Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 47

Thread: Grinding = Prostitution?

  1. #1
    God/dess Sophia_Starina's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Nudie-Land
    Posts
    7,219
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 4,151 Times in 1,462 Posts
    My Mood
    Sneaky

    Lightbulb Grinding = Prostitution?

    I was talking with a friend the other day about lap vs. air dances. And I got to thinking about how little a full on grind lap dance varies from an HJ. Really… even when there is one-way contact girls are still stimulating the gentleman’s genital area with some part of their body (whether it be a leg, ass, tits, or even kitty). When straddling a guy there are a few layers of fabric between the girl and full sex. I’m starting to think that these sort of dances are just shy of prostitution….. What are your thoughts?
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay12 View Post
    ^What Sophia said.
    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    I wish there was an "auto-like" setting that I could just have applied to all of your posts Sophia....

  2. #2
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    465
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    In Indiana, it is actually labeled as prostitution. But then again so is going to dinner with a customer....... But yeah..... I think it's a form of prostitution.

  3. #3
    God/dess Bridgette's Avatar
    Joined
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Gettin the fuck outta Dodge!
    Posts
    14,241
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    I think in most areas that grinding does = prostitution legally. That's why so many girls get arrested during raids for nothing more than giving a regular lapdance, and frankly, it's also a large part of the reason so many girls are doing more than a lapdance these days. If they're going to risk the same prostitution charge for giving a lapdance as for doing more, why not do more and get more money? Strict lapdance laws only make clubs dirtier unless they strictly hold CLUBS responsible and not just the girls. So, you can thank your local politicians and clubowners for the degradation of stripclubs. Sorry for getting on a tangent, but this is one of my biggest pet peeves.

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

  4. #4
    Banned Katrine's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    13,855
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    There is a big difference, if you've done grinding dances in a club, and prostitution in a private place. There just is. Now, legally, that varies....

    "Have you ever been to American wedding? Where is the vodka, where's marinated herring?" - GB
    "And do the cats give a shit? No, they do not. Why? Because they're cats."-from The Onion

    Quote Originally Posted by Mia M
    If a cupcake was tossed at me... well, I'd only be upset if it missed my mouth

  5. #5
    Picaresque
    Guest

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    I don't know...but I know that grinding has skewed my perception. I have always worked in clubs where contact and grinding was the norm...and in a few months I will be in Melbourne, where ALL the clubs are air-dance clubs. So now I'm paranoid that I'm not going to be able to sell a single dance after I move...because "why would anyone want to buy a dance with no contact?" Clearly my thinking is faulty, because girls are working and selling air dances, in Melbourne and in other air-dance cities across the world. But it's going to take some major re-learning on my part.

    Personally, I don't consider grinding to be prostitution. I don't have any particular rationale for feeling that way, though; it's just my gut instinct that there's a big difference.

  6. #6
    God/dess Bella21's Avatar
    Joined
    Sep 2003
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    7,772
    Thanks
    2
    Thanked 40 Times in 35 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Personally, I think prostitution is getting paid for sex (whether genital or oral). Rubbing on someone isn't sex so I wouldn't call it prostitution... But I would still call it illegal (because of my area).
    If you think school is hard, try being stupid.

  7. #7
    TheSexKitten
    Guest

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by kylie3183 View Post
    In Indiana, it is actually labeled as prostitution. But then again so is going to dinner with a customer....... But yeah..... I think it's a form of prostitution.
    GRARR I heard that around my part of the states giving your number to a customer is solicitation.

    WTF would it be solicitation if a waitress gave her no. to a hot diner? NO.

    These laws are retarded

  8. #8
    Featured Member Kalligirl's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    1,134
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 18 Times in 15 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    I think prositution is paid for sex. Sex is defined as something go in the vagina or anus, penetration if you will.


    So.. I don't think it is. Thats jsut MO.

  9. #9
    Veteran Member laplover69's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    412
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    In Indiana, it is actually labeled as prostitution. But then again so is going to dinner with a customer....... But yeah..... I think it's a form of prostitution

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalligirl View Post
    I think prositution is paid for sex. Sex is defined as something go in the vagina or anus, penetration if you will.

    So.. I don't think it is. Thats jsut MO.
    Indiana has no laws on "grinding" lapdancing on the books; it does however posses a STATEWIDE PASTIE LAW that is enforced, although not uniformly. I also agree that prostitution is paid for sex DIRECTLY. One could argue that ones monogamous girlfriend is a "prostitute" cause she gives him sex albeit through INDIRECT means instead of DIRECTLY (just for the act). If a "customer" takes a "dancer" shopping several times and she finally gives it up, does that make her a prostitute??

  10. #10
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jan 2005
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    3,786
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalligirl View Post
    I think prositution is paid for sex. Sex is defined as something go in the vagina or anus, penetration if you will.


    So.. I don't think it is. Thats jsut MO.
    I agree with this to an extent. I would include HJ's in that as well.

    I don't find grinding to be prostitution because you're not being paid for actual sex, only stimulation and fantasy. And there is the layer of clothing as well.

    It's also not usually planned to get him off, just excited. So, that in itself, means it not really prostitution, to me.

  11. #11
    God/dess Sophia_Starina's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Nudie-Land
    Posts
    7,219
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 4,151 Times in 1,462 Posts
    My Mood
    Sneaky

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    I dunno... if someone paid to get a handjob it would be considered prostitution even if no oral, anal, or vaginal penetration was involved. I think its interesting that there is the legal designation, but my gut instict says that using a part of your body to get someone off for a per-song fee is prostitution. Just my thoughts. Also... the notion of "intent" is a tricky thing....
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay12 View Post
    ^What Sophia said.
    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    I wish there was an "auto-like" setting that I could just have applied to all of your posts Sophia....

  12. #12
    StrayStripper
    Guest

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Legally, grinding is prostitution. Clubs allow it anyway.

  13. #13
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    465
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    If a "customer" takes a "dancer" shopping several times and she finally gives it up, does that make her a prostitute??
    The fact that a dancer let a customer take her shopping would technically make her a prostitute legally. Now, I may not agree with this, but from a legal standpoint that's just how it is in Indiana.

    Indiana has no laws on "grinding" lapdancing on the books.
    And actually, Indiana does have a law that grinding is not allowed. A dancer is legally not allowed to be within 6" of a customer's dick. Most of the time, as long as there is a visible distance that's good enough.

  14. #14
    God/dess virgoamm's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2006
    Location
    In the clouds.....
    Posts
    2,413
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    I don't think that it's prostitution at all. To me, prostitution is full on sex, oral sex and hand jobs.

  15. #15
    Veteran Member laplover69's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    412
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by kylie3183 View Post
    The fact that a dancer let a customer take her shopping would technically make her a prostitute legally. Now, I may not agree with this, but from a legal standpoint that's just how it is in Indiana.



    And actually, Indiana does have a law that grinding is not allowed. A dancer is legally not allowed to be within 6" of a customer's dick. Most of the time, as long as there is a visible distance that's good enough.

    Well, I know lots of dancers who go out with "customers" with no sex involved so I guess there is a lot of sex-free prostitutes! LOL I am not sure what law you are referring to that prohibits a dancer from going shopping or at to dinner with a "customer"?? Maybe he was a "friend" before he was a "custy"?... The 6 inch rule technically is on the books, but never has been enforced or cited and prosecuted to my knowledge.

  16. #16
    Senior Member manchester's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2006
    Location
    st.louis
    Posts
    197
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheSexKitten View Post
    GRARR I heard that around my part of the states giving your number to a customer is solicitation.

    WTF would it be solicitation if a waitress gave her no. to a hot diner? NO.

    These laws are retarded
    well yeaaaah bc strippers =lower class citizens, duhzz.



    Quote Originally Posted by DylanAngel View Post
    . And there is the layer of clothing as well.

    It's also not usually planned to get him off, just excited. So, that in itself, means it not really prostitution, to me.
    if anything that women did that could made men excited suddenly became illegal? well damn.

  17. #17
    God/dess ViolaStrings's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    4,219
    Thanks
    84
    Thanked 236 Times in 120 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    I don't mince words. I think any form of sex for profit is prostitution. The stereotpyical trophy wife is more of a prostitute than a dancer grinding dick. When will gold diggers get ticketed? When will they leave the strippers alone? GOSH.

  18. #18
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    465
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Laplover, I'm not saying that I agree with this law, but what I am saying is that meeting (or even saying that you will meet up) with any customer that has been in the club is considered prostitution EVEN if it is not for sex. And yes, even if you know this person.

    While I may not agree with this, I was just trying to point out what the law is where I work. And yes, they do send in excise to check on this.

    Now, I don't agree that this should be prostitution, but I do know that you can get busted for this and girls HAVE gotten ticketted for this. They have to draw the line somewhere I guess, and it's prbly just easier to give citations if all girls have to do is say that they MIGHT meet up with a guy later. That way, quotas get upped and so do collections from fines.

  19. #19
    Veteran Member laplover69's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    412
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by kylie3183 View Post
    Laplover, I'm not saying that I agree with this law, but what I am saying is that meeting (or even saying that you will meet up) with any customer that has been in the club is considered prostitution EVEN if it is not for sex. And yes, even if you know this person.

    While I may not agree with this, I was just trying to point out what the law is where I work. And yes, they do send in excise to check on this.

    Now, I don't agree that this should be prostitution, but I do know that you can get busted for this and girls HAVE gotten ticketted for this. They have to draw the line somewhere I guess, and it's prbly just easier to give citations if all girls have to do is say that they MIGHT meet up with a guy later. That way, quotas get upped and so do collections from fines.
    I am very well versed at the law and know of nothing on the books, this maybe a CLUB RULE but to my knowledge there is no STATE LAW if there is could you please let me know? ... Which club do you work at if you mind me asking? I would guess the Red Garter or Dancers...

  20. #20
    StrayStripper
    Guest

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by laplover69 View Post
    I am very well versed at the law and know of nothing on the books, this maybe a CLUB RULE but to my knowledge there is no STATE LAW if there is could you please let me know? ... Which club do you work at if you mind me asking? I would guess the Red Garter or Dancers...
    I have friends who make a lot of money practicing law and still have no clue that grinding/touching = prostitution. No, they aren't customers.

    In every contract I have signed, there is a blurb about how my dances will involve no touching and will be performed at least 6" away, sometimes 3 feet. Is it enforced? No. The clubs have those contracts to cover their butts in case someone is busted for "hooking".

    In one serious mileage club, I signed a form before every shift stating that my dances would be performed a foot or two away. The hypocrisy of the management made me sick.

    Personally, I would love the expectation for dancers to grind and allow touching to be removed from dances.

  21. #21
    God/dess Sophia_Starina's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Nudie-Land
    Posts
    7,219
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 4,151 Times in 1,462 Posts
    My Mood
    Sneaky

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Let me be clear, I’m not judging, I’m philosophizing. Just thinking. Whipping up rousing conversation. This equation dawned on me and I wanted to get other peoples two cents. I am currently holding onto one perspective, that perspective being that dancing may be deeper into sex work than previously thought.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay12 View Post
    ^What Sophia said.
    Quote Originally Posted by yoda57us View Post
    I wish there was an "auto-like" setting that I could just have applied to all of your posts Sophia....

