Results 1 to 20 of 20

Thread: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

  1. #1
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    it would appear that no doc credit cards are going mainstream ...



    now for the question - what's to stop any American from obtaining one of these no doc credit cards using a pseudonym and a PO box address ?

    In other words, can 'Melonie Charm' legally apply for a BofA no doc credit card ?

  2. #2
    Veteran Member StuartL's Avatar
    Joined
    Feb 2006
    Location
    European Man Of Mystery
    Posts
    648
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 21 Times in 7 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    Melonie, YOU need to ask us??? I think an imposter has taken control of your keyboard!!

    I know what you are thinking, but I doubt it. Forgive me for not being exact, but the US isn't my area of specific expertise ... but as you know I am a civil liberties and privacy nut.

    As I understand it, you can't open a PO Box in the USA without ID. You'd need to check, but I'm sure you'll find that they want ID and a utility bill.

    The UK has legislation now (put in place during the last few years) that make it an offence to be impersonating someone else. This is to stop terrorists and drug lords, obviously. I am under the impression that the main thrust of our law was inspired by US legislation.

    I'd be interested to hear if anyone else has input, this is an interesting area to me.

    Good luck in finding your answer Melonie.

    Best,

    Stuart

  3. #3
    Featured Member scorpio's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    868
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    in order to get the BofA card, you must have a BofA bank account for a least 90 days.

  4. #4
    God/dess VenusGoddess's Avatar
    Joined
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Home
    Posts
    13,598
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 28 Times in 23 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    ^ Yep, and in order to get a BofA account, you must show drivers license and have your credit pulled.

  5. #5
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    ^^^ so how are illegal aliens opening BofA checking accounts ?

  6. #6
    Featured Member Miss_Luscious's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Raleigh
    Posts
    988
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 36 Times in 23 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    I was approved for a BofA card before I opened my account there. I had to go open the account and sign some stuff at the bank branch but got the card before I had the account.
    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand." - Bertrand Russell

    "It's just a matter of people having low self esteem and being way too easily offended." -Random Guy on a Internet Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    Ya'll bitches need to calm down. Cerously.
    In other words: Boo-motherfucking-hoo

  7. #7
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    ^^^ but Luscious you're a US citizen with a Social Security number, right ? This news blurb is promoting the fact that BofA is now offering credit cards to people in California who do not have a Social Security number and who under California state law are ineligible for Cal Driver's Licenses because they do not have a SS#. This presupposes that BofA allowed these SS numberless, driver's licenseless people to open checking accounts three months before allowing them to obtain credit cards. BofA's announcement also says they plan to start doing the same in other states.

    Mailboxes Etc. here I come !!!

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 02-13-2007 at 07:38 PM.

  8. #8
    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,493
    Thanks
    120
    Thanked 50 Times in 35 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    Probably using their matricula consular as an ID to get the account.

  9. #9
    242_fair
    Guest

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    Recently BofA offered me this card, in association with an account that has not been used since 2001, thats 5 years!! And I don't even live in that state or COUNTRY any more!

    Maybe they contacted me because that account was established with a Tax Payer ID # and not a SSN?

  10. #10
    Featured Member Vamp's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    1,111
    Thanks
    271
    Thanked 757 Times in 289 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    Under the patriot act, when opening an account at a branch, you must show two forms of Id. One must be picture Id.

    There is absolutely no law which requires a SS card when applying for accounts though.

    It has been a standard industry practice because it makes tracking debtors easier but it is not a legal requirement. Bank of America is not the only company making credit card offers and mortgage loans to illegals. Many do so if the illegal has a checking account, fed id tax number, decent job history with proof of income and an id card issued by Mexican authorities.

    Bank of America is just the first to bring it mainstream with a large ad campaign.
    Nature knows no indecencies; man invents them. ~ Mark Twain


  11. #11
    Featured Member Vamp's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    1,111
    Thanks
    271
    Thanked 757 Times in 289 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...home-headlines

    "The bank's program may be controversial, but it also vividly demonstrates that businesses view the country's estimated 12 million illegal immigrants not as lawbreakers but as customers.

    Other major banks including Wells Fargo & Co. and Citibank have launched similar initiatives to gain customers in the burgeoning Latino community.

