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Thread: prayer rooms in airports

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    Default prayer rooms in airports

    what do you guys think? after the guys were removed from the plane last week, now muslims are asking for separate prayer rooms in airports since they have to pray 5 times a day.

    i see both sides of this.. its part of their religion, they have to pray 5 times a day. BUT, we cant cater to everyone. thats just how it is. if i had a baby ahd had to breast feed, that makes people uncomfortable too, should i get my own room? (though i know its not uncomfortable in the same way). personally, i dont think they need private rooms at all. once you do that, where do you draw the line? might as well just give them their own personal airline if that's how its going to be.

    and on top of that, if we were to go to a muslim country, would they cater to us? absolutely not.

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    they're talking about this on the ed norris show on the radio right now, that's what made me think of it.. and a guy just called in to say "who cares if they pray, god doesnt listesn to them anyway."

    i think thats an awful thing to say. just had to add that.

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    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    There are several airports with "meditation rooms." I think the idea has been to build more of these rooms and encourage muslims to pray in there.

    If we do build prayer rooms, then the next request will be separate prayer rooms for men and women. Especially when the Wiccan's decide to dance skyclad in a prayer room....

    I don't have a problem with meditation rooms being used for praying.

    I agree that Islamic countries would not be as gracious, since doing such a thing would damn them all to hell in Allah's eyes. Ain't fundamentalism in government wonderful?

    I guess another question is, just how functional can a fundamentalist Muslim be in our society?

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    God/dess Jenny's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    i see both sides of this.. its part of their religion, they have to pray 5 times a day. BUT, we cant cater to everyone. thats just how it is. if i had a baby ahd had to breast feed, that makes people uncomfortable too, should i get my own room? (though i know its not uncomfortable in the same way)
    Hmm. That's difficult because so many women object to being "put" into rooms to breastfeed. But, outside of that difficulty - yes. You should have an area where you can breastfeed with dignity and privacy. Why not? To whom can they not "cater" in respect to religious practice, and why?

    personally, i dont think they need private rooms at all. once you do that, where do you draw the line? might as well just give them their own personal airline if that's how its going to be.
    What line are we drawing? I'm seriously asking - I don't know where you see this heading. You might say that it is not particularly onerous to accommodate them in this case, where as getting private planes would be very onerous (although I still don't know why private planes are necessary?) Airports are big - a prayer room is not hard, and many airports have had them for years.

    and on top of that, if we were to go to a muslim country, would they cater to us? absolutely not.
    How in the world is that the point? Freedom of religion and tolerance of religion is not some kind of international quid pro quo. It's meant to be an integral part of our value system.
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    What line are we drawing? I'm seriously asking - I don't know where you see this heading. You might say that it is not particularly onerous to accommodate them in this case, where as getting private planes would be very onerous (although I still don't know why private planes are necessary?)
    It would have to be a private balloon line so they couldn't easily fly them into buildings.

    How in the world is that the point? Freedom of religion and tolerance of religion is not some kind of international quid pro quo. It's meant to be an integral part of our value system.

    I wasn't clear on what I posted. We are BETTER than most countries and should allow an individual the freedom to pray in their manner.

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    What I meant by where do we draw the line is that if Muslims get their own prayer rooms for their religion, what would be next? (Like Deogol said about Wiccans) It wouldnt just stop there. And the private airlines thing wasnt serious, just making a point that if we do one thing it will be built on.

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    God/dess Jenny's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Okay. I would suggest that if we are considering limiting tolerance for other religions, and limiting what is necessary for them to perform within their faith in service provider that there should be a compelling reason - that the requirement would be onerous for the airline (in this case). If you are not anticipating anything specificOkay. I would suggest that if we are considering limiting tolerance for other religions, and limiting what is necessary for them to perform within their faith in service providers (especially necessary service providers like airlines) that there should be a compelling reason - that the requirement would be onerous for the airline (in this case). If you are not anticipating anything specific then I really wonder what the problem is. Like I think you need to present some reason to believe that the requirements on the airlines are going to be onerous. I would suggest that one distinction between orthodox muslims and wiccans is that muslims have strenuous prayer requirements at SPECIFIC times EVERY day of the year; there is no real reason wiccans can’t either schedule their flights on non-holy days or perform their rituals after they get to their destination.