  22. #22
    Veteran Member
    Joined
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    465
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    I am very well versed at the law and know of nothing on the books, this maybe a CLUB RULE but to my knowledge there is no STATE LAW if there is could you please let me know? ... Which club do you work at if you mind me asking? I would guess the Red Garter or Dancers...
    Yes, I do work at the Garter. And yes, it actually is a law. With the Garter being downtown, the club is considered "prime" real estate, which means that excise comes in quite a bit looking for different things when they are there. Lately, it's been tittie tape, but there have been occasions where they have been in. When they come in, they normally will do a VIP or two if they are looking for prostitution. And one of the things that they try to get you to do is say that you will meet up with them. They will not say it is for sex, but they will ask you to meet them for dinner, etc.

  23. #23
    Veteran Member laplover69's Avatar
    Joined
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    412
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by kylie3183 View Post
    Yes, I do work at the Garter. And yes, it actually is a law. With the Garter being downtown, the club is considered "prime" real estate, which means that excise comes in quite a bit looking for different things when they are there. Lately, it's been tittie tape, but there have been occasions where they have been in. When they come in, they normally will do a VIP or two if they are looking for prostitution. And one of the things that they try to get you to do is say that you will meet up with them. They will not say it is for sex, but they will ask you to meet them for dinner, etc.
    I am well aware of the STATEWIDE PASTIE LAW, but sould you please give me the specific Indiana Statute that you are referring to?? My guess is this is just a CLUB RULE, and perhaps being downtown Indy makes you more vulenrable. I think someone is trying to scare you off perhaps club management strongly DISCOURAGES OTC meetings because of the perceptions...

  24. #24
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    ^^^ actually, in Indiana the legal issue is a technical one ... 'escorting' without a license ... based on

    " Escort means a person who, for consideration, and for another person, agrees or offers: (i) to act as a companion, guide, or date, or (ii) to privately model lingerie, or (iii) to privately perform a striptease."

    I believe that Indiana has the Notre Dame legal dep't to thank for this bit of 'back door legislation'. Technically, escorting isn't illegal. However, escorting without a license IS illegal under state SOB laws, and no Indiana city will issue any escort licenses ! I'm told that this is a modern day variant of original marijuana laws ... where marijuana itself was still legal, but it's sale without tax stamps was illegal under (tobacco based) business laws, and of course the gov't chose not to issue any tax stamps for marijuana (actually a token few WERE issued - they're collector's items today).


    In regard to 'grinding', the vast majority of state prostitution laws have wording that allows a local DA to interpret contact with the customer's genital area by any part of the dancer's body (with or without clothing in between), in exchange for a customer payment in any form, to be legally interpreted as an act of prostitution. While there is often a chance to beat such a charge at the appellate level, at the local level there usually isn't any shortage of local jury members willing to hand down a conviction on general principles.

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 04-24-2007 at 10:54 PM.

  25. #25
    God/dess PaigeDWinter's Avatar
    Joined
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Cocoa Beach, FL
    Posts
    10,220
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 52 Times in 37 Posts

    Default Re: Grinding = Prostitution?

    Quote Originally Posted by kylie3183 View Post
    In Indiana, it is actually labeled as prostitution.


    Also in New York and Florida. But then again, so is paying someone to shake your hand. Any contact for money = prostitution. Do I personally agree? No. But I don't grind anyways. I think that if you wanna, cool. Whatever.
    Number of times Rickrolled on stage: 6
    *******************************

    Marasmus ... "Ladies don't fart. They butt-laugh."
    Marasmus says, "Oh no, that wasn't gas, it was merely a rectal chuckle."

    Marek says, "A friend of mine got punched in the face by a dominatrix stripper about two weeks ago and I thought of you."

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Grinding
    By Axiom in forum Stripping (was Stripping General)
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 10-08-2009, 02:21 PM
  2. No grinding?
    By sexyi86 in forum Newbie Board
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-19-2008, 05:34 PM
  3. Grinding
    By Jill0101 in forum Newbie Board
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-09-2005, 11:47 PM
  4. Grinding??
    By tRoUbLeMaKeR in forum Hustle Hut
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 05-03-2004, 03:37 AM
  5. Grinding
    By sallylou in forum Dancer's Discussion
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 08-19-2003, 12:27 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •