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Thread: I just don't get it!

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    Newbie Kawigirl's Avatar
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    Default I just don't get it!

    Let me start of by saying that last time I checked I worked in a stripclub not a brothel. I haven't been in the business long at all, but I thought we were doing this whole fantasy thing. Am I right or am I wrong? I went from making at least 700 a night to walking with 200 if I am lucky. Last night I was on the verge of tears when my manager asked me what was wrong. I told him that I was perfectly fine with what I do as a stripper, but I will be damned if I am going to sell my soul for a buck. I am not going to let someone finger fuck me, suck on my titty, or suck cock. Sorry not me. I told him that I just didn't understand why one of the girls whom I really thought was clean was making bank and I was suffering. Usually I make about 200 less than her a night when I work. He looked at me and told me "sweetie she's just about as dirty as they get". AHHHHHHHHHHHH! My friend I usually give a ride home from the club was fuming. "I found out what she does, I found out what she says to get them back there!" One of her customers told her everything, luckily her customer found it disgusting rather than going to the dark side. I used to have pity on the girls that I knew did extras. It really never affected my money in such a way before. Now it feels personal. Now I really know what the older girls are talking about. Just when we got rid of the oxycotton queen saying "35 dollars and you can finger fuck me", this bitch pops up. What the fuck? Why don't they just become escorts?

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    Senior Member Sassy~n~Sexy's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    I hear you! And it is happening in a lot more clubs then anyone is willing to admit

    Reason these girls don't just 'escort'...because then they would have to screen clients, place ads and ADMIT they are escorts...because their ads would state that. This way they can live in denial and use a 'safe' enviroment (they assume all guys coming there are not cops obviously) and they really don't care!

    Don't sweat it...they have to go to bed every night with that monkey on their back
    "Just hold me close boy 'cause I'm your tiny dancer"

  3. #3
    Yekhefah
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Ah, life in California. Yep, I'm going through a similar hassle right now at my club. We've got this really cute little chick, great dancer, and I thought she was a really great hustler. She's always on the VIP couch. Lately I realized that every time somebody turned me down and said he wasn't interested in dances, five minutes later those same guys would be on the VIP couch with her. I mentioned to some other girls, "Wow, what a hustler!" We have cameras and a VIP host and our club is really clean.

    Nope. Little chickadee is going way above and beyond the call. I notice that the VIP host leaves the room while she's on the couch... I guess she's paying him. This has been really upsetting me too.

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    Veteran Member kelly514's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    It's happening everywhere...

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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    I've heard on here that the extra girls will only make a certain amount but rarely will make above that because they're using they're fuck skills instead of their hustle skills and that they won't get many regulars. Am I wrong? Is that what it was like years back and now it's changed? I wonder if that's happening in my club. My club is from what I know and what I've experienced a very very clean club, with air dancing, no touching. But I always see the same girls in the VIP rooms all night long and rarely ever see them on the stage or in the club at all. Do you think they're doing things they're not supposed to do or they're just really good hustlers. These girls have been there for 5 + yrs, so maybe that's why they're so good?

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    Moderator Djoser's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    I've been surprised to discover that dancers whom I thought were the non-extras types were doing everything back there. Usually you can sense who does and who doesn't, regardless of what they say the won't do. The assistant manager has to go in once and a while to see who's there (sometimes to see if I need to skip them), and he sees it. He wants to keep his job, so he doesn't do anything to stop it.

    The worst cases are the ones who really don't want to do it but occasionally knuckle under because their rent is due, and it's sometimes so difficult to compete when there's someone giving a BJ three feet away from them. I've rarely heard of it, but one night a good friend of mine told me she had just done it--I knew she was hurting for money, too.

    And it does seem to be happening more often, in general...
    You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star.
    Friedrich Nietzsche

    Free your mind, and your ass will follow.
    George Clinton

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    Featured Member francescadubois's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Quote Originally Posted by leogirl876
    I've heard on here that the extra girls will only make a certain amount but rarely will make above that because they're using they're fuck skills instead of their hustle skills and that they won't get many regulars. Am I wrong?
    Could be. I mean, isn't fucking/sucking the ultimate hustle? (Then we would go into the definition of hustle, I'm sure...)
    "I came in like a lamb, but I intend to leave like a lion."

