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Thread: When The Levees Broke

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    Sad When The Levees Broke

    I just finished watching Act I & II of Spike Lee's documentry and I cried at the images I seen. This brought back so many bad memories of hurricane Katrina and what it done to the Gulf Coast. I grew up in the back bay of Mobile, Alabama and although I was not there went it hit, all of my family and friends live through out the Gulf Coast. I have loved ones living in all three states effected by that storm. So many people in New Orleans, Mississippi, and Alabama suffered so much during that storm. I called my Mom as soon as her cell phone was working right after the storm hit and listened to her cry because the water kept rising and there was no were else to go. She was not able to evacuate because at the time she did not have the financial means to leave the area. As soon as the airport was up and running, I had on the first flight to my home. She was only able to salvage three suit cases of clothing....everything else was ruined because not only did her home flood with water, the sewers gave way and everything was contaiminated and could not be saved.

    What many do not understand is that it is not just the initial cost of leaving for an evacuating but the continuing cost while you are away from home and with out work. You could be trapped in a city for weeks at a time waiting to be allowed to come back to your home town and that costs money.....living in hotels, eating out, supplies...it really can take out a chunk of your wallet especially when your already strapped for cash as it is. As I watched this film it reminded me of how angry I was at the governments pitiful response to this crisis. I am not saying it was anyone's fault, but MY GOD, that was HORRIFIC. Babies, the elderly, and the disabled dying from exhaustion and hunger here in AMERICA....it still makes me sick!!

    If you have not seen this documentry, please do so. Not to make any one have pity on the victims of Hurricane Katrina, but to inform and educate.

    Sorry you guys.....did not mean to bumb anyone out but I just had to rant for a moment...thanks for listening...

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    God/dess fancygirl's Avatar
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I'm sorry hon. I'll be interested to see the nation's response to the one year anniversary.

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I can verify the cost of evacuation. I left New Orleans on Sunday morning. By the time I got to Tallahassee, Florida all the hotels were full. I had tried to make reservations on saturday. But a lot where already booked up. By pure luck I got into a hotel by ignoring the "we are full" sign at the Wingate Hotel and came in right behind a woman who had booked two hotel rooms accidently when she needed only one. So that is how I got in. Many hotel where not taking pets, and I had to beg them to allow my cat. I stayed there for seven days at about $90.00 a day and my cat fine was $50.00. I would have gone to a shelter but could not find one that took pets. The day I evacuated I had never driven that much( atleast 14 hours) in my entire life. Thankfully the hotel had a good breakfast buffet. But I have some serious food allergies- milk, citrius, onions, garlic. So that with the fact that there was no kitchenette in the rooms really added my food bill. Thankfully one of my customers paid my hotel bill. I have moved three times since Katrina, and god willing the next will lead me back to New Orleans.
    I am not a fan of spike Lee as I see lots of his mysogynist beliefs in his films. I also have always felt that he is racist torwards latinos, and Asians. Maybe someday I will see the film, but not now.
    "Can we read it on the Smoking Gun? "

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    P.S. I think the reason more people did not evacuate who could have besides cost reasons is that many would not want to go to public shelters. Look how the superdome turned out. Also remember that after the hurricane in areas in Orleans parish where people could have walked to safety they were barred by the police. The whole situation was [email protected]#[email protected]
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Sounds like you have been through the ringer with this storm too! I understand your position on Spike Lee's films.... not everyone agrees with his views....hell I don't agree with every thing he represents but his film was touching and it reminded me of how so many had to live through that storm.

    Hope you make it back to New Orleans soon.....man I miss that city. I would love to go to the Quarter, stop by Cafe Du Monde an have some coffee an beignets!!

    Good Luck Sweetie!!

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    God/dess Paris's Avatar
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Just wondering if he touched on the anti hand gun laws in N.O. It seems to me that if more families had weapons, then the police could have concentrated on actually helping people and not tracking down criminals and looters.

    In Oregon we have a liberal concealed carry law. Pretty much it is about as hard as getting a sheriff's card in Vegas, except you have to complete a 15 hour class on gun saftey. If good, law abiding citizens have guns, the criminals think twice about commiting crimes against those people. If anyone could be carrying at anytime, that adds to the danger to the criminal risks in trying to harm someone.

    I really hope he said something about the fact the cops were TAKING AWAY the guns of law abiding citizens!! That shit pissed me off. This is not Hitler's Germany!!


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  7. #7
    madmaxine
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I watched this. I think everyone should. It makes me wish that Bush Jr. had the nuts to perform hara-kiri on himself.

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Anti gun laws? I don't know about the laws, but my dad sure has a few guns!

    I am currently thinking seriously about moving back to New Orleans. I moved to tampa almost three years ago for work reasons and now that I'm certified nationally I can move back. I just don't know if I can find enough work and that is what worries me. I might watch the documentary but honestly just going home and seeing the bad parts of the city are so depressing that's about all I can take. My family is just getting the hole in their roof fixed that happened during the hurricane. They are some of the lucky ones that still have a home and had a place to go when they evacuated and still have jobs but it was very hard for them so I can't imagine how bad it is for others. My friend's dad is living in a FEMA trailer in Chalmette that is about the size of my living room. He buys a paper every day and drives to the French Quarter to read it so he can get out.

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    Veteran Member casaubon1's Avatar
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I'm not exactly a pro-Spike Lee demographic either, but the documentary is well done and worth seeing. No misogyny or racism seemed to show.
    The only criticism I have is that politically, while he is tough on Bush and Blanco, as he should be, he goes way too easy on Ray Nagin. And I really don't need to know what Al Sharpton thinks about anything, but despite that it is a good piece.
    I agree with the OP -- it brings tears to your eyes and makes you want to punch out the guys who just weren't paying attention.

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    God/dess Paris's Avatar
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Read the first paragraph of this article:
    http://www.reason.com/hod/dk091005.shtml

    This outraged me when it happened, and still has me outraged.


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  11. #11
    madmaxine
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I used to be pro-gun control until I learned how useless the police are when you really need them.
    Aside from the gun control factor, what happened to the Gulf Coast was disgusting. Greed, graft and oversight conspired to kill thousands and cause suffering to hundreds of thousands. Yes Mother Nature was not having her finest moment but people knew for decades what needed to be done to prevent massive loss of life & property value. But..."drink & be merry, for tommorrow we die."

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Quote Originally Posted by Paris
    Just wondering if he touched on the anti hand gun laws in N.O. It seems to me that if more families had weapons, then the police could have concentrated on actually helping people and not tracking down criminals and looters.

    In Oregon we have a liberal concealed carry law. Pretty much it is about as hard as getting a sheriff's card in Vegas, except you have to complete a 15 hour class on gun saftey. If good, law abiding citizens have guns, the criminals think twice about commiting crimes against those people. If anyone could be carrying at anytime, that adds to the danger to the criminal risks in trying to harm someone.

    I really hope he said something about the fact the cops were TAKING AWAY the guns of law abiding citizens!! That shit pissed me off. This is not Hitler's Germany!!
    They mentioned the police taking everyone's guns away in NO just when they needed them most in America: Freedom to fascism.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Quote Originally Posted by madmaxine
    I watched this. I think everyone should. It makes me wish that Bush Jr. had the nuts to perform hara-kiri on himself.

    It is more than just Bush. I think everyone is slowly figuring out that the federal government (and many state governments) are simply incompetent and can't be counted on like in the past.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Quote Originally Posted by casaubon1
    I'm not exactly a pro-Spike Lee demographic either, but the documentary is well done and worth seeing. No misogyny or racism seemed to show.
    The only criticism I have is that politically, while he is tough on Bush and Blanco, as he should be, he goes way too easy on Ray Nagin. And I really don't need to know what Al Sharpton thinks about anything, but despite that it is a good piece.
    You realize your two paragraphs are diametrically opposed to each other right?

  15. #15
    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I'll add, Texas is learning the value of being a good neighbor for Katrina too - ie higher crime rates and the destructiveness of the "victims:"

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Scariest part of all of this? The historical context. Most great empires eventually have their reigns ended not by foreign powers but by their own people losing faith in the government, usually with the combo of a trio of factors: dumb wars, natural disasters, stupid leadership. That trio has knocked out everyone going all the way back to aincient Egypt.

    We've got all three right now, and I think we, as a nation, are starting to lose faith in the government.

    I mean, read this thread. Madmaxine isn't alone.

    And while we eat, drink and are merry, consider what did in the Egyptians, Romans, English, French, Spanish and all those what came before.......

    Siber
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    Veteran Member casaubon1's Avatar
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Quote Originally Posted by Deogol
    You realize your two paragraphs are diametrically opposed to each other right?

    You mean because Nagin is black and Lee gave a forum to Sharpton? I didn't see it as a racial thing, but who knows.

  18. #18
    Star_bare_elegance
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I felt all sides of the story were told for once. It was hard to watch so many people lose so much.


    Deogol:Texas was not Pleasentville before the victims (yes victims) were sent there. If it had happened to you I don't think you would want people to have that attitude toward you.

  19. #19
    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Quote Originally Posted by Star_bare_elegance
    I felt all sides of the story were told for once. It was hard to watch so many people lose so much.


    Deogol:Texas was not Pleasentville before the victims (yes victims) were sent there. If it had happened to you I don't think you would want people to have that attitude toward you.
    They didn't have that attitude towards them in the beginning. Only when SOME of them started shooting up the city, taking advantage of welfare, and wrecking people's property did they start to get a reputation. They have been hard at work earning that reputation.

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Quote Originally Posted by Siber
    Scariest part of all of this? The historical context. Most great empires eventually have their reigns ended not by foreign powers but by their own people losing faith in the government, usually with the combo of a trio of factors: dumb wars, natural disasters, stupid leadership. That trio has knocked out everyone going all the way back to aincient Egypt.

    We've got all three right now, and I think we, as a nation, are starting to lose faith in the government.

    I mean, read this thread. Madmaxine isn't alone.

    And while we eat, drink and are merry, consider what did in the Egyptians, Romans, English, French, Spanish and all those what came before.......

    Siber
    What a great post!

    It's scary to think about but history really does seem to repeat itself doesn't it? Something I feel has played a part in probably every downfall of an empire is the increasing greed and desire for power of the leader or leaders.

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    ^^Yeah, I would agree with that. Only I'd go a bit further and say that we as a nation HAVE lost faith in the government. Or at least well on the way. We are definitely not just starting...

    It'll be interesting to see who the next big power is. Some have said for years now it would be China. It's looking more and more like that's a possibility.

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Amen, Bridgette. And another country/region that is rising in power that doesn't get a lot of airtime is India/Pakistan. Big army, nukes, a billion people, and the highest percentage of citizens with PhDs in the world (true).

    But that's a different thread. Back to Spike Lee.

    Siber
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    Maybe I'll say.... Maybe"

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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Quote Originally Posted by Paris
    ...I really hope he said something about the fact the cops were TAKING AWAY the guns of law abiding citizens!! That shit pissed me off. This is not Hitler's Germany!!
    Quote Originally Posted by madmaxine
    I used to be pro-gun control until I learned how useless the police are when you really need them. Aside from the gun control factor, what happened to the Gulf Coast was disgusting. Greed, graft and oversight conspired to kill thousands and cause suffering to hundreds of thousands...
    Quote Originally Posted by Deogol
    It is more than just Bush. I think everyone is slowly figuring out that the federal government (and many state governments) are simply incompetent and can't be counted on like in the past.
    Quote Originally Posted by Siber
    Scariest part of all of this? The historical context. Most great empires eventually have their reigns ended not by foreign powers but by their own people losing faith in the government, usually with the combo of a trio of factors: dumb wars, natural disasters, stupid leadership. That trio has knocked out everyone going all the way back to aincient Egypt...
    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgette
    ...Yeah, I would agree with that. Only I'd go a bit further and say that we as a nation HAVE lost faith in the government. Or at least well on the way. We are definitely not just starting...
    Re: gun control and faith in government, why would anyone feel the need to have a gun, other than target shooting/hunting, if the majority of the population actually did have faith in their government? Whether the government be local, state or federal. Personally, I no longer have much faith left in government at any level. What I do have faith in is my friends, family and acquaintances, most of whom either work for a small business or have small businesses of their own.

    What I really have lost faith in is the government here at all levels. Partially due to lobbying(most, but certainly not all, of this lobbying being done on behalf of multinational corporations), and the practices of "spinning"(i.e., lying) and the marketing of candidates instead of trying to develop sound policies for this country - even policies which might be unpopular, although good for the country as a whole over the long-term(i.e., the next 100 years). And I have only a tiny shred of faith left in both the educational systems and religion as practiced in this country.

    I guess, what I feel most is the loss of "structure" from my continuing loss of faith in the four main pillars I was taught to trust as a child (i.e., education, government, business and religion).
    Last edited by PhaedrusZ; 08-24-2006 at 09:41 AM. Reason: typos

  24. #24
    Star_bare_elegance
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    Deogol :I did a lil research you are right about the crime... I still hope its just because theres more people. ....Where do you think it will go from here?

  25. #25
    Jay Zeno
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    Default Re: When The Levees Broke

    I haven't lost any faith in government that I had. People do not think rationally and logically. People take positions and polarize each other.

    I've lived through the sixties, seventies, eighties, nineties, and now the aughts. You want to see real polarization, check out the attitudes circa 1970 with hippies, Agnew fans, and things like Kent State.

    We don't have faith in government because of what, no stem cell research? No rational approach to government funding? No gay marriages? Bah. We've never had that before now, and it'll come around as society evolves. Well, not government funding. I don't think that'll ever be rational.

    We don't have faith in government, but we drive on government-supplied roads, expect that our lights will come on when we flick the switch, expect that fairly clean water will come out of the faucet when we turn the knob, expect that the subway will get us to where we're going at $2 a pop, expect that the military would repel Chinese paratroopers, expect that our city won't allow a Wal-Mart to go up in the middle of our subdivision, expect ... well, you get the point. We don't like the way government is acting right now ("right now" being just about anytime), but we have plenty of faith in a lot of its functions and institutions.

    Now, as to New Orleans.

    *As far as I can tell, the failure to adequately protect the city through levees can be tied directly to local government, with the federal government being a hesitant accomplice - they paid their money out, even knowing that they weren't getting full value due to local corruption.

    *Failure to protect the city by building in less vulnerable places goes from the individual homeowner to the federal government, but the vast majority of that lack of foresight is local.

    *The failure to evacuate well goes from the individual to city government to state government to federal government. I will note that the official tally, as I know it, to date for identified human deaths within the city itself is fewer than 1,000. Considering that, what, 60% (?) of the city was submerged, they got out cheap. 1,000 deaths is a tragedy, don't get me wrong, and it's heartwrenching to see the devastation. But the death toll could have easily been much worse.

    * New Orleans took a couple hundred years to build up to 2005, and the ground that it stood on is in much worse shape right now with pollutants, destroyed infrastructure, and toxins than it was before. It's going to take a long, long time, it'll be very, very expensive (especially with billions diverted elsewhere for an ill-conceived war), and we could put all that stuff back together and have a couple nasty Category 4-5's push Humpty Dumpty right off the wall again.

    * All this ugly stuff was really caused by the hurricanes hitting a low-lying, corrupt, and poverty-ridden city, y'know. The result had to be ugly.

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