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Thread: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

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    Default floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    I know all clubs have floormen/bouncers that except their cut and I understand that and am fine with that. Especially if they're doing their job of kicking out customers & keeping the customers in line and then also if they're helping me make money. At my club there's "a list" of girls that the floormen always call or help out with VIP's because those girls on "the list" tip them really well. I am one of the girls that's always tipped really well because in return I've gotten to do more of what I want (be late for stage, leave stage early, get my pick of the room, etc.) I've been working at this club for about 8 months and have been working with the floormen for about 6 months. Well lately the floormen have been getting waaaaay too greedy!!! Last night this one floorman who is someone I've worked with the most, pointed me to a table of guys which turned into 2 hour VIP. I tipped him very well (standard at our club 15-20% minimum to stay on the list) and after I did that he told me and this other girl to go to this other table. Well, the table he told us to go to didn't turn into anything but we ended up finding something on our own. Well, at the end of the night he asked me if I tipped (we'll call him John). I said "no, this ended up being a table we found on our own" and he got kind of an attitude about it. (At our club the floormen put all their money together between all 7 of them and divide it up so they'll work together on finding stuff, plus they get a salary from the club, I think like $14/hr but not 100% sure how much they get)

    And last week, this other floorman introduced me to a customer in which it turned out to be a 1 hour VIP. WHile the customer was ordering funny money for me, he was only going to order the minimum and I ended up hustling a tip for this floorman, which was $100 (the customer's choice for the amount) and the funny money girl gave it directly to the floorman. At the end of that night I went up to the floorman, thanked him for the lead and asked him if he got the tip from the funnymoney girl. He said he did and that this particular customer always tips him between $100-$200 each time he comes in. So as we were checking out with the housemom and everything, the floorman from last night came up to me and was saying "aren't you going to tip him", I told him I hustled a $100 tip for him and he said "the customer always tips him" and I then said "well, the customer was going to order the minimum amount and so I said something", then he said something else, I can't remember, but it didn't make any sense, so I wasn't going to argue with him, I at that time really tried to put myself in their shoes, see where they were coming from so I tipped him more.

    So, last Saturday when I worked and then last night which was the next time I worked, 2 nights in a row he's coming up to me and expecting more!!! It's really starting to piss me off!!! I'm one of about 10 girls in the club that tip them (there's about 100 girls each night) and they're going to piss me off to where I'm not going to want to deal with this. I don't like to have drama at work and I don't want to be on anyone's bad side but at the same time I'm not going to allow someone to take advantage of me and manipulate me. At my club in order to get what you want/need you have to grease a lot of hands, I understand that, but they're starting to get really carried away with it. It wasn't like this a few months ago.

    Please give me some advice on how to handle this in a way that I'd pretty much let them know that they're not going to take advantage of me without pissing anyone off. I could understand if I was one of the girl's that doesn't tip very much or at all, but I'm not, I'm a good tipper! And it really makes me wonder why they're doing this to me, why not say something to the girls that don't tip or barely tip? How do I handle this in a way that keeps the peace but also letting them know that I'm not going to let them take advantage of me? I do always try to get VIP's on my own obviously but sometimes I really need their help and many nights they've really saved my night so I don't want to get on anyone's bad side. Thanks everyone!!!!

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    It sounds like they're getting confused over who you work for. You don't work for them, you work for yourself. You're right, they are being greedy and rude. Where do you work? Last I heard, it was illegal to ask for tips, at least in CA. Take the money you made from their help and subtract the tip that they view as acceptable. Is it worth it? If it is, you might just have to deal with it. How much do you tip them compared to the other girls on "the list"? How much do you tip them compared to the girls who aren't on "the list"? As long as your tipping more than the girls who aren't on that list, then you're probably still good, even though they might bitch about it.
    If you think school is hard, try being stupid.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    I don't know if it's illegal to ask or not. I'm definitely one of the highest tippers, out of the 10 girls, I'm in the top 5 of them, I'm always one of the first that gets called for VIP's and leads. So, it's just amazing me that they're saying this to me! Do you think that maybe they're saying this to me because they know I tip well and think they can take advantage of that? To me it's like, why don't you focus your energy and attitude on the ones that don't tip much or at all versus the one that does!!!! I just don't know if I should say something the next time one of them does this or just ignore it.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    They think they can rip off dancers too and they can get away with it. This business is too political for me. But I love the money.



