverse is true.") In other words, nothing in this formula suggests that rich scumbags do not exist. We all know that they do. Having a broader range of choices does not always mean that people make the right ones.

    It's still important to recognize that this broader range of financial choices not only makes the generosity scenario possible, it also makes dozens of other outcomes possible -- not the least of which is an incomparably wider range of social and sexual choices outside the club. Bluntly put, the guy is not pressuring because the guy doesn't have to.

    There are so many important and vaguely twisted psycho-sexual complexities beyond these generalizations that we are not discussing, which is really too bad. It's these subtle mind games that explain how an otherwise successful guy could become so hopelessly lost and adrift in the club environment that he would earnestly propose marriage to his shocked ATF. Yikes!

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Speaking for myself, Because of hard work and selling a successful business at an early age, I could afford to be extremely lavish when I go to SC's.. and I am more than generous, as I am recieving a service that should be well compensated for.

    And although I could in all honestly take 3-5 thousand to the SC and spend it and wouldn't loose much if any sleep, once you get over the 1k mark per visit, you start to get to the point of deminishing returns... in otherwords, what you are getting, isn't worth what you are paying.

    There some hot women at the SC i go to, some even hotter women on this forum... but logically speaking, 10k at a SC?... there isn't that much conversation in the world.

    Hell for that much, you can fly first class to the Bunny Ranch, then take about 3-4k to the Casino

    Dancers down here don't know how to act when you try to give them money.. I offered one dancer to buy out her shift, and told her to name her price.. she honestly told me $200 dollars.. I gave her 300, simply because I knew she didn't know what she was doing


    Now I have a Fav, i won't say ATF, but a Fav dancer, and if she called me and told me she needed something, and I honestly believed her, I wouldn't have too much of a problem doing it for her.

    But I go to the SC once, sometime twice a week.. and everytime she sees me, she's guaranteed at least 300 dollars, and it would be more if she asked for it.

    And no I don't want, nor do I like extras... it's about the atmosphere. I got an expensive lap dance from a new dancer that caught my eye saturday night and she put her fingers in her cochie and put them in my mouth.. I wanted to choke her.. id on't know where she has been, and if she did that to me, lord knows how many guys she has done that too... if I wanted to fuck I would call an escort service, or just go get some in general

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Quote Originally Posted by The Other Owner
    It's still important to recognize that this broader range of financial choices not only makes the generosity scenario possible, it also makes dozens of other outcomes possible -- not the least of which is an incomparably wider range of social and sexual choices outside the club. Bluntly put, the guy is not pressuring because the guy doesn't have to.
    There you go again... lol... whatever...

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    Default Re: Is it possible? long

    Quote Originally Posted by songofthesword
    Dancers down here don't know how to act when you try to give them money.. I offered one dancer to buy out her shift, and told her to name her price.. she honestly told me $200 dollars.. I gave her 300, simply because I knew she didn't know what she was doing.
    When you give a dancer more than she thinks she's worth, it can be a kind of mindfuck. Especially if you connect with her in an egalitarian way and sometimes act indifferent.

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