    I’m not sure what you mean by “built on” – if the requirements on the airline is not unduly onerous, why is it a bad thing to build on it? And if it is unduly onerous there is a good and rational reason to limit it. So what exactly are you concerned about?
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    Okay. I would suggest that if we are considering limiting tolerance for other religions, and limiting what is necessary for them to perform within their faith in service provider that there should be a compelling reason - that the requirement would be onerous for the airline (in this case). If you are not anticipating anything specificOkay. I would suggest that if we are considering limiting tolerance for other religions, and limiting what is necessary for them to perform within their faith in service providers (especially necessary service providers like airlines) that there should be a compelling reason - that the requirement would be onerous for the airline (in this case). If you are not anticipating anything specific then I really wonder what the problem is. Like I think you need to present some reason to believe that the requirements on the airlines are going to be onerous. I would suggest that one distinction between orthodox muslims and wiccans is that muslims have strenuous prayer requirements at SPECIFIC times EVERY day of the year; there is no real reason wiccans can’t either schedule their flights on non-holy days or perform their rituals after they get to their destination.

    I’m not sure what you mean by “built on” – if the requirements on the airline is not unduly onerous, why is it a bad thing to build on it? And if it is unduly onerous there is a good and rational reason to limit it. So what exactly are you concerned about?

    So in short, you are saying our society should bend to the most intolerant and strict segment?

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    God/dess Jenny's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Deogol View Post
    So in short, you are saying our society should bend to the most intolerant and strict segment?
    No. Not at all. Not even a little. Where do you even get that? (outside of your rampant racist ideology and paranoia, of course).
    I'm saying accommodation of religious difference to the point of undue hardship is a good thing, that airports, airlines and flights are necessary services in this day and age, that airports, arilines and flights have built in time commitments, as does orthodox Islam and that providing a prayer room is not an onerous requirement. Finally, I'm saying that unless there is some reason to anticipate that this particular kind of tolerance is going to lead to an onerous requirement hypotheses on private airlines are not relevant. There is really no shorter way of putting that.

    I also think that airlines should provide kosher meals. It's about religious difference, not privileging one religion.
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    No. Not at all. Not even a little. Where do you even get that? (outside of your rampant racist ideology and paranoia, of course).
    Not "ha ha funny" but "hmm funny" given your perception of the world.

    I ask because you leave yourself open to defining what is a hardship and what isn't. If I was racist I wouldn't be asking the question nor posting above I welcome them using meditation rooms for praying.

    Sorry if I am "racist" if I refuse to deny Muslims are currently in 14 wars across the world and that is something to take note of.

    (Unlike these folk who can only manage to cough out "fighters of Arab nomadic background" to stay politically correct with their college aged "Jihad Denial" activist funding market.)

    I could say the nonsense in your signature details a very bizarre view of the world... oh did I just say that. Oh well.

    I'm saying accommodation of religious difference to the point of undue hardship is a good thing, that airports, airlines and flights are necessary services in this day and age, that airports, arilines and flights have built in time commitments, as does orthodox Islam and that providing a prayer room is not an onerous requirement. Finally, I'm saying that unless there is some reason to anticipate that this particular kind of tolerance is going to lead to an onerous requirement hypotheses on private airlines are not relevant. There is really no shorter way of putting that.
    I don't think I am saying anything different when it comes to prayer rooms.

    I also think that airlines should provide kosher meals. It's about religious difference, not privileging one religion.
    (sniff sniff) I smell bait.

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Deogol View Post
    I ask because you leave yourself open to defining what is a hardship and what isn't.
    Well, currently various courts and tribunals define hardship based on quantum of various factors including, but not limited to, cost. I don't see why it should be different for airlines.
    Sorry if I am "racist" if I refuse to deny Muslims are currently in 14 wars across the world and that is something to take note of.
    No. But interpreting religious rights that have nothing to do war, violence, the middle east or intolerance through that lens to determine whether or not a certain religion deserves tolerance is indicative of a racist ideology.
    I could say the nonsense in your signature details a very bizarre view of the world... oh did I just say that. Oh well.
    Well it doesn't surprise me that you don't understand my signature; and seeing as the probability of you understanding it is so close to zero, I suppose it isn't surprising that you would think it bizarre.

    I don't think I am saying anything different when it comes to prayer rooms.
    Then why are you arguing with me?
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    Then why are you arguing with me?
    I don't know - you're the one out calling me a racist and shit. You are starting arguments with me.

  13. #13
    God/dess Jenny's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    See posting #8
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    See posting #8

    You are gonna need to be more detailed than that.

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    What line are we drawing? I'm seriously asking - I don't know where you see this heading. You might say that it is not particularly onerous to accommodate them in this case, where as getting private planes would be very onerous
    Why are we accommodating them? Why aren't they assimilating to our way of life? These are obviously rhetorical questions since these folks by and large have zero interest in living by Western norms.
    Idealism is fine, but as it approaches reality, the costs become prohibitive.

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    you cant make everyone happy all the time. that's just how it is. it doesnt mean that anybody is racist.

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Casual Observer View Post
    Why are we accommodating them? Why aren't they assimilating to our way of life? These are obviously rhetorical questions since these folks by and large have zero interest in living by Western norms.
    Well, who is "we" and who is "them"? How is wanting to pray 5 times a day inconsistent with Western norms? And the reason "we" want to accommodate "them" is because religious tolerance is integral to our system of values.
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Casual Observer View Post
    Why are we accommodating them? Why aren't they assimilating to our way of life? These are obviously rhetorical questions since these folks by and large have zero interest in living by Western norms.
    Who the hell is they? You should maybe realize that some of us are them! Did I miss something? Do we in the US have a national religion now?

    And I meant that^^^ with LOVE c/o just so we're clear. What religion is the US though? Why should we be pissed if people wanna pray? The more you are praying, the less you are trying to talk me to death in the damned airport!
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    The cut-off age for stripping is when customers stop paying you.

    The end.

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by JustJayda View Post
    Who the hell is they? You should maybe realize that some of us are them! Did I miss something? Do we in the US have a national religion now?

    And I meant that^^^ with LOVE c/o just so we're clear. What religion is the US though? Why should we be pissed if people wanna pray? The more you are praying, the less you are trying to talk me to death in the damned airport!
    Prayin is cool until they do it in front of your strip club.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    ^^^
    This is just you trying to create a conflict where there is none to reinforce an us/them mentality. Muslims praying (by which I think you mean using prayer to enact some kind of protest) outside a strip club has no relation to prayer in the airport. There is no reason to pray outside a strip club except to harass harass patrons and workers; there is a reason to do so in an airport.
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

  21. #21
    DJ Maimed
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    I don't see a problem with it as long as either they or Jenny pay for it all.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    ^^^
    This is just you trying to create a conflict where there is none to reinforce an us/them mentality. Muslims praying (by which I think you mean using prayer to enact some kind of protest) outside a strip club has no relation to prayer in the airport. There is no reason to pray outside a strip club except to harass harass patrons and workers; there is a reason to do so in an airport.

    Yea, when people see a pack of Muslims getting on the plane there is a lot of praying going on!

  23. #23
    God/dess Jenny's Avatar
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    Again - that's just racist. It's not like a cute, funny joke deserving of a little evil smiley. It might be clever and funny to two illiterate guys sitting on a porch, who don't own shoes and use a confederate flag as a curtain, but you might as well just point at the next stranger who walks by and use a racial epithet.

    Just in case you didn't realize. That's how you are coming across.
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    i thought it was funny. not because im racist, because you seem to be taking it so personally.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: prayer rooms in airports

    ^^^
    Well, there you go. Being racist isn't like being left handed. People don't readily admit to it.
    I have taught that the sky in all its zones is mortal and its substance was formed by a process of birth

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