    I Love Life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    ^Helpful . Leo, is there one of them that you can talk to easier than others? Or maybe the next time he sticks his hand out, politely but firmly say something to the effect of he's been tipped and taken care of, I dunno. The floor people at my club are getting this way also, and so far the best way I have delt with it is to stick to what I normally tip out, don't bend, but stay polite and nice.
    So far they have gotten the hint that unless they plan on making me a grand that night, they will get tipped well, as well as I feel like tipping.

    So, to not piss anyone off, and to not get moved off the list, that is what I would do.... or say something like "Would you rather me be occasionaly extravagant, or consistantly good? The last option is always bad." Work the floor guy like a custy.

    Argh, good luck hun, sounds yucky.
    Last edited by ExoticEngineer; 02-02-2007 at 03:46 PM. Reason: Forgot to add personality. ;)




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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Quote Originally Posted by ExoticEngineer
    Or maybe the next time he sticks his hand out, politely but firmly say something to the effect of he's been tipped and taken care of, I dunno.
    I agree with this. Or something like, "You know I always take care of you guys, but I need something left to go home with for myself. Don't worry, I'll keep taking care of you as long as you keep taking care of me." That last bit reminds them that a tip is not an entitlement.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Thanks for the advice. The one that was kinda "my friend" , the one out of all of them that I could talk about things, ask advice, etc. is the one that's sticking his hand out. Maybe he thinks since we're "closer" than I am with the other floormen that it's ok for him to ask. I couldn't say something to the effect that "I already tipped him or I already took care of him" because they all talk, just like girls talk about gossip, they all talk on which girls tips and how much. They're their group, since they split the tips 7 ways, they all try to work as a team to collect the most as possible so they each can take home more. The reason why I work with this one the most is because he's and this other one work the hardest on finding things for girls. There's a couple there that just stand around and collect off the guys that work.

    The only thing I can think of is maybe because I don't tip same amount each time. It varies, it depends on how much of a tip I get from the customer (if any), it depends on what VIP room I get because one type the dancer pays a rental fee per hour but another VIP which is more expensive for the customer the dancer doesn't have to pay, and it also depends on how the rest of my night went also. I used to tip a flat percentage when I first started working with them for the first few months because I didn't really know any better but when I started working with the other girls on "the list" and learned how much they were tipping which was a lot less, I lowered mine a little. I still tip more than most of the other girls, it's just not quite as much as it was a couple months ago. But still, he's getting a really fat ass tip, so there shouldn't be any complaints! Ughh, the politics of dancing!

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    sings.... "The politics of dancing...the politics of ooooooh, feeling good!"




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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    there's some vip hosts that i refuse to tip more than the minimum because they don't do shit for me. That's a shame that not all of the seven guys work equally. I was thinking when reading the part about sitting with a group and not hitting on any vips: what prevents the guys from just randomly picking out groups for you to sit with? this way they can claim part of your money even though they just randomly picked them out.

    something to ponder depending on how good you are at getting guys up to the vip.

    Here's what I do:
    At the beginning of the shift, after I've warmed up with a couple table dances or what not, I go up to the vip host (any one except the guy that doesn't do anything) and hand him $20. this is, in effect, my tip out (we are required to tip min of $5 I think, to be spread out over three floor guys. I always tip $20 base.)
    As I hand it to him I say, "hey, here's the tip out. Remember me tonight and I'll give you more."

    (keep in mind dancers get 150 for a vip half hour and 300 for a vip hour if it's not in credit card sales, otherwise there's a 5-15% taken out.)

    Now, if I do a vip, and I got the vip myself, I don't tip on every one. However I will throw a five or a ten occasionally down off of one of the vips. Now, there's one vip host who knows his shit, and has set me up with guys. Not a lot...but enough to make me feel like it behooves me to continue greasing the wheels.

    Typically I'll give him ten from each vip room, and if he gives me a vip room that I wouldn't have gotten on my own, I try to tip him $20-30.

    However, I'm in a different situation than you.
    this particular vip host will start to refuse my tips at a certain point during the night-- normally around $30-40 (TOTAL including that initial 20 I would have given him anyways.) He will refuse to take them, and at the end of the night, depending on how I'm doing I will force him to take a tiny bit extra (the other night I left $7 extra for him, but that's because I was trying to break $400 on a night when a lot of the other girls were leaving with $100. I actually ended up going home with 460 but I didn't figure that out til later.)