    Wells Fargo began a pilot program last year in Los Angeles and Orange counties to offer home mortgages to immigrants who have lived in the United States for at least two years. The customers are allowed to identify themselves using taxpayer numbers issued by the Internal Revenue Service instead of Social Security numbers. That's the same type of identification number an immigrant can use to obtain a credit card under Bank of America's pilot program.

    Wells Fargo may follow Bank of America's lead on credit cards.

    "We are also looking at the possibility of offering unsecured credit cards to customers who may not have Social Security numbers," Wells Fargo spokeswoman Mary Trigg said."
    Nature knows no indecencies; man invents them. ~ Mark Twain


  12. #12
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    so does this mean that I can apply to the IRS for a Taxpayer ID number under the name of 'Melonie Charm' giving a temporary (bogus) address in East LA - then take the Taxpayer ID number and open a bank account at BofA or Citibank in the name of Melonie Charm - then apply for the credit card in the name of Melonie Charm ?

    Assuming that is true, I can then deposit all of 'Melonie Charm''s earnings into the BofA account and spend them using the BofA credit card .... that I can 'subtract' these earnings from my 'normal' personal tax return ... and that if the IRS ever decides to track down why 'Melonie Charm' forgot to file a tax return they will get stopped cold in their tracks in East LA ?

    I also assume that if I max out Melonie Charm's BofA credit card and stop making payments, that BofA will also get stopped cold in East LA ... and that only Melonie Charm's credit rating will be affected, not my personal credit rating ?

  13. #13
    God/dess Bridgette's Avatar
    Joined
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Gettin the fuck outta Dodge!
    Posts
    14,241
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    It IS still possible to get a private rental mailbox without ID or proof of address. Not at Mailboxes Etc - they almost want to see proof of what your last crap smelled like But at many other smaller facilities, you don't even have to show ID. Or you could show a Mexican consulate ID, which apparently anyone can get under just about any name.

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

  14. #14
    Member OCWizard's Avatar
    Joined
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    18
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    The program offered by Bank of America focuses on the individuals who are here illegally. An underlying pinning of this program is the assumption that Congress will enact legislation that is a "pathway to citizenship" (amnesty) and suddenly you will have twelve million new citizens and another fifty to eighty million family members who follow the current illegals to the U.S. (Remember most of the illegals are male family members with the wife and kids remaining at home and the husband/brother/son wiring up to $3,000 home a day to wives/sisters/daughters - but that's another story and its affect on the U.S. Economy, Melonie.)

    The Bank of America or Banco de Mexico as it is being referred to will issue a credit card with a $500 limit to any illegal alien who has opened and maintained an account with B of A for three months without an overdraft and who has a Maticular Consular card which is merely an ID card that the illegal obtains from any office of the Mexican Consulant for the asking. I believe the cards are so easy to obtain that the illegals who sell fake social security cards and other documents don't bother with the Maticular Consular cards. The question is how many of these accounts will default and what effect will such defalcations has on B of A, its shareholders and its earnings.

    The illegal alien issue and the cost to the American taxpayer is only the ten percent tip of the proverbial ice berg. The remaining ninety percent is the North American Union that is being planned and implemented as I write this. If you are interested in the economy I suggest you google "North American Union" and also visit (could be .org). The affects on our economy are stagering. Adios y Vaya Con Dios mi amegos~

  15. #15
    Featured Member AkashaM's Avatar
    Joined
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Big City of Dreams...
    Posts
    870
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 31 Times in 15 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    Bank of America will make a fucking killing! They know it too! The interest rates HAVE to be high. Especially since their target custy group is generally a hardworking, pay-the-bills-ontime crowd. Many imigrants (legal or not) have to save $ over the course of may years before they are ready to buy houses or start businesses (as thy often do). BofA will enable that process faster for them.

    they WILL pay these loans back ontime. Why? if you're illegal, you dont want the damn problems.

    I like it---fucking genius. Capitalism at its finest---putting new americans in debt, one person at a time, lol.
    I'm getting my Dial-A-Stripper service up and running again. If you are in NYC or NJ and are interested in private party dancing, email [email protected] with your SW handle, contact info, photo (if you have one) & best time to call and I'll get back to you asap.