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    God/dess Paris's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Sorry to say it but the brief fun time when it was cool and profitable to be a clean stripper is coming to an end. Over the last year or so I'v been having a harder and harder time finding a truly clean club. When I do find such a place it is totally dead.

    I guess nudity is passe. Guys don't seem to want to pay for just dances anymore.


    Promote yourself and earn more money! This is a business that is owned by strippers for strippers. Let's make that money!


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    God/dess
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Never had an extra and never want one.

    I feel that the guys that get them are sad cases. Where's the satisfaction in knowing the girl's blowing you for $$$'s and couldn't give a sh*t about you.

    And, yeah, I'm with Paris. Nudity has becomre passe - which is a pity, cos anything more goes beyond the bounds of entertainment. I've always viewed striptease as fun - you go to see a pretty woman naked and leave with a smile on your face. Seems like that attitude is going out of fashion.

    Phil.

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    Featured Member francescadubois's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    ^^Paris, I absolutely have to agree. My hustle has significantly improved and if not for that, I'd really be starving and I'm STILL making peanuts. Thank goodness for my square job or I'd be ass out.
    "I came in like a lamb, but I intend to leave like a lion."

    -Sade
    Quote Originally Posted by Mastridonicus View Post
    The only thing a person hates more than being a sex object, is NOT being a sex object.
    Quote Originally Posted by TigersMilk View Post
    If you should your way through life you'll be should-ing all over yourself later.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheSexKitten View Post
    Finger pointing is awesome!! No really, it gets things done.

  11. #11
    Senior Member KittyKat07's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    I got called "wholesome" once while working in Vegas. I asked my customer what he meant by that. He said it was a compliment. He enjoyed my company and my dances, but instructed me that I was just a "warm up". I was so curious as to what else he would find in the club I was working at.

    I see some girls in the VIP room straight grinding and dry humping their customers. It just isn't my style. No amount of money is worth that to me. I pride myself in giving a good, sensual dance and being really good conversation. There will always be some guy(s) out there who are willing to pay big bucks for my "wholesome" dance.

    So don't give up. You aren't the only clean dancer left out there......
    Are you "in" or "in the way"?

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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Quote Originally Posted by KittyKat07

    I see some girls in the VIP room straight grinding and dry humping their customers.
    If that is the extent of what is going on in many clubs, things wouldn't be so bad. Guys used to drive out of town to hit clubs for some good grinding, and now more and more want the "real deal". They've always wanted more, but due to the economy and the glut of dancers in clubs now compared to the volume of customers, many clubs have become a "buyers market" and girls do whatever it takes to make some money over no money.

  13. #13
    DJ Maimed
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    As they said "don't lose hope"!! Remember the free love of the sixties??? These loosening of a generations morals come and go. Guys that aren't Pl's know the difference between a strip club and a whorehouse. Idiot's willing to pay for a communical disease are a species doomed to failure.

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    Veteran Member calliope7's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    I really think part of the problem is the spazy strippers who only work when they really need money. At my club there are plenty of regular house girls like me who work 3 to 6 nights a week on average. Most of them have some money saved up, so going into work and having a crappy night is not the end of the world because you're not desperate to pay a bill thats due tomorow. So what if you only made $150? At least you didn't do anything you're not comfortable with. And there is always tomorow.

    I think for the girls who work less often, its really a matter of lacking any type of foresight or responsibility for their finacial situations. Hence they have to do whatever is necessary to make their quota instead of working regularly.

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    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil-W
    Never had an extra and never want one.

    I feel that the guys that get them are sad cases. Where's the satisfaction in knowing the girl's blowing you for $$$'s and couldn't give a sh*t about you.

    And, yeah, I'm with Paris. Nudity has becomre passe - which is a pity, cos anything more goes beyond the bounds of entertainment. I've always viewed striptease as fun - you go to see a pretty woman naked and leave with a smile on your face. Seems like that attitude is going out of fashion.

    Phil.

    I second this!

    I guess I am getting old. I read on the net that a lot of kids don't think a BJ is sex - just a fancy kiss - so there is that whole mindset coming into play.

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    Moderator Djoser's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    To me, anything that brings on orgasm--by mutual consent--between two adults is sex.

    The one grey area is when a customer has an orgasm from thorough grinding, regardless of whether the dancer is totally grossed out by the idea, and has no intention of bringing it on.

    In my mind, he has had sex, but she hasn't. This is of course, only my view of the situation. But it might be one of the biggest reasons why I am opposed to the idea of heavy grinding in principle, even though I sell heavy grinding most effectively every night I work.

    This might make me a hypocrite in the minds of many people, but they would be completely failing to understand my motivation in being a DJ--to make the women dance as well as they possibly can, and make it an esthetic experience for those who are there to appreciate it.

    Money is a secondary factor, so long as I make enough to make my time worthwhile--or else I'd be in one of the big factory clubs, putting four women onstage at a time (OK, I do frequently run three stages, but one is always the focal point).
    You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star.
    Friedrich Nietzsche

    Free your mind, and your ass will follow.
    George Clinton

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  17. #17
    PhillyDancer1982
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    ^^ I agree with what calliope7 said. The philosophy makes a lotta sense for those dancers. I notice that too...dancers who only work on the last couple days of the month. Isn't that immaure and stupid to only work a day before rent is due, though?? Aren't we supposed to be adults and be able to calculate our expenses and allow enough workdays to reach these expenses? Yeah there were a few times that I had bills due the next day and I was desperate for money too, but these times were very very rare and only occured because of unexpected situations, such as severe illness(I coulda gone to a hospital and speeded up my recovery time, but that bill without insurance woulda been a lot more than the loss of money from not working!!) or taking off 1.5weeks after my mother's sudden death. I work 4-6nights/week(at one point, it used to be doubles 7days/week!), hustle like crazy(the CLEAN way!), and save some money; so for the times that I was worried that I wouldn't have enough money to pay my bills, they were drastic unforseen situations! Even then though, I felt guilty for not having a bigger savings cushion. And even then, I still had credit cards that I coulda used for paying the bills but didn't choose to. When I first started dancing, I was in an EXTREMELY bad poverty situation(heh what do you think turned me to dancing?), and it took MONTHS of working doubles nearly every single day before I got caught up financially and was able to live a stereotypically middle-class/slightly-upper-middle-class lifestyle. So when I'm working nearly every day of the week, it annoys me when I see girls who lazily work a few days a month and then expect to make all this money all at once, and even worse resort to extras to make that money.

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    Moderator Djoser's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    You are a professional, they are without control of the situation.

    I do work with a few women who are professional in their timely appearance for work, consistent schedule, and the serious approach they take to it, and who provide extras.

    However they tend to be the exception, and I'd prefer they not work in any club I'm in. Just to clarify again, not because I am opposed to prostitution, just prostitution in the clubs, which I think is ruining the business rapidly.
    You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star.
    Friedrich Nietzsche

    Free your mind, and your ass will follow.
    George Clinton

    ______________________________________

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    Featured Member tampadancer's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Paris has it right.

    It is sad, but true... most strippers are not strictly entertainers anymore. It is extremely frustrating to know that you are having to compete with whores, but at least you will be able to look at yourself in the mirror in the morning. Ultimately, that is what wore me down to a very low point and forced me out of the business. If you let it, it can grate away at your spirit. You have to be very tough, as a stripper.

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    Featured Member Wwanderer's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    It seems to me that the whole SC industry is now awkwardly trying to keep its footing on an extremely slippery slope, so to speak. At one time all dancing and stripping was done on the stage(s) and was intended/available as entertainment for the whole audience. During that period there were (of course) still dancers, plenty of them in some clubs, who would provide individual customers with "something extra" in a dark corner or OTC. But dancing, and more, for individual customers was not part of what the club officially offerred for sale and was not a standard part of a dancer's job.

    Imo, as soon as the practise of private dances (even air dances), and certainly lap dances, became a standard/accepted part of the industry, SCs took the first steps out onto that slippery slope. It is at that point that clubs and all (or nearly all) dancers working in them began to sell sexual stimulation to individual guys for some official announced price, often in some space set aside just for the purpose (VIP rooms etc), with DJ promoting them and so forth. Most of the old school "stage dancing only" strippers around when that transition happened regarded it as a fundamental change in the nature of the job, and in retrospect, I agree. Dancers and clubs began to sell sexual entertainment/services/stimulation from a specific woman to a specific guy, and the gradual slide (driven my competition and market forces) down the slope toward making these more exstensive and permissive began.

    -Ww
    "At this moment what more need we seek?
    As the Truth eternally reveals itself,
    This very place is the Lotus Land of Purity,
    This very body is the Body of the Buddha."
    - Zazen Wasan

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    Veteran Member mark45y's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Mons Venus opened a quarter of a century ago.

    The clubs in San Francisco were open and pushing the same behavior that you refer to before that.

    I took a trip to Tampa and Daytona and Miami in 1982 and had more action then, than is available in any of those clubs now.

    I don’t think it is anything new unless you count 25 years as being new.

    If anything I think the atmosphere has tightened up. The only thing that has changed to my mind is the availability of tease action in the club as opposed to more OTC action then.

    Life was easier before the advent of HIV and the atmosphere was a lot more laid back. Plus the advent of so many feminist strippers has made it a real possibility to get your head knocked off for suggesting things that 25 years ago would have initiated a price negotiation instead of a high heel in the forehead.

    The rules used to be simple. Now they are complex.

    It used to be if you worked at one of those clubs you were open to offers. Now it is some of the dancers are open to offers in the club. Some of the dancers are open to offers OTC and some of the dancers are completely off limits under any circumstances.

    If this isn’t a mix that is designed to create psychosis in both customers and dancers I don’t know what is.



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    Featured Member Wwanderer's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Quote Originally Posted by mark45y
    I don’t think it is anything new unless you count 25 years as being new.
    I do. I have been going to strip clubs for about 40 years!

    But the point is not my personal history nor the time at which the first private dances became available. A few places, mostly in big cities, routinely sold private attention from dancers to individual customers going back way earlier (I'm not sure how far), but it was not until the '80s roughly (I am not sure of the exact years) when that practise, in one for or another, became the norm in SCs all over the country. It was then that it became difficult, and eventually nearly impossible, to be an exotic dancer without becoming some form of a private sexual "entertainer". And, imo, that is when the only obvious "bright line" distinction was crossed.

    -Ww
    "At this moment what more need we seek?
    As the Truth eternally reveals itself,
    This very place is the Lotus Land of Purity,
    This very body is the Body of the Buddha."
    - Zazen Wasan

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    Veteran Member mark45y's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    The last stage only strip club that did not sell some kind of personal entertainment that I knew of was the Empress Theatre in Detroit and as I remember I put on a trench coat and a fake mustache and got in when I was 13 that would make it around 1958. We been on a slippery slope for a long time.



  24. #24
    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Quote Originally Posted by mark45y
    The last stage only strip club that did not sell some kind of personal entertainment that I knew of was the Empress Theatre in Detroit and as I remember I put on a trench coat and a fake mustache and got in when I was 13 that would make it around 1958. We been on a slippery slope for a long time.
    Few posts make me laugh like this one did!

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    Featured Member Wwanderer's Avatar
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    Default Re: I just don't get it!

    Quote Originally Posted by mark45y
    The last stage only strip club that did not sell some kind of personal entertainment that I knew of was the Empress Theatre in Detroit and as I remember I put on a trench coat and a fake mustache and got in when I was 13 that would make it around 1958. We been on a slippery slope for a long time.
    The places officially/explicitly selling "personal entertainment" as a part of their basic business model were the exception, not the rule, until the 1980s. Ditto dancers doing so as their primary work as strippers. As you pointed out earlier, it was places like Mons Venus in Tampa, The Brass Rail in Toronto, several places in SF etc that brought "personal entertainment" to the main stream SC business.

    In any case, imo at least, the date of the transition is of only secondary importance; my primary point is that their is a difference in kind between providing sexual entertainment on stage to a whole audience and providing direct sexual stimulation/service to an individual customer. Once you have crossed that line, there is a continuum of degrees of permissiveness/mileage (a slippery slope) going all the way from private air dances to full-on prostitution.

    -Ww

    PS - Just to be specific, I went to lots of clubs in SoCal, Arizona, Texas, Florida, Massachusetts, New York, Maryland, Virginia and Illinois (and no doubt many other places I can't now remember off the top of my head) in the 1970s and early 80s that offerred stage dancing only.
    "At this moment what more need we seek?
    As the Truth eternally reveals itself,
    This very place is the Lotus Land of Purity,
    This very body is the Body of the Buddha."
    - Zazen Wasan

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