    So-- this guy in your situation doesn't seem to understand the gravy train starts and ends with you. Perhaps you just need to accept that you need to hustle harder on the nights he's pressuring you; or you could always try starving them out on the minimum tip (though there would be backlash.) I would be open and up front with him in saying that his pressuring you is making you really start to resent him. This is someone who you probably need to give up any friendly relationship with except in terms of saying "hi" and "which customer wants me?"

    Without you talking about numbers, I can't really say what is fair or unfair-- but considering you tip the most or almost the most, they can't really have anything to complain about, and perhaps the best way to phrase it to them:

    Am I, or am I not, one of the best tippers in this club? If I am, then stop trying to squeeze the geeze that lays the golden eggs.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Thanks for all the advice. Fancygirl, I thought of the same thing about them randomly picking tables and it being a numbers game, eventually one of the tables they point to will turn into something. I'll let you all know how it goes after tonight and will give you some numbers. I'll tell you, I've tipped a lot more than what you are, it's kind of a standard at my club. Basically for a 1 hour VIP, which used to be $250 (changed it to $300 last week), if you didn't give $50 per $250/hr they wouldn't consider you again! They want AT LEAST 20% to consider you again! This one girl at my club tips 50%!!!! I know, she's crazy! He got her 4 hours last week only because she tips 50%, so she made $1200 and he was upset that she tipped him $400 instead of $600!!! I would NEVER tip that much, it's not even worth it!

    I'll let you all know how it goes, oh, and our floormen would NEVER turn away money, EVER!!!

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    ^ that is kind of extreme, however it would be nice to make $1200 on a shift (but he just got her four hours for the week?)

    It's a toss up between having faith in your own abilities versus faith in the guys actually pointing out quality customers that you likely wouldn't get on your own.

    Do an experiment and see how many hours you get from these guys. Try to remember what you've been getting the past few weeks. See if it's really THAT much different on those nights when you've had to wing it on your own.

    If you're making a lot more, then yeah...it's probably worth it, but if you're making about the same or just a little bit extra, it sounds like you need to wing it independently.

    However, I would tell the guys something like:

    "hey-- I have this really expensive thing to do on my car and so for the next couple of weeks I'm going to have to pull back from using you guys as VIP help. I need to pull back from extravagently tipping and honestly I feel like you guys are expecting more and more for the same (or less) service. So, I'm going to take a break, work the floor on my own, and when I don't have to worry about my bills as much I'll come back to tipping you for your services."

    ^only do if you know they'd take you back after you took a break. Might be nice to get them to wake up and appreciate your contribution to tip out though.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Quote Originally Posted by leogirl876 View Post

    I'll let you all know how it goes, oh, and our floormen would NEVER turn away money, EVER!!!
    ^and I pay him MORE because of it! He's the whole reason why I started doing $20 minimum every shift instead of $5, and when he resists I do pressure him to take more money, so I might push $25 at him and he'll take $10 and then cut me off at the end of the night.

    Though it works both ways-- one time he paid me twenty dollars extra and I brought it back to him saying there was some mix up.

    He took the money back and said "and THAT is worth more to me than your tips."

    If these guys are out to make you feel cheated, then you are going to be out to cheat them...not a good working relationship.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Personally, I would be inclined to tell them to fuck off. I don't really need help making money. I wonder, after hanging out with you in person and hearing some of your hustle, how much these guys really help you, and how much you'd make without their leads. It seems to me you might just make the same money or more on your own. Think of how many times they lead you to dead tables, and what you might've done with that time otherwise...

    I have found that I do better working with waitresses and other dancers than with floormen - for basically the same reasons you described here. At my last club the floormen were known for hustling tips from the custies by offering to bring them girls, and then expecting tips from the girls they brought over also - whether or not the girls made any money from the table. I quit tipping the floormen for leads and they quit leading me, and guess what? I actually started making MORE money because I wasn't wasting time on bullshit leads - sometimes their leads were good and sometimes they were utter crap. By not spending any time on floorman leads I was able to focus ALL my time on selling, not fucking around with some floorman turd.

    At another club I didn't tip the floormen much at all, and I was a top earner. A couple other girls got a few CRs when I didn't, but I sold more dances and repeat CRs by concentrating on my own hustle, AND I left with more of MY money so at the end of the day I made out better than the floormen's "favorites". There were only a handful of times that one of the floormen's girls got some really big spender from their leads, but my overall earnings were higher so the rare times those girls got a big fish from leads didn't really put them over the top.