    If you're having a party and need strippers, email me with the details and any questions you have. Thanks!

  16. #16
    Featured Member GnBeret's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    796
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    Quote Originally Posted by OCWizard View Post
    An underlying pinning of this program is the assumption that Congress will enact legislation that is a "pathway to citizenship" (amnesty) and suddenly you will have twelve million new citizens and another fifty to eighty million family members who follow the current illegals to the U.S.
    Quote Originally Posted by OCWizard View Post
    The question is how many of these accounts will default and what effect will such defalcations has on B of A, its shareholders and its earnings.
    Aja... but the underlying pinning (i.e., financial basis) for the industry's willingness to engage in such heretofore unheard of risky lending practices on such an enormous scale is basically sound. In this regard, after first managing to convince Congress that the laundry list of charges, fees and penalties they're allowed to incorporate in the lending agreements should not be subject to usury laws, and reaping the benefit of same in the form of more than a decade of record profits, the industry then somehow managed to convince Congress to 'reform' the basic personal bankruptcy provisions such that an enormous percentage of those who would have previously qualified for a complete discharge of their debts will no longer be so eligible and will instead have to repay substantial amounts of monies (in the aggregate) to their creditors... the benefits of which the industry just beginning to reap in additional profits. The net effect of all of which has served to now place some of the largest lenders in the industry in the financial position to be able to undertake the potential risk of incurring such huge losses... especially when balanced against the potential pay-off of capturing an excess market share of what they're effectively betting will soon be an enormous increase in their customer base.

    IOW, while there's no denying they're taking a huge gamble on this concept, they've managed to f*** everyone for long enough and backstop their position with changes in bankruptcy code well enough to afford to be able to take the bet - especially given the potential pay-off if they're correct in their assessment of the situation and it all works out the way they're anticipating it will.
    "That's your answer Old Man? I guess you're a Hard Case too...."
    - Luke
    "Some men, you just can't reach...."
    - Boss, re Luke

    If there's one thing in my life these years have taught me,
    it's that you can always see it coming, but you can never stop it.
    -Cowboy Junkies

  17. #17
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    ^^^ actually, in a warped sort of way, the B of A illegal alien credit card might actually reduce the number of future illegal immigrants who stay in the USA - because bill collectors are going to be much more persistent than 'la migra' about tracking them down and seeking (financial) law enforcement. Bankruptcy proceedings will never actually happen though, since the vast majority of illegal aliens have no official assets to be repoed and no official paycheck to be garnished, and can simply switch to a new assumed identity.

    I'm probably mistaken tha the B of A cards will have a chilling effect though, because all an illegal alien needs to do to avoid bill collectors is to obtain a new Matricula Consular ID card using a different assumed name, move across town, and apply for yet another B of A checking account and credit card using a different name and different address ! That way a clever illegal alien can probably maxx out and go belly up on 3-4 credit cards a year using 3-4 different assumed names and addresses, increasing their cash income by some $2000 !

    One thing that is absolutely certain is that the B of A illegal alien checking accounts and credit cards are going to drastically reduce the incomes of check cashing / money transfer services, who are presently able to rake in something on the order of 6% fees to cash checks for illegal aliens and transfer a portion back to a Mexican bank for them. Wells Fargo's loss is Bank of America's gain !

    The US congress has gotten involved in this issue to some small degree - see . However, between the recent media attacks on Atty Gen Gonzales and what appears to be lukewarm support at best by Democrats in congress to conduct B of A hearings, the B of A illegal alien checking account and credit card programs are still alive and well - and will probably stay that way.

    Of course, B of A isn't the only bank to profit from Illegal Alien 'loans' ...



    but the ultimate a$$ puckerer is that our federal tax money i.e. HUD funds are being used to fund ACORN's efforts to actually go out and promote mortgages for illegal aliens.

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 04-01-2007 at 05:44 AM.

  18. #18
    Member bellyflower's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    26
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    I would really rather my social security number be used only for social security.
    That is, when i file my taxes and (if and when) when i cash in any benefits.

    We all have lots of numbers assigned to us for lots of things...driver's license number, employee number, student ID number, various membership numbers, license plate number...

    Nobody requires your license plate number to visit the doctor, and nobody requires a patient ID number to take a college class...so why use my SSN?

