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Thread: Homeless person...

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by madmaxine View Post
    but isn't it better than getting doused with gasoline & set on fire because they're sleeping where some random sociopathic asshole can try to kill them for kicks?
    Very true.

    BTW, the average San Franciscan/Northern California native has my attitude because there's more than enough people out on the street who don't try to get out of that situation & some of them get aggressive and unpleasant when they don't get a handout. Willie Brown (former SF mayor) suggested painting the homeless yellow and using them as speed bumps..He wasn't serious & I thought it was an awful thing to say, but that's the attitude.

    I do realize what I'm saying sounds heartless but it's just as heartless to not do a damn thing.....& No they're not all on drugs but the majority of time there is some problem that can be eliminated, oftentimes the problem that put them on the street.
    I don't think you sound heartless. But I think the cops should not get involved unless they absolutly have to. Call a local homeless shelter and ask what they would suggest. get social services involved before you get the cops involved. I understand the concen about not wanting there to be crackheads living across the street, that is a safety issue. But I guess my biggest problem is that we as a society arent dealing with the issue of homelessness, we are just trying to figure out how to tuck them away and not deal with what is going on that we have homeles. Our jails and prisons are becoming holding facilities for the homeless and mentally ill as the sate instituations are being shut down and there arent enough social service programs to help the homeless (some of which are people who have been kicked out of mental institutions that have closed down) I think this country should be looking at why these things are happening and why we arent doing anything about getting people the help they need (or stopping it before help is needed and trying to stop the problems before they result in being homeless) rather than sending them to jail... I am a little tired and I dont know if that made sense and I dont want to derail this thread with my views of public policy in regards to homeless and/or mentally ill. So yeah... the end? haha good night!
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Call the cops. Do not let that guy into the house. The minute that he gets in - he'll bring his friends the next night. Then, before you know it, you've got a crack house across the street. I live in the ghetto; I see this stuff happen all the time.


  3. #28
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    It is depressingly true that our system has been dismantled to where people who need real help aren't being given the best options.

    I don't want this to be a flame-out thread...I hope people who read it think about what they can do to combat homelessness in their community.

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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by josie View Post
    Call the cops. Do not let that guy into the house. The minute that he gets in - he'll bring his friends the next night. Then, before you know it, you've got a crack house across the street. I live in the ghetto; I see this stuff happen all the time.
    How do you know that he does drugs and/or has friends?
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Maxine, I don't think you CAN combat homelessness, really. There will ALWAYS be a segment of the population that simply prefers to not have to live a "normal" life.

    However, if I were given the task of this issue, and a good amount of funding, here's what I'd do....

    1-Make resources available for homeless to get back on their feet...very temporary housing like a shelter (they get less than a week there), with a program to get them into a group home (that would have strict rules including curfews, etc) and then eventually on their own with job programs and as soon as possible, into their own place to live. This program is meant for the truly homeless. If at any time they drop out of the program, they get ONE second chance and then that's it...no more chances.

    2-For the mentally ill, public hospitals with drugs and mental health counseling, with the goal of eventually landing these people in one of the group homes in the program above. For the seriously mentally ill, they'd be transferred to a state hospital (like Chattahoochee in Florida). The rest would have to maintaint their drug/counseling regimen, and I'd give these people a "three strikes" policy instead of the two strikes policy for other homeless.

    Also, these facilities would have help for drug and alcohol addicted people as well.

    3-That's it. If you insist on not abiding by the rules of the programs, you're on your own, no more help, no more shelter, go find it at a charity if you can (which I would limit as much as possible in terms of simple handouts).

    May be cruel, but I think this gives people a fair chance at helping themselves.

  6. #31
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by PaigeDWinter View Post
    How do you know that he does drugs and/or has friends?
    Your right, I don't know for sure. But they are almost always on drugs, wants drugs, are drunk, or want booze. Like I said, I live in a bad neighborhood and in a city famous for homeless people. There's a guy crawling through the house next door as I type this.

    I've been robbed, my house has been robbed, my car has been broken into. Desperate people will do desperate things. That's why it's best to keep the homeless guy out that abadoned house.

    I should point out - unless the homeless guy does something crazy like brandish a weapon, or if he has drugs on him - it is unlikely the cops will take him to jail. It is more likely they will take him to the nearest shelter or simply shoo him out of the neighborhood.


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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by josie View Post
    But they are almost always on drugs, wants drugs, are drunk, or want booze.



    Yeah, sure. Homeless = junkie. Right. I'd love to hear from the others who have admitted to being homeless in this post, but I was NOT on drugs, nor a drunk, when I was homeless. Ever. Plenty of homeless people are NOT druggies or drunks. Sheesh.
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  8. #33
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Hyde View Post
    Group 2 is tough...many of them simply do not/will not take medications they are given. However, some are just mentally ill...for the most part, group 2 has my sympathy, however, I still wouldn't want a mentally ill person breaking into ANY building near where I live, especially one that I own, even if I have abandoned it.
    This is a topic I really dont want to get into because I just dont feel like getting into it this late at night but I have to say something about what you said. Many mentally ill people -
    - cannot afford their medication
    - think they are better and go off meds and of course go their illness comes back full force
    - go off meds because they cannot feel anything which is worse than being dead
    - go off meds because of the side effects

    There are many reasons people go off meds, and it generally isnt just "oh yawn, I think I'll go back to mi vida loca today no more meds" Also to group all mental illnesses into one group of "I wouldnt want a mentally ill person breaking into any building..." Just isnt fair. There are many different mental illnesses with many different degrees to which they affect people.

    Group 3 deserves very little if any sympathy and I am willing to bet the person breaking into this abandoned house falls into this category.
    Define bum. most homeless people who I think you see as bums are unable to get jobs not because they are lazy or are not willing to wok but because they dont have any sort of resources. (I mean they do, but they donnt know were to go) and just arent able to get themselves out. And yes, there are people who are fine with being homeless and panhandeling, but I would venture to say that is a very very small %.

    Overall, I don't really believe we have a serious homeless problem in this country. We've always had bums, they've just been given the nicer name of "homeless" now. For the truly homeless, there are a ton of places to turn to get help, but most bums use them as a way to keep from working.
    Ok so i just want to say that the fact that we have homeless is a serious problem. Having said that even the able bodied and minded are and can be homeless and it isnt that they dont want to work, there just isnt the work for them and/or the only places that have job openings require a higher level of education, or some sort of certification that they dont have. I think you are of the residual viewpoint on this issue and I am of the institutional. I think it is us as a society who are to blame for these things, we are failing our people. I think (and of course I could be wrong) you would more likely say that it is the fault of the individual and up to the individual to help themselves.

    I know this sounds mean, but the older I get, the more I realize that the idealism I had about such things tends to hit reality. That reality hit me when I offered to pay a "homeless" guy to come help me do some work on a property I owned about 9-10 years ago.

    I had seen this guy near the house I owned in South Tampa a lot, always holding up a sign that said "will work for food." So one day, I needed some help hauling a shitload of carpet and old plaster and crap out of a house I was renovating. I drove over to where this guy was, and offered him 5 bucks an hour plus lunch if he'd come over and help me. This guy was probably about 30-35, healthy, etc. and told me (he said it nicely, at least, although almost in a bragging fashion) that he could make 5 bucks within the next 10-20 minutes just standing there, and thanks but no thanks.

    I know this is just one guy, but that's my experience.
    Well if he is going to make more money sitting there why on earth would he work for you for cheaper? He might not need food, he might go to a food bank/soup kitchen for his food. I mean really just because he's homeless doesnt mean that he doesnt know what his time is worth and I dont think 5 bux an hour to do manual labor is fair. It isnt even min wage. Just because he is homeless does not mean he should be paid any less than anyone else should be paid. If you had offered him more maybe he would have come and worked for you. I knew a homeless man who was a very very ... successful drug dealer (strippers loved him, he dropped about 5-10,000 a week in the club) He got arested for something else and when he got out of jail he was homeless. I dont think he would ever agree to do lots of physical labor for anything less than whatever the going rate would be for someone who was hired to do that. I think beyond that guys making more just standing there its also an issue of trying to hold onto some dignity that can be lost in becoming homeless. This is just imo.

    I'm glad thay you tried to help him like that, but please dont take this one guy to represent all homeless people.


    And then yes, of course there are the drug addicts and they will pose as homeless asking for money. They are also of course homeless themselves sometimes. But there are definately "fakers" who arent homeless but just dont want to work, or who cant work because if they did they wouldnt be elidgeable for whatever $ they're getting from welfare or whatever. I'm not saying there arent people who just use homelessness to avoid getting a job and whatnot, but they are so very few.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    I just got hollered at by a CUTE guy, at dusk, in my car, in gym attire and hair. Word?
    Picaresque is the shit, I loooooves her!!!

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  9. #34
    Veteran Member josie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by PaigeDWinter View Post
    Yeah, sure. Homeless = junkie. Right. I'd love to hear from the others who have admitted to being homeless in this post, but I was NOT on drugs, nor a drunk, when I was homeless. Ever. Plenty of homeless people are NOT druggies or drunks. Sheesh.
    You're absolutely right. Homeless does not always equate to being a junkie. And it's definitely wrong to stereotype. It certainly wasn't my intention to offend you. My greater point is that it's best to not take chances. If I assumed that every homeless person in my neighborhood was harmless I'd get robbed everynight.


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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by josie View Post
    I should point out - unless the homeless guy does something crazy like brandish a weapon, or if he has drugs on him - it is unlikely the cops will take him to jail. It is more likely they will take him to the nearest shelter or simply shoo him out of the neighborhood.
    He would probably be arrested for breaking and entering.

    Quote Originally Posted by josie View Post
    You're absolutely right. Homeless does not always equate to being a junkie. And it's definitely wrong to stereotype. It certainly wasn't my intention to offend you. My greater point is that it's best to not take chances. If I assumed that every homeless person in my neighborhood was harmless I'd get robbed everynight.
    I think being homeless or not should not change the way you take care of yourself at night(or ever). Being homeless doesnt = dangerous/criminal. "If I assumed that every person in my neighborhood was harmless I'd get robbed everynight" makes more sense to me.

    Someone jumped by friend and because she had been nice to a few homeless men in our neighborhood they saw this happen chased the guy down and held him until the police arrived. These guys also had her back when she walked into the "wrong side" of the block and some homeless man was harrasing her. They acted as her escort... not all homeless people are out to hurt people. And unfortunately most are viewed as such.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    I just got hollered at by a CUTE guy, at dusk, in my car, in gym attire and hair. Word?
    Picaresque is the shit, I loooooves her!!!

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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    "Well if he is going to make more money sitting there why on earth would he work for you for cheaper?"

    I think this statement kind of shows where you and I disagree. I'd rather dig shit out of a ditch with my bare hands than accept a hand out, if given the choice. He'd rather hold up a fake sign pretending he wants to work than actually work.

    And yes, I do view being a bum as an individual problem. There are numerous places that people who need a hand up can get help. A girl I used to date worked at the Mental Health Association of Tallahassee, she was a social work major in college. She'd tell me countless stories of homeless people simply moving from shelter to shelter...once one shelter would tell them "you've been here long enough, either find a job or move out" they'd move out, go to the next place, and repeat procedure.

    Back then, I thought the same thing you did..."they just don't know how to find work" even though my GF told me that after speaking with these people that they were just content to just live life on the street.

    I'm not saying all homeless people are bums...just most of them. Like Josie said, I don't want to stereotype...but sometimes the stereotype exists for a reason.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Hyde View Post
    "Well if he is going to make more money sitting there why on earth would he work for you for cheaper?"

    I think this statement kind of shows where you and I disagree. I'd rather dig shit out of a ditch with my bare hands than accept a hand out, if given the choice. He'd rather hold up a fake sign pretending he wants to work than actually work.

    And yes, I do view being a bum as an individual problem. There are numerous places that people who need a hand up can get help. A girl I used to date worked at the Mental Health Association of Tallahassee, she was a social work major in college. She'd tell me countless stories of homeless people simply moving from shelter to shelter...once one shelter would tell them "you've been here long enough, either find a job or move out" they'd move out, go to the next place, and repeat procedure.

    Back then, I thought the same thing you did..."they just don't know how to find work" even though my GF told me that after speaking with these people that they were just content to just live life on the street.

    I'm not saying all homeless people are bums...just most of them. Like Josie said, I don't want to stereotype...but sometimes the stereotype exists for a reason.
    Have you ever worked with the homless?
    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    I just got hollered at by a CUTE guy, at dusk, in my car, in gym attire and hair. Word?
    Picaresque is the shit, I loooooves her!!!

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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    No, but she did...she scheduled counseling for them and tried to help them find resources in the community that would help them with mental health issues. This required her to interact with them a lot.

    So I had/have a close second-hand view of the homeless.

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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Ok. Well I have, and I will be again, and I know that it can be disheartening to see so many people who wont help themselves for whatever reason. And it can get very very frustrating to see this happen and so it is usually what people talk about because you dont blow off steam about things that are going good... The lack of funding to pay social workers makes it a very very difficult job because you have such a large caseload and many workers get burnt out because of this... But you have to know that there are many many people who will help themselves. Our current social welfare programs are not set up to help people. Everywhere is different as far as funding goes and some places have amazing resources while others have virtually none. And funding really dictates what the organization can and cannot provide for the homeless. I'm going to bed now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    I just got hollered at by a CUTE guy, at dusk, in my car, in gym attire and hair. Word?
    Picaresque is the shit, I loooooves her!!!

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  15. #40
    aussiepunkshocker
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    >Raises hand< Me too. I only had a short stint of being homeless but a junkie or alcaholic? Ha, no.
    Homeless people have been some of the best people I have ever known.


    Quote Originally Posted by PaigeDWinter View Post
    Yeah, sure. Homeless = junkie. Right. I'd love to hear from the others who have admitted to being homeless in this post, but I was NOT on drugs, nor a drunk, when I was homeless. Ever. Plenty of homeless people are NOT druggies or drunks. Sheesh.

  16. #41
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    What you describe is partially why she left the profession.

    However, all the funding in the world won't help those who don't want to help themselves.

    I am NOT trying to argue or look for a pissing match...I really am not. I just find it hard to generate sympathy for people who don't deserve it. I'd rather save that for kids dying of cancer, or orphans, or the like.

  17. #42
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Knowing one person who worked with one area's homeless population isn't really a great reason to classify MOST homeless into one category.
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  18. #43
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    Quote Originally Posted by PaigeDWinter View Post
    Knowing one person who worked with one area's homeless population isn't really a great reason to classify MOST homeless into one category.
    Too true! Because of funding and various other reasons there are some places that are full of helpful places to turn while others have none, and are so desperate for workers they will hire people off the street who dont know how to deal with the clients (one of the reasons people dont want to go get help - they are treated like shit for their circumstance by assholes who dont know what they're doing/talking about but have been hired by an agency because they need help) and end up doing more damage than good.

    goddamnit why cant I go to sleep?! gerr.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
    I just got hollered at by a CUTE guy, at dusk, in my car, in gym attire and hair. Word?
    Picaresque is the shit, I loooooves her!!!

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  19. #44
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    Default Re: Homeless person...

    I blame Ronald Reagan for this whole frickin conversation.

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