    At any rate, the reason these guys are hustling you harder for money now is because you have given them reason to believe they'll get it if they ask. Like dogs - give them treats a few times and they'll keep coming back for more and more. When you get a $100 floorman tip from custy, DON'T give him more money. $100 is MORE than enough - it doesn't matter if that custy always tips well or not. I personally would HAVE to remind him that in the grand scheme HE made out better than you in that deal so he should not resort to biting the hand that feeds him (you). Anyway, if you continue to bend when he "asks" you for more money, he's going to keep asking and his expectations will only get worse.

    There are NO friends in this business. NONE. Remember that. You might have friends OTC but NOT at work. The floorman who is getting overly greedy with you isn't doing it because you are "friends" - again he's doing it because you let him.

    Tip them when it's appropriate, and that's it. Be firm but polite. You may not get as many leads, but I'm inclined to believe that won't hurt your money overall


    Bottom line: Don't be too dependent on the pimps, and don't let them push you around. They are not as valuable or helpful to you as they want you to believe.
    Last edited by Bridgette; 02-03-2007 at 06:30 PM.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    On an additional note, instead of tipping heavily to the floormen for leads, I will tip the CR host when there is a line to get into a room and I have a custy sold on CR. THAT helps me more than tipping for leads

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    I gotta agree. It sounds like your hustle is strong so I'm not sure you really need them. I've done $1200 quite a few times and with no one's help. I'm not a magician, you just get to the point where you have a feel for who has money. You have a feel for who'll spend on you. THAT'S how you knew to get away from the bum lead your friend gave and concentrate on the good lead you got yourself. Just believe in your intelligence.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bridgette View Post
    On an additional note, instead of tipping heavily to the floormen for leads, I will tip the CR host when there is a line to get into a room and I have a custy sold on CR. THAT helps me more than tipping for leads
    The CR host is the same as the floormen, they're all the same at our club. I am going to start focusing on my own more and see how that works for me. That'll be the true test to see how well my hustling skills are, I'm confident that they're pretty good, much better than before. A few months ago I really depended on the floormen but more and more I'm not. And come to think of it, the one I was talking about does kinda try to make you think that you couldn't make money without him. I was talking to another dancer about this and she said "he's like that with all the girls, he's a spoiled ass". She also said if they come up to me again with their hands out more than make them tell me what they want, she said say to them "what do you want from me? I tipped you xyz, what more do you want?" she said to make him feel uncomfortable.

    Last night at the very end of the night another floormen sent me to a table with a half hour left in the night and I got a half hour from that table. At the end of the night the one floormen I was talking about in the original post, the one that was coming up to me with his hands out was saying to me I could give him the tip and he's tell the one that sent me the lead. And come to think of it, he does that a lot saying I could give it to him, probably so he knows how much someone is tipping so he can try to manipulate you more, the other ones haven't ever done that to me. According to other dancers, this one does it to a lot of the girls.

    So, I'm going to really start working on my own, I bet I'll do just as well, maybe even better! Wish me luck!

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    I wonder if that guy who comes up asking for the tips and claims he'll pass it on, is really passing it on? From experience, I'm betting he's pocketing all or some of that money himself. I bet it's NOT just so he "knows" how much the girls are paying. Bouncers like that got fired asap at my last club, thankfully.

    We only have floormen/CR host too - that wasn't the point. The point is that I don't pay them for leads. I pay them to get me and my custies into our rooms faster. I will go right up to the guy and hand him a $20-50 and make sure he knows that is EXTRA, on top of whatever I hustle for him from the custy, and of course that we'd like to get into any room asap. THAT helps me more than getting leads because I can get in the room faster when possible, to avoid losing a custy due to too much time passing between sale-closing and actually getting into the room and getting his money. We also don't have that many floormen so we don't have to pay them as much as you apparently pay.


    I bet you will make as much money on your own, maybe more. If you see your money dip a little at first, don't get discouraged. Use what you've learned in the last few months to keep finding your own money. You may not get quite as many VIPs but if you just keep working I bet your money will not drop. Think about it: if you're paying 20% for leads now, that's the equivalent of 1 VIP out of every 5 you sell, so you can afford to sell one less VIP out of every 5 you sell now, not pay for leads and still make same money. Plus, you can always sell more dances if you're not in a VIP, AND you will keep more of the money you do make so you might even start taking home more. Keep at it a couple weeks and see how it goes.
    Last edited by Bridgette; 02-04-2007 at 01:33 AM.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Thanks for your advice everyone!!!! It's been great advice and I'm going to apply all of this. I'll let you know what happens and how I end up doing. If I find that they're taking too long to get me a room, I'll tip them. Many times I just say f$ck them and go get the room myself and say "Ok, this is the one we want". We're not supposed to do it but I get away with it all the time!

    Another thing I was talking to a veteran dancer there and she said she's noticed it's gotten much much worse just lately. I don't know if it's because they have less girls (the housemoms have been making calls a lot to get us to come in) or if they're just getting more greedy. I will not allow them to manipulate me and take my money, because it is mine! And she also thinks that they just randomly pick out tables so if one of the girls gets a VIP from them they'll say they should get their cut. She said they've done that to her with some of her loyal regulars by saying "So in so is here for you, he's over there" and she's like "yeah, I know, thanks" and then they come later with their hands out and she doesn't give it to them because they're her regulars that come to see her! Ughh!!! Greedy bastards!!!!

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    Yep, that's kinda what I was saying would happen at my last club, in part. Those guys were always trying to hustle both ends though - both custies and dancers. And more than a few times they'd send girls to totally dead tables, just sending girls to ANYONE for the sole purpose of hustling tips from the dancers later. That's why I quit tipping them for leads and started being very busy when they came to me, until they stopped bothering me These guys don't really change much from club to club or region to region - pimp mentality is pimp mentality and a cheater is a cheater.

    My last club would clean house every few months because the bouncers would always start getting too greedy and "big for their britches" and not only start hustling the girls more, but the customers and club as well. Thankfully, as soon as management would hear about them scamming, especially if they were pocketing tips instead of pooling them, they'd be fired.

    They figure out they can get away with x and then they get brave and start pushing to y and z. If someone doesn't call them on their bullshit they'll run over everyone.


    I still can't help thinking that guy you're talking about is *probably* pocketing some of those extra tips he's so fond of asking for rather than pooling them as he should, and if he were to "accidentally" get caught he'd probably get canned. Unless of course he's some owner's nephew I might just do a little detective work, and see what I could find out. I don't know how they track what they get from the girls but there's probably some way to figure out what he's turning in and whether it matches what you gave him...

    At my last club one guy got fired because people started noticing he wasn't writing down what we turned in and having us sign it like he was supposed to. At first most girls just blew it off because *occasionally* we'd just kinda run out without signing - but we started noticing he NEVER wanted us to sign and would even TELL us to just go even if we stood there and offered to sign. So it became totally obvious he was skimming the tips.

    OR perhaps he's turning it all in and the other guys are just sending him to do their dirty work because they see he is more successful at it. Either way, stand your ground and don't let him or anyone else push you around.

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    I really think he's doing their dirty work. I doubt he's pocketing the money because they've all worked together between 7-15 yrs and there was a guy that they caught pocketing some of the money a couple years ago and they had him fired. I really think he's doing the dirty work because he's the most aggressive, almost like he's the high hustler out of the group.

    I'm wondering though, what should I do when they have me called to a certain area, should I just ignore the page or if they're trying to pull me off somewhere to meet a customer or whatever, should I just tell them I'm busy? Last weekend I was with a customer doing a tour of the VIP room and they pulled me away from that customer to introduce to me the customer that they later claimed always tips them. Luckily, the customer that I was pulled away from ended up getting a VIP with me anyway and the only reason why I went was because it was a couple and it's either a hit or miss with couples. I'm wondering what would be the best way to go about blowing them off & working on my own without making it too obvious. I'm someone who never wants to burn their bridges with anyone.

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    Default Re: floormen at my club getting too greedy (need advice how to handle this)

    I just ignore them or tell them flat out I'm busy. Because once I make such a decision I want nothing more to do with them. That works best for me because 1) I prefer not to be bothered most the time at work and get annoyed when being called away from custies and 2) it forces me to swim on my own, and I'm much happier that way in the long run.


    I don't have any fabulous ideas for blowing them off without blowing them off. I kinda think that'll be next to impossible to accomplish without some reaction from them.

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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