    We all have birth certificates, I think that should be good enough to prove that I really am who I say I am for nearly all business transactions. Any question in that matter could easily be proved by refering back to the certificate.

    Anyways, whether they have my SSN or not, a bill collector can still track me down just about as well as having provided my social security card doesn't mean I've provided a correct address, phone number, or work information.

    Hasn't anyone ever gotten a collections agency calling for a different person of the same name?

    Ah....really, the whole needing your SSN to open a bank account or blow your nose makes me feel like an animal wearing a tracking collar, you dig?

    Big Brother gives me the heebee jeebees.
    Last edited by bellyflower; 04-01-2007 at 05:47 AM. Reason: misspelling: numbee ---> number

  19. #19
    Member bellyflower's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    26
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    A little addition...

    When I got the loan on my car, I had yet to file taxes and so proved my income with checking and savings account records. That was easy because I got the loan from the same credit union I have used since I was 7 or 8 years old, but I'd never seen the loan officer before in my life, nor she I.

    Anyone with bit of wit and a sliver of knowledge about me could have walked in and taken out that loan in my name.

    I was not asked for any identification whatsoever.

    I had, as a matter of fact, provided my social security card to them already. 14 years prior.

  20. #20
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: I'm gonna need a little legal / finance industry help on this one ...

    ^^^ well big brother is doing just that under the premise of national security. For better or for worse, the REAL ID act is trying to set standards for a national ID which will constitute reasonable proof that you are the one and only US citizen / legal alien named X living at address Y and earning a paycheck / paying taxes under SS# / TIN# Z.

    Birth certificates are so easy to obtain bogus ID's from it's ridiculous. These are all 'local' documents thus not subject to much original scrutiny. Also, there is no cross-check between the existance of a 'local' birth certificate and a 'local' death certificate. This fact resulted in a major expose' that it's ridiculously easy to obtain official but fake ID's by doing the following ...

    first, go through back issues of local newspapers and locate an obituary for a person who is the same sex and age that you are. Read through the obituary to determine where that deceased person was born, and find one that was born in a different city from where they died. Then use your computer to print out a couple of phony rent and utility bills using the deceased person's name and a ficticious address. The go to city hall (or wherever) in the city in which the deceased person was born, show the clerk your phony rent and utility bills, pay them $10, and you'll walk away with a copy of the dead person's birth certificate showing their name and your ficticious address. Then go immediately to the state Motor Vehicle department and apply for a driver's learner's permit using that birth certificate with the dead person's name and a phony address. Two weeks later, borrow a car from a friend and take the driver's test. You'll then walk away with an official driver's license in the deceased person's name with the ficticious address which can then be used as official ID for just about anything !

    The above scheme was successfully used by some of the 9/11 hijackers !


    As to your addition, this is the crux of the B of A checking accounts and credit card accounts. Your credit union at one point required you to show a SS card (and also verified your name and address via your parents) in order to open a bank account in the first place. Illegal aliens would not have been able to open a credit union account since they lack the SS card and also probably lack corroborating evidence of real name and real address.

    B of A's decision essentially boils down to a matter of ID verification, or lack thereof. By allowing the opening of bank accounts without effective ID verification and without effective cross-checking for the use of multiple fake ID's by the same person, B of A's precedent threatens the entire financial structure of America. Why ? Well, if you could do it with impugnity, instead of reporting and paying taxes on say $60k in gross income and paying out the a$$ in taxes, wouldn't you rather file three tax returns in three different names for $20k each thus paying no taxes and instead collecting three earned income credit tax refunds ? All you would need to do is open three different B of A accounts !
    Last edited by Melonie; 04-01-2007 at 06:18 AM.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 5
    Last Post: 07-19-2011, 03:20 AM
  2. Finance courses?
    By Zinaida in forum Dollar Den
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 07-06-2011, 10:19 PM
  3. Replies: 5
    Last Post: 04-03-2007, 09:11 PM
  4. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-01-2006, 08:23 PM
  5. Legal Forum: Ask your legal questions here.
    By ATLDiscoLawyer420 in forum The Lounge
    Replies: 42
    Last Post: 04-29-2003, 09:11 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •